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Vena · 2012-02-26, 23:55

Its still a little early to delve into the writing evaluations in greater detail but I'd say we should keep our eye on what they do with Kagura and Zessica from here on out because we're likely to see the plot either pull off something brilliant or we're going to watch it trip and stumbled over the plot threads it created... either way, we'll be entertained.

It would be interesting if Zessica and Kagura defect to the respective other side... but, while this makes sense for the latter, I can't really wrap my head around why the former would do such a thing. The foreshadowing has been/was pointing at Mikono for a long time but I don't even know how that could happen at this point in time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by miketyson

Perhaps Amata was born to Alisia on Altair, and his flashbacks aren't "Alisia leaving him (to go to Altair)" but instead "Alisia dropping him off (on Vega)"...

It makes the most sense as to his origin, to be honest. He knows the difference between animals, he has no family whatsoever to speak of and has lived alone his entire life, and Alicia is the patron goddess of Altair and the only character in his still rather mysterious background. There are too many *little details* that point to him not being from Vega for nothing to come of it.

Which brings us to an interesting question: Why does Altair have two possible Apollos? To which I have an answer~ish. Assume that Alicia is a descendant of the Sylvia line, then her child would be a descendant of the Shadow-Angels, giving Amata full capabilities in operating the machine angel and leaving Kagura to be the actual reincarnation while Amata is actually not a reincarnation at all but a descendant. Could go to explain why he has wings, but not why he doesn't smell like anything (for a simple line, it sure holds a lot meaning and mystery)... unless Kagura can't smell people from Altair for some reason? We've never seen him sniff anyone on Altair have we?

(If Amata is a descendant of Sylvia, and Mikono is Sylvia reincarnated... is that selfcest in some odd way? Also if Amata is from Altair and likewise for Kagura, then we have two guys from that one side and two girls on the other in Vega... seems awfully convenient.

)

Quote:

Originally Posted by noobita

On serious note, why don't those Altair citizens just migrate to Vega? Almost of all them are bishi, and it will be super easy for them to get their "mate".

Simplest answer is because they cannot and that the same penalty applies to males as to females when going through the gate, and that Kagura and Jin are special (and the three stooges this episode got special protective make-up from Mykage to protect them). We've only seen unmanned drones for the nameless mooks. Given the limitations on remote control and how desperate they are, if they could all pilot robots and just fly through the portal, I'd imagine they would but the fact that they had remote models would imply that they cannot.

Zuul · 2012-02-27, 00:20

I hope Mikono will defect (or be unwillingly be taken away). Because it would make room for Zessica and actually gives her a chance with Amata.

My heart sunk a little seeing what happened to her genki disposition this episode because of love. So I don't want her sufferings to be in vain and her having an actual real chance. Not just being a foil. She deserves better than that.

This episode was nice, but I liked last week better (what could possibely beat NTRed Kagura), and I'm looking forward next week a lot more, there will be a lot of plot prograssion it seems.

Thess · 2012-02-27, 00:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vena

It makes the most sense as to his origin, to be honest. He knows the difference between animals, he has no family whatsoever to speak of and has lived alone his entire life, and Alicia is the patron goddess of Altair and the only character in his still rather mysterious background. There are too many *little details* that point to him not being from Vega for nothing to come of it.

Which brings us to an interesting question: Why does Altair have two possible Apollos? To which I have an answer~ish. Assume that Alicia is a descendant of the Sylvia line, then her child would be a descendant of the Shadow-Angels, giving Amata full capabilities in operating the machine angel and leaving Kagura to be the actual reincarnation while Amata is actually not a reincarnation at all but a descendant. Could go to explain why he has wings, but not why he doesn't smell like anything (for a simple line, it sure holds a lot meaning and mystery)... unless Kagura can't smell people from Altair for some reason? We've never seen him sniff anyone on Altair have we?

(If Amata is a descendant of Sylvia, and Mikono is Sylvia reincarnated... is that selfcest in some odd way? Also if Amata is from Altair and likewise for Kagura, then we have two guys from that one side and two girls on the other in Vega... seems awfully convenient.

)

Actually, yeah, that would make a lot of sense in general. "Alisia"/Alicia = descendant of Silvie (or Sirius). The wings will be explained that way. BUT. Those children who were picking on him, there were girls among them, was this before or after Alicia left?

(Amata has mommy issues? The manga seems to strongly imply that he's into Mikono because of the resemblance with Alicia).

Vena · 2012-02-27, 00:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thess

Actually, yeah, that would make a lot of sense in general. "Alisia"/Alicia = descendant of Silvie (or Sirius). The wings will be explained that way. BUT. Those children who were picking on him, there were girls among them, was this before or after Alicia left?

(Amata has mommy issues? The manga seems to strongly imply that he's into Mikono because of the resemblance with Alicia).

I assume that was after he'd arrived on Vega and been left behind (we do not see him with any one, and he's wearing his rags and lives in the empty attic/room in which he grows up), he had actual wings that he ripped off (remember his flashback), and the kids found him strange and ostracized him. If he were just a normal elemental user on Vega, the kids making fun of/ostracizing him for flying makes no sense as they'd all be able to do random stuff too. But if he had actual wings, came out nowhere, and could fly, that's a different matter entirely. In fact, now that I've remembered that he had wings, this all lends credence to the idea that he may just be a descendant of the Sylvia line rather than anyone's reincarnation... (which also means there may be a Kagura-Aquarion form we have yet to see).

I've been reading the manga and it seems to be implying that but I'm not getting drawn in by the art style, and a lot of the emotion and feel from the anime seems lost somewhere in translation.

EroKing · 2012-02-27, 01:32

Holes are deep......

While the entire episode was pretty fun watching,

^This made my day

willyvereb · 2012-02-27, 01:33

I have a different theory on the origins of Amata and Kagura.

I won't go in the details about whoever comes from Altair and whoever comes from Vega. There aren't enough evidence for even the the assumption's base to properly speculate.

Instead I bring up something from the original Aquarion series.

Spoiler for mayor Sousei no Aquarion spoilers:

If you didn't watch Sousei no Aquarion (that I assume are relatively few in numbers) then read the spoiler above at your own risk.

Anyways, in short I theorize that the soul of Apollo and Apollonius reincarnated separately.

Amata = The reincarnation of Apollonius
Kagura = the reincarnation of Apollo

That makes more sense IMO than claiming both Altair and Vega has the reincarnation counterparts of every important character.

evil|plushie · 2012-02-27, 01:42

it'd just be easier to say amata = reincarnation of Apollo's good feelings and kagura = reincarnation of the negative feelings since apollonius and apollo are the same soul anyway.

Thess · 2012-02-27, 02:21

Also this episode:

Spoiler for episode 9:

j0x · 2012-02-27, 02:32

@episode 9

the sexual implications are FILLING my brain right
and im DIGGING the sexual dialogues in this show too

FLCL · 2012-02-27, 02:32

Bros before holes yo!

Andy reminds me of a

Spoiler:

Simon from TTGL with 10x more badass

kuromitsu · 2012-02-27, 02:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheEroKing

^This made my day

*facepalm*

The "translation" is funny I suppose but ARGH NO it's not "Boys before flowers" that's the title of a manga!

It's "dango" (団子) as in those cute round dumplings, and the proverb literally means "dango over flowers," "practical over aesthetics"... The title of the manga Hana yori dango (男子) is a pun on this proverb.

(At least this was just a throwaway gag, not something like "La'Cryma" in Noein... I'll never get over that.)

Thess · 2012-02-27, 02:55

More about the cards:

Spoiler for for copy pasta yum:

Jack of Clubs (Amata's card):
Traditionally the Jack of Clubs is “the trusted friend and adviser.” He is a hard-working, honest, sincere young person. When read for coloring, the Jack of Clubs is of medium complexion, and has brown hair and brown eyes. The
Jack of Clubs is a busy, active young person. He is clever and enterprising. He enjoys sports, and may participate in school or community baseball, football, etc. This is also the card of “the student,” and can represent a school boy, or a young man in high school or college. This young man is of service to—or in the service of the person being read. He can be an employee, and often represents a young acquaintance from work. Or he could be a close friend or business associate who is going to be useful to the inquirer in some way.

Ace of Diamonds (Zessica's card):
The Ace of Diamonds is traditionally a positive card. Specifically, it signifies a letter, a ring or paper money. The Ace of Diamonds represents news, a message, an invitation, or written communication. The surrounding cards will indicate if the news is good or bad. It also denotes new beginnings. It signifies making a fresh start, and beginning again from scratch. It can indicate the start of a new financial venture, or the beginning of a new phase in life. Furthermore, its original meaning of “a ring” simbolizing the Ace of Diamonds was about wedding engagement taking place.

Queen of Diamonds (MIX's card):
Traditionally, the Queen of Diamonds represents a woman with very light coloring -- red or light blond hair with blue, green or gray eyes. She might also have gray or white hair. The Queen of Diamonds is intelligent, energetic, cultured and financially secure. The Queen of Diamonds is usually an intelligent, dynamic woman of authority, and there could be money around her. She might be a wealthy jet-setter, an account executive, a CPA, a bank manager, or a government official. She could represent a female relative by marriage. She might be a stepchild, step-sister, mother-in-law, sister-in-law, daughter-in-law, or any family bond by marriage of the one who is getting their fortune read.

Ace of Hearts (Mikono's card):
Traditionally the Ace of Hearts is a card of love. Happiness and celebrations. As an Ace and a Heart, this card can indicate a new love, or the beginning of an emotional period in the seeker's life. Specifically this card denotes the source of seeker's emotional support which in most cases is the home and the family. The Ace of Hearts can refer to the actual building in which the seeker resides, or it can denote the idea of feeling comfortable and "at home." It can also represent a change of residence, or a return home after being away for a period of time. The Ace of Hearts can also refer to real estate and the sale or purchase of a home or a specific family member, or the seeker's family in general. The symbol of this card is "home", the surrounding card will reveal the current situation in the home, and any problems or changes in that area of the seeker's life.

Ace of Spades (I don't remember if this was mean to be Shrade's or Kagura's card):
Traditionally the Ace of Spades has gotten a bad rap similar to the common misconceptions regarding the Death card of Tarot. And like the true meaning of the Tarot Death card, the Ace of Spades symbolizes the changes and transformations associated with endings and new beginnings. In rare cases the Ace of Spades can indicate physical death, but only in combination with other Spades. Some systems use a reversed position meaning for the Ace of Spades even though no reverse meanings are used for the other 51 cards in the deck. Traditionally, the reversed Ace of Spades symbolizes death. Whereas the three other Aces in the deck represent new beginnings, the Ace of Spades can refer to endings, or possibly the beginning of trouble in a reading. Of course, endings are not always bad things, so the appearance of this card in a reading can indicate a “rebirth,” and can be regarded as an indirectly positive influence. Because Spades symbolize “the mind,” a modern meaning of the Ace Spades refers to “what affects the mind” such as worry, fear, anxiety, decisions, etc. Reversed could mean fear or anxiety about death/change.

It's also the known "most powerful" card in the deck.

Where there any others of note? I haven't paid attention.

pingva · 2012-02-27, 02:59

Quote:

Where there any others of note? I haven't paid attention.

I like this kind of things.
Ace of Spades is Shrade. Joker was shown for Kagura.

Thess · 2012-02-27, 03:12

Was it a black or red Joker? It's important because, IIRC, black Joker is compared to the Fool (the one who does the journey, the non-numbered one who holds all the cards but he's unaware of his potential and theirs: symbolizing new beginnings, the start of the journey, etc) while the red one (the Juggler) is compared to the Magician of the Tarot.

Zuul · 2012-02-27, 03:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thess

Was it a black or red Joker? It's important because, IIRC, black Joker is compared to the Fool (the one who does the journey, the non-numbered one who holds all the cards but he's unaware of his potential and theirs: symbolizing new beginnings, the start of the journey, etc) while the red one (the Juggler) is compared to the Magician of the Tarot.

I think it was black but I'm not too sure about it.

Thess · 2012-02-27, 03:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zuul

I think it was black but I'm not too sure about it.

Time for me to re-watch episode 5!

pingva · 2012-02-27, 03:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thess

Was it a black or red Joker? It's important because, IIRC, black Joker is compared to the Fool (the one who does the journey, the non-numbered one who holds all the cards but he's unaware of his potential and theirs: symbolizing new beginnings, the start of the journey, etc) while the red one (the Juggler) is compared to the Magician of the Tarot.

It's hard to choose a color. It was colored in red and black.

hai_san · 2012-02-27, 03:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by jix

@episode 9

the sexual implications are FILLING my brain right
and im DIGGING the sexual dialogues in this show too

really aquarion evol has the most pervert speech this whole season

"i will digg a whole for you" or "i will fill your whole with my dirt"...

Ypocaramel · 2012-02-27, 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by noobita

On serious note, why don't those Altair citizens just migrate to Vega? Almost of all them are bishi, and it will be super easy for them to get their "mate".

Basic Law Article 24 reinterpreted.

Sorry, couldn't get help get a good Hong Kong joke pass even if no one will get it.

Thess · 2012-02-27, 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by pingva

It's hard to choose a color. It was colored in red and black.

I just re-watched. It's the black Joker (the red Joker usually has opposite color scheme and the "J" is in red).

Kagura gets the most important card. The black Joker = the Fool. The one who trumps all.

Since I'm lazy to copy-paste stuff, I'm choosing this site to give a glimpse. Oh, it also symbolizes karma and destiny.

2012-02-27, 01:32	Link #2045
EroKing Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Age: 38	Holes are deep...... While the entire episode was pretty fun watching, ^This made my day __________________

2012-02-27, 01:33	Link #2046
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	I have a different theory on the origins of Amata and Kagura. I won't go in the details about whoever comes from Altair and whoever comes from Vega. There aren't enough evidence for even the the assumption's base to properly speculate. Instead I bring up something from the original Aquarion series. Spoiler for mayor Sousei no Aquarion spoilers: As anyone who saw Sousei no Aquarion knows that Celiane's soul split into two parts and reincarnated separately. Silvia = Celiane's love and positive feelings Sirius = Celiane's guilt and negative feelings Let's take a spin on that and assume the same for Amata and Kagura. As you know, in the finale Apollo, Sirius and Toma piloted Aquarion to save the world. Silvia and Apollo had to part with each other but they promised to meet with each other in their next reincarnation. Although, I theorize that feeling of separation left a longing in Apollo's heart. He may have hated his destiny to be Apollonius' descendant and also he longed for reuniting with Silvie again. So his soul was split into two. The one which was the reincarnation of Apollonius = Amata The one which was the reincarnation of Apollo = Kagura Remember, Apollonius didn't have the power of smell. It was something unique to Apollo. Same with his ferocious/ wild animal like tendencies. Just like Kagura. In contrast before meeting Celiane Apollo was a nice and peace-loving being, similar to Amata's behavior. Okay, except the whole "destroy Humanity" thing. This kind of specific split would also explain both Amata's and Kagura's behavior with Mikono. If we theorize that Mikono is the reincarnation Silvie/Celianne, that is. Kagura was forceful and desperate to get Mikono. From the few scenes we saw with him, Kagura treated Mikono like someone who's already belonging to him. In contrast Amata was like the opposite. He was smothered by Mikono's presence and fell in love with her on first sight. Just the way Apollonius did. If you didn't watch Sousei no Aquarion (that I assume are relatively few in numbers) then read the spoiler above at your own risk. Anyways, in short I theorize that the soul of Apollo and Apollonius reincarnated separately. Amata = The reincarnation of Apollonius Kagura = the reincarnation of Apollo That makes more sense IMO than claiming both Altair and Vega has the reincarnation counterparts of every important character.

2012-02-27, 01:42	Link #2047
evil\|plushie The Last Frontier Join Date: Apr 2004	it'd just be easier to say amata = reincarnation of Apollo's good feelings and kagura = reincarnation of the negative feelings since apollonius and apollo are the same soul anyway. __________________ God is on the side with the biggest cannon. http://sining83.blogspot.com

2012-02-27, 02:21	Link #2048
Thess Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010	Also this episode: Spoiler for episode 9: Revealed the specific card holder. Amata = Jack of Clubs. MIX = Queen of Diamonds (right?). Mikono = Ace of Heart. Zessica = Ace of Diamonds. But also something important that their meaning combines and turns into something new. __________________ *"Who* would understand you after I die? Who else would march forward by your side?"** Last edited by Thess; 2012-02-27 at 02:33.

2012-02-27, 02:32	Link #2050
FLCL I've been Kawarolled Join Date: Sep 2007 Age: 33	Bros before holes yo! Andy reminds me of a Spoiler: pre-Kamina's death Simon from TTGL with 10x more badass Last edited by FLCL; 2012-02-27 at 02:45.

2012-02-27, 00:20	Link #2042
Zuul Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012	I hope Mikono will defect (or be unwillingly be taken away). Because it would make room for Zessica and actually gives her a chance with Amata. My heart sunk a little seeing what happened to her genki disposition this episode because of love. So I don't want her sufferings to be in vain and her having an actual real chance. Not just being a foil. She deserves better than that. This episode was nice, but I liked last week better (what could possibely beat NTRed Kagura), and I'm looking forward next week a lot more, there will be a lot of plot prograssion it seems.

2012-02-27, 02:32	Link #2049
j0x Giga Drill Breaker Join Date: Jan 2009	@episode 9 the sexual implications are FILLING my brain right and im DIGGING the sexual dialogues in this show too

2012-02-27, 02:55	Link #2052
Thess Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010	More about the cards: Spoiler for for copy pasta yum: Jack of Clubs (Amata's card): Traditionally the Jack of Clubs is “the trusted friend and adviser.” He is a hard-working, honest, sincere young person. When read for coloring, the Jack of Clubs is of medium complexion, and has brown hair and brown eyes. The Jack of Clubs is a busy, active young person. He is clever and enterprising. He enjoys sports, and may participate in school or community baseball, football, etc. This is also the card of “the student,” and can represent a school boy, or a young man in high school or college. This young man is of service to—or in the service of the person being read. He can be an employee, and often represents a young acquaintance from work. Or he could be a close friend or business associate who is going to be useful to the inquirer in some way. Ace of Diamonds (Zessica's card): The Ace of Diamonds is traditionally a positive card. Specifically, it signifies a letter, a ring or paper money. The Ace of Diamonds represents news, a message, an invitation, or written communication. The surrounding cards will indicate if the news is good or bad. It also denotes new beginnings. It signifies making a fresh start, and beginning again from scratch. It can indicate the start of a new financial venture, or the beginning of a new phase in life. Furthermore, its original meaning of “a ring” simbolizing the Ace of Diamonds was about wedding engagement taking place. Queen of Diamonds (MIX's card): Traditionally, the Queen of Diamonds represents a woman with very light coloring -- red or light blond hair with blue, green or gray eyes. She might also have gray or white hair. The Queen of Diamonds is intelligent, energetic, cultured and financially secure. The Queen of Diamonds is usually an intelligent, dynamic woman of authority, and there could be money around her. She might be a wealthy jet-setter, an account executive, a CPA, a bank manager, or a government official. She could represent a female relative by marriage. She might be a stepchild, step-sister, mother-in-law, sister-in-law, daughter-in-law, or any family bond by marriage of the one who is getting their fortune read. Ace of Hearts (Mikono's card): Traditionally the Ace of Hearts is a card of love. Happiness and celebrations. As an Ace and a Heart, this card can indicate a new love, or the beginning of an emotional period in the seeker's life. Specifically this card denotes the source of seeker's emotional support which in most cases is the home and the family. The Ace of Hearts can refer to the actual building in which the seeker resides, or it can denote the idea of feeling comfortable and "at home." It can also represent a change of residence, or a return home after being away for a period of time. The Ace of Hearts can also refer to real estate and the sale or purchase of a home or a specific family member, or the seeker's family in general. The symbol of this card is "home", the surrounding card will reveal the current situation in the home, and any problems or changes in that area of the seeker's life. Ace of Spades (I don't remember if this was mean to be Shrade's or Kagura's card): Traditionally the Ace of Spades has gotten a bad rap similar to the common misconceptions regarding the Death card of Tarot. And like the true meaning of the Tarot Death card, the Ace of Spades symbolizes the changes and transformations associated with endings and new beginnings. In rare cases the Ace of Spades can indicate physical death, but only in combination with other Spades. Some systems use a reversed position meaning for the Ace of Spades even though no reverse meanings are used for the other 51 cards in the deck. Traditionally, the reversed Ace of Spades symbolizes death. Whereas the three other Aces in the deck represent new beginnings, the Ace of Spades can refer to endings, or possibly the beginning of trouble in a reading. Of course, endings are not always bad things, so the appearance of this card in a reading can indicate a “rebirth,” and can be regarded as an indirectly positive influence. Because Spades symbolize “the mind,” a modern meaning of the Ace Spades refers to “what affects the mind” such as worry, fear, anxiety, decisions, etc. Reversed could mean fear or anxiety about death/change. It's also the known "most powerful" card in the deck. Where there any others of note? I haven't paid attention. __________________ *"Who* would understand you after I die? Who else would march forward by your side?"**

2012-02-27, 03:12	Link #2054
Thess Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010	Was it a black or red Joker? It's important because, IIRC, black Joker is compared to the Fool (the one who does the journey, the non-numbered one who holds all the cards but he's unaware of his potential and theirs: symbolizing new beginnings, the start of the journey, etc) while the red one (the Juggler) is compared to the Magician of the Tarot. __________________ *"Who* would understand you after I die? Who else would march forward by your side?"**