Macross Delta - Anime General Discussion Thread

[BetoJR]

Originally Posted by Dash_Hunter

But Mirage was not really a bad pilot, Messer and others said that she was a good pilot, it's just that he piloted too by the book, like following a recipie, and that made her predictable.
Also, aside from the six main aerial knights (who are practically super-humans) Delta squad never had a problem with any other enemy, Zentradi, controled NUNS pilots or Windermereans. Most of Delta Squad shortcomings IMO come from their leaders, in this case Ernest and Arad who is probably the worst commander of all Macross.

Yeah, that's pretty much it. She was just not really an ace, when compared to such hotshots as those people - and Messer, of course.

[Tak]

And I am still sad at what they done to Mirage... •sniff•

- Tak

[ippus]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

One problem with making Mirage a bad flyer, is that it makes her entire team look bad. They should not have done that, it creates the very much justified idea that Delta as a squad are a bunch of unwanted rejects.

I don't get why this comes down to Mirage...

From what I gathered, Mirage is the original newbie prior to the arrival of Hayate. Her code name was Delta 4, and in episode 1 Mikumo and Arad were conversing about their "naive little girl" whom Mikumo ditched because it was hard for her to blend in. Asides from a bit of experience under her belt shouldn't have been expected to take on as many responsibilities as she did.

When the Delta squad consists of ARAD who does virtually nothing and recruited a non trained rando kid who is the child of the Windermerean bomber AND SHOVED HIM TO THEIR OTHER NEWBIE TO LOOK AFTER (I have a string of reasons as to why Mirage was the only one capable of looking after Hayate in those circumstances but it still doesn't change the fact of the matter...that they stuck newbie to the other runt...) or Chuck who is...what does he do? He's one code number above Mirage but what does he actually do? How shitty is he that Arad promotes Mirage over him?

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If the Delta squad looks terrible it's honestly a group effort.
It's not helped that their replacement ace was the untrained newbie who doesn't want to learn anything from anyone else during the course of the show...no, Natural Instincts, Pop Music and Love is all you need to be an ace pilot guys. Fuck Helmets.

As for the lack of security around Mikumo...that annoys me too but I think the implication was that she could handle herself given how much she ran off from her assigned groups to work solo. Like she was super human and can take care of herself sorta thing. If anything the reason she was caught in the first place was that she was slowly moving about with Makina and Reina, one of whom was injured and the other decided to have a picnic out in the open...while they teased her with snow.

As much as I'm a fan of kawaii Mikumo.............given the circumstances....>____>

[HirouKeimou]

Not positive on where Mirage's piloting / guarding skills play into this (after all, isn't her responsibility Makina?); however, I agree with Dash_Hunter and ippus on how it's really got nothing to do with Mirage.

Mikumo basically "does her own thing", as described by characters in the show itself; hell, she basically disappears on Freyja numerous times in one episode and reappears on her own. She handles herself in hand-to-hand combat in episode 23 alright and could outrun everything Windermere shoves at her too. She's inhuman; and while it doesn't excuse their inability to keep her safe, I'd also like to argue how no one in Delta Squad or Chaos period knows that Roid holds her secret, the words which could immobilize her. It's a plot convenience, really, however; it's understandable that from their POV, Mikumo is safe and no one knows who she is outside of Lady M and higher ups (and our heroes).

[Tak]

It also makes very little sense as to how Windermere has the power to incapacitate her, a Star Singer.

- Tak

[ippus]

Originally Posted by Tak

It also makes very little sense as to how Windermere has the power to incapacitate her, a Star Singer.

- Tak

One true Go-
I mean One True King.

Because they're speshul k.

[HirouKeimou]

Originally Posted by Tak

It also makes very little sense as to how Windermere has the power to incapacitate her, a Star Singer.

It's a big plot convenience, because Roid accidentally stumbles upon it accidentally one day while observing the ruins in their ship and accidentally learns the phrase from a little light that goes in his head.

And hell, while I'll proclaim love for Delta (and others will for Frontier), I'll gladly admit there are numerous plot conveniences in each one of them; doesn't hinder me from enjoying especially it's good moments. I'll just be quicker to admit "it's dumb but then again, what else could Delta do when Frontier is what it's expected to live up to?"

[Convoy]

And the stupid thing about Roid's ability to control Mikumo is that he is the one who claimed that only the royal line of Windermere could control the Star Singer. Yet he could. If this show had realistic writing, then Chaos's leadership should have just told Walkure Mikumo's command code and have her sing to her fullest to destroy all the ruins on every planet before Windermere seized the cluster.

Originally Posted by Magewolf

The only thing that actually makes much sense is that Lady M wanted her to be captured by the Windies for some reason.

Delta squad had one good pilot, who was a grenade with pin pulled just waiting to go off, a giant flying target, two nonentities, and a forklift driver with no flying experience. It is not surprising that they jobbed and went from one defeat to another.

Yeah, Lady M's incompetence is criminal. Unless it was intentional. (Damn you, producers.)

[Tak]

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

It's a big plot convenience, because Roid accidentally stumbles upon it accidentally one day while observing the ruins in their ship and accidentally learns the phrase from a little light that goes in his head.

Its not just that, its also how Heinz was able to overpower her when all indicators suggest Windermerians are inferior in their abilities compared to the typhoon that is Mikumo.

I mean, the breaks that Windermere gets... yeesh.

- Tak

[HirouKeimou]

Originally Posted by Tak

Its not just that, its also how Heinz was able to overpower her when all indicators suggest Windermerians are inferior in their abilities compared to the typhoon that is Mikumo.

I mean, the breaks that Windermere gets... yeesh.

Unless, by a fluke, going off of the plot conveniences in the series too, he is royalty because of "plot reasons."

His origin is unknown, outside of his friendship with Keith, so it's... probable? Who knows? Dude is basically Heinz's guardian / butler guy earlier on in the series and... for what purpose that no other typical maid / butler could do? And how is this dude hired for this job? Again, I'm chopping it up to pure plot convenience.

[*SNIP*]
[MOD EDIT] The rest of the off-topic has been moved here [/MOD EDIT]

[CrowKenobi]

Yeah...

In the future, let's stay on topic, and if you just have to make comparisons to previous series, please use properly labelled spoiler tags.

Thank you.

[magnuskn]

Dammit, sorry. I keep forgetting that Frontier now is considered spoilers.

[Father Hentai]

Originally Posted by ippus

I don't get why this comes down to Mirage...

From what I gathered, Mirage is the original newbie prior to the arrival of Hayate. Her code name was Delta 4, and in episode 1 Mikumo and Arad were conversing about their "naive little girl" whom Mikumo ditched because it was hard for her to blend in. Asides from a bit of experience under her belt shouldn't have been expected to take on as many responsibilities as she did.

When the Delta squad consists of ARAD who does virtually nothing and recruited a non trained rando kid who is the child of the Windermerean bomber AND SHOVED HIM TO THEIR OTHER NEWBIE TO LOOK AFTER (I have a string of reasons as to why Mirage was the only one capable of looking after Hayate in those circumstances but it still doesn't change the fact of the matter...that they stuck newbie to the other runt...) or Chuck who is...what does he do? He's one code number above Mirage but what does he actually do? How shitty is he that Arad promotes Mirage over him?

Arad has been charged to oversee operational command of all units meaning he can't take care of delta personally (Episode 12). Therefore it's predestined that he won't get bling bling screentime but lesser and the focus goes over to Mirage.

Arad did not promoted her based on making fun of her but along with the reports and detail provided by Messer, she is better judged than Chuck Mustang. Also compared to Chuck Mirage seems to have more military years compared to chuck. Although she is younger. Basically age is not a reason to promote someone but promotion based on skill or also years military duty. One thing. When she started to train Hayate, she seems to be more arrogant but this attitude changed. Maybe also a reason why Arad has chosen her over Chuck, because of visible changes in her character.

There is no reason to put a negative mark on her because she was "Delta 4" only. It's more that she is the fourth to join Delta Squad. This makes more sense why she was delta 4 at the beginning.

If you have any source to provide where Mirage is justified to call a newbie, please share this source with all of us.

[Father Hentai]

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

Not positive on where Mirage's piloting / guarding skills play into this (after all, isn't her responsibility Makina?); however, I agree with Dash_Hunter and ippus on how it's really got nothing to do with Mirage.

Nope. Mirage was assigned to watch over Mikumo in episode one. Mikumo answered to Arad: I can't go undercover with her around.

Anyhow. My intention was not to focus on Mirage itself but that Mikumo wasn't without guard. Also. Mikumo was always near areas around delta or walküre but not futher away. So why put a bird into a birdcage, although she knows the borders to walk around?

[ippus]

Originally Posted by Father Hentai

Arad has been charged to oversee operational command of all units meaning he can't take care of delta personally (Episode 12). Therefore it's predestined that he won't get bling bling screentime but lesser and the focus goes over to Mirage.

Arad did not promoted her based on making fun of her but along with the reports and detail provided by Messer, she is better judged than Chuck Mustang. Also compared to Chuck Mirage seems to have more military years compared to chuck. Although she is younger. Basically age is not a reason to promote someone but promotion based on skill or also years military duty. One thing. When she started to train Hayate, she seems to be more arrogant but this attitude changed. Maybe also a reason why Arad has chosen her over Chuck, because of visible changes in her character.

There is no reason to put a negative mark on her because she was "Delta 4" only. It's more that she is the fourth to join Delta Squad. This makes more sense why she was delta 4 at the beginning.

If you have any source to provide where Mirage is justified to call a newbie, please share this source with all of us.

I'd discuss back but it's got nothing to do with the point I was making- which was that Delta Squad as a whole is looking piss poor in performance even without Mirage being mediocre.

I didn't understand why the post I was quoting shoved the blame upon her when Arad has shown bad judgment in many areas (not just in what I have put forward) but is also a non factor in most of the combats and Chuck is apparently considered below Mirage (which you are agreeing but for some reason seem to be putting it back at me as a refutation of what exactly?) despite whatever mediocrities she's been flaunting on screen.

Oh, and Hayate blah blah whatever I said in previous post.

The belief I have that Mirage is a newcomer (i guess that's a better way to describe it?) to Delta is what I am assuming out of her code name Delta 4 and again the short interaction made between Arad and Mikumo where in Arad checks in on Mirage and her naivety over at episode 1.

[Yu Ominae]

Finally I was able to watch another Delta Special episode.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Yu Ominae

Finally I was able to watch another Delta Special episode.

And its more interesting than the main series, imagine that!

- Tak

[Gravitas Free Zone]

Originally Posted by Tak

more interesting

You're just there for the rune-on-rune action, admit it.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Gravitas Free Zone

You're just there for the rune-on-rune action, admit it.

...

Come to think of it, the bishi-rune-to-rune just made me throw up inside my mouth... hold on... I'll be right back...

- Tak

[Convoy]

What the next Macross series needs is a storyline wherein surviving members of the Protoculture return and try to restore their civilization to glory. And their first order of business is to wipe out the Windermereans for daring to slaughter in their name.