2012-09-02, 20:40 | Link #242 | |||
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
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The motive is just that: completely random unless exposed, since the benefit and context of the incident just don't make sense to begin with. That is to say, everything else can be assumed with evidences. Quote:
1) the incident occured months ago, and was never addressed until people found out by chance 2) Kokoro Connect radio event and Eufonius' Kikuchi comments are definitely not pushing the "staged prank" claim presented in the website news. 3) Ichiki explaining his "venture" to Sugita and Imai hardly sounded someone who realized afterwards it was staged. 4) The itasha trip being actually true, with obviously nothing for Ichiki to really involve himself in the series despite his -actual job- sounds off no matter how you look at it In a business sense, you definitely wouldn't want people going ahead of themselves which could potentially contradict statements, but as Guardian Enzo said already, it was possible for them to take responsability to a certain degree without leading to complicated matters. Quote:
If you consider marketing and business perspectives, no one in their right mind would do that for pragmatic reasons. This is why something is missing, and I never tried speculating the reason why they did that (there isn't even any evidence that they indeed targeted Ichiki, and it could be any random low profile seiyuu instead). That's the reason why the whole "misunderstanding" just doesn't click on me at all: claiming it was a misunderstanding implies that either the prank wasn't mean to be severe (despite we got gratuitious remarks after the incident) or was staged (to which they didn't address it to either Ichiki or the public until people found out and went on rage). I'm like you and everyone else wondering about this affair: I don't have the slighest idea of the individuals who are truly responsible for this mess, but I believe mindlessly accepting their words, under the pretense it was a "mere prank" would be no better than a nod at them. That said, I do not agree with the whole "witch hunt" going all out, nor it is a good idea to lead a widespread boycott that would obviously involve people who have nothing to do with that. I simply just cannot accept that situation, thus I speak my mind on it.
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2012-09-02, 20:48 | Link #243 | |
procrastinating...
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From the apathy of some people here about the thought that no harm was caused and that it wasn't premeditated to at least a group of individuals, then just looking at the quotes from Terashima should ought to dispel that thought. I do not think anyone is arguing that the scattergun approach is the correct way, and I hope that the novel and the author are unaffected, but surely what has come to light on the comments from the two VAs, for example, cannot be defended. |
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2012-09-02, 21:02 | Link #244 | |
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Personally, I don't like "Punked", that sense of humour, or any shows like it. I find it in bad taste. But it's a very popular style of comedy in the entertainment business around the world today. So when they say their intentions were misunderstood, I can actually buy that. The whole thing reeks to me of a prank that was supposed to be funny, but went wrong due to some poor decisions and some people involved taking it too seriously (and being far too vicious). The organizers likely just wanted to have some sort of "fun" way to introduce their new PR guy, and someone came up with this. Again, I'm not trying to excuse everything that happened... but I can honestly see how it's quite possible that many (not all) of the people who were aware of this did not necessarily believe it was malicious, or intend for things to be taken the way they were. I'm also not going to argue about how they should or shouldn't have worded their apology to appease you and others -- maybe it wasn't the best strategy, who knows -- but I also can see how there is probably truth in what was written there.
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2012-09-02, 21:15 | Link #245 |
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
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I see where you are coming from, and that kind of "entertainment" is definitely not uncommon in Japan.
I will admit I did think something like this could occur, but again few points just don't click that assumption so that -I- (not saying for everyone else) believe in that. If, for example, Ichiki wasn't so lost in his explanations to Sugita and Imai and/or state everything was to have a wonky PR campaign... fine. If the Kokoro connect radio event had Kanemoto and Terashima explaining how they made an original PR campaign etc... sure. But none actually happened, and the circumstances (low profile until the public and the internet stormed in) and comments just blow that assumption imho. My biggest grip is definitely that radio event, where Kanemoto and Terashima just couldn't stop acting ecstatic after what happened to Ichiki. It certainly doesn't define the whole motive of the "prank", but it definitely leaves an idea of what were their thoughts. Assuming this radio was staged as well, they made another mistake in not even "punking" the public on this. I will give you that Ichiki remaining as a PR can be seen as he actually acknowledged the ploy, but it can be equally seen as a way "not to lose a job" or to save face, even if it has the opposite effect. Suffice to say, an abnormal point with that statement is that Ichiki wasn't really prepared for that, nor briefed afterwards, considering his reactions during Sugita and Imai's radios, and with Kanemoto in the car during the "connecting the hearts" itasha campaign (No, I have no idea how far went the punishment game with the electrodes, so I won't claim he really was hurt or anything, no idea really). As a "usual punked" stunt, I would expect them to do it right after the fake audition, as a regular "you have been had! but you won't leave with empty hands". Instead, they left him rot with expectations for weeks before having that event where he got slammed with public humiliation, discovering first hand with everyone else what really happened. So really, while I won't deny that direction of a "eventual staged prank" isn't close to null, points really are disturbing in that equation, even more so if you involve Japanese mindset.
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Last edited by Klashikari; 2012-09-02 at 21:30. |
2012-09-02, 21:16 | Link #246 |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
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Anyone have a link to a translation or summary of the various apologies/blog entries (the show's, Ichiki's, Terashima's, Mizushima's, Ogame's)? It's still somewhat beyond me what Mizushima and Ogame were apologizing about; were they involved as well? I wonder how in they were on this whole thing.
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2012-09-02, 21:23 | Link #247 |
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
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Mizushima and Oogame were present during the event and did laugh at Ichiki's predicament. There is no indication if it was because they thought it was staged, the flow or whatever, so they were "cut some slack" I guess, unlike Kanemoto and Terashima.
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Last edited by Klashikari; 2012-09-02 at 21:33. |
2012-09-02, 21:55 | Link #248 |
Tch.
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Australia
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Honestly I think had Terashima and Kanemoto not gleefully laugh about the event on the Kokoroco radio, they would have not gotten themselves as much heat as they have now. It's precisely because of their behaviour towards the situation that brought them such animosity compared to Mizushima and Oogame. IIRC, Ichiki said that Mizushima gave him a sympathetic glace at another event during Imai's radio program, which I presume got some people off his back (though, the extreme ones would've still been wishing him ill fortune).
Had the laughing been kept within the event itself (and in Kanemoto's case, kept herself more in check during the itasha campaign), people would have been more willing to give them benefit of the doubt and assume they had no choice but to got along with the joke as part of their job. In the end, the true culprit is none other than Yamanaka, especially since it's already been said that this isn't the first time he's pulled this shit (just not a this level) on Ichiki, which makes the idea that Ichiki may have been a poor randomly selected victim more unlikely. |
2012-09-02, 22:04 | Link #249 | |
procrastinating...
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Then on a public stage they rescinded that role and said in all actuality that his role never existed and that he would work as a PR guy where the social status of the PR work is more akin to manual labour rather than a VA, all the while being laughed at for failing to not be more successful in his chosen profession. |
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2012-09-02, 23:16 | Link #250 |
My posts are frivolous
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 35
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It was not a public stage per se because the performance was not meant to be uploaded on to NND. It was shown during a pre-season event for the anime in front of the audience and that's all.
Seriously, the perpetrators have apologised, and their apologies are now construed as being insincere. The victim came out and said he's taking it in stride and considered the current state of events as being blown out of proportion and it's now argued as being untruthful. Notwithstanding the blatant lack of evidence for these views, what more are the parties expected to do? |
2012-09-02, 23:52 | Link #251 | |
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2012-09-03, 02:43 | Link #252 | |
Homo Ludens
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Continuing to stir up trouble in an attempt to drag an apology out of people not willing to give it is not what anyone actually involved in this wants. |
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2012-09-03, 02:57 | Link #254 | |
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2012-09-03, 04:08 | Link #255 |
My posts are frivolous
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Except that there is no evidence that the apologies were insincere. All of the stuff we have here is simply assumptions that we're reading into the events. We don't have the full picture of what's going on. I personally find it in bad taste to read insincerity into an apology, once again especially because Ichiki himself has already said that he bears no ill will against the people involved.
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2012-09-03, 04:33 | Link #256 | |
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2012-09-03, 05:30 | Link #258 | ||||
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Not at all. The naivety I'm seeing here is from people who refuse to accept that real wrong-doing and bullying almost certainly occurred.
Klashikari has put forward excellent arguments clearly showing why the official story coming from these apologies just does not fully add up, at least not for all of the participants. Quote:
The way Kanemoto and Terashima handled this whole event is highly suspicious, in my opinion. Like Klash said, the radio event is quite eyebrow-raising. The reason why a lot of people aren't satisfied with the apology is because the apology is frankly insulting to people's intelligence and doesn't address how this is a bit more than just a mere misunderstanding. There's times in life when it's better for people to suck it up and truly admit that they did wrong, and if people don't do that, then why should they be forgiven? Speaking personally, I'll forgive any sincere apology. But the apology we have right now seems very half-hearted, at best, to me, and it dodges what really needs to be apologized for, imo. Now, obviously a lot of the fan reaction to this has been quite nasty and unwarranted itself. But I agree with Kirarakim, I'm glad that fans who heard about this didn't just shrug their shoulders and say 'whatever'. What happened here was very crude and hurtful, and it shows a seedier side of the anime industry that shouldn't just be ignored or swept under the carpet, imo. Maybe all of the fan outrage over this incident will make it less likely for incidents like this to happen in the future, and that's a good thing if you ask me. Quote:
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And sometimes apologies are insincere, so I don't see why it's in bad taste to read insincerity into an apology if you have good reason to suspect that they're not sincere.
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Last edited by Triple_R; 2012-09-03 at 05:46. |
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2012-09-03, 09:15 | Link #260 |
Cah Gunungkidul
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Jogja
Age: 35
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the 2ch citizen are goats, goats without love
actually they dont care about the truth of rokken-- err I mean Ijimeconnect incident nor the victim as long as they can keep bashing they will do it. just for fun in the end without love it cant be seen
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Last edited by gecd; 2012-09-03 at 09:55. |
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