Aquarion EVOL - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll

[kuromitsu]

It's not just the number of characters, it's the writers' inability to handle them. Genesis had the same amount of mostly-regulars (or even more), and still managed not to lose focus. Just as a comparison, correct me if I missed anyone:

Genesis
Deava: Fudou, Rena, Sophia, whatshisface the vice comander guy, Apollo, Silvia, Sirius, Reika, Tsugumi, Pierre, Jun, the Paku Romi twins
Baddies: Touma, Otoha, Futaba, and 5 more angels who were smaller but nevertheless speaking roles
Random: Baron & Chibiko (arguable, but they were important and appeared from time to time)
So even if we don't count the 5 minor angels it's still 18 charas

Evol:
Neo-Deava: Fudou, Crea, Suomi & Donar, Amata, Mikono, Zessica, Mix, Andy, Shrade, Cayenne, Sazanka, Yunoha
Baddies: Mykage, Kagura, Izumo, Jin (deceased)
Random: Alisia (arguable because she's in stasis, but she's important)
Altogether 18 charas, 16 if we don't count Jin and Alisia.

And yet... Genesis managed to have episodes focusing on Pierre (oh lol the gattai addiction ep) and Tsugumi, lots of episodes that were basically fillers and existed mostly to have fun with the cast, and still the main characters were never handled as bad as they are in Evol.

[Iwa Ite]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

It's not just the number of characters, it's the writers' inability to handle them. Genesis had the same amount of mostly-regulars (or even more), and still managed not to lose focus. Just as a comparison, correct me if I missed anyone:

Genesis
Deava: Fudou, Rena, Sophia, whatshisface the vice comander guy, Apollo, Silvia, Sirius, Reika, Tsugumi, Pierre, Jun, the Paku Romi twins
Baddies: Touma, Otoha, Futaba, and 5 more angels who were smaller but nevertheless speaking roles
Random: Baron & Chibiko (arguable, but they were important and appeared from time to time)
So even if we don't count the 5 minor angels it's still 18 charas

Evol:
Neo-Deava: Fudou, Crea, Suomi & Donar, Amata, Mikono, Zessica, Mix, Andy, Shrade, Cayenne, Sazanka, Yunoha
Baddies: Mykage, Kagura, Izumo, Jin (deceased)
Random: Alisia (arguable because she's in stasis, but she's important)
Altogether 18 charas, 16 if we don't count Jin and Alisia.

And yet... Genesis managed to have episodes focusing on Pierre (oh lol the gattai addiction ep) and Tsugumi, lots of episodes that were basically fillers and existed mostly to have fun with the cast, and still the main characters were never handled as bad as they are in Evol.

I agree. They did way better job previous season.
Unlike in Evol, I actually cared about characters it Genesis, each one of them.

[wisteria233]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

It's not just the number of characters, it's the writers' inability to handle them. Genesis had the same amount of mostly-regulars (or even more), and still managed not to lose focus. Just as a comparison, correct me if I missed anyone:

Genesis
Deava: Fudou, Rena, Sophia, whatshisface the vice comander guy, Apollo, Silvia, Sirius, Reika, Tsugumi, Pierre, Jun, the Paku Romi twins
Baddies: Touma, Otoha, Futaba, and 5 more angels who were smaller but nevertheless speaking roles
Random: Baron & Chibiko (arguable, but they were important and appeared from time to time)
So even if we don't count the 5 minor angels it's still 18 charas

Evol:
Neo-Deava: Fudou, Crea, Suomi & Donar, Amata, Mikono, Zessica, Mix, Andy, Shrade, Cayenne, Sazanka, Yunoha
Baddies: Mykage, Kagura, Izumo, Jin (deceased)
Random: Alisia (arguable because she's in stasis, but she's important)
Altogether 18 charas, 16 if we don't count Jin and Alisia.

And yet... Genesis managed to have episodes focusing on Pierre (oh lol the gattai addiction ep) and Tsugumi, lots of episodes that were basically fillers and existed mostly to have fun with the cast, and still the main characters were never handled as bad as they are in Evol.

It seems as though the writer for Genesis was just better at handling a larger cast, and a heck of a lot better at setting the pace for the series. It was also much better at handling romance as well, as the main romance was solved by episode 15, preventing it from becoming a plot tumor. Also by this episode we had already solved quite a bit of the mysteries regarding the series, and Apollo's side story was resolved. The series was just getting ready to wrap up. Unlike Evol where they haven't even begun to explore the main character's side story.

[Vena]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

Yeees, because stealing a vector to chase after someone who you love (or hell, even a friend) and who is likely to be in grave danger right now has nothing to do with protecting them, nope, not at all. It's totally obsession. On the level of totaling buildings and killing and harming people just to get a girl who you know really wants to be with you, and also on the level of being debilitatingly depressed over your love interest not liking you that way. (But I suppose Andy is also obsessed for wanting to go to save Mix, even though Mix had just rejected him. And he never even asked if Mix even wanted to be saved, I mean, who knows, maybe she's happier at Altair! Also, everyone else who wanted to go help Mix even though she's not in love with them is obsessed with her.)

He has no basis for thinking any of this (danger, peril) aside from a dream. A dream. There was no grave danger , there was no known invasion, no reported mechas or wild Kaguras running around to even bring up the thought that she might have been in any sort of danger, he went out hunting blindly and had no idea where she was, that's all it was. Instead of doing the rational thing, he went ahead and (a.) stole a vector from an already weakened defense force, (b.) defied orders, and (c.) got others in trouble because of his obsession.

Mikono even told him to stay at Neo-Daeva and protect the school (she was in no more danger when she left initially than when he went chasing after her blindly). Him leaving Neo-Daeva to chase her against her wishes is what set off the events that led to her kidnapping, to Zessica's body-snatching, to Shrade's death, loss of yet another vector, and to the activation and loss of the Aquarion. All of these events tie back to the fact that, like a fool, he got caught by Mykage hook, line, and sinker.

Amata and Kagura are two sides of the same coin. Kagura just doesn't hide it with pretty words to cover up the fact that his actions are single-minded of purpose and obsessive. At the very least, he's an honest character even if he's the equivalent of an earthquake.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Vena

He has no basis for thinking any of this (danger, peril) aside from a dream. A dream.

A pretty horrible dream, and a pretty realistic one (apart from the Amagura thing) as far as Amata knew back then. Also, even thinking about it rationally Kagura was very likely out there looking for Mikono.

Originally Posted by Vena

There was no grave danger , there was no known invasion, no reported mechas or wild Kaguras running around to even bring up the thought that she might have been in any sort of danger,

There was no known invasion or suchlike when Kagura appeared out of nowhere in the graveyard, either. Last time they saw Kagura he rose out of the ground and disappeared in a whirl of sakura petals. No mecha, no reports, nothing. Not even any ominous bgm. (And before you say "oh, but then they weren't at Neo-Deava to hear the reports!" - there wouldn't have been any reports, seeing the method Mykage used to transport Kagura there.)

Originally Posted by Vena

he went out hunting blindly and had no idea where she was, that's all it was. Instead of doing the rational thing,

And doing the rational thing would've been...? ^^;; It's not like his tactics involved screaming "MIKONO-SAN, WHERE ARE YOU!" until he found her (that was when he was really out of his mind), he tried looking for clues, which is why he went to that town where Mikono used to live. He didn't know it had been destroyed.

Originally Posted by Vena

he went ahead and (a.) stole a vector from an already weakened defense force, (b.) defied orders, and (c.) got others in trouble because of his obsession.

You know, in any other anime this might have been a good argument. But this is Aquarion and Neo-Deava. Neo-Deava sent four of their six mechas to Altair, blindly, mind you, to find a single person on an entire planet, never mind the possibility of the whole thing being a trap - in which case they would've been open to an attack without an Aquarion to defend them. Neo-Deava also let Zessica go on this mission, even though previously she'd endangered her comrades' lives, was near-suicidal, and was the cause of Mix getting kidnapped. She was very clearly not in the mental state to fight, and yet they let her go to Altair. And so on, in short, this sort of logic is not really applicable in this show.

Originally Posted by Vena

Him leaving Neo-Daeva to chase her against her wishes is what set off the events that led to her kidnapping, to Zessica's body-snatching, to Shrade's death, loss of yet another vector, and to the activation and loss of the Aquarion. All of these events tie back to the fact that, like a fool, he got caught by Mykage hook, line, and sinker.

Wow, a few more posts and we'll get to the point that Amata is the direct cause of every horrible thing that happened in this show by falling in love with Mikono! Damn this Amata and his obsession! He killed Jin! He killed Shrade! He ruined everything! DAMN YOU, AMATA SORA! DAMN YOU! *shakes fist* (Wait, no, it was Mikono, because Amata was ready to give up when he thought she wasn't interested. Mikono said they should go on a "date." DAMN YOU, MIKONO SUZUSHIRO!!)

So, before that happens, let's just look at things rationally. Mikono would've been kidnapped with or without Amata looking for her (why do you think Kagura was even there? what do you think he was trying to do during the whole series?), Neo-Deava would've sent vectors to get Mikono back anyway because she's kind of important, and so Shrade would've died because he would've insisted on piloting Aquarion, just as he insisted on joining Operation Let's Save Mix. And Mykage would've taken over Zessica with or without Amata's involvement, that was settled many episodes earlier! All Mykage was waiting for was Solar Aquarion to appear. That's why he needed Amata, and if Amata hadn't gone looking for Mikono then Mykage would've made him go there in some other way (like, sending his Cherubim on a rampage to lure out Neo-Deava forces).

[Arya]

kuro, fighto fighto ehm ... Don't know if someone already said this but Amata at least has a reason to be "obsessed", Mikono reciprocates or gave him big hints of reciprocating him. That gives him enough justification for being so, I'd say, resolute pursuing his relationship.
Zessica never ever had any positive hints, on the contrary she knew from the start that Amata liked Mikono, having said that, I could totally understand her 'til she confessed. After that I agree with Kuromitsu that it became an obsession. I don't need to start speaking of Kagura's, do I?
I don't care what Amata did or what Zessica did because of their issues, because this is an anime, and this is EVOL, (do we really want to debate using EVOL inconsistencies? ) on my part I find normal for a MC stealing a vector or for an underdog girl sacrificing herself in the name of love. But generally speaking they are in two different positions. What divides love interest from obsession is a thin line, but for me Zessica crossed that line, Amata didn't. He is in love and "someone" is feeding his love now and then.

[Zuul]

Originally Posted by Vena

Amata and Kagura are two sides of the same coin. Kagura just doesn't hide it with pretty words to cover up the fact that his actions are single-minded of purpose and obsessive. At the very least, he's an honest character even if he's the equivalent of an earthquake.

I did notice it. At the end I find Kagura more sympathetic on that matter (even if he's in the wrong obviously) because he at least looks guenuine. That's the good thing about his lack of subtility, he's super honest.

[KleenexGhost]

Gotta agree with Zuul they are two halves of the same person. Amata tends to be indirect while Kagura is straightforward. Both fixated on Mikono.

[Vena]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

A pretty horrible dream, and a pretty realistic one (apart from the Amagura thing) as far as Amata knew back then. Also, even thinking about it rationally Kagura was very likely out there looking for Mikono.

There was no known invasion or suchlike when Kagura appeared out of nowhere in the graveyard, either. Last time they saw Kagura he rose out of the ground and disappeared in a whirl of sakura petals. No mecha, no reports, nothing. Not even any ominous bgm. (And before you say "oh, but then they weren't at Neo-Deava to hear the reports!" - there wouldn't have been any reports, seeing the method Mykage used to transport Kagura there.)

A dream is a dream, realism or not its still a dream. Does he run to Mikono's room after every nightmare? He has no basis, on a dream, to go stealing vectors (especially after being asked by the person he's chasing to not follow her (no matter how you shake it, he does not respect her wishes)) and chase blindly after someone because he had a nightmare. And as I said, he has no more reason to think she's less *safe* now as when she initially left. In fact, a giant portal opened up last time and that, more than any dream, should be a cause for concern.

So, basically, the mere existence of Kagura gives Amata a pass to never let Mikono be on her own, even when she requests it? (Sounds like an over protective parent floundering in obsession with their child's so called *safety*.) Even though she defended said invader? Has an attachment to said invader? And thinks said invader is not a bad person? Seems more like Amata is quite disturbed by the concept of Kagura taking Mikono (specifically willingly) from him than he is about Mikono being in danger. The fact that the mere dream, staring non other than Kagura, sends him flying while a giant portal opening in the sky does not, seems to point in this direction.

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

And doing the rational thing would've been...? ^^;; It's not like his tactics involved screaming "MIKONO-SAN, WHERE ARE YOU!" until he found her (that was when he was really out of his mind), he tried looking for clues, which is why he went to that town where Mikono used to live. He didn't know it had been destroyed.

The rational thing? Talk to the very rational, open minded Crea about the fact that you had a very strange dream and think Mikono is in danger. If its *that* believable, others, especially his friends, would likely not be against giving him a hand and, collectively, going out to look for the missing Mikono. He'd accomplish far more with his friends.

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

You know, in any other anime this might have been a good argument. But this is Aquarion and Neo-Deava. Neo-Deava sent four of their six mechas to Altair, blindly, mind you, to find a single person on an entire planet, never mind the possibility of the whole thing being a trap - in which case they would've been open to an attack without an Aquarion to defend them. Neo-Deava also let Zessica go on this mission, even though previously she'd endangered her comrades' lives, was near-suicidal, and was the cause of Mix getting kidnapped. She was very clearly not in the mental state to fight, and yet they let her go to Altair. And so on, in short, this sort of logic is not really applicable in this show.

That single planet is (a.) their only threat, so taking the fight to them in a rescue mission is not incomprehensible, (b.) they might figure out why the hell they are getting attacked, (c.) they were given a once in a lifetime opportunity (they never had the portal open for them in the past) to take the fight to the enemy or to do recon.

As for letting Zessica go, there's a multitude of reasons just as letting Andy go has its reasons. She'd be driven to make right what was wrong (Andy is driven to save MIX), she's one of the only TWO remaining females with which to form the various forms of Aquarion and sending only one is a risk.

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

So, before that happens, let's just look at things rationally. Mikono would've been kidnapped with or without Amata looking for her (why do you think Kagura was even there? what do you think he was trying to do during the whole series?), Neo-Deava would've sent vectors to get Mikono back anyway because she's kind of important, and so Shrade would've died because he would've insisted on piloting Aquarion, just as he insisted on joining Operation Let's Save Mix. And Mykage would've taken over Zessica with or without Amata's involvement, that was settled many episodes earlier! All Mykage was waiting for was Solar Aquarion to appear. That's why he needed Amata, and if Amata hadn't gone looking for Mikono then Mykage would've made him go there in some other way (like, sending his Cherubim on a rampage to lure out Neo-Deava forces).

Actually. Without Amata going to look, he and Kagura never meet, the Golden Aquarion never awakens, and Mikono isn't tossed into the air by its awakening. There's a good reason Mykage goaded our troubled little boy and pulled him by the nose to where Kagura was waiting.

In the same way that Zessica's actions caused a rippling effect with negative consequences (for herself and for others), Amata's actions caused a rippling effect with negative consequences.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Arya

kuro, fighto fighto

I'm just trying to get it out of my system before the haters arrive. Though I see it's too late... Amata is not this subforum's favorite fictional person, and that's putting it mildly, but things are getting a teeeny little bit ridiculous. (Amata, hiding his horrible, base, sick obsession with pretty words! That rake! )

Originally Posted by Vena

A dream is a dream, realism or not its still a dream. Does he run to Mikono's room after every nightmare? He has no basis, on a dream, to go stealing vectors (especially after being asked by the person he's chasing to not follow her (no matter how you shake it, he does not respect her wishes)) and chase blindly after someone because he had a nightmare. And as I said, he has no more reason to think she's less *safe* now as when she initially left. In fact, a giant portal opened up last time and that, more than any dream, should be a cause for concern.

No-one said he wasn't worried when she left? But she said she wanted to go alone because [reasons] and so he stayed and kept his worry to himself. But now had a nightmare about the very real possibility of Kagura being out there and hurting Mikono. Maybe (possibly) it was Mykage manipulating him. Maybe it was just his own fear and worry playing tricks on him. But he finally decided he couldn't sit on his ass while who knows what is happening to Mikono. It's not like he went from "no worries! 8D" to "OMG MUST HELP HER!" (Also, I can't help but have a feeling that, if after such a dream Amata hadn't said "screw you guys I'm going out to find her" people would be ragging on him for not going. See, here's the proof, he doesn't really love her!)

Originally Posted by Vena

So, basically, the mere existence of Kagura gives Amata a pass to never let Mikono be on her own, even when she requests it? (Sounds like an over protective parent floundering in obsession with their child's so called *safety*.)

...the very real possibility of Kagura being out there and hurting Mikono. Also, it's not like he never let her be on her own, Christ, now I'm about to ask you of all people, if we're watching the same show... :/ *facepalm*

Originally Posted by Vena

Even though she defended said invader? Has an attachment to said invader? And thinks said invader is not a bad person? Seems more like Amata is quite disturbed by the concept of Kagura taking Mikono (specifically willingly) from him than he is about Mikono being in danger.

Aww man, you're right! This is sick!! Overprotective, overly jealous, how horrible can Amata be?
...OK, trying to take this seriously for five minutes, remember episode 6? When they were running from Kagura? Amata said something along the lines of "I also feel I know him - and I know I can't let him take you." ("あいつにだけは")
Also, it's not just Kagura "taking" Mikono, it's Kagura hurting Mikono and then taking her. Big difference there.

Originally Posted by Vena

The fact that the mere dream, staring non other than Kagura,

Kagura raping Mikono while Amata is unable to help her...

Originally Posted by Vena

sends him flying while a giant portal opening in the sky does not, seems to point in this direction.

...you know what, I just give up.

Originally Posted by Vena

The rational thing? Talk to the very rational, open minded Crea

...who didn't want them to go save Mix until Fudou gave the order... Crea is awesome and all, but the end result would've been the same. Hell, Amata's plight may have convinced Andy to sneak out with him.

Originally Posted by Vena

going out to look for the missing Mikono. He'd accomplish far more with his friends.

And the result would've been the same: playing into Mykage's hand.

Originally Posted by Vena

That single planet is (a.) their only threat, so taking the fight to them in a rescue mission is not incomprehensible, (b.) they might figure out why the hell they are getting attacked, (c.) they were given a once in a lifetime opportunity (they never had the portal open for them in the past) to take the fight to the enemy or to do recon.

4 vectors. Four. Just to make sure they can't make an Aquarion in case the gate is a trap after all and the Altair forces attack.
Still doesn't justify sending Zessica, or Andy for that matter who wasn't exactly in the right state of mind either.
Also, Izumo had already told them why they were getting attacked.

Originally Posted by Vena

As for letting Zessica go, there's a multitude of reasons just as letting Andy go has its reasons.

Yes: the plot. (Or, to be exact, making Andy and Zessica angst, and also to make people worried about Zessica (& Yunoha) turning into a boy and losing her boobs.)

Originally Posted by Vena

Actually. Without Amata going to look, he and Kagura never meet, the Golden Aquarion never awakens, and Mikono isn't tossed into the air by its awakening. There's a good reason Mykage goaded our troubled little boy and pulled him by the nose to where Kagura was waiting.

Mykage wanted the Solar Aquarion. He most likely already knew that Fudou and Mikono were there. That's why he put Kagura there: to meet Amata when he comes and take Mikono when the time comes and the Solar Aquarion appears. Even your "rational" solution consisted of Neo-Deava going out to look for Mikono which would've ended with the exact same result. No matter what Amata would've ended up there and would've met Kagura because that's what Mykage wanted. (Also, plot reasons.) And Mykage taking over Zessica was the promise he was talking about to Zessica when he kissed her, how many episodes earlier?

Look, there's really no point in continuing this. I'm bowing out because, well, I'm sorry but I can't take this seriously anymore. Please do continue blaming Amata's ~obsession~ for Shrade's death and Mykage taking over Zessica's body.

[mayumi]

Compared to how Apollo was, yes Amata and Kagura are obsessed. It's rather sickening for me that they act so dependant. Like thier whole life revolves around Mikono.

I am begining to see how reincarnations and promises from past lives really suck. Stop making stupid promises, perhaps that's the theme of EVOL.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

A pretty horrible dream, and a pretty realistic one (apart from the Amagura thing) as far as Amata knew back then. Also, even thinking about it rationally Kagura was very likely out there looking for Mikono.

It was a dream. Period.

He disobeyed orders, stole a vector, left the place vulnerable for attacks (who he had no idea would stop) and flew into a quarantined area because of a vague idea that turned out to be false. Then got attacked and had one of his comrades killed in action (saved by Mykage, but still).

It was the equivalent to what Zessica did in episode 18. Stop justifying him acting like that. He was reckless and was out of his mind.

I'm sick and tired to see Amata's obsessive, unhealthy behavior justified when it's not (have we forgotten how depressed he acted when he couldn't see her or was unable to almost act when she had a misunderstanding in the first episodes? While she never really gave so much thought about him). He's as badly written as the rest. Instead of helping a fallen comrade (which could have been Zessica, Andy, Cayenne, I don't care). Or, oh geez, contact the headquarters to tell them what happened to help them, he starts a feral fight against Kagura over unimportant crap. When Kagura wasn't even violent or anything.

His actions are understandable because he has massive 24.000 years old blue balls as Kagura does. But healthy and non-obsessive? Not really. If anything shows how creepy reincarnation romance is supposed to be

Originally Posted by Vena

In the same way that Zessica's actions caused a rippling effect with negative consequences (for herself and for others), Amata's actions caused a rippling effect with negative consequences.

This so much, how can anyone be utterly blinded by fangirlism/boyism over a character or a couple to not see the obvious.

Originally Posted by mayumi

Compared to how Apollo was, yes Amata and Kagura are obsessed. It's rather sickening for me that they act so dependant. Like thier whole life revolves around Mikono.

Funny thing that Amata placed unrealistic expectations over Mikono since the beginning (he thought he finally found the one who will wait for him!). She cracked a joke and he took it seriously. Our boy has mental issues which are obvious due to his trauma and reincarnation. I don't blame poor Mikono when she tries to put some distance.

[wisteria233]

Originally Posted by Thess

Funny thing that Amata placed unrealistic expectations over Mikono since the beginning (he thought he finally found the one who will wait for him!). She cracked a joke and he took it seriously. Our boy has mental issues which are obvious due to his trauma and reincarnation. I don't blame poor Mikono when she tries to put some distance.

Actually Amata's actions only caused a negative reaction from Zessica who already knew from day one that he didn't love her back, and as stated time and time again it isn't Amata's fault that he doesn't love her. It isn't Amata's fault that she is obsessed with him and doesn't make an effort to move on. We can't blame Amata for Zessica's short comings, since she got herself into that mess.

It wasn't Amata's fault, that Mix got kidnapped due to Zessica's reckless behavior, it wasn't Amata's fault that Kagura was separated from him, it wasn't Amata's fault that Jin died, it wasn't Amata's fault that Mikono got kidnapped. You can't blame Amata for the things that other people do. Amata himself has been consistently ineffectual to the story so far.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by wisteria233

Actually Amata's actions only caused a negative reaction from Zessica who already knew from day one that he didn't love her back, and as stated time and time again it isn't Amata's fault that he doesn't love her. It isn't Amata's fault that she is obsessed with him and doesn't make an effort to move on. We can't blame Amata for Zessica's short comings, since she got herself into that mess.

It wasn't Amata's fault, that Mix got kidnapped due to Zessica's reckless behavior, it wasn't Amata's fault that Kagura was separated from him, it wasn't Amata's fault that Jin died, it wasn't Amata's fault that Mikono got kidnapped. You can't blame Amata for the things that other people do. Amata himself has been consistently ineffectual to the story so far.

What does have to do with anything I posted?

[Maximillionus]

here's to hoping that Alicia does something useful these last few episodes.

[Triple_R]

Here's my take on Amata and Zessica:

Both are guilty of having quite a bit of an one-track mind... but then again, we are talking about teenaged crushes here. Many teenagers don't handle their first crush well, if it runs into a lot of complications (Amata) or strongly implied rejection (Zessica). And a lot of teenagers haven't had a lot of life experience, so that can make a failed or struggling crush/romance appear more important than it is.

Amata and Zessica both need somebody to take them aside, and talk a bit more sense into them, but that's it. I don't think they're crazy or anything, just a bit obsessed.

[wisteria233]

Originally Posted by Thess

What does have to do with anything I posted?

Oops I meant to quote Vena saying that Amata's actions caused rippling effects which had consequences. Since Amata hasn't done anything, and certainly can not be blamed for Zessica's current plight as no one told her to flirt around with the guy who was interested in someone else, and not take no for an answer and to not move her life.

[kk2extreme]

Originally Posted by Maximillionus

here's to hoping that Alicia does something useful these last few episodes.

I think she will be surprised that her one son is now two

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by wisteria233

Oops I meant to quote Vena saying that Amata's actions caused rippling effects which had consequences. Since Amata hasn't done anything, and certainly can not be blamed for Zessica's current plight as no one told her to flirt around with the guy who was interested in someone else, and not take no for an answer and to not move her life.

You're making Zessica out to be worse than what she is.

It's not like there was anything firm between Amata and Mikono when Zessica started flirting with him.

And how did Zessica not take "no" for an answer? She hasn't tried to force anything on Amata. It's not like she's insisting that he be her boyfriend. Geez, in an entertainment medium that includes actual yanderes, you're blowing Zessica's behavior a bit out of proportion, imo.

[Zuul]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

You're making Zessica out to be worse than what she is.

It's not like there was anything firm between Amata and Mikono when Zessica started flirting with him.

And how did Zessica not take "no" for an answer? She hasn't tried to force anything on Amata. It's not like she's insisting that he be her boyfriend. Geez, in an entertainment medium that includes actual yanderes, you're blowing Zessica's behavior a bit out of proportion, imo.

Zessica has even been actually giving support to Amata in his pursuing of Mikono.

She just loves him, can't help him and is suffering about it.

She's pretty much aware her only chance is Mikono ditching Amata in favor of Kagura (if Amata doesn't kill himself over it, that's it) and that in 12000 years from now.

I don't think it is anything like pushing herself on him.