Fate/stay night Heaven's Feel Movie Discussion Thread

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

And this is why I hate multiple endings in a game. Fans are the worst kind of people especially if they argue like this.... -_-
This is why I liked manga the best in Fate series, clean and simple and it does everyone justice. But then not everyone liked it because it hurts their favorite route, boo-hoo.... -_-

Except that it doesn't "do everyone justice". They basically completely re-wrote Sakura's backstory to get rid of Zouken, meaning that her personality no longer makes sense, and her involvement in the story consists of a minor mention when she saves Shinji, with basically nothing else about her past (including her relationship with Rin) covered at all.

And really now, it's same with any other japanese game. As long as they have their route they like everyone are happy. Anime covers only one and everyone get's mad.
Westerners do this thing so much better, just look at Mass Effect. I don't see people arguing about who is better love interest or what way is better to choose, they all enjoy and share their experience.

It's not as simple as "who is the love interest?", though. It's more a matter of which characters are actually involved. If your favourite character is ignored (as Sakura often is) then you are obviously not going to be happy about it.

And, honestly, the reason Mass Effect is OK (assuming it is, I don't know) is because it is a game, and the players chose the route like they do with a VN. If they made a film of it and cut out half the characters, I bet people would moan.

What I find it interesting in this cases is that most people are attracted to Lawful Good characters who are strong and independent and fight evil. There are some exceptions but most of the time it's like this. So if your character doesn't have this traits while some other does don't expect that your character be more popular than 'heroic' type one.

Personally, I dislike Lawful characters, I far prefer Chaotic ones. So, even there I don't like that approach. Why should everything appeal to the majority...?

[Brother Coa]

Originally Posted by allfictions

That was sarcasm, right?

I know nobody liked the ending, myself included.
But you cannot say that universe and story itself is not epic.

[Brother Coa]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

Except that it doesn't "do everyone justice". They basically completely re-wrote Sakura's backstory to get rid of Zouken, meaning that her personality no longer makes sense, and her involvement in the story consists of a minor mention when she saves Shinji, with basically nothing else about her past (including her relationship with Rin) covered at all.

In your opinion, to me what they did to Sakura here was fine by me. Of course I am not a fan of Sakura but everything is better than what she got in original F/SN Haven's Feel. So I am ok with that.

It's not as simple as "who is the love interest?", though. It's more a matter of which characters are actually involved. If your favourite character is ignored (as Sakura often is) then you are obviously not going to be happy about it.

I agree. But as I said - economy and ratings. I can at least tell that I know the feel.

And, honestly, the reason Mass Effect is OK (assuming it is, I don't know) is because it is a game,

And F/SN is what? picture anime? It's a video game as well just with little less interaction.

and the players chose the route like they do with a VN.

Let's just said that Fate visual novel is little kid when compared to this. You do not just make up your story - you shape entire setting the way you like. The decisions you make in 1'st game ( it's a trilogy ) have impact on how everything will turn out in the third game. To the very last detail.

If they made a film of it and cut out half the characters, I bet people would moan.

Actually they did, and everyone liked it. Not official but close enough.

Personally, I dislike Lawful characters, I far prefer Chaotic ones. So, even there I don't like that approach. Why should everything appeal to the majority...?

Well you are minority, I understand and respect this.
Why everything should appeal to majority? As several people, myself included here, said - MONEY. If minority can pay to the mother company much more than majority then you can have your way.
So you get in the amount you pay, and so far it seems that Sakura fans cannot pay more than Saber fans.

[blitz1/2]

@fireminer:

Oh, how could I forget, but technically it would be pseudo wincest since Ilya and Shirou aren't blood related.

[allfictions]

Incest is never wincest in my book.

[Brother Coa]

You clearly never watched Yosuga no Sora

[blitz1/2]

Originally Posted by allfictions

Incest is never wincest in my book.

Schrodinger's wincest? And besides, Ilya and Shirou are not blood related, hence pseudo incest, which according to some is not considered as wincest. But still, you can't go wrong with incest, pseudo or real otherwise.

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

In your opinion, to me what they did to Sakura here was fine by me. Of course I am not a fan of Sakura but everything is better than what she got in original F/SN Haven's Feel. So I am ok with that.

I think your statement there about sums it up. You're not a Sakura fan, so of course you don't care if they completely massacred her character and gave her virtually no involvement.

And F/SN is what? picture anime? It's a video game as well just with little less interaction.

Games can have multiple routes, animes cannot. It's a lot easier to avoid arguments when you can pick your own route than when the company has decided on one for you.

Let's just said that Fate visual novel is little kid when compared to this. You do not just make up your story - you shape entire setting the way you like. The decisions you make in 1'st game ( it's a trilogy ) have impact on how everything will turn out in the third game. To the very last detail.

Yeah, which is why there is less argument. If you prefer a particular path, you just play that path, there's no need to shout at each other about it.

Actually they did, and everyone liked it. Not official but close enough.

I have to admit that is surprising.

Well you are minority, I understand and respect this.
Why everything should appeal to majority? As several people, myself included here, said - MONEY. If minority can pay to the mother company much more than majority then you can have your way.
So you get in the amount you pay, and so far it seems that Sakura fans cannot pay more than Saber fans.

Except that we don't "get the amount we pay". Sakura fans might not be in the majority but nor are there none of us. And, yet, TM seems quite happy to act as if we don't exist and just pander to the damn Saber fans all the time.

[blitz1/2]

WHat about us Ilya fans?! T_T

[Cherry_Lover]

Well, Ilya is an important part of HF anyway, and she also gets a lot of involvement in Fate, and therefore the original FSN anime.

[CBredbeard]

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

WHat about us Ilya fans?! T_T

The universe would explode if Illya ever kissed Shirou.

[blitz1/2]

Originally Posted by CBredbeard

The universe would explode if Illya ever kissed Shirou.

That sounds like a good idea. But it's ok, we have the Second Magic, hence if one Universe explodes, we have another. And besides, it would explode in happiness and of joy.

[Bdoom12]

Damn, we're freiking messed up. Wish I could disagree, lol.

[Touko]

Fate Side Materials explained.

A good "Wise Up" before you watch the animu.

But cracking open the Visual Novel is probably better.

[allfictions]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

You clearly never watched Yosuga no Sora

Heard of it though, so that counts for something right?

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

But still, you can't go wrong with incest, pseudo or real otherwise.

Yeah, no.

Westermarck effect: People in an incestuous relationship would have to have had their natural instinct broken, usually through some traumatic experience(s). Ergo, you can only go wrong with incest actually, pseudo or real. Any ''convenient'' explanation is a cop-out to justify it for fans who, while probably not having siblings, would still feel a bit too squicky about it.

[Touko]

Stop trying to make Ilya route happen.

It is not happening.

Especially when UFOtable wants to do simu-cast and not get banned in the West.

[allfictions]

My only requirements:

1) Yuki Kaijura must compose again.

2) While I think Heaven's Feel would be a bit too dark, I require Nine Lives Blade Works, and I require something as awesome as the Shirou vs. Kotomine fight from that route.

Personally though, I'd prefer if it was the Fate route (best romance) integrated with the best parts from the other 2 routes (the plot from HF and the battle scenes/EMIYA ideology clash from UBW).

But I fear that that would be too much to hope for.

[Touko]

Originally Posted by allfictions

My only requirements:

1) Yuki Kaijura must compose again.

Why not Kawai? He composed the original tracks.
Pegasus Meteor Bomb without "Sword of Promised Victory" is not right.
UBW/Nine Lives without "Emiya" is not right.

2) While I think Heaven's Feel would be a bit too dark, I require Nine Lives Blade Works, and I require something as awesome as the Shirou vs. Kotomine fight from that route.

The Shirou vs. Kotomine man-fight sounds good on paper, but I think it is gonna be boring.
It was just Shirou flailing about and getting punched by Kotomine.

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by allfictions

Personally though, I'd prefer if it was the Fate route (best romance) integrated with the best parts from the other 2 routes (the plot from HF and the battle scenes/EMIYA ideology clash from UBW).

That's what they did before. It didn't work out. HF, UBW, and Fate though are incompatible with each other so it just creates a mess when you try to combine stories. I could see them do HF while going more in depth about Archer (which works really well considering what happens in the route). and getting more fighting between servants in.

The fact the anime poster has the greater grail and not the lesser ones shown in Fate and UBW means that HF is going to play a major role in this anime one way or the other. So unless they do all 3 routes, HF has a high chance of being the main route they follow but adding in some extra scenes to expand the characterization in it more.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by allfictions

Westermarck effect: People in an incestuous relationship would have to have had their natural instinct broken, usually through some traumatic experience(s). Ergo, you can only go wrong with incest actually, pseudo or real. Any ''convenient'' explanation is a cop-out to justify it for fans who, while probably not having siblings, would still feel a bit too squicky about it.

You cannot actually be trying to use the Westermack effect as a reason to hate on IllyaxShirou, are you? The entire basis of the effect is that it requires people to be brought up in close proximity. Are Japan and Germany (or Switzerland or whatever country they're from) now in close enough proximity to trigger the effect? If so, I guess everywhere on earth is pretty much in close enough proximity to everywhere else, huh?