2018-02-14, 13:53 | Link #42 | ||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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2018-02-14, 21:42 | Link #43 | |
Bittersweet Distractor
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 32
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The reputation system was very much this for forum activities. There could have been reforms done on the system that didn't do away with it entirely but it's definitely got to be one of the reasons. Not that I think these sorts of addictive dopamine incentives are a good thing to have in society.
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2018-02-14, 23:02 | Link #44 |
On a mission
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Oh I know what.
Stop demanding the rules be changed just because one is butthurt over the results. I feel people value consistency and simplicity over what is "optimal" Good thing it didn't happen this year, but like every year before some anomaly happened (so-and-so won too many awards) like anyone really gives a shit. Adopting Blizzard's balancing scheme is just annoying. But really, IMO the crew has done all it can. Just not enough momentum anymore
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2018-02-15, 01:08 | Link #46 |
Princess or Plunderer?
Join Date: May 2009
Location: the Philippines
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Lol no.
The rep system shifted the focus from the actual content to the poster and whether this poster belongs to some social circle within the forum community. So if I, for example, was established as someone who just comes to a thread to drop strong opinions of a show, someone who doesn't like my way of posting could just go and neg-rep each of my posts until people see the conga line of red blocks and stop taking my posts seriously. This destructive effect was one big reason why the reputation system was shut down, and I will try to prevent its revival, even if I have to hoard the Dragon Balls in my basement.
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2018-02-15, 03:32 | Link #47 | |
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 41
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And, by the way (to address an earlier post), if anyone wants to send us new banner images for any current theme, we'll consider them if they're decent. I can put the different current-theme backgrounds somewhere. Briefly, anime discussion in a simulcast, streaming world is completely different than the fansub world. The knowledge gap between raw viewers and sub viewers is gone, and that drove a lot of interest/demand (and certainly the torrent tracker played into that). This is why we still see a fair bit of traffic in novels and manga, where this is still a factor (people still sign up to this site today looking to discuss novel/manga raws). I'd also say anecdotally that a lot of people I know stopped doing the weekly cycle and just binge watch stuff, so that basically kicks you out of the discussion too. There's no magic fix for any of this stuff, but I don't think there's any desire among the staff to make changes that would encourage shitposting or lower the quality of discussion just to build more controversy traffic. (Unlike every single site that has advertising, we aren't paid by the click.) I still think there's more than just that at play if you want to get raw increased participation in this contest (there still is a decent community on this site, this notwithstanding), but just like the site itself, it's a question if you want to change the design/vision/strategy to pursue traffic or not.
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2018-02-15, 04:33 | Link #48 | ||
Unspecified
Scanlator
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Unspecified
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2018-02-15, 14:05 | Link #49 | |
sleepyhead
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: event horizon
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With regard to other social media. They don't really show per-user karma but per-post karma from my point of view. Subscriber/Viewer counts is what's really the equivalent if I were to name one, but I can respect viewcounts at least. I can tolerate up/down on posts, it at least can be said to directly add something to a debate. These days the only variation I'm really happy with is the "reaction" system (as seen on things like Discord, Github and the like). To described it plainly, responding to posts with a random emoji of your choice (usernames names shown); looks otherwise similar to up/down system, but personally like it when people use anything but up/down emotes unless it's an actual question. What's considered current theme? the blue gradient? or is there some winter requirement?
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2018-02-16, 03:09 | Link #50 |
You're Hot, Cupcake
Join Date: Aug 2008
Age: 42
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Dopamine/upvoting is for glimmer agents who follow the masses, addicted top 10 anime betrayals every 5 minutes seasoned with omegaluls.
There is nothing wrong with being a smaller community. So what if Reddit and Crunchyroll are where the bigger numbers are? There are consequences to bigger communities. And I remember them when they were here. There was considerably more hostility. There were more flame wars. There were zealots who would stop at nothing to make their point of view the only acceptable point of view in a series thread. Heck, even in 2016 there were zealots here who just wouldn't stop crusading. Or that popular titles were the only titles that mattered. Because popularity is the only thing dictating the quality of a title or what the masses should do, right? No, of course it isn't....If anything, I feel while there is less activity here, that I have been able to say some things without it turning into World War 3. So this place is smaller these days. So be it. AniDB, ANN and the like plod on. They have their own way. We have our own way. And while there are some Youtubers that are bastions now like Gigguk, Mother'sBasement, etc. that do have overall merit to them, there comes a point where their constant omegalul-centric ways do get tiresome. I give Gigguk more time because he is able to be serious at times and get valid points across. But as Youtubers and streamers have shown, omegalul antics get more views, so they have to cater to that. And throw in the self depreciation of anime fans/one of us mentality - more negativity/ranting comes from it. Because heck, you're not allowed to have any self-value or be a decent person if you're an anime fan, if you actually believe that dumb mentality. But there is something to remember. To enjoy anime does not require being backed up by the masses or feeling some sort of justification from being part of the masses. Watch anime for your own reasons and your own fulfillments. When I came to that conclusion a few years ago, I enjoyed the medium more than I had in a long time. And remember that anime fans are generally not that sociable to begin with. Plenty of them wouldn't even bother saying something out loud. Even an emote would be a big deal for some. As for the poll results, decent overall. One title's backing across any community chills me, but meh, each to their own. It's their right to like it. Good work, Haak. Be well, people. Don't fall victim to glimmer agents.
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Last edited by Last Sinner; 2018-02-16 at 12:17. |
2018-02-17, 02:06 | Link #51 | |
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 41
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This gradient is a winter theme, but there are other gradients for each season (Spring, Summer, Fall/Halloween, and Christmas). I can post them all somewhere with an open call for more additions.
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2018-02-17, 05:27 | Link #52 |
そのおっぱいで13才
Join Date: Dec 2006
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I'm just going to drop in and say I would disagree with bringing back the rep system (yes, I know it wouldn't come back anyways).
All that does is motivate people to act outside of their actual opinion. "If I said this, then I might get up-voted/down-voted!" It's hardly helpful. On top of that, because people can do it without giving their names, that also brings in another factor of meh-ness. As for the social media whatevers that supposedly addict people to coming back on... Yes, I get that people get "happy" over others giving those weird heart things on Twitter or whatever. That's nothing to really brag about. It's not necessarily good. And it isn't worth the trade-off. And you know, the results will never really be satisfying for these type of things, no matter where you go. The bigger your population, in fact, the easier it is for the more well-known hyped but not actually good stuff or casual stuff that people just happen to know more to "win" awards. It's just for the fun of things. If people told me One Piece won more awards than Kissdum, good for them. Me? Spoiler:
PS: Wait, Animesuki stopped hosting torrents or something? I'm honestly out of the loop on that since I never really used the site for that purpose...
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2018-02-17, 07:56 | Link #53 | |
sleepyhead
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: event horizon
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I'll take that as a yes to just the gradient being the requirement.
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2018-02-17, 16:23 | Link #55 | ||
Bittersweet Distractor
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 32
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I recognize this is different from the moderator's perspective, you always had to manage the negative side effects of the system, but this is where I think you guys tend to be out of touch with the user base as a whole to be frank and as usual cater to the more sensitive among the community in order to lessen your own workload. There were ways to reform the reputation system or go to another system that maintained its positives and less of its negatives. If you're looking at the post reputation system world of AS as the golden years of discussion here, then that kind of makes me sad. Quote:
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2018-02-17, 17:45 | Link #56 |
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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I'm with Reckoner on this one. My experience is that the declining activity has been a real let down. I used to love the times when I could have so much discussions. Sure there was a lot of crap too (like the amount of time I wasted arguing that Naruto would ultimately end up with Sakura XP) but I still found it fun. Now I feel like I have to put in effort just to stay active and even when I do post I feel like I'm talking to air a lot of the time. I've even sometimes found myself deliberately being stubborn on arguments just to find an excuse to be more active. That's how sad and deprived I am. XP
When members say that they had rubbish experiences with the reputation system and the activity then I can believe them. But let me point out the fact that the whole reason we're having this discussion in the first place is that the Awards (which everyone here still appreciates) has been in serious jeopardy and now we're even having to downsize it. That's also a consequence of the declining activity. I don't mean to belittle other people's perspectives here. People have had different experiences on this forum and I can appreciate that. And if you guys still think the trade-off is worth it, then I can't convince you otherwise. But I do feel the need to at least get a word in because the last thing I want is for people to believe that there is a consensus on this when there isn't. In fact I'm pretty sure there are loads more that would agree with me. You just won't hear it because most of them have already left. And for what it's worth I liked the reputation system too: It was what kept me interested in this site during my dumb socially withdrawn teenage years. XP I'm also really worried that this forum is going to die and I'd hate for that to happen. I feel like there's a lot of misplaced optimism that activity levels have plateaued (or will even increase) but I'm not convinced. I've seen forums die and it kills a part of me every damn time.
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2018-02-17, 19:58 | Link #57 |
sleepyhead
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: event horizon
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Are you guys talking about the little messages you would get with each rep? Or the bars?
There's kind of two parts to this, there's the bars, and then there's the rep messages which are more of a personal thing since only you could see them. I know they're technically part of the same system but they're really not. It's tweakable, so we can actually have rep, with such absurd high levels that to get 2 bars is phenomenal, and so and such. The reason it was removed, and what people complain about, was not the messages but the bars (as I recall). So which one are you both referring to? I can totally see where you're coming from if it was the messages. But if it's the bars I find it hard to see the argument here. To have a discussion you need,
Lets assume for a sec the rep system was re-enabled (since it's that simple unless someone dropped something), BUT, in this alternative reality Naruto never existed as a forum! only as a single thread. Do you think your Sakura X Naruto would have existed as more then a 3-4 post thing on page 20XX? I mean just look at this thread to see single-thread-syndrome in action (not talking about this rep thing here either). If you want a chance of going back to the old ways the moderation team has to go back to the old "seeded discussion" and per-series/multi-series moderators (instead of everyone is supermod as I believe they are now) as well as "free market" when it comes to topics. Otherwise yes of course "my review of", "news on", "update for" are going to reign king, since a generic topic elicits generic posts, and you don't get any "oh I didn't read/post in that topic" kind of replies either. But there's one tiny wincy problem with all that as well. It's ALL assuming equal opportunity when it comes to the material in question. I have a sneaking suspecion that while not entirely, but at least in part, a large problem is that, stuff is just not as interesting to talk about. Like I said, and I really want to hear counter arguments on this, but I feel like both emotional stock is low and points of contention is at an all time low. There's always the obvious personal reasons involved (sometimes you just grow out of it) but then there's also just the nature of the thing. So for example you might like all the moe fluff but, there really isn't much to talk about with them, not as much as say some gundam show, or any show with deep political system and world building. Some of these newer trends also seem to have these really annoying akward discussions that come up (single father with daughter show... [insert 100 lolicon accusation posts]). I feel like for a long time now shows have been moving away from world building and heavily leaning on "cute girls doing cute stuff" (and more recently, "cute boys doing cute boy stuff") as well as just having a single "edge" to them rather then a myriad of things piled up. There's then also the issue of tropes. What are some new tropes? Anyone actually seen any? Similarly the old tropes are so trenched in that it's impossible to even think of the alternative happening. In Franxx is it even worth thinking about the main dude ending up with any other girl but 002? Like it used to happen that we would have these discussions, feels a bit pointless for new shows. Don't get me wrong, they work great, it's good show and all, but when you have this case of very finely tuned perfected tropes, you're in the situation where it's nice to watch, but there's no much to talk about. Occasionally I'll watch a ol' goodie I missed, and maybe it's just me, but they feel a bit less predictable, not completely unpredictable in places but less of a smooth curve overall. You don't necesarily feel like they're sticking to some nothing actually matters template (fluffy shows) or a extremely strict formulaic theme.
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2018-02-17, 21:19 | Link #58 |
On a mission
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Rep system I won't miss. It was a fun minigame but I think it was toxic and just another form of an echo chamber. It would be a strong tendency to not seperate a post from a poster.
It is just like what gets upvoted in reddit. Rarely it is the most thoughtful post but generally a modest quip that is inline with groupthink that makes sure to be safe enough to not offend anyone and also because people don't have time to read long posts. It was also a moderation burden since some saw it as a way to secretly insult people, which it really isn't.
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2018-02-18, 13:09 | Link #59 | |
Kana Hanazawa ♥
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 37
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Regarding the removal of the rep system, I do think it is one of the factor that caused people to leave. Some people need to know their posts are appreciated or at least read, and it was an easy way to do that. Just had to click one button and that was it. Now when we see a really good post, and we don't have anything to add to it, we can do nothing, which might give that person the impression their post was totally ignored. PMs and VMs aren't practical for that purpose, and if you post a simple "great post", it will be considered spam by the mods.
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2018-02-19, 01:38 | Link #60 | |
On a mission
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And then there are the fucking dipshits that pass off spoilers as "hints" usually to skirt around spoiler rules but usually to win an argument using advance knowledge of the show, probably involving shipping or the other big one is "you're watching the show wrong" That kind of shit is alienating, and it's quite evident in some cases. For example, I watched Hibike Euphonium after it aired and avoided all discussion about it. It was pretty enjoyable because with all the buzzing around I sensed that the discussions on certain topics would be pure cancer. Unfortunately I didn't take that advice for season 2. And again, it's much worse everywhere else. I guess it's really just a sign of the times. Oh sorry. I really do think this should be a separate topic. Should keep the optimism up in this thread, so I do extend my appreciation to the folks that make these things possible despite tough times.
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