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Bakaizer · 2013-12-15, 21:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by desrtsku

Othinus is the first villain ever that achieved a long term goal (and on an unprecedented scale) in this series, that makes her already more competent than any other villain so far + she's badass.

it is also undeniable that she is the most powerfull villain in the series so far so expect something like this to happen

Kenju of the Right · 2013-12-16, 00:41

i dont think there's much that you can do to past destroying the world

dniv · 2013-12-16, 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenju of the Right

i dont think there's much that you can do to past destroying the world

Don't underestimate Kamachi-dono. He will continue the current trend and come up with MUCH worse things.

desrtsku · 2013-12-16, 01:38

He can always go Demonbane mode if he wants over the absolute top feats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Birdway

That and Fiamma went against the world while Othinus make an over the top plan while hiding from the world.

Oh, my ... does that even matter when more or less the entirety of the Magic side (England, Catholics and Russia + dawn colored sunlight, Ollerus, Fiamma and Touma ... which is more hardcore than what Fiamma had to withstand during the second half of vol 22) was after Othinus in NT8, and yet she still won?

Gray Servant · 2013-12-16, 03:35

Plus Fiamma had Gabriel as a decoy the whole time, everyone was going after it leaving him free to do his business. Othinus just didn't give a crap.

tsunade666 · 2013-12-16, 06:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gray Servant

Plus Fiamma had Gabriel as a decoy the whole time, everyone was going after it leaving him free to do his business. Othinus just didn't give a crap.

Fiamma had russian soldier and gabriel while othinus also had gremlin but both didn't care for such thing.

desrtsku · 2013-12-16, 08:51

Actually Fiamma absolutely needed a war in order to fuel his HR. It was a necessity for his plan, so obviously he would mind ... and he got it served on a silver platter but still lost anyway.
Whereas Othinus didn't really care whether there was a war or not, whether people tried to interfere with her plans or not, whether someone finds a way to beat her or not. None of that really matters to her since she had a way to win in every situation.

tsunade666 · 2013-12-16, 09:13

well fiamma unlike hothinus who has the permanent status of magic god, has no stable source of power. sure holy right is strong but its dependent on the opponent so the power level of it is more dependent on the stronger the opponent the stronger you are. So fiamma really needed that war and index because he doesn't know how to stable it. fiamma's power has lots of problem to be needed to be complete unlike hothinus who is already complete. She is already a magic got that embodies infinity possibilities but it also hinders her because it goes both ways.

see the difference? the one who is a magic god and the one who is not.

desrtsku · 2013-12-16, 11:07

Yeah I see it.
And I can also see that Othinus is hotter even without flames.

Miraluka · 2013-12-16, 13:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by desrtsku

Oh, my ... does that even matter when more or less the entirety of the Magic side (England, Catholics and Russia + dawn colored sunlight, Ollerus, Fiamma and Touma ... which is more hardcore than what Fiamma had to withstand during the second half of vol 22) was after Othinus in NT8, and yet she still won?

Didn't she work to stop them using several decoys?

Fiamma was on "come at me bro" during the war.

Anyway, I don't see Othinus having a long life after this arc. I feel like the death flag is near her back.

desrtsku · 2013-12-17, 10:40

Quote:

Fiamma was on "come at me bro" during the war.

That's what makes Othinus a very competent villain and him not as much.
It's really simple. They both had to fight a big opponent, but one had a proper way to deal with it whereas the other didn't.

Spoiler for Guide to cleanse the world, by Toaru Antagonists:

Fiamma had a supposedly perfect plan, and didn't really bother with a spare one. That's where his downfall started.
He did try to improvise when things got bad though, too bad Accel was just bellow the fortress.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VS the world, Fiamma edition

I started a war : I power myself up on the World's resulting angst.

Prince on a big castle : Look at me everyone!

I summoned Misha : she's a monster and my precious toy.

Got stabbed in the back : by Acqua Of the Back. I didn't see that one coming, even though he did it in front of my eyes. But everything went as planned ... or so I thought.

Let Misha take care of everyone, believing she's invincible and didn't give a damn : she lost when they started ganging up on her.

Cut His Hand : it wasn't pretty

Tried to destroy the world by myself, believing I was invincible and didn't give a damn : I lost when they started ganging up on me.

Verdict : very powerful, broken, as hot as flames, organized and somewhat intelligent ... but his ego was bigger than his brain, and it came back to bite his hand. Still pretty competent at that time.

In comparison, Othinus looked at things through and through, and actually included the eventual possibilities that will lead to her "loss". And that's why she won in the end.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VS the world, Othinus edition

Had already cut his hand a few weeks before : it wasn't pretty ... for him.

Distributed the forces : unity is bothersome.

Decoys everywhere : might as well look for a needle in a haystack.

Took care of Ollerus myself : he's not doing so well anymore.

Got stabbed in the back : literally by Fiamma of the right. I didn't see that one coming, since it was an attack from the back. But everything went as planned.

If I lose, I win : I'm a Fairy loser, yet a Godly winner.

Had a spare lance : Marian's failure isn't a problem.

Tried to destroy the world by myself, believing I was invincible and didn't give a damn : world is destroyed.

Verdict : goddamn powerful, beyond broken, hotter than flames, intelligent, careful, systematic and organized. Most competent villain so far, can't find better in Fairy Tales.

PS : how do you kill someone who can't be killed?

Miraluka · 2013-12-17, 18:03

Successful or not, that's not the point, that doesn't make her charming character(exhibicionist looks aside) it's due to a lack of charisma that there is the comparison with Fiamma and Acqua, just look at the previous posts even Accelerator despite being a loser had charm since his debut.
You can have a character who pulls out a gun and shoots Touma and wins and that won't make it interesting.

desrtsku · 2013-12-18, 09:22

I'm looking at it with an "objective" POV, what makes a great villain is that he/she/it's competent at being a villain. Whether you like him/her/it or not is up to you. Most of you don't like the girl who is currently the most popular character in this series, that's the same idea.

Now about what you just said :

Quote:

You can have a character who pulls out a gun and shoots Touma and wins and that won't make it interesting.

Oh, now I'm pretty sure that's the kind of stuff that'll get 1000+ replies on all boards and forums. Oh yeah, it already happened. Too bad it was an unnamed and faceless character.

Quote:

a lack of charisma that there is the comparison with Fiamma and Acqua

I won't say anything about Acqua. But please do explain that so called "charisma" Fiamma is supposed to have.

Acer · 2013-12-18, 11:37

no matter where you look, you will never find a fully comprehensive answer to the meaning of charisma, it is something like a personal vision + that most people decide whether a individul keep or not. in my case I always thought Touma is charismatic, and a while ago I think the Mikoto is unbearable. We should follow the teachings of our ancestors and take a vote to decide such matters, since the voice of the people is the voice of God.

ACertainStark · 2013-12-18, 11:55

That sounds uncivilized. And vote on characters, you mean? that already happens and she's luckily been voted 1st place for a long long time now. :3

Acer · 2013-12-18, 14:39

I meant in the case of Othinus, if she is charismatic or not ...............................or not and continue with this discussion, it is fun to read.

ACertainStark · 2013-12-18, 14:41

Aha. Didn't see you specify Othinus. You only mentioned Touma & Mikoto. In that case, what's the point really? it won't change anything.

Acer · 2013-12-18, 14:44

you talk as if I have all the answers.

ACertainStark · 2013-12-18, 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acer

you talk as if I have all the answers.

I know you don't.

that's why I didn't quote you like right now!

Acer · 2013-12-18, 15:06

but personally it would be nice to know what people who attend the forum think about Othinus, and that is, I do not enter here anymore until volume 9 be finalized, goodbye.

2013-12-16, 08:51	Link #1887
desrtsku Nympholept Join Date: May 2011 Location: Wonderland. Age: 31	Actually Fiamma absolutely needed a war in order to fuel his HR. It was a necessity for his plan, so obviously he would mind ... and he got it served on a silver platter but still lost anyway. Whereas Othinus didn't really care whether there was a war or not, whether people tried to interfere with her plans or not, whether someone finds a way to beat her or not. None of that really matters to her since she had a way to win in every situation. __________________

2013-12-16, 09:13	Link #1888
tsunade666 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: In my room	well fiamma unlike hothinus who has the permanent status of magic god, has no stable source of power. sure holy right is strong but its dependent on the opponent so the power level of it is more dependent on the stronger the opponent the stronger you are. So fiamma really needed that war and index because he doesn't know how to stable it. fiamma's power has lots of problem to be needed to be complete unlike hothinus who is already complete. She is already a magic got that embodies infinity possibilities but it also hinders her because it goes both ways. see the difference? the one who is a magic god and the one who is not. __________________ To A certain Lonely Hero

2013-12-16, 11:07	Link #1889
desrtsku Nympholept Join Date: May 2011 Location: Wonderland. Age: 31	Yeah I see it. And I can also see that Othinus is hotter even without flames. __________________

2013-12-16, 03:35	Link #1885
Gray Servant Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013	Plus Fiamma had Gabriel as a decoy the whole time, everyone was going after it leaving him free to do his business. Othinus just didn't give a crap.

2013-12-17, 18:03	Link #1892
Miraluka Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Age: 34	Successful or not, that's not the point, that doesn't make her charming character(exhibicionist looks aside) it's due to a lack of charisma that there is the comparison with Fiamma and Acqua, just look at the previous posts even Accelerator despite being a loser had charm since his debut. You can have a character who pulls out a gun and shoots Touma and wins and that won't make it interesting.

2013-12-18, 11:37	Link #1894
Acer Death to the infidels! Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: in a world of pain!	no matter where you look, you will never find a fully comprehensive answer to the meaning of charisma, it is something like a personal vision + that most people decide whether a individul keep or not. in my case I always thought Touma is charismatic, and a while ago I think the Mikoto is unbearable. We should follow the teachings of our ancestors and take a vote to decide such matters, since the voice of the people is the voice of God.

2013-12-18, 11:55	Link #1895
ACertainStark お姉さん☆ Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Toronto, ON Age: 31	That sounds uncivilized. And vote on characters, you mean? that already happens and she's luckily been voted 1st place for a long long time now. :3

2013-12-18, 14:39	Link #1896
Acer Death to the infidels! Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: in a world of pain!	I meant in the case of Othinus, if she is charismatic or not ...............................or not and continue with this discussion, it is fun to read.

2013-12-18, 14:41	Link #1897
ACertainStark お姉さん☆ Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Toronto, ON Age: 31	Aha. Didn't see you specify Othinus. You only mentioned Touma & Mikoto. In that case, what's the point really? it won't change anything.

2013-12-18, 14:44	Link #1898
Acer Death to the infidels! Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: in a world of pain!	you talk as if I have all the answers.

2013-12-18, 15:06	Link #1900
Acer Death to the infidels! Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: in a world of pain!	but personally it would be nice to know what people who attend the forum think about Othinus, and that is, I do not enter here anymore until volume 9 be finalized, goodbye.