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Thor's Hammer · 2024-02-05, 00:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strahan

How could Elsie not be complicit? She and Kamil were there with Theodore, obviously they were the ones to spirit her out. It may be that the prince holds something over their heads to force their cooperation, but either way she better hope Rishe is forgiving because Arnold doesn't strike me as the merciful type if someone abducts his fiance. I doubt he'll care about their circumstances.

Yeah, I could see Arnold murdering both of them for daring to do that regardless of their circumstances even though Kamil personally serves Arnold, actually especially since Kamil is one of his retainers.

Frontier · 2024-02-05, 10:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor's Hammer

Yeah, I could see Arnold murdering both of them for daring to do that regardless of their circumstances even though Kamil personally serves Arnold, actually especially since Kamil is one of his retainers.

He's far more merciful than he appears at first glance, even if he says otherwise, so I feel like if Rishe pleads for leniency and explains their circumstances, he might listen.

zeross87 · 2024-02-05, 12:12

since arnold referred to his knights as his personal retainers in episode 2 it's also a possibility that kamil was actually planted by arnold to infiltrate theodore group and was here on his order.

Thor's Hammer · 2024-02-05, 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frontier

He's far more merciful than he appears at first glance, even if he says otherwise, so I feel like if Rishe pleads for leniency and explains their circumstances, he might listen.

We'll see. I feel Theodore's plan is to get Rishe to see Arnold at his worst, and there's no better way for that to happen then to kidnap his fiance, causing him to snap and savagely kill those involved. If Theodore himself were to die, I think he'd be satisfied as long as Rishe was forced to see it happen.

SeijiSensei · 2024-02-05, 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeross87

since arnold referred to his knights as his personal retainers in episode 2 it's also a possibility that kamil was actually planted by arnold to infiltrate theodore group and was here on his order.

That uncomfortable sheepish look on his face at the end says otherwise unless Kamil is a really good actor.

magnuskn · 2024-02-06, 01:46

Hm, somehow I suspect this could be a Rishe pulling a fast one on Thedore, simply on the fact that there is no way that Theodore could have planted Elsie in advance to become the personal maid for Rishe. I'm probably overthinking it, though.

Strahan · 2024-02-10, 22:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frontier

I assume she and Kamil both hail from the slums and Theodore used that to get them to help him, but now Elsie is likely having second thoughts when she realizes Rishe is genuine about wanting to help the people in the slums like her family.

Yea, the second thoughts I totally believe. That doesn't mitigate one's guilt though if you still went ahead and did the deed regardless. The prince may be merciful, but I'd imagine there are limits and lines that shouldn't be crossed. I think the pair's only hope is that Rishe forgives them; her advocating for them may stay his hand.

Frontier · 2024-02-11, 10:46

You know it's serious when they skip the OP

!

I knew Rishe was in on it the moment she started "acting" and immediately started being casual with Theodore despite being ostensibly held captive. She'd had Elsie and Kamil made from the start, and she used it to her advantage to get in the best position to do something about Theodore and Arnold's relationship with their support

!

Dang, Theodore is really obsessed with his brother! Whether it's trying to steal the throne from him or just trying to get him to feel SOMETHING for him as a brother whether it's pure hatred

.

I love how Arnold knew exactly that his wife would be able to free herself and escape and here she comes in especially with a leg slit and everything with that proud Rishe smile. Also I love how he now thinks she can just punch her way through doors and she regularly jumps out windows

.

Rishe so based that not only did she carry a dagger hidden in her dress but she was able to take down several dozen men single-handedly in her escape but then lectures Arnold on the proper way to keep a prisoner secure while putting the fear of God into him at the same time. Rishe definitely knows what she's talking about

.

Why would Theodore go to such lengths to instigate Arnold? Why would someone who uses his own money to help the slums try to play himself off as the villain? Is it for his brothers' sake? Even Arnold's coldness seems to be that for Theodore, as his stoic and unfeeling persona is meant to make him out to be someone not to be idolized or cared for, from someone who doesn't see a future with themselves in it

.

Rishe and Theodore have the same goals, to help Arnold and prevent him from going off the deep end or sacrificing himself in whatever plans he has for the future...but Theodore has resigned himself that the only way he can do that and stop being a burden on his brother is by taking his own life. But that, and Rishe's own words to him, finally makes Arnold act as a big brother and save him, and slap some sense into him. Because what big brother wouldn't value the life of their one and only little brother

?

I'm glad Rishe got to stay conscious long enough to see the brothers reconcile and Theodore crying like a baby before falling asleep...in Arnold's arms, no less! And not only did she patch things up with her brother-in-law and get more aid both for the slums and in her quest to prevent war, she also has Arnold's sincere gratitude in the process! A really successful evening for our time-looping princess

!

magnuskn · 2024-02-11, 10:57

Holy shit, Rishe took down all those guys like Schwarzenegger. Yeah, her last two lives definitely were something else.

And it was kind of a double cross on the part of Rishe, by virtue of her immediately seeing through Elsie's and Kamil's motivations (both of whom were loyal to her, but also to Theodore) and involving them in her own plot to ultimately help Theodore get on good terms with his brother.

Oh, hey, they used actual legible and correctly written and spelled German for that letter from Theodore! And the text of the letter spells exactly what the narration from Theodore then says. Color me impressed!

zeross87 · 2024-02-11, 12:01

oh so iwas wrong in thinking kamil were on arnold order. i loved how rishe is brutal in her consel on how to handle captives

so this was all a bit convoluted "please notice me big brother" ? its a little dissapointing i was expecting for thing to move a little more. appart from rishe gaining a ally in theodore (and his allies as well) it didn't do much. arnold is a good terme with his brother so it"s not nothing, it could prevent him from going berserk in the future, but i was expecting to discover a bit more about arnold and his plans. "he make himself a vilain but he is in fact kind" is not something we din't already know.

scififan · 2024-02-11, 12:48

The plot is typical shoujo style: the fighting brothers actually care about each other. The theme is overused, so I find it boring.

Kanon · 2024-02-11, 19:04

Figured Rishe had planned everything out, but she didn't even require Kamil and Elsie's help to escape. She did it all on her own. I'm assuming she's been training pretty intensively lately because mere knowledge from her past life shouldn't translate to her being this OP.

Her whole speech about how to handle prisoners made me wonder where she picked that up. Because that was pretty hardcore. Good thing she's not the one in charge of a certain Princess' "torture".

Theodore was just a good boy starving for his brother's attention. And kinda yandere until Rishe scared that out of him.

Thor's Hammer · 2024-02-11, 20:45

As I indicated after Episode 3, I believe Arnold’s plan in 7th Time Loop is to start a worldwide revolution that dismantles all monarchies. It didn’t occur to me until now, but Episode 1 itself likely hinted at that given the elite guard of King Dietrich were tasked with protecting the very young Crown Princes, which showed that Arnold was there to ensure that there were no heirs to the throne in Hermity. I believe this is backed by Theodore saying that Arnold only lets his reputation as a monster on the battlefield spread while leaving his legacy of creating policies that help commoners go unnoticed. Arnold likely wants to damage the reputations of monarchies to such an extent that the world decides to start anew rather than continue having monarchies as if nothing had happened.

To put it simply, I believe in all likelihood that Arnold believes it is impossible to reform the Empire of Galkhein and perhaps the rest of the world’s monarchies in any way, and that is why he is determined to cast aside his future and disappear after fully carrying out his plan because he sees the world as being so rotten that he need to consider doing that. Maybe Rishe and Theodore can change Arnold’s outlook on life, but it will be difficult as we don’t know just how long Arnold has envisioned having this plan be enacted. If this has been his plan since early childhood, it could be very difficult to get him off his current path.

Frontier · 2024-02-11, 21:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanon

Figured Rishe had planned everything out, but she didn't even require Kamil and Elsie's help to escape. She did it all on her own. I'm assuming she's been training pretty intensively lately because mere knowledge from her past life shouldn't translate to her being this OP.

I assume Kamil and Elsie helped sell the idea that she didn't have anything on her when they brought her to Theodore.

I think she's probably been training and can rely a lot on her memory of her training, though she still doesn't have the full stamina of her past loop.

Quote:

Her whole speech about how to handle prisoners made me wonder where she picked that up. Because that was pretty hardcore. Good thing she's not the one in charge of a certain Princess' "torture".

I can only imagine it was in the 6th Loop as a soldier or in the 5th Loop (that we still know nothing about).

magnuskn · 2024-02-12, 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor's Hammer

As I indicated after Episode 3, I believe Arnold’s plan in 7th Time Loop is to start a worldwide revolution that dismantles all monarchies. It didn’t occur to me until now, but Episode 1 itself likely hinted at that given the elite guard of King Dietrich were tasked with protecting the very young Crown Princes, which showed that Arnold was there to ensure that there were no heirs to the throne in Hermity. I believe this is backed by Theodore saying that Arnold only lets his reputation as a monster on the battlefield spread while leaving his legacy of creating policies that help commoners go unnoticed. Arnold likely wants to damage the reputations of monarchies to such an extent that the world decides to start anew rather than continue having monarchies as if nothing had happened.

To put it simply, I believe in all likelihood that Arnold believes it is impossible to reform the Empire of Galkhein and perhaps the rest of the world’s monarchies in any way, and that is why he is determined to cast aside his future and disappear after fully carrying out his plan because he sees the world as being so rotten that he need to consider doing that. Maybe Rishe and Theodore can change Arnold’s outlook on life, but it will be difficult as we don’t know just how long Arnold has envisioned having this plan be enacted. If this has been his plan since early childhood, it could be very difficult to get him off his current path.

And this is why edgy teenagers should not be given the power to decide the fate of millions of people. ^^

Thor's Hammer · 2024-02-12, 22:29

One thought I have is that if Arnold is indeed planning a worldwide revolution/reformation, who is he working with to enact this plan? As Theodore said, word of Arnold’s monstrous presence on the battlefield is what is being spread while the good he does for Galkhein's commoners goes unnoticed. Arnold must have people in on his plan whatever that may be as it’s not something he can accomplish by himself. Would any of these people be willing to hurt Rishe for whatever reason if she tries to persuade him to not cause a world war?

Frontier · 2024-02-13, 00:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor's Hammer

One thought I have is that if Arnold is indeed planning a worldwide revolution/reformation, who is he working with to enact this plan? As Theodore said, word of Arnold’s monstrous presence on the battlefield is what is being spread while the good he does for Galkhein's commoners goes unnoticed. Arnold must have people in on his plan whatever that may be as it’s not something he can accomplish by himself. Would any of these people be willing to hurt Rishe for whatever reason if she tries to persuade him to not cause a world war?

I think his white-haired assistant might be in on at least some of his plans.

Thor's Hammer · 2024-02-13, 00:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frontier

I think his white-haired assistant might be in on at least some of his plans.

I don't think Oliver is in on Arnold's plans. There's no other reason for Arnold to retort to Oliver, "I didn't bring Rishe here to be my wife to improve the nation or the imperial family." when Oliver said he can't wait to see the things Rishe accomplishes in this country. This very much suggests that Oliver is an outsider and is not in the in group, whoever those people may be.

Frontier · 2024-02-13, 10:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor's Hammer

I don't think Oliver is in on Arnold's plans. There's no other reason for Arnold to retort to Oliver, "I didn't bring Rishe here to be my wife to improve the nation or the imperial family." when Oliver said he can't wait to see the things Rishe accomplishes in this country. This very much suggests that Oliver is an outsider and is not in the in group, whoever those people may be.

True, but he's probably been serving with Arnold longer than most so I feel like he might at least have some idea.

zztop · 2024-02-18, 07:37

It's interesting to observe the many theories being thrown around as to Arnold's true endgame/motives for world war across the timelines, considering the novels still haven't explained anything yet.

(It's like Akatsuki no Yona all over again, where the mangaka kept dancing around the mystery of the past across so many volumes before finally answering it after so long.)

2024-02-06, 01:46	Link #106
magnuskn Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hamburg, Germany Age: 48	Hm, somehow I suspect this could be a Rishe pulling a fast one on Thedore, simply on the fact that there is no way that Theodore could have planted Elsie in advance to become the personal maid for Rishe. I'm probably overthinking it, though. __________________

2024-02-11, 10:46	Link #108
Frontier Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013	You know it's serious when they skip the OP ! I knew Rishe was in on it the moment she started "acting" and immediately started being casual with Theodore despite being ostensibly held captive. She'd had Elsie and Kamil made from the start, and she used it to her advantage to get in the best position to do something about Theodore and Arnold's relationship with their support ! Dang, Theodore is really obsessed with his brother! Whether it's trying to steal the throne from him or just trying to get him to feel SOMETHING for him as a brother whether it's pure hatred . I love how Arnold knew exactly that his wife would be able to free herself and escape and here she comes in especially with a leg slit and everything with that proud Rishe smile. Also I love how he now thinks she can just punch her way through doors and she regularly jumps out windows . Rishe so based that not only did she carry a dagger hidden in her dress but she was able to take down several dozen men single-handedly in her escape but then lectures Arnold on the proper way to keep a prisoner secure while putting the fear of God into him at the same time. Rishe definitely knows what she's talking about . Why would Theodore go to such lengths to instigate Arnold? Why would someone who uses his own money to help the slums try to play himself off as the villain? Is it for his brothers' sake? Even Arnold's coldness seems to be that for Theodore, as his stoic and unfeeling persona is meant to make him out to be someone not to be idolized or cared for, from someone who doesn't see a future with themselves in it . Rishe and Theodore have the same goals, to help Arnold and prevent him from going off the deep end or sacrificing himself in whatever plans he has for the future...but Theodore has resigned himself that the only way he can do that and stop being a burden on his brother is by taking his own life. But that, and Rishe's own words to him, finally makes Arnold act as a big brother and save him, and slap some sense into him. Because what big brother wouldn't value the life of their one and only little brother ? I'm glad Rishe got to stay conscious long enough to see the brothers reconcile and Theodore crying like a baby before falling asleep...in Arnold's arms, no less! And not only did she patch things up with her brother-in-law and get more aid both for the slums and in her quest to prevent war, she also has Arnold's sincere gratitude in the process! A really successful evening for our time-looping princess ! __________________

2024-02-11, 10:57	Link #109
magnuskn Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hamburg, Germany Age: 48	Holy shit, Rishe took down all those guys like Schwarzenegger. Yeah, her last two lives definitely were something else. And it was kind of a double cross on the part of Rishe, by virtue of her immediately seeing through Elsie's and Kamil's motivations (both of whom were loyal to her, but also to Theodore) and involving them in her own plot to ultimately help Theodore get on good terms with his brother. Oh, hey, they used actual legible and correctly written and spelled German for that letter from Theodore! And the text of the letter spells exactly what the narration from Theodore then says. Color me impressed! __________________ Last edited by magnuskn; 2024-02-11 at 11:17.

2024-02-11, 19:04	Link #112
Kanon Kana Hanazawa ♥ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: France Age: 37	Figured Rishe had planned everything out, but she didn't even require Kamil and Elsie's help to escape. She did it all on her own. I'm assuming she's been training pretty intensively lately because mere knowledge from her past life shouldn't translate to her being this OP. Her whole speech about how to handle prisoners made me wonder where she picked that up. Because that was pretty hardcore. Good thing she's not the one in charge of a certain Princess' "torture". Theodore was just a good boy starving for his brother's attention. And kinda yandere until Rishe scared that out of him. __________________

2024-02-05, 12:12	Link #103
zeross87 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2014	since arnold referred to his knights as his personal retainers in episode 2 it's also a possibility that kamil was actually planted by arnold to infiltrate theodore group and was here on his order.

2024-02-11, 12:01	Link #110
zeross87 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2014	oh so iwas wrong in thinking kamil were on arnold order. i loved how rishe is brutal in her consel on how to handle captives so this was all a bit convoluted "please notice me big brother" ? its a little dissapointing i was expecting for thing to move a little more. appart from rishe gaining a ally in theodore (and his allies as well) it didn't do much. arnold is a good terme with his brother so it"s not nothing, it could prevent him from going berserk in the future, but i was expecting to discover a bit more about arnold and his plans. "he make himself a vilain but he is in fact kind" is not something we din't already know.

2024-02-11, 12:48	Link #111
scififan Senior Member Join Date: May 2014	The plot is typical shoujo style: the fighting brothers actually care about each other. The theme is overused, so I find it boring.

2024-02-11, 20:45	Link #113
Thor's Hammer Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2012	As I indicated after Episode 3, I believe Arnold’s plan in 7th Time Loop is to start a worldwide revolution that dismantles all monarchies. It didn’t occur to me until now, but Episode 1 itself likely hinted at that given the elite guard of King Dietrich were tasked with protecting the very young Crown Princes, which showed that Arnold was there to ensure that there were no heirs to the throne in Hermity. I believe this is backed by Theodore saying that Arnold only lets his reputation as a monster on the battlefield spread while leaving his legacy of creating policies that help commoners go unnoticed. Arnold likely wants to damage the reputations of monarchies to such an extent that the world decides to start anew rather than continue having monarchies as if nothing had happened. To put it simply, I believe in all likelihood that Arnold believes it is impossible to reform the Empire of Galkhein and perhaps the rest of the world’s monarchies in any way, and that is why he is determined to cast aside his future and disappear after fully carrying out his plan because he sees the world as being so rotten that he need to consider doing that. Maybe Rishe and Theodore can change Arnold’s outlook on life, but it will be difficult as we don’t know just how long Arnold has envisioned having this plan be enacted. If this has been his plan since early childhood, it could be very difficult to get him off his current path.

2024-02-12, 22:29	Link #116
Thor's Hammer Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2012	One thought I have is that if Arnold is indeed planning a worldwide revolution/reformation, who is he working with to enact this plan? As Theodore said, word of Arnold’s monstrous presence on the battlefield is what is being spread while the good he does for Galkhein's commoners goes unnoticed. Arnold must have people in on his plan whatever that may be as it’s not something he can accomplish by himself. Would any of these people be willing to hurt Rishe for whatever reason if she tries to persuade him to not cause a world war?

2024-02-18, 07:37	Link #120
zztop Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2013	It's interesting to observe the many theories being thrown around as to Arnold's true endgame/motives for world war across the timelines, considering the novels still haven't explained anything yet. (It's like Akatsuki no Yona all over again, where the mangaka kept dancing around the mystery of the past across so many volumes before finally answering it after so long.)