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Old 2022-09-28, 02:42   Link #801
Yu Ominae
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Maybe...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belkov View Post
Maybe the question should be should ordinary Ukrainians die needlessly and the futures destroyed over a war they can't win and is only continuing with the help of NATO whose support has been shown with recent events can be withdrawn at any time?
The poster in question's from Scotland.
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Old 2022-09-28, 02:57   Link #802
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nachtwandler View Post
Oh damn. Russia supporters posing as westerners here? Sorry, but none of people I know are willing to give up here.
Same energy as Floch from Attack on Titan when he ask what's bad about submission. I mean, you are one of the Ukrainians we know of, in this very forum, and some "westerners" are pretending to be concerned about your life by outright telling yall to just surrender and submit.

Last edited by Sheba; 2022-09-28 at 04:02.
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Old 2022-09-28, 04:15   Link #803
Yu Ominae
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https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/com..._without_even/

A Channel 1 video of the votes being counted in the occupied areas.

They’re showing the ballot papers, but I don’t see anything written.
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Old 2022-09-28, 07:12   Link #804
GDB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Belkov View Post
Maybe the question should be should ordinary Ukrainians die needlessly and the futures destroyed over a war they can't win and is only continuing with the help of NATO whose support has been shown with recent events can be withdrawn at any time?
Implying Russia isn't sending its people to die needlessly, and by becoming Russian you can avoid this?

As for "war they can't win"... I dunno, they seem to be doing pretty well. Sure it's because of NATO's help, but that doesn't change the fact that they're winning all the same.
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Old 2022-09-28, 08:43   Link #805
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yu Ominae View Post
Maybe... The poster in question's from Scotland.
The sad truth (whether Belkar is Scottish or not) is that there are many Europeans that are crybabies (just like many 'murricans) that rather have all of Ukraine suffer the civilian bloodshed we have seen on the liberated cities, than paying this winter higher energy bills.

The simple fact is that by next winter utility prices will have returned to normal, but putin enablers rather feed the alligator now thinking "the iron curtain never came this close", give me my cheap gas. Maybe they don't know russian mini-subs have already sabotaged nordstream, so russia does not have to pay extra for not fulfilling written contracts.
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Old 2022-09-28, 18:50   Link #806
Belkov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mangamuscle View Post
The sad truth (whether Belkar is Scottish or not) is that there are many Europeans that are crybabies (just like many 'murricans) that rather have all of Ukraine suffer the civilian bloodshed we have seen on the liberated cities, than paying this winter higher energy bills.

The simple fact is that by next winter utility prices will have returned to normal, but putin enablers rather feed the alligator now thinking "the iron curtain never came this close", give me my cheap gas. Maybe they don't know russian mini-subs have already sabotaged nordstream, so russia does not have to pay extra for not fulfilling written contracts.
Yeah, next winter utility prices will return to normal. LOL.

Really sums up the level of political discussion on this forum.

Enjoy yourselves as to who can virtue signal the most on the topic on the moment. What next? Taiwan?
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Old 2022-09-28, 20:42   Link #807
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Low blow on Taiwan. Coming from you.
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Old 2022-09-28, 22:49   Link #808
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This is some weird reddit/4ch level victim blaming going on here.
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Old 2022-09-29, 05:02   Link #809
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A guy with Russian-sounding nickname pretends to be Scottish. That is to blatant.
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Old 2022-09-29, 05:08   Link #810
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Mangamuscle also poorly worded that part about the prices going back to normal I think.

I am guessing he meant that supposed peace supporters, who advocate for Ukraine immediate and unconditional surrender are pretending to side with Karens who want to go back to normal asap. Ukrainian people's freedom to choose their own destiny be damned.
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Old 2022-09-29, 12:54   Link #811
Roger Rambo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Implying Russia isn't sending its people to die needlessly, and by becoming Russian you can avoid this?

As for "war they can't win"... I dunno, they seem to be doing pretty well. Sure it's because of NATO's help, but that doesn't change the fact that they're winning all the same.
I really can't grasp how anybody can gripe about Ukraine sending its soldiers to die needlessly with a straight face while Russia sent press ganged Donbass residents into combat with World War 1 bolt action rifles, and whose current mobilization plans involve conscripted reservists being sent to fight in Ukraine with anywhere between 0 to 2 weeks of training like this was the Vulksturm when the German Army was falling apart in WW2.

I certainly know if we had suggested Russia would do this prior to this war starting, Russia sympathetic parties would have gone berserk about how slanderous and absurd this all ways. Yet 7 months into the conflict, they don't even blink at any of that and insist that everything is obviously going perfectly fine for Russia.
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Old 2022-09-29, 19:52   Link #812
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
I really can't grasp how anybody can gripe about Ukraine sending its soldiers to die needlessly with a straight face while Russia sent press ganged Donbass residents into combat with World War 1 bolt action rifles, and whose current mobilization plans involve conscripted reservists being sent to fight in Ukraine with anywhere between 0 to 2 weeks of training like this was the Vulksturm when the German Army was falling apart in WW2.
The low press coverage on the situation of the civilians on the russian side and the fact than Russia did start the conflict could explain why a lot of peoples would care more for the live of the ukrainians than of the russians.
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Old 2022-09-29, 22:08   Link #813
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The sabotage to the Russian pipeline marks a new phase in this war, too many people all over Europe and Africa are going to suffer even more now. This pipeline was the best leverage that Russia had to make Europe submit to their demands, specially given the upcoming winter season, and possibly provide a exit ramp out of this conflict, but now with it gone there there is no incentive to deescalate (not that either side was ever contemplating the idea of a cease fire in the first place).

This is absolutely tragic for the world, we are inching closer to WW3 and this might be the spark to ignite it. I predict that the world's economy is going into a major recession that will impact every country in the world. History doesn't repeat but it does rhyme; a little over a hundred years ago the world was struck by the Spanish flu pandemic, which fractured the word's economy and it eventually lead to world war. The economy only recovered when the US emerged as the world's super power.

Brace yourselves everyone, there will be famine, mass immigration and lots of death to come just around the corner. But hey! at least those who can weather the storm will come out much wealthier when they get to buy assets at bargain prices... yay...

PS. Friendly advice, build up your cash reserves! you can thank me later.
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Old 2022-09-30, 01:09   Link #814
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Do you seriously think Russia will stop at the east side of Ukraine if they won.

They didn't stop at Crimea

They will absolutely try to invade Poland (AGAIN)
(and ironically, when this happened in WW2 it caused a domino effect which led to present day Ukraine)



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Old 2022-09-30, 04:06   Link #815
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First espionage case related to the war in Ukraine. A trans man and his wife are arrested for trying to provide medical records of US military figures to "supposed" FSB officers, who are undercover FBI officers.

Quote:
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A former U.S. Army major and his anesthesiologist wife have been criminally charged for allegedly plotting to leak highly sensitive healthcare data about military patients to Russia, the Justice Department revealed on Thursday.

Jamie Lee Henry, the former major who was also a doctor at Fort Bragg in North Carolina, and his wife, Dr. Anna Gabrielian, were charged in an unsealed indictment in federal court in Maryland with conspiracy and wrongful disclosure of individually identifiable health information about patients at the Army base.

Although the indictment identifies Henry with the pronouns "he" and Henry used male pronouns during an initial court appearance on Thursday, in prior media interviews dating back to 2015, Henry came out as a transgender female.

Henry's attorney David Little declined to comment on the charges, but said his client was released on home detention.

An attorney for Gabrielian could not immediately be reached for comment.

The indictment alleges that after Russian President Vladimir Putin invaded Ukraine in February, the pair sought to assist the Russian government by providing it with data to help the Putin regime "gain insights into the medical conditions of individuals associated with the U.S. government and military."

The couple met with someone they believed was a Russian official but was in fact an FBI undercover agent, the indictment says.

At a hotel in Baltimore on Aug. 17, Gabrielian told the undercover agent "she was motivated by patriotism toward Russia to provide any assistance she could to Russia, even if it meant being fired or going to jail," the indictment says.

In the meeting, she volunteered to bring her husband into the scheme, saying Henry had information about military training the United States had provided to Ukraine, among other things.

At another meeting later that day, Henry told the undercover agent he too was committed to Russia, and said he had even contemplated volunteering to join the Russian army.

"The way I am viewing what is going on in Ukraine now, is that the United States is using Ukrainians as a proxy for their own hatred toward Russia," Henry told the agent, according to prosecutors.

The agent in turn urged them to read a book called "Inside the Aquarium: The Making of a Top Soviet Spy," telling the pair it would help them understand what they were about to do.

"It's the mentality of sacrificing everything ... and loyalty in you from day one," the agent said. "That's not something you walked away from."

Henry had some reservations about providing healthcare data, saying it would violate the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA), according to the indictment, but Gabrielian had no hesitations.

In a subsequent Aug. 24 meeting, she told the agent her husband was a "coward" to be concerned about violating HIPAA, but she broke the law "all the time" and would ensure they could provide Russia with access to medical records from Fort Bragg patients.

By the end of the month, she had handed over information on current and former military officials and their spouses, the indictment says.
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Old 2022-09-30, 05:30   Link #816
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A trans person supporting Putin is like a gay person supporting Nazi Germany

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Old 2022-09-30, 09:17   Link #817
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugetsu View Post
The sabotage to the Russian pipeline
Stop. Said pipeline is owned 51% by Gazprom (Russia), but the rest is owned by european companies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nord_Stream_AG

Quote:
This pipeline was the best leverage that Russia had to make Europe submit to their demands
You frame here russia here as a victim. IMO putin had a deadline for germany to submit to his demands and since they didn't he retaliated. You might ask "what does putin wins by destroying nordstream?", remember putin is a bully and he has demonstrated here he can destroy europe's energy infrastructure whenever he wants. It is no coincidence that the day Norway announces plans for a new gas pipeline that nordstrom blew up, the message is clear "I can blow that also too" and I would not rule out the pipelines that go from africa to spain either nor I would rule out the wagner group going full piracy by giving weapons and training to pirates to attack gas tankers that travel near the arabian peninsula.

https://www.france24.com/en/tv-shows...d-stream-leaks

This reminds me how when the pandemic started, a neighbor of mine asked me when it was going to end, expecting me to tell her it would end "in a few months", I told her "in a year if we are lucky" knowing full well the last pandemic lasted two or three years. Anyone here wants to ask me when this war will be over?
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Old 2022-09-30, 11:35   Link #818
Sugetsu
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^ You are clearly all-in the in the western propaganda camp. It doesn't matter what side of this war you are on anyway. The ramifications of this event are catastrophic and will only increase tension and escalate this conflict to the next level. All the players involved want nothing but war and they have done everything in their power to ensure that is so. Get ready for some major global pain both in the economic and migratory fronts in the coming months.

I pray that this war doesn't escalate into a nuclear conflict, but what's alarming is the fact that all actions undertaken by western powers do nothing else but back Russia into a corner... And since Putin is just another sociopath with great power, like the rest of them, there is nothing stopping him from pushing that red button and destroying civilization as we know it.

EDIT: This video was recently uploaded by Redacted and it echoes my sentiment. What a "nice" coincidence this is... The next few hours are going to be pivotal for the course of this war. Lets hope the NATO rejects Ukraine's application or all bets are off.
YouTube
Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?
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Last edited by Sugetsu; 2022-09-30 at 12:10.
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Old 2022-09-30, 12:20   Link #819
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Is it really that hard to acknowledge who has the most to gain from removing Russia's ability to blackmail Germany and the rest of the EU?
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Old 2022-09-30, 13:32   Link #820
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by ramlaen View Post
Is it really that hard to acknowledge who has the most to gain from removing Russia's ability to blackmail Germany and the rest of the EU?
It's not just about who has the most to gain. It's also who has the most to lose. That's a big component of a gamble like this.

If the US busts the pipeline *maybe* the energy blackmail threat is removed, and the EU coalition is strengthened...but if they get caught, it creates the very fracture in the EU Coalition you were trying to avoid. This makes it a dubious bet for the US, regardless of how shady you think the CIA is

Now if you're Russia the situation is different. If you blow the pipe covertly *maybe* you weaken the EU Coalition by leaving people wondering if the US did it. And if you get caught red handed the cost is....not all that much since you're already under sanctions and isolated as hell and unpopular.

There's also the fact that gambles like this are more likely to be performed by the more desperate side. The US and EU backed Ukrainians are currently conducting successful offensives in the north east, and Russia is conducting an utterly panicked and disorganized mobilization. Which side comes off as more desperate?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugetsu View Post
I pray that this war doesn't escalate into a nuclear conflict, but what's alarming is the fact that all actions undertaken by western powers do nothing else but back Russia into a corner... And since Putin is just another sociopath with great power, like the rest of them, there is nothing stopping him from pushing that red button and destroying civilization as we know it.
Russia backed itself into a corner. Russia could declare a cease fire and withdraw from Ukraine tomorrow. And leverage their energy resources (and all those Ukrainian civillians they kidnapped) to try to get some of the sanctions removed and return to *some* semblance of the pre-war status quo.

What's preventing this is all the Kremlin hawks, full of dreams of reestablishing the Russian Empire, refusing to acknowledge that they could lose the war, and they've probably already lost it conventionally speaking.
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