High School DxD Light Novel - Archived Speculation & Theories

[WILD_LION]

Originally Posted by kikix

Gram is one of the strongest (if not the strongest) of all true demonic swords, focusing on a ridiculous offense. It have a heavy toll on it, however.

Excalibur and Durandal are among the strongest holy swords (Colbrande being the only one stronger than Excalibur). Excalibur have a destruction part (the Excalibur Destruction) and Durandal is like Gram strictly focusing on destruction. So that's two destruction-focused holy swords melded into one.

There's absolutely no way there could be a sword that could compare to their destructive power (except maybe Arthurs Colbrande), whether it be against a dragon or not.

Besides, Issei said himself that he's no good with swords. The users ability probably affects the swords limits. Like Xenovia's inability to use Excalibur Ruler effectively.

Is true, but this spoiler made me ask: Does issei will use the True Longinus?

Spiler: Cao Cao himself doesn't appear but his Holy Spear does in order to help DxD out. Ise gets informed about him joining DxD from Azazel.

I said that issei will use the true longinus because in VOL12 the True Idea(God's will in the Holy Spear) select issei Dream instead CaoCao dream.

According to Cao Cao's explanation, Truth Idea's effects depend on God's will in the Holy Spear and sucks the ambition of the holder of this spear, and by responding to how strong the opponent is, it will create many effects and miracles which will be different depending on what the will chooses such as granting an absolute power to destroy the opponent or a blessing to the opponent to capture their hearts.

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by sunsengnim

about valerie yes it has already been explained by azazel that her mental health has been taken damage to the extent that she talks to the other beings in the other world at this point she still had all 3 grails

the one vali's grandfather took was after that fact so her mental health issues are here to stay it won't be fixed just by taking it back


yes saji's current predicament can be compared to issei's yet they're completely different aswell
issei has DDraig one of the 2 Heavenly Dragons wich exudes strength and fascinates everyone near it
saji has vrithra one of the weakest dragon kings nothing special comes with it and it isn't actually that strong

i mean they have completely different circumstances issei helped all of the girls and even guys in the gremory group trough their trauma's and healed their hearts and that's how he earned their love but also by never going down and protecting everyone at all costs

this is something saji could never accomplish see the difference here?
also issei has energy charisma wich saji doesn't issei is just a born leader and people will follow/like him wether they're ready for it or not saji could only dream of this

you can't compare saji and issei's circumstances that's just how it is

We actually don't know just how long before it was that Rizevim stole the Grail before Marius. It could have been a while and what originally caused the weakening of her mind which was only made worse by the usage of her powers. There is still a chance that returning all 3 could improve her condition and that maybe turning her into a servant could repair a majority of the damage to her mind. Then just have Azazel seal the powers of the grail so it won't be able to taint her mind as much.

[jopjopjop]

Originally Posted by cyberdemon

WE actually don't know just how long before it was that Rizevim stole the Grail before Marius. It could have been a while and what originally caused the weakening of her mind which was only made worse by the usage of her powers. There is still a chance that returning all 3 could improve her condition and that maybe turning her into a servant could repair a majority of the damage to her mind. Then just have Azazel seal the powers of the grail so it won't be able to taint her mind as much.

edit:
Azazel already said that she has shown the side-effects of overusing the holy grail and he explained why/how. Her mind became like that because of the overuse, not the extraction.

~The best that could happen when the third is returned is Valerie regaining her consciousness.

[kikix]

Originally Posted by jopjopjop

Yes. Earlier.. earlier before it was Marius' turn to extract the 2nd Holy Grail. Why do you think Crom Cruach delayed them for ten minutes?
When they saw the light outside their window, the extraction for the 1st Longinus has started, the one Rizevim has. :|

Those ten minutes were to prepare the ritual obviously. I can't really imagine how Marius wouldn't realise when Rizevim would extract the Holy Grail with him in the room...

Originally Posted by Rizevim"

“Yeah, the number of Holy Grails that Valerie-chan possesses is—three in total. So it’s a sub-species Longinus which is so extraordinary since it comes with three in one package~. I already allowed myself to extract one of them out before~. Though it seems like Marius-kun didn’t realise there were several of them~. It sure makes me laugh coming from a self-proclaimed researcher of the Holy Grails!”

The above suggests that he did extract the Grail before this second extraction happened. To begin with, Rizevim is the one that brought knowledge about Sacred Gears to the vampire faction. It is easy to imagine how he would extract it considerably earlier.

Unless you can explain how Marius, being constantly in the extraction room for its duration, missed a single, full extraction of a Grail from a girl that was right in front of him, being done by some other guy. And how he didn't even have any idea that there were multiple Grails.

Mind you, I'm not saying that it is made by Grail extraction. I am saying that it is possibly related. We do not know either way what results the first extraction had. It may have weakened her, making the corrosion easier. It may have broken her, causing the effects. It may have had no noticeable effect. But it is not something that should be dismissed.


On another note, apparently there is some way to "save" Valerie from that state to begin with.

Originally Posted by Volume 16, Life 1

“Sensei, is there any way of saving her?”

I ask. Sensei puts his hand under his chin and starts to think.

“……First, we need to stop her using the Holy Grail itself and—”

Azazel didn't say that there is no way to save her. He started talking about how she can be saved, but Rizevim's appearance stopped him. That being said, with or without the Grail extraction argument, chances are that Valerie could be returned to normal.

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by jopjopjop

edit:
Azazel already said that she has shown the side-effects of overusing the holy grail and he explained why. Her mind became like that because of the overuse, not the extraction.

but he didn't know that there was 3 grails at the time and that one of them had already been stolen. Normally extracting a SG would kill but since it was only 1 of 3 while not killing her it would certainly have an affect on her psyche. That doesn't mean though that the corruption can't be relieved. Reviving as a devil has been shown to resurrect the recently dead and even cure fatal illnesses like Okita's so there is a good chance that doing so could relieve the affects of the grail from her mind. Maybe not completely but enough that she could live a more normal life.

[WILD_LION]

I think that in the end valerie will be saved, after all she is the woman of Gasper, about her mind, maybe she will recover little by little, after all her eyes recover a little of shine when she was talking with Gasper, Rias, Issei and koneko about how is the life in japan and about japan sweets.

By the way, really what do you think this mean?:

Cao Cao himself doesn't appear but his Holy Spear does in order to help DxD out.

[sunsengnim]

Originally Posted by WILD_LION

By the way, really what do you think this mean?:

Cao Cao himself doesn't appear but his Holy Spear does in order to help DxD out.

remember the last fight they had cao cao wanted to use his overdrive ability and the spear ignored him because it valued issei's dream more then his
im thinking the spear appeared to protect issei's dream

[Simonsy]

Originally Posted by sunsengnim

what happend in VOL 5 was ishibumi showing the gremory team that issei could lose since they never actually saw him get taken down at that point (raiser doesn't count he didn't have balance breaker at the time)

he had so many limitations in the fight of sona vs rias
1 no damage to the envirement
2 he gave ascalon wich could cut trough saji's wire's to xenovia
3 sona had a plan from the get go that would focus on taking issei down

this was all orchestrated so he would lose to saji
i found it quite infuriating to be honest when he went to his hospital room to hear him say he was his rival
if issei had no limitations he'd have cut saji's wires and 1hit KO'd him
it wouldn't have even been called a fight thats how sad it would've been

now kiba/vali/saji/saoriaorg/cao cao all see issei as a rival they want and feel the need to catch up to him we'll except vali who's stronger then issei at this point

issei has mentioned he sees them all as rivals BUT he knows his true rival is nobody BUT vali

so i aswell see his only rival to be vali

and yes saji has gotten a power up BUT he's still nowhere to being even a fight for issei for it to be even possible issei would need to hold back
so no saji isn't really a rival in my eyes he'd probably be able to put up a fight against kiba but that's it everyone else of the 4 (the 4 being issei,vali,saoriaorg,cao cao) would destroy him sadly so he's still at the bottom in the ranking we'll maybe hes above kiba? but thats it

this is their power ranking in my eyes

1st Vali
2nd Issei
3rd Cao Cao (since he's a genius technique type and hasn't released his full strength due to his spear not listening i think he could win from saoriaorg who's just pure power)
4th Saoriaorg
5th Saji (thanks to his Balance Breaker he's also still has a beast driver? if i remember correctly so if it was indeed an ALL OUT fight to the death he'd win from kiba)
6th Kiba

Two things you are neglecting

1. You are downplaying that Saji was 100% focused on Issei and it was all planned to take him down. If in the future they were to fight, would Saji not again be using 100% of his brain to take down Issei. There not going to randomly just be walking down the street and be like "hey lets fight". Saji would have time to prep and solely come up with a plan with his superior brain than Issei to take down Issei.

2. Saji was super weak during that fight. The amount of powerups Saji has gotten since that fight have been insane, EVEN before this BB. Look at all of saji's powers. he could keep Issei in a prison, sap his energy, and what else. Loki even had difficutly with its very base elementary stage that has since been improved upon.


So don't take Saji lightly. He is smarter than Issei. He has gotten plenty of new powers and is much much stronger than before. He could also use things like the reverse thing that was banned from games and who knows what else. You have Kiba on the bottom of that list, but again does Kiba not spar with Issei every day and Issei being the idiot he is thinks he needs to go 100% for his friend. Kiba can handle Issie's 100% and not die and he has 0% defense. What makes you think that Saji would be OHKO?

Now yes this isn't the 100% of Issei protecting some female or a promise of sex or something, but would we see the Issei that is fighting some super evil bastard in a fight against a Friend? Hell no, he wouldn't unlock some new Super Siayan ability in a fight against Saji, and neither would Saji. They would both just fight as their normal 100%. And if there is one thing anime/manga/ect has taught us is that a Main Characters 100% in a fight with friends versus his 100% when the world is on the line/revenge/ect is worlds apart. They dont tap into that special hidden gear that unlocks infinite potential, which is something that Issei has done in practically all of his fights with bosses. He does some special thing as the super very end that finally turns the tides. Whether its talking to a Breast God, going beserk from seeing a death , magical breast summoning, ect. A fight with Saji or Kiba or whoever rival would not have some random spuratic power up moment.

[bones]

Sorry but you don't get to use prep time as reason for Saji to beat Issei. In a no holds barred match, now Issei can choose to boost or divide or blow Saji to kingdom come if he wishes. Any prison he puts him in will just get its strength divided. Saji sucks his energy, Issei will just divide Saji's energy until they're at the same level. Saji may have been able to give Issei a hard fight but now that Issei can boost as well as divide, it's a lost cause for Saji

[sunsengnim]

Originally Posted by Simonsy

Two things you are neglecting

1. You are downplaying that Saji was 100% focused on Issei and it was all planned to take him down. If in the future they were to fight, would Saji not again be using 100% of his brain to take down Issei. There not going to randomly just be walking down the street and be like "hey lets fight". Saji would have time to prep and solely come up with a plan with his superior brain than Issei to take down Issei.

2. Saji was super weak during that fight. The amount of powerups Saji has gotten since that fight have been insane, EVEN before this BB. Look at all of saji's powers. he could keep Issei in a prison, sap his energy, and what else. Loki even had difficutly with its very base elementary stage that has since been improved upon.


So don't take Saji lightly. He is smarter than Issei. He has gotten plenty of new powers and is much much stronger than before. He could also use things like the reverse thing that was banned from games and who knows what else. You have Kiba on the bottom of that list, but again does Kiba not spar with Issei every day and Issei being the idiot he is thinks he needs to go 100% for his friend. Kiba can handle Issie's 100% and not die and he has 0% defense. What makes you think that Saji would be OHKO?

Now yes this isn't the 100% of Issei protecting some female or a promise of sex or something, but would we see the Issei that is fighting some super evil bastard in a fight against a Friend? Hell no, he wouldn't unlock some new Super Siayan ability in a fight against Saji, and neither would Saji. They would both just fight as their normal 100%. And if there is one thing anime/manga/ect has taught us is that a Main Characters 100% in a fight with friends versus his 100% when the world is on the line/revenge/ect is worlds apart. They dont tap into that special hidden gear that unlocks infinite potential, which is something that Issei has done in practically all of his fights with bosses. He does some special thing as the super very end that finally turns the tides. Whether its talking to a Breast God, going beserk from seeing a death , magical breast summoning, ect. A fight with Saji or Kiba or whoever rival would not have some random spuratic power up moment.

1st all the planning saji does can't make up for issei's speed+power
also superior brain? he won a few times in a silly game against him doesn't qualify as "superior"

2nd he has no defense just like kiba but kiba has speed saji doesn't

3nd he's not an idiot for going all out against kiba since kiba needed to be put in a life or death situation to unlock his new balance breaker and since issei acknowledged his determination he went all out the only reason he survived was his speed

so as you can see saji isn't actually as strong as you make him out to be yes hes an excellent technique/support character but like kiba he has no defense and sadly also no speed wich kiba used to survive against issei's all out

issei goes all out every time
he takes everything serious when it comes to fighting especially during training since they're training to survive against god class opponents and they do not hold back
the only reason kiba can actually spar with him all out is because of his speed wich you completely forgot

so no saji is forever doomed to run in issei's shadow

[Gary29]

Not to mention he may be able to use the mini-dragons as a defense against Saji's prison-based attacks, while having them Divide his power at the same time. There's no way Ise would lose to Saji.

Originally Posted by Simonsy

So don't take Saji lightly. He is smarter than Issei. He has gotten plenty of new powers and is much much stronger than before. He could also use things like the reverse thing that was banned from games and who knows what else. You have Kiba on the bottom of that list, but again does Kiba not spar with Issei every day and Issei being the idiot he is thinks he needs to go 100% for his friend. Kiba can handle Issie's 100% and not die and he has 0% defense. What makes you think that Saji would be OHKO?

Ise is an idiot for going all-out against Kiba? What's the use of them training to improve themselves if they won't be going all-out? It's not like Ise will continue to fight until he kills Kiba; if Kiba gets seriously injured they'll stop fighting and get him healed up. I wouldn't say Saji's much smarter (if smarter at all) than Ise either, Ise's come quite a long way from their last battle (which only resulted in Saji winning because he did what Sona told him to do).

[Simonsy]

Originally Posted by bones

Sorry but you don't get to use prep time as reason for Saji to beat Issei. In a no holds barred match, now Issei can choose to boost or divide or blow Saji to kingdom come if he wishes. Any prison he puts him in will just get its strength divided. Saji sucks his energy, Issei will just divide Saji's energy until they're at the same level. Saji may have been able to give Issei a hard fight but now that Issei can boost as well as divide, it's a lost cause for Saji

Your apparantly a big fan of the whole DBZ power level hugh. Where whoever is stronger wins. end of story.

Try reading more recent things like say One Piece were you could have Luffy lose to someone, yet Usopp be able to beat that person. Strength doesn't always end all.

Hell look at Cao Cao, he is a freaking human being and he should be taken down by the thousand of random enemies with no names that can move at like the speed of light. Yet he doesn't. He evades even people like Vali. Because... well not gonna explain it, cause he did explain it in the LN already.

How many times has the author had Issei constantly say he is weak against Technique and he has a hard time against technique and so on. Saji is technique, yet your argument comes down to "he would blow anything saji tries away with power"

What about the reverse gear? You see how effective that was in the rating game. The more powerful issei gets the more powerful the attack being redirected back at him is.

[bones]

That was before he got divide, now anything Saji hits him with will just get divided. His dark fire prison will get divided, his blood absorbing lines will get divided. His reflected attack using the reverse gear will get reflected back again at Saji or divided. His energy while using BB will get divided until he's no longer able to use BB. I'm not even getting into Issei using Ascalon to slash Saji's armor to shreds. Also Cao Cao is a different kind of opponent to Saji, the reason why Issei has so much trouble against him is because that spear is death for non humans especially devils. His techniques aside, one hit from that spear can be fatal.

[Simonsy]

Originally Posted by sunsengnim

1st all the planning saji does can't make up for issei's speed+power
also superior brain? he won a few times in a silly game against him doesn't qualify as "superior"

2nd he has no defense just like kiba but kiba has his speed saji doesn't

3nd he's not an idiot for going all out against kiba since kiba needed to be put in a life or death situation to unlock his new balance breaker and since issei acknowledged his determination he went all out the only reason he survived was his speed

so as you can see saji isn't actually as strong as you make him out to be yes hes an excellent technique/support character but like kiba he has no defense and sadly also no speed wich kiba used to survive against issei's all out

issei goes all out every time
he takes everything serious when it comes to fighting especially during training since they're training to survive against god class opponents and they do not hold back
the only reason kiba can actually spar with him all out is because of his speed wich you completely forgot

It doesn't take much to have a superior brain to Issei

Speed whatever. Cao Cao was a normal human and he could dodge the fasted people in the universe by reading their slight ki adjustments or whatever it was.

Originally Posted by Gary29

Not to mention he may be able to use the mini-dragons as a defense against Saji's prison-based attacks, while having them Divide his power at the same time. There's no way Ise would lose to Saji.



Ise is an idiot for going all-out against Kiba? What's the use of them training to improve themselves if they won't be going all-out? It's not like Ise will continue to fight until he kills Kiba; if Kiba gets seriously injured they'll stop fighting and get him healed up.

Also for above person saying going all out on Kiba. You guys constantly talk about how insanely powerful Issei is. If Kiba were to take a direct hit, there is no amount of healing that would bring him back, he would be dead. Now i'm not saying issei shouldn't go all out. But that wasn't my point anyway. I was trying to point out and both of you agree that Isse is going ALL OUT, 100%. So if Issei is going 100% and isn't able to hit Kiba ever then why is kiba so low on the list? Doesn't that mean he is stronger than Issei? When Trunks went ultra strong against Cell he was stronger physically, but he was so slow he couldn't land a single punch on him. So Cell wins.

Why would Issei be able to just mop the floor with Saji? Who's to say Saji is so easy to hit and his techniques would just be blasted away like flimsy paper?

[sunsengnim]

Originally Posted by Simonsy

It doesn't take much to have a superior brain to Issei

Speed whatever. Cao Cao was a normal human and he could dodge the fasted people in the universe by reading their slight ki adjustments or whatever it was.





Also for above person saying going all out on Kiba. You guys constantly talk about how insanely powerful Issei is. If Kiba were to take a direct hit, there is no amount of healing that would bring him back, he would be dead. Now i'm not saying issei shouldn't go all out. But that wasn't my point anyway. I was trying to point out and both of you agree that Isse is going ALL OUT, 100%. So if Issei is going 100% and isn't able to hit Kiba ever then why is kiba so low on the list? Doesn't that mean he is stronger than Issei? When Trunks went ultra strong against Cell he was stronger physically, but he was so slow he couldn't land a single punch on him. So Cell wins.

Why would Issei be able to just mop the floor with Saji? Who's to say Saji is so easy to hit and his techniques would just be blasted away like flimsy paper?

cao cao is a genius technique type unlike saji and issei won against cao cao
saji would lose badly against cao cao he'd get destroyed actually even if saji wen't BB it still wouldn't help him

that's why issei would destroy saji it's just that simple

kiba is so low on the list because everyone else is a monster and i stated before that a fight between kiba and saji would be really close but since saji got his new BB i gave him kiba's spot

[Gary29]

Originally Posted by Simonsy

It doesn't take much to have a superior brain to Issei

Speed whatever. Cao Cao was a normal human and he could dodge the fasted people in the universe by reading their slight ki adjustments or whatever it was.





Also for above person saying going all out on Kiba. You guys constantly talk about how insanely powerful Issei is. If Kiba were to take a direct hit, there is no amount of healing that would bring him back, he would be dead. Now i'm not saying issei shouldn't go all out. But that wasn't my point anyway. I was trying to point out and both of you agree that Isse is going ALL OUT, 100%. So if Issei is going 100% and isn't able to hit Kiba ever then why is kiba so low on the list? Doesn't that mean he is stronger than Issei? When Trunks went ultra strong against Cell he was stronger physically, but he was so slow he couldn't land a single punch on him. So Cell wins.

Why would Issei be able to just mop the floor with Saji? Who's to say Saji is so easy to hit and his techniques would just be blasted away like flimsy paper?

From what we've seen, Saji is not the super-speed type. He's a technique type, that's it. Therefore it makes sense to assume that he won't be too difficult for Ise with a much higher speed to be able to hit him. His techniques can be Divided, eventually making them useless against Ise. He's not just dealing with the Sekiryuutei, he's dealing with the power of both of the Heavenly Dragons combined.

Oh and:

Originally Posted by Gary29

I wouldn't say Saji's much smarter (if smarter at all) than Ise either, Ise's come quite a long way from their last battle (which only resulted in Saji winning because he did what Sona told him to do).

[Simonsy]

Originally Posted by bones

That was before he got divide, now anything Saji hits him with will just get divided. His dark fire prison will get divided, his blood absorbing lines will get divided. His energy while using BB while get divided until he's no longer able to use BB. I'm not even getting into Issei using Ascalon to slash Saji's armor to shreds.

What about Saji's Delete Feild power? One of Vritra's Sacred Gears and has the ability to take away the opponent's powers.

Would that not neutralize the Divide power?

What's stopping the author from giving Saji some random items/weapon to rival or take away Ascalon. he always gives issei some convenient plot device item that helps him all the time, why not give one to saji. For example during the Rating Game against Sona he newly introduced the reverse which GREATLY changed the battle outcomes. What's to stop him from all of a sudden being like michael or something gave Saji a Draogn Slaying sword as well? Or something else that would make those two things cancel out in terms of effectiveness.

Or maybe Issei just decides not to use it and have it be a man to man fight like Saoraorg. No misc weapons, extra sacred gears, ect. Just their Boosted/Divide verse his Vrita. Or lets not forget that Issei is not the greatest with a sword. Maybe Saji has dealth with sword weilders enough that in comparison Issei is easy to dodge all attacks.

The point is, we are not the author and anythign you say I or another could come in and say "what if" to that. Maybe Issei could blast away shadow prison without a though, maybe it takes a ton of stamina. Maybe his ascalon is super effective or maybe it gets nuetralized super easily right away, and so on. Any good fight the winner could go either way. Look at all the best manga fights out there and as usual the good guys practically always win, but if just one thing happned slightly differently it would have been the other way. Do you guys seriously think that if Issei and Saji fought it would be as one sided as when Issei took on Shalba Beelzebub the second time? That Issei would just walk forward brushing off every attack like its nothing? I'm glad you guys aren't the authors.

[Emwe]

First, hello everyone discussing DxD!

Originally Posted by sunsengnim

cao cao is a genius technique type unlike saji and issei won against cao cao
saji would lose badly against cao cao he'd get destroyed actually even if saji wen't BB it still wouldn't help him

that's why issei would destroy saji it's just that simple

kiba is so low on the list because everyone else is a monster and i stated before that a fight between kiba and saji would be really close but since saji got his new BB we gave him the win

Cmon is this the only reason you can come up with, its extremly weak and Ise only won because Cao Cao let his guard down.

To make it easier for you to understand the same thing can happen in a fight Saji vs Ise, Saji just says infight that girl X is standing in her underwear nearby and Ise will run into his trap and lose simple right?

[rickiminato]

what powers have saji in balance breaker?

[Emwe]

I would guess improved version of his vitra promotion skills, not going enrage and higher basestats because of the armor.

Also if go with Ranks, Ise would be an SSS rank in power and something like A -> S in tech, Saji would be A -> S in power and for now without training SS -> SS+ in tech. Some forget that Vitra has the weakest basestats but the highest tech stats of the dragon kings and equal.