(L) X-Men (Madhouse)

[duckroll]

Originally Posted by orion

It's a 12 ep. title right? Can't get too much back info or the series won't finish in time. It looks like the main story is with Inner Circle anyways.

I don't really see how that's true. 12 episodes is over 4 hours. That's two full length movies. It's really not about back story. It's simply about having good villains with a compelling set of bad guys. The villains in the anime basically suck.

They spent 6 episodes on the U-Men and there was basically zero development. They didn't even have names. It was one stupid looking scientist guy who eventually gets into a big robot, and another cyborg thing who goes "organs! organs! organs!" over and over.

That's not interesting. That's stupid. They have no personalities, no motivations, no relation to the world or any sort of development whatsoever. They're just stupid looking weirdos who serve a singular purpose of being there to create action scenes.

Like I said, it's a visual anime, which is entertaining for the action and the designs, but the writing just sucks. Even the Inner Circle is going to turn out to be nothing more than "these weird mutant dudes who follow Mastermind's orders because the show needs more action" characters. That's a far cry from what the Hellfire Club actually is, and it's a pity that the writing is so abysmal that they didn't take advantage of any of the history and personality the Hellfire Club had to offer.

[orion]

Originally Posted by duckroll

I don't really see how that's true. 12 episodes is over 4 hours. That's two full length movies. It's really not about back story. It's simply about having good villains with a compelling set of bad guys. The villains in the anime basically suck.

They spent 6 episodes on the U-Men and there was basically zero development. They didn't even have names. It was one stupid looking scientist guy who eventually gets into a big robot, and another cyborg thing who goes "organs! organs! organs!" over and over.

That's not interesting. That's stupid. They have no personalities, no motivations, no relation to the world or any sort of development whatsoever. They're just stupid looking weirdos who serve a singular purpose of being there to create action scenes.

Like I said, it's a visual anime, which is entertaining for the action and the designs, but the writing just sucks. Even the Inner Circle is going to turn out to be nothing more than "these weird mutant dudes who follow Mastermind's orders because the show needs more action" characters. That's a far cry from what the Hellfire Club actually is, and it's a pity that the writing is so abysmal that they didn't take advantage of any of the history and personality the Hellfire Club had to offer.

The U-Men served to get Hisako and Emma into the org. If people are interested in getting a back story about them, they can look online. Same with Inner Circle. You're not going to get a lot of development in a 12 ep title unless it has a second season planned. So far this one doesn't.

Besides, this one is going on US channels. Back stories aren't that much focused in some titles here. The recent Transformers title had some back story given in less than 1 min and onto the present action it went.

[duckroll]

Originally Posted by orion

The U-Men served to get Hisako and Emma into the org. If people are interested in getting a back story about them, they can look online. Same with Inner Circle. You're not going to get a lot of development in a 12 ep title unless it has a second season planned. So far this one doesn't.

Besides, this one is going on US channels. Back stories aren't that much focused in some titles here. The recent Transformers title had some back story given in less than 1 min and onto the present action it went.

Erm. I don't think you understand what I'm even saying. I'm not sure if it's because you're being deliberately dense, or if you're not familiar with the material at all. There is no "back story" to speak of. That is the entire problem. The villains in the X-men anime are not based on any comic stories. There is nothing to "read online".

The Inner Circle in the anime is not the Inner Circle of the Hellfire Club in the comics. It is something entirely different, made up of original characters who have no purpose other than to just look cool and fight. This is bad writing. I'm not sure why you disagree with this. The U-men in the anime are also completely different from the U-men in the comics. It is not like they are adapting some comic story, and are simply leaving out details because they don't have the time to fit them in. They are creating an completely original story, and because of poor writing, the villains end up uninteresting and lame.

[orion]

Originally Posted by duckroll

Erm. I don't think you understand what I'm even saying. I'm not sure if it's because you're being deliberately dense, or if you're not familiar with the material at all. There is no "back story" to speak of. That is the entire problem. The villains in the X-men anime are not based on any comic stories. There is nothing to "read online".

The Inner Circle in the anime is not the Inner Circle of the Hellfire Club in the comics. It is something entirely different, made up of original characters who have no purpose other than to just look cool and fight. This is bad writing. I'm not sure why you disagree with this. The U-men in the anime are also completely different from the U-men in the comics. It is not like they are adapting some comic story, and are simply leaving out details because they don't have the time to fit them in. They are creating an completely original story, and because of poor writing, the villains end up uninteresting and lame.

But if most are going to die by the end of the title anyways, who's going to care at the end of the series? Really the only prob enemy survivor is Mastermind and he's on wiki based on what happened in the previous 2 titles. (Most original characters died.)

U-men were told to the viewers as people who harvest mutant organs and experiment on mutants. It's not like the viewer really needed more info to grasp the basics of what was happening. Xmen came, kicked ass, U-men died. U-men found not to be the source of the original blackout problem but source of kidnappings. Now we're onto the next set.

If this is like Madoka, some of the blanks will be filled in by the end. But being for US consumption means whatever history is meant to be will be brief imo with an emphasis on action like the recent Transformers series. I think its done to tailor this title more for US tastes and not poor writing.

[Triple_R]

I wonder if Marvel Comics (or whoever owns the trademarks to its characters) is to blame on the villain front?

It's possible that the people in charge of Marvel Comics told Madhouse "You're very limited in which of our characters you're allowed to use in your story itself. We're going to tell you specifically who they are. The only actual Marvel Comics villain you're allowed to use is Mastermind. The rest will have to be anime originals."

If that's the case, I find the writing of the villains here a bit more excusable.

Otherwise, though, it's a real mystery to me why Madhouse aren't utilizing the perfectly good established X-Men villains like Magneto, Apocalypse, Juggernaut, Mystique, and Stryfe.

In fairness, the X-Men's non-mutant/anti-mutant villains have always been the weakest link of their rogues gallery, in my opinion. Not to mention that some of them (mainly the ones that are American politicians) simply wouldn't work in a story where Japan is the primary setting. So if the anime writers wanted to highlight anti-mutant racism for X-Men's opening arc, then creating the U-Men might not be significantly worse than, say, bringing in William Stryker.

But now that they are using mutant villains, I can't help but wish for guys like Magneto, Juggernaut, and Stryfe.

[GDB]

It's most likely Marvel's fault there. It was a problem in Iron Man. It was a problem in Wolverine. It's looking to be a problem in X-Men. Odds are, it'll also be a problem in Blade.

And don't expect any answers on these characters' backstories. Kikyo didn't get one in Wolverine, and it's already obvious he was more likeable than these new guys in X-Men.

[wingdarkness]

Wow I really hadn't noticed the controversy with the story...While I agree it isn't really developing the U-Men story, I thought the first 6 eps were clearly a "Team-building" sort of thing...The type of thing you'd see in new shonen animes where you have no clue who the real opposition is or what their motives are just yet...You kinda just get thrown in there...

Did you know Vegeta was the big baddy 6 eps in? Nevermind Freeza's entire network, for example...

I kinda think since so many westerners are familiar with the X-men storylines we're sorta discounting the fact that this show IS FOR THEM (the Japanese) more than it is for us...In that sense, the U-Men are just some mysterious opposition that's waiting to be revealed as the new team-mates storyline is getting hardened...

Now maybe I'm enjoying X-men so much because it's actually watchable (unlike that utterly terrible CGIronman, and utterly so-so Wolverine), but I see this first arc as a set-up, like in any shonen fighter series...Dealing with the aftermath of Jean Grey's situation, while incorporating Emma and the younger X-girl is what's developing right now...

Honestly I've been pleasantly surprised by most of the show, again perhaps because of low expectations based on the other 2 works, but it's working for me so far because 6, 7 eps is just 6, 7 eps...What's to get all squirrely about right now?

Additionally, of every incarnation of X-men I've ever seen this is by far the coolest version of Scott Summers...I usually hate that guy, but in this show he's actually a badass to be reckoned with..Wolverine has failed to overshadow him for the first time ever to me...Pretty good considering all the bishie-backlash his character was getting pre-production...

So yeah I too pine for some Magneto or Juggernaut (etc.) action if I'm being selfish (Really selfish for Gambit!!^^)...But what I'm seeing thusfar didn't strike me at all as abysmal...Not in the writing department if again we look at it as a new series shaping it's team before establishing the real threat or whatever some such...

[orion]

Hmmm...Magneto and Juggernaut would just be taken down by Professor and Emma or manipulated by Mastermind, right? 3 telepaths are on the roster. Those 2 prob wouldn't add much. Now if the show had started with a ruckus caused by one of them, that's something different.

Originally Posted by GDB

And don't expect any answers on these characters' backstories. Kikyo didn't get one in Wolverine, and it's already obvious he was more likeable than these new guys in X-Men.

I was surprised that Kikyo lived until the end of the series after watching Iron Man. It was like "Japanese anime original character is on the top of the list to die." Those anime original characters were dropping like flies in Wolverine.

That's why if its an anime original character I'm expecting him or her not to be alive by the end and won't mourn any lack of development before he or she dies. Of course, I'll be cheering if Emma or Hisako lands the finishing blow.

[wingdarkness]

Originally Posted by orion

Hmmm...Magneto and Juggernaut would just be taken down by Professor and Emma or manipulated by Mastermind, right? 3 telepaths are on the roster. Those 2 prob wouldn't add much. Now if the show had started with a ruckus caused by one of them, that's something different.

I did say selfish action...As in seeing them do cool stuff...

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by orion

Hmmm...Magneto and Juggernaut would just be taken down by Professor and Emma or manipulated by Mastermind, right?

Last I checked, Jug's helmet is specifically designed to defend against telepathic assault (especially from Xavier). The same might be true of Magneto's helmet, but I don't remember for certain in his case.

Magneto vs. this particular anime X-Men team would be a good fight. Ironically, I could see it coming down to Hisako. Now that would be something.

[duckroll]

I seriously don't think you guys should expect any of the villains in the ED to show up, because they won't. I'm pretty sure that Mastermind's "ultimate" plan somehow involves Takeo. He is likely to be a Japanese variation on Legion. I won't be surprised if Mastermind is keeping Takeo inside some sort of machine to harness his incredible and unstable powers, and Yui is only helping him because she doesn't want Takeo to be hurt.

From the Newtype synopsis, we know that Mastermind will officially come into the picture in ep9, which is supposed to be a major episode in terms of staff and plot events. I'm honestly hoping that for the last four episodes they just go balls to the wall with the action, and have tons of multi-character fights all the way to the climax. Ep7 showed a glimpse at how the heroes/villains could be paired up in fights, so it should be pretty cool when the remaining villains show up and the team has to take them on all at once.

[klare]

Prof X lost his calm as soon as he heard he got a son... i suspect Yui lied to him to lure him to Japan

agree about that 2 villains in this eps, they look worse than the U-men

[Aeshma]

Originally Posted by duckroll

They spent 6 episodes on the U-Men and there was basically zero development. They didn't even have names. It was one stupid looking scientist guy who eventually gets into a big robot, and another cyborg thing who goes "organs! organs! organs!" over and over.

That's not interesting. That's stupid. They have no personalities, no motivations, no relation to the world or any sort of development whatsoever. They're just stupid looking weirdos who serve a singular purpose of being there to create action scenes.

Truth be told, the U-men in the comics are pretty lame too.

[orion]

Originally Posted by klare

Prof X lost his calm as soon as he heard he got a son... i suspect Yui lied to him to lure him to Japan

agree about that 2 villains in this eps, they look worse than the U-men

I'd be beyond pissed if someone told me "Oh yeah, we had a son. He's dead now. I'll tell you about it sometime later."

That's like whatever relationship was there didn't rate enough to be told that
a. We had a kid.
b. He died an unspecified time ago so that I didn't get to know him or am able to mourn his passing.

Plus, it was so obvious a lie from the flashback and the way she said it.

[duckroll]

Originally Posted by Aeshma

Truth be told, the U-men in the comics are pretty lame too.

They are. I don't think anyone is saying otherwise.

[kenjiharima]

Ep.7

Wolverine is the main mutant to call whenever you need a good fight.

So is this anime to make the U-men more cooler? lol

[Kallen4life]

wonder if X-men First Class'll be better ? ^^

[GDB]

Probably not.

[kenjiharima]

A little bit off topic.

I wish Marvel would also anime style Spiderman and the Hulk. If they're licensing Wolverine, X-men and Blade why not add the other top guns of marvel as well?

[duckroll]

Ep8 was pretty sweet. Nice to see Storm finally making herself useful in fights without looking compromised or nerfed. The story developments are moving the characters into good positions to "reveal everything" next ep. Can't wait. Villains are still awful, but it matters a lot less when the fights in each episode are interesting to watch.

The preview for ep9 opens with a pretty awful character art scene (Emma and Hisako don't even have faces!), but I believe in Hayama. He won't let us down. The animation in the episode should be fantastic! I want to believe!