2010-06-16, 07:39 | Link #2123 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: In the middle of nowhere
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Well, not all of them, but yeah, Kai's dub is generally a lot more faithful than the dub of Z... apparently. I haven't actually seen it myself, and quite frankly, I probably won't, as I sort of lost interest in Kai halfway through the Freeza-battle. Despite them trimming it down, I thought it was still way too slow. I mean, come on, this is supposed to be the filler-free version, yet Namek still takes 4 episodes to explode?
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2010-06-16, 08:24 | Link #2124 | |
Beautiful fighter.
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: England, UK
Age: 37
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What you're saying is that after Freeza stated that namek will explode in five minutes, that it did explode in five minutes later in the episode, instead of 4/5 episodes later? Sure that would make sense, though would completely destroy the climax moments of the end of the arc.
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2010-06-16, 08:56 | Link #2125 |
廉頗
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Massachusetts
Age: 34
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Also, '5 minutes' on a television show very rarely, if ever, would actually mean '5 minutes.' That isn't just in shounen, or anime, or whatever, I'm talking all TV. Watch American sitcoms, dramas, etc, it is pretty much universal that time is not the same in the TV world as the real world.
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2010-06-16, 09:50 | Link #2126 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: In the middle of nowhere
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But they didn't cut all the filler. That's the whole point. I've read the manga, and while it's obvious that they couldn't fit all that content into just five minutes of screentime, 4 episodes is still far too much, and considering how stuff like Goku "dying" and Gohan returning to hold of Freeza was supposedly kept, I can't say I'm particularly impressed at their efforts to cut it down either. Sure, having it actually last 5 minutes would be almost impossible, and 1 episode might not be enough either, but I'm pretty damn sure they could cover everything that happened in those 8 chapters in 2 episodes, considering how short an average Dragonball-chapter is, and how those 8 chapters were mostly just fighting.
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2010-06-16, 10:14 | Link #2128 | |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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I've read the manga too, and there's no way in hell they could have fit those 8 chapters into 2 episodes. An episode of DB Kai usually covers 3 chapters at most.
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2010-06-16, 10:28 | Link #2129 |
Wise Kitty Cat
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
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As much as I dislike the filler, too, there's no denying that to avoid all filler, they'd have to reanimate the show from scratch. I think they're doing the best with what they have to work with, which wiki says are digital lifts from the original animation. Androids pacing has been great so far but I know that during Cell Games, for example, there's no way of cutting Mr. Satan's fan club entirely out because, like Kuma said, the animation would become choppy and awkward.
Someone could argue that Kai could've been a complete re-animation using the team that does the opening, but quite honestly I think the original animation looks most similar to the manga. I think they've struck a good balance between old and new styles, and a true HD remaster with most of the filler removed is enjoyable enough for me. |
2010-06-16, 17:33 | Link #2131 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
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^ Exactly. The entirety of the Goku vs. Frieza fight was 20 chapters in the manga, which was by far the longest one-on-one battle in the whole story. Kai's adaptation of this fight is 10 episodes. I don't see a problem with the pacing here.
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2010-06-16, 20:56 | Link #2132 |
Mad Scientist
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jersey
Age: 38
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I dunno, for me, the Freeza battle doesn't really feel any less sluggish simply by saying "it was like that in the manga". It provides justification, but not necessarily a remedy. I just chalk it up as an unfortunate side effect of trying to build a castle with someone else's legos.
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2010-06-17, 06:23 | Link #2133 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: In the middle of nowhere
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One chapter of the manga very rarely provides enough material for 10 minutes of the anime without dragging things out. Heck, there are some chapters that barely have enough material for 2 minutes. I feel that Toei is doing this whole thing the wrong way. Keeping filler like Bulma and Ginyu because those scenes overlapped with canon material? They've shown several times that they're perfectly willing to reanimate scenes, so that really shouldn't be an issue at all. They could just reanimate the scenes without any references to the fillers.
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2010-06-17, 07:18 | Link #2134 |
Banned
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So much for a filler free version they kept yaping about... That is why Kai is a big failure for me.
And by the way, how strong is the lord of the dead Enma? Kami said Kaio is stronger than him yet he keeps supressing all the far more powerful villains that go there and sends them to hell? Or that is filler too and all villains are imediately stripped of their bodies and powers when they die? |
2010-06-17, 07:47 | Link #2135 |
Beautiful fighter.
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: England, UK
Age: 37
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Regarding the obvious reason as to why they can't remove 100% of the filler, i'd say they're doing a mighty fine job of Kai. I mean the past 5 episodes of the Android arc are a great example.
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2010-06-17, 08:13 | Link #2137 |
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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Vegeta and Nappa's introduction was reanimated to correct the color of Vegeta's hair and armor. There also seem to be a few reanimated shots in most episodes, but for the most part, they're just traced over the old material, so I'm not quite sure why they even bother.
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2010-06-17, 08:30 | Link #2138 | |
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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And "reanimate" really isn't the correct word to use here. At most, they'll trace over the original animation. That's completely different from actually redoing a scene with new animation and artwork entirely. All they're doing is slightly modifying the original source work. What you're asking for is not feasible. That was simply an error they fixed, which has nothing to do with actual pacing.
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2010-06-17, 08:45 | Link #2139 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
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I know. That still doesn't change the fact that one 15-page chapter of Dragonball rarely has enough material in it for 10 minutes of animation, especially during action-heavy chapters.
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2010-06-17, 09:04 | Link #2140 |
廉頗
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Massachusetts
Age: 34
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Why not? Watching a fight in real time would obviously include more details than watching one in a comic-style. You can't show as much detail in a comic/manga as you can in animated form, thus the fights are sometimes a bit longer. Even completely faithful anime adaptations will sometimes stretch scenes to make them fit better to the animated medium. Kai is supposed to be a 'director's cut,' and I think we're getting what was promised. No more, no less, but still pretty damn epic if you ask me.
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