Mobile Suit Gundam: Iron-Blooded Orphans Episode 17 Discussion Thread

[monster]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

They didn't have to cross it. Space is not limited by two dimensions so they could go literally in ANY direction but one to avoid it. Remember Gjallahorn was positioned to engage protesters heading to DORT 3 and quite busy wiping them out. Even if Gjallahorn detected Isaribi, they wouldn't be able spare much fighting forces without letting their main target escape.

Regardless, as soon as they went off to space, they couldn't be certain of who they will encounter. The point is to have their mobile suits ready. The fact that they actually sought engagement on their own is another issue.

[Tenzen12]

Of course having MS ready is obvious, there is not even point mention it. I though we do talk about that other issue.

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

The main target that's on space stations and has no ships? And non functional weapons? That main target?

Yes, that main target. Didn't you watch this episode?

[BoyTitan]

I swear i have seen the revolutionist get defective weapons before but I just can't remember where.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Of course having MS ready is obvious, there is not even point mention it. I though we do talk about that other issue.



Yes, that main target. Didn't you watch this episode?

Yes, but I thought you were talking about a target that could escape. Or, you know, resist in a significant way. Like maybe I'd missed someone with an actual ship. With, in fact, a whole fleet of them, to necessitate Gjallarhorn's own fleet to stay together.

[Jestersage]

Originally Posted by BoyTitan

I swear i have seen the revolutionist get defective weapons before but I just can't remember where.

That's just like Mr. Big operation, such as the terrorist sting in Canada's Victoria made by RCMP.

[Somnus]

Gjallarhorn's "tactics" piss me off. A lot. In terms of becoming invested into a story's villains, that's an extremely good thing, but I have to say I felt nothing but hate for them knowing what they were doing to those poor workers and seeing the results of it all.

I also have to give some pretty major kudos to the writers for the fact that aside from the big, corrupt bad at the center of it all...it's still hard to discern the movements/motivations of the various parties involved. You look at everyone; the Seven Stars, Chocoman, Kudelia, Teiwaz, Nobliss, etc. Everyone has their own agenda, and seeing the genuine mess of all these clashing is...refreshing, to say the least. Revolution is never supposed to be as black/white or one-sided as SEED was (and don't get me wrong, I love SEED). This is much, MUCH more accurate.

And don't get me started on the battles. Hearing all this heavy metal slamming against each other is music to my ears.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Yes, but I thought you were talking about a target that could escape. Or, you know, resist in a significant way. Like maybe I'd missed someone with an actual ship. With, in fact, a whole fleet of them, to necessitate Gjallarhorn's own fleet to stay together.

Sight, do you know what purge means? Or slaughter, wipe out? Ring any bells? That's was Gjallahorn plan, to get rid of opposition WITHOUT resistance. So letting them get away was not part of it.

Could they spare some ship or MS? Sure, they could, but if you know how basic math operations works, you would be aware that part is less than whole thing. Dividing enemy forces is how Tekkadan managed survive their first battle with Gjallahorn in first place.

[DragoonKain3]

Damn, I knew the chance was low with the new ED still showing everyone on the ship, but I was still hoping for a break of Tekkadan into two. I mean, just like Gjallahorn has their own factions, I envisioned Tekkadan breaking into two that would be the reason why Mika breaks away from Orga. Oh well, it was nice to have that thought while it lasted.

In any case, Barbatos still using its mace as its main weapon makes me so happy.

[monster]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Of course having MS ready is obvious, there is not even point mention it.

The point is regarding the security aspect. Although having mobile suits deployed may or may not attract attention eventually.

Originally Posted by Somnus

it's still hard to discern the movements/motivations of the various parties involved.

To be fair, that's because there's barely any focus on anyone aside from Tekkadan until lately.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Sight, do you know what purge means? Or slaughter, wipe out? Ring any bells? That's was Gjallahorn plan, to get rid of opposition WITHOUT resistance. So letting them get away was not part of it.

Do you know what "stuck on a space station with no space ship means? They were never going to be able to escape.


They didn't bring that many ships because they thought they would need them. They brought them as a show of force. They have two, somewhat contradictory messages to send the world:
- It's a dangerous universe out there. You need serious protection.
- Sleep well, citizens, when it comes to protection, Gjallahorn is totally on the job with definitely enough strength to pull it off.

And possibly a third "it's a nice space station/country/whatever you've got there, it'd be a shame if anything happened to it".


Isaribi was going from a stop at Dort whatever, Gjallarhorn was set for a zero/zero intercept with that same station, so it works out to whoever can produce the most acceleration wins. If we forget the question of where Isaribi could run to, a question which would not have favored the Tekkadan anyway. Point is, Gjallahorn didn't need a lot of ships to surround Isaribi or anything fancy. Just a few run it down.

[Tenzen12]

1) They were heading to DORT 3 regroup with other rebels. If they got in, clean up would take significantly more time, especially if they were able obtain functional weapons.
2)It wasn't demonstration of force, not how it was portraited through medias.
3)Still don't see how to fight whole fleet is safer, than fight few ships.

[Anh_Minh]

1) A fight on the ground, such as it is, wouldn't play to the Tekkadan's strengths. So by all means, let them trap themselves on another space station. If that's what you think their plan should have been, I really don't know how you pictured it going.
2) The rebels are dangerous lunatics with dangerous weapons, but Gjallahorn's pacifying them is exactly how it was presented.
3) Hopefully Kudelia has a clever plan so they don't have to fight. Otherwise, they're pretty hosed.

[Tenzen12]

1) What the hell are you talking about?
2) Yes, pacifying situation and annihilating enemy are two different images. Demonstration of force can be applied on later.
3) In this situation it indeed require some good planning. It would be easier if they decided run away instead (we don't even know if they would be targeted ivn first place).

Well I am ditching this discussion now, as all relevant arguments were said.

[Chosen_Hero]

Originally Posted by Gundamx

if you watch Game of Thrones.
Then Gjallarhorn will be what if House of Stark actually mange live in capital for years and got corrupted like other nobles.

Don't see it, if anything they are the Lannisters, they go a hold of power in a revolution then took the reins through shady means and are now plotting every dirty move they can to get rid of their enemies while giving 0 fucks about what anyone thinks of them and of course they have those members that have noticed how corrupt they are and are confused as to what to do considering how loyal they are to them.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

1) What the hell are you talking about?

What are you talking about? You've been saying the Tekkadan should have run instead of whatever they're doing. And that Gjallahorn wouldn't have had the forces to spare chasing after them.

And now you're saying the running they should have done would have been to the other workers getting massacred.

Oh, and you were also saying Gjallahorn's plan was to kill everyone, but that they'd have let the ship that delivered weapons to the rebel run away.

Really, I don't know how you think any of that would have gone well for the Tekkadan.

[FlareKnight]

I give props to Gjallahorn for the utter brutality and plain evil of their plan. Push the people to fight and give them weapons. Then if they don't cross the line, blow up part of a building yourself and then use that as an excuse to attack, slaughtering the moderates. Then basically hand suits and ships over to these workers, luring them out and slaughter them. At most you lost some people working in the facilities that were hit when the workers 'stole' the equipment, but that's about it.

Also thank god Kudelia has finally had something traumatic enough happen to make her step up. No more of this helpless "woe is me" character. Someone who lost someone she cared for and now wants to achieve something.

Also nice that the fights do still have that weight to them.

[germanturkey]

I was hoping for a great speech from kudelia at the end with white reflection playing over it. i am disappoint.

[ninjastarforcex]

kudelia should start singing and dancing like lacus clyine, that will unite all people
or just form some k-pop group with atra and meribit and make everyone your fans

[Faux Mecha]

at least they still had the evolving OP song sequence gimmick, this time having the Gusion & Ryusei-Go Graze now flying side by side with the launched Barbatos, with Merribit replacing Fumitan as the bridge bunny for said launch sequence, poor Fumitan..........

[Galaxian]

The Gali Gali bit was funny, but for me "Ryusei-go" takes the prize, specially after the reaction between Ride and the old man.