Gundam 00: A wakening of the Trailblazer - Expectations and Speculation

[SonicSP]

Theyve given us An update the other day with the New Trailer
and the weapons such as Bits and Harute's beam cannons.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Well Harute's beam cannons were pretty much shown in the second trailer. They were just used more in the third one.

[Jeffry2009]

I mean IF only they had a Full version of the trailer instead of Camrip version so I can Share you a pics for some updates for that.

[SonicSP]

There was one for a short but it was taken off the nico site, I think.

[GundamFan]

Originally Posted by rocawarde

gonna take a shot in the dark:

Yeah, their built-in. Raphael's backpack can go in two ways: 1. the backpack could be its own MS using Seravee standard equipment on a smaller MS. 2. The Backpack could double as armor for the main MS. Remember that Raphael is trying to improve on Seravee GNHW, I don't think it would be to much of a stretch to imagine the backpack as a direct kin to the Seravee functions.

*I know that my points sound lik i pull them out of the exhaust pipe. But from the trailers the backpack is hardly used. Guessing that the secret is in the backpack and it would be logical to rebuilt the Bazookas as cannons

Actauly Rocawarde it seems like very reasonable speculation and I have been thinking along the same lines given the size of backpack and that the line of MS that it is part of.

[SonicSP]

I've been doing some thinking on my own, and I'd come to a certain early conclusion of sorts.

Now, we know from pres sources and whatnot that the Zabanya and Harute will be re-using Cherudim and Arios frames. But we also know that Raphael will be utilizing Seravee in some ways from the development charts, yet even in the 00V Weapon Books fails to acknowledge Zabanya/Harute's status as re-using frames, despite labeling Raphael as so. Essentially it just repeats what the 00 genealogy said.

But then I did some thinking, and I'm think it may be because they're both different terms of re-using one's frame, which is why in the press Raphael wasn't mentioned about any re-usage of any sort and in the charts Zabanya/Harute was only showed a normal "developed from" term.

I think its because Zabanya and Harute does not re-use Cherudim/Arios's frames [well.......maybe just a little but not necessarily the same whole physical frame]. I think what is meant is that they use the exact same "frame" but not necessarily the same exact "physical frame".

Kinda like the, imagine if I say the "Generation One GN-X's frame", I could either be saying about the specific frame of one GN-X or I could referring to a general frame design that is standard across all of that GN-X model. Put it simply, a GN-X frame is a single design yet it physically exists not as one but many copies of the same thing. Yet under manufacturing terms, they are indeed the same because they're all mass produced of the same design, yet they're all separate physical entities.

Another example is, imagine if you lost your right hand. But then you have the doctors regenerate your hand [you can in 300 years at least]. Is it now the same hand? It is the same hand as before, the exact same in design.........but its not the same hand physically.

What I'm trying to say is, its possible that Harute and Zabanya may not be physically the same units as Cherudim and Arios but they re-use the exact same frame design as them. The saving that Cb get would be by not wasting development resources by developing new more advanced frames, which in turns limit their technological development [relative to developing new frames] and allows them to focus their efforts and resources on the more important 00Q [which as far as we know, have not been spared any development]. This may be why the charts do not acknowledge them in the same way it does with Raphael.



Raphael on the other hand, like mentioned with the GN Archer in the Genealogy and the HG Archer, may actually re-use some physical frame or parts of its former, Seravee. We know that Tiera made Raphael for his own use. If he developed it himself, then it means he must have acquired Seravee's frame and GN-Drive at some point. This gives it more chance and possible reason on why Tiera may be re-using Seravee physically in some form , since his situation involves him making the MS himself, which isn't impossible when he controls Veda, but his may be makeshift and desperate like CB. [but in a different manner, since not only is he most probably alone but if he produced it at CB, it will be under nose of the Federation. That will always be hard]


So in essence, the differing categories could possibly be that Zabarute re-uses their previous frames designs though not the same physically but Raphael may be the one that actually uses the older MS physically in some form.........like maybe...........a very suspicious ominous black backpack with GN Bazooka II looking thingies it? [LOL]

EDIT
[Yeah RD, thanks for pointing that out.]

[Rising Dragon]

The Zabanya and Harute will be re-using Zabanya and Harute's frames, huh?

=X

[GundamFan]

Personaly I think if they physical reused any of the frames Arios is one they're going to use out of Cheridum, Arios and Seravee. The reason I think the Arios is the most likely one out of the 3 frames is while any of them would need repairs the Arios at least has it's frame entact and won't need 2 limbs replaced.

[rocawarde]

Originally Posted by GundamFan

Actaully Rocawarde it seems like very reasonable speculation and I have been thinking along the same lines given the size of backpack and that the line of MS that it is part of.

True.

If it was me, I would think the Cherudim's physical frame would be easy to re-use.
Stripping it down to the bone then rebuilding a sturdy design that ends up being Zanbanya.

This will sound odd: I don't think Harute should have been connected to the Arios. A majority on its design and function came from the Kyrios and Archer. Instead of the regular Arios, I would have like them to personally mention Ascalon since they share a "Heavy Assault Fighter" purpose.

[Death Header]

If Harute and Zabaniya are using the same "frame" from Arios and Cherudim, compared to Raphael and 00Q (both of who are using a different frame), wouldn't that mean that Harute and Zabaniya aren't that big of an upgrade from Arios and Cherudim?

This leads me to wonder of the S2 gundams have the Same frame as the S1 gundams.

edit: note that it might not be possible Raphael to have the same frame as Seravee because Raphael looks like a skinny ass unit with a huge backpack while Seravee was a chunky unit with a smaller backpack.

[GundamFan]

Originally Posted by rocawarde

True.

If it was me, I would think the Cherudim's physical frame would be easy to re-use.
Stripping it down to the bone then rebuilding a sturdy design that ends up being Zanbanya.

Fair enough personaly I think between the missing limbs from Cherudim and the general way it was beat to hell it wouldn't be worth it but that's just my opinion.

This will sound odd: I don't think Harute should have been connected to the Arios. A majority on its design and function came from the Kyrios and Archer. Instead of the regular Arios, I would have like them to personally mention Ascalon since they share a "Heavy Assault Fighter" purpose.

They might make reference to the Ascalon in some of the supplemental material to come on about the Harute however they may also credit it to the GNHW/M Arios too.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Originally Posted by Death Header

If Harute and Zabaniya are using the same "frame" from Arios and Cherudim, compared to Raphael and 00Q (both of who are using a different frame), wouldn't that mean that Harute and Zabaniya aren't that big of an upgrade from Arios and Cherudim?

This leads me to wonder of the S2 gundams have the Same frame as the S1 gundams.

edit: note that it might not be possible Raphael to have the same frame as Seravee because Raphael looks like a skinny ass unit with a huge backpack while Seravee was a chunky unit with a smaller backpack.

Not really, going by the details and footage shown, they are vast upgrades. The usage of the same frame only means that they probably stripped down what was left of the Arios and Cherudim frames, and added all new stuff.

[rocawarde]

Originally Posted by GundamFan

Fair enough personally I think between the missing limbs from Cherudim and the general way it was beat to hell it wouldn't be worth it but that's just my opinion.

Trust me, My reasoning is base on the fact that Arios has a more complex transformation sequence than Harute. I would be lazy by saying: "Let's start wit fixing Cherudim up, then built a beef-up version. With the Arios to Harute we have to reformat the frame to work for Harute's transformation sequence and I don't feel like it "

Originally Posted by GundamFan

They might make reference to the Ascalon in some of the supplemental material to come on about the Harute however they may also credit it to the GNHW/M Arios too.

I hope so myself. Also, 00V mention that Ascalon was used to create the GNHW/M Arios. So its the other way around

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by rocawarde

Trust me, My reasoning is base on the fact that Arios has a more complex transformation sequence than Harute. I would be lazy by saying: "Let's start wit fixing Cherudim up, then built a beef-up version. With the Arios to Harute we have to reformat the frame to work for Harute's transformation sequence and I don't feel like it "

Actually, the Arios' transformation sequence isn't very complicated, and both the frame and the transformation for the Arios corresponds with the Harute's--both machines' shoulders fold up into a kind of nose-cone, and both machines have a piece of equipment on the back that folds over the back of the Gundam, over the folded shoulders. The differences lie in the transformation of the legs and the head--the Arios' head folds down, while the Harute's doesnt, and the legs swivel sideways, whereas the Harute's doesn't. Both easily fixable from the transition from Arios to Harute. From a frame standpoint, the Arios' legs and the Harute's legs are spaced the same way, and the basic design of the two match each other. From there, all they needed to do was add the new armor and the new back units, and add the folding chest piece.

[SonicSP]

Originally Posted by Death Header

If Harute and Zabaniya are using the same "frame" from Arios and Cherudim, compared to Raphael and 00Q (both of who are using a different frame), wouldn't that mean that Harute and Zabaniya aren't that big of an upgrade from Arios and Cherudim?

This leads me to wonder of the S2 gundams have the Same frame as the S1 gundams.

edit: note that it might not be possible Raphael to have the same frame as Seravee because Raphael looks like a skinny ass unit with a huge backpack while Seravee was a chunky unit with a smaller backpack.

The S2 Gundams was not mentioned to do so unlike Harute and Zabanya who have been mentioned to do so both in a directo statementand on it's mecha designer statements. Also 2 out of 4 of the S2 Gundams cannot be physically re-using the same frame as CB do not possess neither Kyrios nor Exia when they were made.

Also, I do not believe Raphael uses the same frame, I actually believe Raphael is a new frame that physically uses Seravee as something[since the developement chart used the term exclusively to Archer and Seravee], most notably that suspicious black backpack with the the GN Bazooka IIs on it and as mentioned in the 2 recent developement charts. Regardless, Tiera would have needed to aquired Seraphim at least just to get the GN Drive to pit inside Raphael

Of course, as for Zabarute the director's statement also said that due to them re-using the same frames, their technological developement is more limited however they still possess greater deal of firepower due to the new weapons and design they have.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Yeah, I'm not seeing much relation between Raphael and Seravee. It's all GNZ if ya ask me, only thing that they can be compared to is the heavy fire power.

[SonicSP]

Originally Posted by rocawarde

This will sound odd: I don't think Harute should have been connected to the Arios. A majority on its design and function came from the Kyrios and Archer. Instead of the regular Arios, I would have like them to personally mention Ascalon since they share a "Heavy Assault Fighter" purpose.

Okay, first of all Arios is from Kyrios so it makes sense to mention Arios as well as the Archer. But more importantly the Ascalon isn't actually related to Harute actually, mainly because the Ascalon was not even finished and the Ascalon was made as a general purpose type. Arios is probably the mention because they took Arios and then upgraded it unto the Harute rather than relying on the data of Ascalon, regardless of whether they're similar or not, Of course they also made a speciLAtion mention of the XN Raiser so more than they could have been influenced than more than the GN Buster Sword III you know.

Of course, they not only followed the designs of the regular physically, they also took some influence by building the upgrades unto Arios as well so even though they're very different Arios as base data would have been very valuable to the base while things the weapons data was mentioned to have been taken from the XN Raiser. So even if it was indeed similar to Ascalon, they may not have necessarily relied on Ascalon's data especially since the Ascalon itself was never built.

Originally Posted by GundamFan

Fair enough personaly I think between the missing limbs from Cherudim and the general way it was beat to hell it wouldn't be worth it but that's just my opinion.

It's not that hard actually, missing limbs are replaced all the time quite often. But regardless of whether they are physically the same machines, I do feel like they have saved alot of resources by not developing new frames and just re-using the old designs.

Originally Posted by GundamFan

They might make reference to the Ascalon in some of the supplemental material to come on about the Harute however they may also credit it to the GNHW/M Arios too.

Hard to say, ironically among all of the movie Gundam, Harute is the only to have NOT been credited to it's Final Battle equipment. Raphael, Zabanya and 00Q a had their fin battle forms as their developement sources specifically.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Originally Posted by SonicSP

Hard to say, ironically among all of the movie Gundam, Harute is the only to have NOT been credited to it's Final Battle equipment. Raphael, Zabanya and 00Q a had their fin battle forms as their developement sources specifically.

What makes you say that? Harute looks just as complete and finalized with design and weapons as the other three.

[SonicSP]

sigh....sorry I worded it wrongly again.......

I meant that Harute is the was the only one out of the 4 MS that is credited to it's normal predecessor the Arios instead of the Arios GNHW/M. The other 3 all got credited to their final battle forms.[00 Raiser+GN Sword III, Cherudim GNHW/R and Seravee GNHW/B respectively]

[GundamFan]

I guys I notice this the other day when I was rewatching the first trailer during part of it you can't see Raphael only it's backpack now it's probably just the angle but maybe it's some sort of alteranet suit mode or the backpack detaches I have a link below to a picture of what I'm about.
http://superrobotwar.files.wordpress..._00m2_ss14.jpg

I'm a little disappointed to see the ESF is still using the A-Laws Battlecruiser I never liked the design and was hoping the ESF by now would be fielding a new type of cruiser and maybe a destroyer class too.