Macross Delta - Episode 6 Discussion / Poll

[Tenzen12]

You know limit, I know limit and NUNS know nothing about it. Without knowledge it's necessary operate under worst case scenario.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

You know limit, I know limit and NUNS know nothing about it. Without knowledge it's necessary operate under worst case scenario.

Once again, I am talking about 7 years ago if the NUNs wanted to seriously destroy all the superiority complex suffered by the Wind, and there was no Var 7 years ago.

Even if Var was weaponized 7 years ago, once the Zentradi made landfall, its hardly useful at that point.

- Tak

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Tak

In episode 6, its pretty much blatantly stated that NUN felt this conflict is akin to unfriendly neighbors having a go, and its nothing that cannot be resolved by local authorities.

Question: How many planets are there under NUN's jurisdiction? The fact that they seem so relaxed over losing 3 planets to an enemy force makes me very curious here.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Question: How many planets are there under NUN's jurisdiction? The fact that they seem so relaxed over losing 3 planets to an enemy force makes me very curious here.

NUN's decentralizing policy means they do not have any planets, save for very core ones within the Solar-system, under direct jurisdiction. Every planet is part of the NUN, but the NUN does not intervene on their internal affairs. Its an organization that is even less centralized than the EU. See, NUN's territorial concept is one based on sectors, not individual stars, unless its Earth. Basically its the United States the founders envisioned, in space.

But defense of sovereignty on the frontiers are handled by local NUNs garrisons. Planets don't have their independent military.

Thus a few planets having disputes in the far edges of the galaxy is akin to having a problem with my next door neighbor, which is often resolved privately or by local authorities, not by an entire division of land, sea & air. For the NUN, its territories now cover more than 1/3 of the galaxy, one or two planets is, well, peanuts. For now.

And at least the Wind isn't bent on conquering the galaxy at the moment, but a star system.

When does the NUN actually respond? Well, when hostile forces directly threaten Earth, or when there is a fleet capable of wiping out entire sectors. The Wind atm can do neither.

- Tak

[magnuskn]

Just you wait until they have found whatever they are looking for.

OTOH, it'll probably make Heinz head explode in a bloody shower of gore. ^^

[Tak]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

OTOH, it'll probably make Heinz head explode in a bloody shower of gore. ^^

Probably an illegal copy of Exsedol Folmo singing My boyfriend is a pilot. There, I called it first!

- Tak

[magnuskn]

Damn, I can't top that.

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Question: How many planets are there under NUN's jurisdiction? The fact that they seem so relaxed over losing 3 planets to an enemy force makes me very curious here.

Updated list of planets.

Brisingr Globular Cluster:

Al-Shahal- Shahal City
Ragna- Barrette City
Windermere- Scarfell, Old Town of Carslisle
Listania (occupied)
Gregor
Randall
Voldor (occupied)
Airberl (occupied)- Ruins of Stig Stania
Anthem III (occupied)
Alfheim
Ionideth

Spoiler for Planets in Macross:

Airberl (Protoculture ruins- Ruins of Stig Stania, Invaded by Windermere)
Alfhiem
Al Shahal
Anthem III (Invaded by Windermere)
Avalon
Avemaria
Banipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)
Bellfan
Beneb
Cristania
Dahan
Eden
Eden 3 (not the same star system)
Elysium (abandoned)
Endebald
Ganymede (also a moon)
Gregor
Hue (Basara visited this planet on a Tousugeki Love Heart video)
Hydra
Ionideth
Iota
Jupiter (multiple satellite cities)
Listania (Invaded by Windermere)
Luna (technically a moon, but hey)
Mars
Neo York
Neptune (satellite city)
New Asia (Declared bio hazard)
Ragna( Homeworld of Ragnans)
Randall
Rax (Supposed to be colonized by Macross 5 but blew up.)
Salvation
Saturn (satellite city)
Sephira (Leon Sasaki's home colony)
Susia
Ouroboros
Vajra Homeworld (Colonized by Macross Frontier)
Varauta colony
4th "Ice" Planet in Varauta system. Formerly Arsenal Planet and origin world of Protodevlin and Supervision Army turned prison world.
Veil
Venus ("satellite city" orbital colony)
Voldor (Homeworld of Voldorans, Invaded by Windermere)
Vulcan
Windermere (Homeworld of Windermereans)
Zola (Homeworld of Zolans)

Thing is there are lots of fleets out there who either colonized, destroyed, MIA, revolted or still trying to find a planet to set roots on. 28 Megaroad fleets, at least 28 Macross fleets (No emigration fleet named Macross 13), 12 SDFN led fleets, Anti-Earth Zentradi that left Earth on their own emigration ships saying goodbye to the UNG out on parts unknown, and who knows how many more.

Oh there's Chlore's 97,000 ship strong Meltrandi fleet that allied with Macross 7 thus the NUN.

As to what NUNS HQ could be so busy about well take your pick. Anti-UN wannabees like the one who tried to take over an Island ship according to Mirage, Rebel Anti-Earth Zentradi. Uncultured Lost Zentradi fleets, Lactence Pro-Earth centrists, and oh Macross Galaxy.

[Tak]

Lets not even dismiss the core reason for the galactic seeding project. It was to ensure humanity (now including member races) to become strong enough so that one day it may go toe-to-toe, head-to-head against a full sized Zentradi fleet. By the end of SDF, there were still between 4 ~ 5 thousand active fleets out there. Compare that threat to the Wind, well, I think we can get the picture.

- Tak

[magnuskn]

I'll be honest, somehow that "4000-5000 active Zentradi fleets" and "we rule 1/3 of the galaxy" doesn't jive. Either they've integrated a great number of those fleets, or the fleets are off having a rock concert to all those incoming Sheryl Nome songs.

[Tak]

The 4 - 5k calculation came out directly from Exsedol's mouth, and affirmed by Boddole Zer. Those are still presumbly engaged in a war of attrition against Supervision forces within this galaxy or outside of it (the war has since escalated after the demise of Protoculture). The original fleet that invaded Earth pretty much stumbled upon it by accident. Although two additional fleets (Neld & Prado) would later come knocking, they were defeated ahem, integrated in 2036 and 2037. Anyway, Earth and a single gunship are probably too insignificant for the Zentradi.

Lets not forget Zentradi fleets are fully automated, with damaged ships most likely discarded than repaired. Factory provides just about everything as long as there are enough minerals for them. The Supervision Army is the other half, so its not hard to see which one takes priority.

In Frontier, humanity has mapped out 1/3 of the galaxy. No, the NUN does not own every single bit of it, but its certainly a bigger pie than a single Windermere.

- Tak

[Annorax]

Ah yes the Supervision army. Have they appeared in show, except for SDF-1 Macross?

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Annorax

Ah yes the Supervision army. Have they appeared in show, except for SDF-1 Macross?

Not directly. It would appear the Protodevlins are the closest thing at this point.

- Tak

[Tempester]

Man, I love Macross worldbuilding and lore.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Tempester

Man, I love Macross worldbuilding and lore.

I also noticed it has a lot of parallels to warhammer 40k, and 40k came out later.

- Tak

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Saying that Freya had advantage was not "jumping the gun", she did. On same note, now it's Mirage instead. Neither of that been impossible see by bare eyes.

There is no romance yet. Mirage hasn't caught on anything with Freyja because her character is painfully two-dimensional at best and underdeveloped. Even this episode, the emotional focus was Hayate's and Freyja learn the 'bad side' of their choices and what not, and must decide why they risk their lives for, etc. We just saw glimpses of Mirage's 'issues' and yet, IMO, Messer has by miles a better subplot ongoing this episode than Mirage. This is the problem with her as a character (and why she's mostly ignored by the Japanese fandom right now): she's kind of bland. Just being cute doesn't make her stand out in a show with other five relevant female characters who are idols in an idol loving franchise. Let's hope Kawamori will do more with her than "she isn't as good as Max and Milia!" which would make her character stand out. At this point I'm starting to wonder why didn't they genderswapped Mirage and Messer characters and had Messer in the triangle, instead, because Messer has a more interesting tension with Hayate and has a heavier influence.

I'm not sure if someone brought this up. Hayate and Freyja made it to Newtype Top Ten this month. Return of Macross. I hope we see Sheryl take back her place too.

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Tak

Although two additional fleets (Neld & Prado) would later come knocking, they were defeated ahem, integrated in 2036 and 2037.

- Tak

That's the Macross II continuity with the PCE games Macross 2036 and Eternal Love Song. Basically Quamzin brought back Neld and Burado fleets consecutively to mess with Earth.

The closest thing that happened like it is Macross VF-X.

Images

Elysium

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

In 2047 rebel Zentradi kidnapped the Milky Dolls taking them to Elysium. Elysium is a colony that was abandoned once it was found out there was a buried abandoned Main Fortress under it. Where the 63254109th Zentradi Outer Space Army, uncultured Zentradi taught how to built their own technology, was fixing the Main Fortress to support their medium sized fleet to invade Earth. Milky Dolls who were part of UNS' Sound Project were rescued and using tech developed during the Varauta War brough chaos to that fleet.

Images

Zentradi

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Sketchley's Translations: Macross Digital Mission VF-X Flight Manual

Rival
The ace pilot in the Zentraadi Forces. A stiffly beautiful character with the behaviour of a German aristocrat. The age of his outward appearance is in the first half of his 20's. Wherever you look, this guy has an appearance like that of the protagonist. He has long hair. With long slitted eyes, he is like the role of the beauty in a Takarazuka Revue (laughs).

Commander: Enemy Mobile Fortress Commander
The mastermind of the underground Zentraadi organization. His body has been made into a Bio-Computer (referencing the theatrical Do You Remember Love?'s Gol Bodoruza), and one of his eyes has been turned into a camera-eye. However, he isn't a complete villain, and has a position where solemnity hangs over his whole body. Outwardly, he appears to be about 60 years old. He has the appearance of an aged American actor (Marlon Brando or somebody like that...).

Pg 39
The Enemy's Variable Device
Fighter Mode
A variety of new combat devices fused mankind's = the Protoculture's technology and Zentraadi technology. They are the enemy Zentraadi mechanics that appear in VF-X. Even though the Zentraadi were originally unable to do creative work, such as inventing things, while coexisting with Earth's mankind those who became acquainted with culture were changed. And then, there are the former Zentraadi soldiers who rebelled against life in Macross City, seized the VFX-11, which was equipped with a Fold Booster that was just developed at that time, and escaped to the 63,254,109th Zentraadi Outer Space District Armed Forces. They came to sow new seeds in the Zentraadi, who only knew about combat. A variety of new armaments were developed by their efforts, and it's needless to say that they were a threat as far as mankind was concerned. The appearance of the Variable Fighter Device in particular was an extraordinary shock to the Unified Forces. It demanded simple, yet absolute performance. It has all of the requirements of "faster than a fighter aircraft, stronger than a tank, more nimble than a soldier, and it must not be seen...", and the Zentraadi considered and concluded that it wouldn't permit the [Unified Force's] Valkyrie's overwhelming victories that frequently defied logic. Even though this new combat device was referred to as the Enemy Valkyrie (EVA) codename by the Unified Forces pilots, you could say that there were hardly any pilots who had actually seen it.

Other times Earth was endangered besides Space War 1 was the Sharon Apple incident and Grace's Vajra invasion.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

That's the Macross II continuity with the PCE games Macross 2036 and Eternal Love Song. Basically Quamzin brought back Neld and Burado fleets consecutively to mess with Earth.

I know, but since that has not been outright de-canoned and there are no apparent conflict to the main continuety, I think its still worth a mention unless stated by Kawamori otherwise.

Just a side note, yeah, I own 2036, 2037, VFX & VFX2. Yes yes, they are obscure titles, I know. Getting both 2036 & 2037 in addition to a working PC Engine cost me a fortune. Meant I bought one less gun that year, dammit!

- Tak

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Tak

I know, but since that has not been outright de-canoned and there are no apparent conflict to the main continuety, I think its still worth a mention unless stated by Kawamori otherwise.

Other than Komilia was born 2019 as per Macross 2036 and Quamzin being alive.

Plus this.
http://monkeybacon.mywebcommunity.or...atedGames1.php

Entering the 1990's, the shooting game "Super Dimensional Fortress Macross 2036" (Mesaiya), which was linked to the 1992 OVA "Super Dimensional Fortress Macross II -Lovers Again-", was sold for the PC engine. Together with the sequel that was sold in the same year, "Super Dimensional Fortress Macross: Eternal Love Song" (this was a simulation RPG), the developments of the original stories earned a favourable reputation among fans.

Therefore not part of SK continuity.

[Father Hentai]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

That's kinda besides the point. Freyja and Hayate are so close and in sync they complete each other's lines. Hayate and Mirage aren't that close yet.

But there has already been a change between Hayate and Mirage. It started as a love-hate and now they "protect" each other in front of their superior.

The positive vibe between Freyja and Hayate is only because both are still a bit "careless" in their action. They share their love for music and now they just stepped into their role as actress and warrior.

My hopes: Moar of those scenes of Makina being touched by Reina at her ... soft spots