Attack on Titan - Episode 25 (END) Discussion / Poll

[LuxorMG]

I wonder why they changed the wall scenes so much.

But most anime-only viewers wouldn't notice the changes, and the episode pretty much hits most of the important points.

[BatouFTW]

I knew this thread was goin to be 90% bitching by manga readers. You guys can stop reading here.

For those of us who are watching and enjoying the anime for its own sake... anybody who still feels sorry for Annie after this ep... wow, issues!

[Revolutionist]

I certainly never felt sorry for Annie, but I get the impression they're painting her as a tragic character of sorts in order to raise sympathies from viewers. My problem with this is that it falls short when pretty much every other main character has a tragic past, and in some cases worse than hers.

[kitten320]

I don't really see how is it issues when Annie was forced to take part in a mission since she was a child. Then she got attached to people whom she eventually would have to kill (yet she didn't)... that's pretty sad if you ask me.

Just for information, key phrase her father says is "Even if whole world will hate you, I will always be on your side".

Just try to put yourself in her shoes. While her actions towards humanity are unforgivable, I think she deserved at least a bit of pity/compassion from viewer's point of view.

Even raged full Eren seemed shaken by her crying face.

Of course in comparison to Eren/Mikasa, her past is nothing. But unlike them she was constantly put under stress what can lead to mental break down. It actually looked like she had one in episode 23.

[Eragon]

Okay, I just got to ask one thing from those who saw the episode. Did they really put Mikasa in place of Armin in most scenes with Eren ?

[Mad Pierrot]

Man, that fight scene!

I really liked that last scene where Eren was eating his meal. Kind of reminded me to the first episodes where they had to force him to eat it. Also, it's kind of funny how some hours ago he was eating Titan flesh.

Also that last second with the Colossial Titan... What the heck?!

[kitten320]

Yes.

Mikasa is the one pulling Eren out of titan body unlike in manga where it was Armin.
Armin also isn't sitting on Eren's bed, just standing further down in the room.

[BatouFTW]

So, first my overall reaction. This was not in my top few favorite episodes, for sure. Mainly, I felt that it lacked the desired amount of feels. The reactions of Eren and Mikasa to the events seemed weirdly muted, I was really hoping for some of the emotional impact we had in the classic episodes. Although there was some badass titan fighting, I didn't like it nearly as well as the first faceoff between FT and Eren.

Spoiler:

I really wanted to see collaboration between Eren and his fellow soldiers in 3DMG as the key to defeating the FT, and actually there was practically no 3DMg action at all, other than Mikasa's ruthless defingeration job, which was definitely the best scene in the ep.

As for Annie...

Spoiler:

So they confirmed that she is, in fact, a psychopath. Her domineering father with his Hit Girl-esque program to make a perfect killer produced a monster who takes pleasure in killing, and unleashed her on the world after realizing his mistake. It remains unclear whether she already had titanshift powers at that stage, my guess is she got them after leaving home. So I'm retracting my theory that her dad is the armored titan. That leaves the relationship between the FT and the AT/CT very puzzling. And Erwin has reached the conclusion that there are LOTS of unrevealed titan-shifters lurking within thee walls and he wants to recruit them... so there may be factions among the shifters. All very intriguing.

Dat postcredit teaser tho:

Spoiler:

I can't tell if that's the colossal or a new shifter titan we haven't seen yet. It actually was a thing I noticed about the animation in this whole ep, the faces looked animated differently and weirdly off sometimes to the point of not immediately recognizing them (like Levi at the end in particular, I was thrown off).

It's also unclear to me whether that teaser represents an actual event (titan "x" is about to scale or break through the wall, some undefined time after the evets of the ep), or whether it is just an "image" picture that expresses the idea "titans still out there".

[BatouFTW]

Originally Posted by kitten320

Just for information, key phrase her father says is

Spoiler:

"Even if whole world will hate you, I will always be on your side".


No, the key phrase is, "I made a mistake. I won't ask you to forgive me."

He realized that he had created a monster.

[larethian]

WTF is with the changes? The stuff with Eren aside, I think they are not going for season 2 given the changes.

Spoiler:

Even with that glimpse of a Titan in the wall, it will be hard for them to turn it around and connect back to the original plot.

[BatouFTW]

Originally Posted by kitten320

Even raged full Eren seemed shaken by her crying face.

Eren is still coming to terms with the depth of her betrayal, as in his difficulty doing the titanshift.

As with the bitching over the tunnel scenes, I do not find it OOC or unrealistic that a period of MINUTES under extreme stress is too long to digest the fact that someone you respected and admired and learned a lot from was just putting on a act and was actually

Spoiler:

a sadistic killer who only finds pleasure in the death of her victims.

It's like those neighbors/family they interview when someone turns out to be a serial killer/molester whatever. Sometimes it's 'we always knew he was messed up' but sometimes it's, 'that's impossible, he was a model citizen!'"

[desrtsku]

Originally Posted by larethian

Spoiler:

Even with that glimpse of a Titan in the wall, it will be hard for them to turn it around and connect back to the original plot.

Spoiler for what the heck?:

What makes you think that? They never disconnected themselves from the original plot in the first place ... they even threw off a preview of the next arc. The only things that changed are character interactions and how things lead up to Annie's defeat.

Originally Posted by BatouFTW

Spoiler:

No, the key phrase is, "I made a mistake. I won't ask you to forgive me."

He realized that he had created a monster.

Nope it's not.

EDIT : nevermind, I misunderstood the point.

[kitten320]

Originally Posted by BatouFTW

Spoiler:

"Even if whole world will hate you, I will always be on your side".


No, the key phrase is, "I made a mistake. I won't ask you to forgive me."

He realized that he had created a monster.

No, I meant it more in defence.

But I guess you are right.

Actually whole flashback has lots of tiny pieces of information that are important.

[BatouFTW]

Originally Posted by richardtengcy

i actually like the animation they did when Eren and Mikasa was alone in the resting room....you can see magic dust!

The plant was a nice touch too, but I thought that scene was way underplayed. Quite emotionally unsatisfying.

[desrtsku]

Originally Posted by BatouFTW

The plant was a nice touch too, but I thought that scene was way underplayed. Quite emotionally unsatisfying.

How was that unsatisfying? If you ask me, it was more unnecessary than anything else. And by "unnecessary", I mean that whatever else you put there to replace it, even if it's more "emotionally satisfying", would be just as useless from a narrative point of view.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by BatouFTW

Dat postcredit teaser tho:

Spoiler:

I can't tell if that's the colossal or a new shifter titan we haven't seen yet. It actually was a thing I noticed about the animation in this whole ep, the faces looked animated differently and weirdly off sometimes to the point of not immediately recognizing them (like Levi at the end in particular, I was thrown off).

It's also unclear to me whether that teaser represents an actual event (titan "x" is about to scale or break through the wall, some undefined time after the evets of the ep), or whether it is just an "image" picture that expresses the idea "titans still out there".

It's none of that. It was supposed to the most shocking revelation of the entire series and they completely mishandled it (Mikasa and Hanji not witnessing this will likely cause major problems later on, I assume they'll retcon this in the first ep of the second season) so I can't blame you for misunderstanding. What this is telling us is that the walls are made of titans. It's the kind of revelation that makes you question everything you thought you know, they shouldn't have included it as an afterthought.

[DevilHighDxD]

Honesty speak, no matter how Annie is experienced at using her titan form Eren still overwhelmed her. If not for her Harden-skin ability to give her some advantage over Eren, she will be devoured by Eren. Eren's blood lust seem to be the thing that fuel his titan, the more he want to destroy the stronger it become.

[BatouFTW]

Originally Posted by kitten320

No, I meant it more in defence.

But I guess you are right.

Actually whole flashback has lots of tiny pieces of information that are important.

Spoiler:

I assume those are dead bodies of Annie's victims in the foreground of the flashback shots. (So brief and blurry it was hard to tell in the lowres I watched) Maybe even her own family, which would be a nice counterpoint to Eren, who killed as a child to SAVE others.

[desrtsku]

Originally Posted by Kanon

It's none of that. It was supposed to the most shocking revelation of the entire series and they completely mishandled it (Mikasa and Hanji not witnessing this will likely cause major problems later on, I assume they'll retcon this in the first ep of the second season) so I can't blame you for misunderstanding. What this is telling us is that the walls are made of titans.

I disagree with that, it's the second most shocking revelation of the entire series and this is nothing compared to how the other one was handled.

Jokes aside, no, they won't retcon anything. Mikasa seeing that or not wouldn't have any impact on the story other than missing one or two epic reaction faces.
As for Hanji, the pastor did mention the "XXXX" during Annie and Eren's fight = he will talk to someone. And as long as he does, it doesn't matter whether it's Hanji or not. I don't see any major problem here.

And one last point, I made a rant about how it's not politically correct to end an anime with a massive overdramatic cliffhanger. I'm glad it didn't happen and that our position is reversed.

[kitten320]

^That's another adaptation problem.

Eren is nowhere near her level. Annie takes him out literally in 2 kicks and one punch. First kick destroys his leg, second his head, and a punch frees her from his teeth grab.

He only lands one punch on her after church scene.

Eren was no match for her in manga while here anime team made Annie look weak.