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Rising Dragon · 2012-05-04, 23:00

... except that's not what they say. All Vita says is that the mages are weak and they can take them down. The only one who mentions anything about the barrier is Signum in the next episode, and even then she doesn't remark on who is maintaining it.

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-04, 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

... except that's not what they say. All Vita says is that the mages are weak and they can take them down. The only one who mentions anything about the barrier is Signum in the next episode, and even then she doesn't remark on who is maintaining it.

Certainly it wasn't Chrno, nor Yuuno. Nanoha and Fate also accesed it latter so it's not them either and judging by Shamal being in the need of casting a devastating thunder to deploy the barrier i think the theory of being a jointed effort by TSAB grunts makes good sense.

Rising Dragon · 2012-05-04, 23:25

Then say it's a theory. Don't spout it off as fact.

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-05, 00:00

Then who was supporting the barrier strong enough to require Signum spend a cartridge to force her entry and Shamal to cast an immensely powerfull spell to get out? If you have the answer please share it with the class xD

Rising Dragon · 2012-05-05, 00:12

It's not said. It's entirely possible your theory is right. It's also entirely possible, though, that the Arthra maintained it. We do know that the technology for drawing mana from planets for use by machines exists--but we have no confirmation.

Lhklan · 2012-05-05, 00:25

Aki... Even if your theory is right, there is no proof, as such you can't said it like it's true. Beside, where would the grunts come from? THis is an Unadmistered World. No way in hell are they gonna send that many here.

Rising Dragon · 2012-05-05, 00:28

Oh, he's correct on the presence of grunts. Around a dozen of them confronted Vita and Zafira alongside Chrono in the scene he's referring to. Any military presence the Bureau had during A's would've been stationed on the Arthra.

That they were the ones maintaining the barrier? That's what we have no proof on.

Lhklan · 2012-05-05, 00:29

Right. But if they're confronting Vita and Zafira, how would they maintain the barrier?

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-05, 00:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lhklan

Aki... Even if your theory is right, there is no proof, as such you can't said it like it's true. Beside, where would the grunts come from? THis is an Unadmistered World. No way in hell are they gonna send that many here.

While it's true neither Vita or Zafira mentioned anything about the soldier mantaining a barrier, it's undoubtly they were there, just rewatch A's 4 to confirm it xDU.

About the Arthra supporting the barrier sounds like a good theory but that's impossible because the Arthra was under repairs on TSAB's main HQ at the moment while the Mission was being commanded by Amy from a building on Uminary during Lindy's abscence. In your defense they seem to have some technology inside the bulding as Amy was able to tranfer Nanoha, Fate and Arf inside the barrier with ease.

Rising Dragon · 2012-05-05, 00:38

Then it's likely that. I doubt it'd be those soldiers because they were confronting Vita and Zafira--it's hilariously stupid for the ones maintaining the entrapment barrier to be within combat range of their targets, especially when they know how dangerous said targets are. It doesn't make any sense for them to be the ones maintaining it.

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-05, 00:50

Well, they never intended to fight them at all, they serve as a diversion to set the two Wolks on one spot so Chrono would be able to prepare his powerfull attack on them xD

Rising Dragon · 2012-05-05, 00:58

Still hilariously stupid to attempt such a stunt with people maintaining the barrier. They wouldn't dare put what's holding the barrier in place in danger like that. Those soldiers would've been there as backup for Chrono in combat and nothing more.

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-05, 01:13

Well, they just were exactly 10 guys, probably another group as sustaining the barrier, but yeah it's not confirmed xDU

Keroko · 2012-05-05, 04:27

Barriers like that are pretty much self sustaining if you recall. Once cast, the caster can still engage in combat. Vita did it, Yuuno did it, whoever cast the barrier then could.

Chrono is as good a candidate as any of the grunts, really.

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-05, 09:57

How about Chrono AND the Grunts? Again the barrier seemed to be quite powerfull and widespread, Chrono is undoubtly badass and skilled but not powerfull, i doubt he, just by himself, could cast something strong enough to require Shamal casting the powers of darkness itself to destroy it xDU

Mow Yun · 2012-05-05, 10:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Oh, he's correct on the presence of grunts. Around a dozen of them confronted Vita and Zafira alongside Chrono in the scene he's referring to. Any military presence the Bureau had during A's would've been stationed on the Arthra.

That they were the ones maintaining the barrier? That's what we have no proof on.

A's Episode 4, about 19:07 ish.

Akiyoshi · 2012-05-05, 10:22

^ Thanks xD

Mistery solved xD

Archon_Wing · 2012-05-06, 04:17

Well from what I've seen, defensive and barrier abilities tend to be overpowered; that is, it takes a lot more force to take one down than to set one up.

The Nanoha metagame is skewed towards outlasting the opponent, which is why Nanoha ends up so strong when properly upgraded and also why support mages like Yuno tend to very valuable.

Mow Yun · 2012-05-06, 05:56

Likely you have to have enough force to pierce their barrier, and then the bodily defenses (barrier jacket etc.) they may have.

Fate doesn't tend to try to outlast people, though. Her endurance is much less than Nanoha's.

Archon_Wing · 2012-05-06, 21:17

It's not easy to pierce through someone's shield, and when they do, they're already completely f'd anyways.

Fate is a special case, but she tends to rely on what we strategy gamers call an "all in play" where she either does or dies. Actually that about summarizes her fights; the most extreme example being her sonic form where she just focuses everything into offense. Unfortunately, it's also why she's struggled pretty heavily in most of her fights besides vs an inexperienced Nanoha and has had to outwit her opponents instead of relying on OP barriers and finishers.

Rarely does she wtfpwn anyone and come out like the enemy never had a chance, with Nanoha in season 1, an exception. It's just that having super dodging abilities in a game where people can flood the entire arena with death rays is just painful.

Of course, support spells are also a gamebreaker. Chrono supposedly doesn't have that high of a magical power but usually has enough abilities to really surprise his opponents. Not that I'm implying he should use them in a fight vs Grahmn. Just saying.

She sort of has a skirmisher role, which I don't really recall anyone else besides Erio usually taking up.

2012-05-04, 23:00	Link #781
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	... except that's not what they say. All Vita says is that the mages are weak and they can take them down. The only one who mentions anything about the barrier is Signum in the next episode, and even then she doesn't remark on who is maintaining it. __________________

2012-05-04, 23:25	Link #783
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Then say it's a theory. Don't spout it off as fact. __________________

2012-05-05, 00:00	Link #784
Akiyoshi The Flame Crussader Join Date: Aug 2009	Then who was supporting the barrier strong enough to require Signum spend a cartridge to force her entry and Shamal to cast an immensely powerfull spell to get out? If you have the answer please share it with the class xD __________________ May 29 2010-2019 ...9 years ago, the day after never would be the same ~The ASFB~

2012-05-05, 00:12	Link #785
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	It's not said. It's entirely possible your theory is right. It's also entirely possible, though, that the Arthra maintained it. We do know that the technology for drawing mana from planets for use by machines exists--but we have no confirmation. __________________

2012-05-05, 00:28	Link #787
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Oh, he's correct on the presence of grunts. Around a dozen of them confronted Vita and Zafira alongside Chrono in the scene he's referring to. Any military presence the Bureau had during A's would've been stationed on the Arthra. That they were the ones maintaining the barrier? That's what we have no proof on. __________________

2012-05-05, 00:25	Link #786
Lhklan The Unpronounceable Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Clock Tower	Aki... Even if your theory is right, there is no proof, as such you can't said it like it's true. Beside, where would the grunts come from? THis is an Unadmistered World. No way in hell are they gonna send that many here.

2012-05-05, 00:29	Link #788
Lhklan The Unpronounceable Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Clock Tower	Right. But if they're confronting Vita and Zafira, how would they maintain the barrier?

2012-05-05, 00:38	Link #790
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Then it's likely that. I doubt it'd be those soldiers because they were confronting Vita and Zafira--it's hilariously stupid for the ones maintaining the entrapment barrier to be within combat range of their targets, especially when they know how dangerous said targets are. It doesn't make any sense for them to be the ones maintaining it. __________________

2012-05-05, 00:50	Link #791
Akiyoshi The Flame Crussader Join Date: Aug 2009	Well, they never intended to fight them at all, they serve as a diversion to set the two Wolks on one spot so Chrono would be able to prepare his powerfull attack on them xD __________________ May 29 2010-2019 ...9 years ago, the day after never would be the same ~The ASFB~

2012-05-05, 00:58	Link #792
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Still hilariously stupid to attempt such a stunt with people maintaining the barrier. They wouldn't dare put what's holding the barrier in place in danger like that. Those soldiers would've been there as backup for Chrono in combat and nothing more. __________________

2012-05-05, 01:13	Link #793
Akiyoshi The Flame Crussader Join Date: Aug 2009	Well, they just were exactly 10 guys, probably another group as sustaining the barrier, but yeah it's not confirmed xDU __________________ May 29 2010-2019 ...9 years ago, the day after never would be the same ~The ASFB~

2012-05-05, 04:27	Link #794
Keroko Adeptus Animus Author Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 36	Barriers like that are pretty much self sustaining if you recall. Once cast, the caster can still engage in combat. Vita did it, Yuuno did it, whoever cast the barrier then could. Chrono is as good a candidate as any of the grunts, really.

2012-05-05, 09:57	Link #795
Akiyoshi The Flame Crussader Join Date: Aug 2009	How about Chrono AND the Grunts? Again the barrier seemed to be quite powerfull and widespread, Chrono is undoubtly badass and skilled but not powerfull, i doubt he, just by himself, could cast something strong enough to require Shamal casting the powers of darkness itself to destroy it xDU __________________ May 29 2010-2019 ...9 years ago, the day after never would be the same ~The ASFB~

2012-05-05, 10:22	Link #797
Akiyoshi The Flame Crussader Join Date: Aug 2009	^ Thanks xD Mistery solved xD __________________ May 29 2010-2019 ...9 years ago, the day after never would be the same ~The ASFB~

2012-05-06, 05:56	Link #799
Mow Yun Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Age: 34	Likely you have to have enough force to pierce their barrier, and then the bodily defenses (barrier jacket etc.) they may have. Fate doesn't tend to try to outlast people, though. Her endurance is much less than Nanoha's.