Aldnoah.Zero - generic discussion thread

[Thess]

Originally Posted by playmaker2k

For me, I really like Slaine.

He's the one I'm looking forward to seeing because his situation is the most interest to me. It's untapped character development for a solo act.

Unlike Inaho who has a sister, friends, and now Marito's crew to support him, Slaine has no one on his side.

The only reason Slaine keeps quiet is not because he wants to, but if he lashes out, it'll only make things worst.

Remember this guy is the only Terran living in a Martian environment where everyone hate his guts. He has no rights.

He could be maimed or killed without no one batting an eyelash.

Slaine puts up with physical, mental, and verbal abuse on a daily basis (for probably the last 5 years), but he's still able to crack a smile from time to time.

This doesn't make him a sissy, that just shows his inner strength.

This is the guy you root for to get out this oppressive environment, because someone like him who puts up with discrimination has a chip on his shoulder and is waiting to prove his self-worth.

I'm sure he's gonna be the ace of the series and I just want to put it out there and say I was on his side from the very beginning before the bandwagon gets full.

#TeamSlaine

I actually prefer Slaine because he's one of the few least poorly written characters in this show (doesn't make him a superby character or anything, just among the least worst). Inaho would have fit my archetype preferences better (and I was looking forward him), but he's so poorly written that all he does is make me cringe or laugh at his scenes (although this is also true for a large portion of the cast: he stands out more because he has more screentime). I hope the characterization will improve because so far, I have zero empathy or concern about the cast except for a precious few. They just move so lifelessly.

The characterization writing (and dialogue) are definitely the weaker aspect of Aldnoah Zero thus far. That's my main criticism for this show. Even trainwrecks like Valvrave which had obviously a weaker world building and ridiculous premise had more compelling characterization (to use a recent example).

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by playmaker2k

For me, I really like Slaine.

He's the one I'm looking forward to seeing because his situation is the most interest to me. It's untapped character development for a solo act.

Unlike Inaho who has a sister, friends, and now Marito's crew to support him, Slaine has no one on his side.

The only reason Slaine keeps quiet is not because he wants to, but if he lashes out, it'll only make things worst.

Remember this guy is the only Terran living in a Martian environment where everyone hate his guts. He has no rights.

He could be maimed or killed without no one batting an eyelash.

Slaine puts up with physical, mental, and verbal abuse on a daily basis (for probably the last 5 years), but he's still able to crack a smile from time to time.

This doesn't make him a sissy, that just shows his inner strength.

This is the guy you root for to get out this oppressive environment, because someone like him who puts up with discrimination has a chip on his shoulder and is waiting to prove his self-worth.

I'm sure he's gonna be the ace of the series and I just want to put it out there and say I was on his side from the very beginning before the bandwagon gets full.

#TeamSlaine

I too really like Slaine. He has a lot of potential for development and growth, and I can connect more to sympathetic characters.

I can't call him a "sissy" at all. It's not cowardice persay, it's self-preservation. It's not like he's backing down to school yard bullies. These are an entire country of bullies that have a say in whether he lives or dies. That's a big difference. This is a group that controls him and has done their best to break him. And after 5 years of living as a slave, I'm guessing he has adopted a subservient behavior just to survive.

However, we can see from last week that he hasn't broken, and somewhere in there, he still has the strength and resolve to rebel when he is pushed to the limit, or when someone he truly cares about is threatened. However, this emergence of courage takes time, especially for someone who is used to living a certain way. But I believe Slaine will shake off his chains eventually. It will just take some time.

[playmaker2k]

I think it's gonna start developing this episode.

The groundwork that was laid out from the first 3 is probably gonna give us better characterization since we can now see it from different perspectives.

Inaho's side is planning the next move while Slaine's solo act is probably him finding out more about who came up with the assassination attempt.

About VVV:

It's been said earlier, but it's a nice reunion to see almost everyone show up except KleenexGhost and Destined Fate. Shadow too.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by playmaker2k

I think it's gonna start developing this episode.

The groundwork that was laid out from the first 3 is probably gonna give us better characterization since we can now see it from different persepctives even more.

Inaho's side is planning the next move while Slaine's side is probably him finding out more about who came up with the assassination attempt.

I don't know what will happen next, what I know is to wait until after credits.

But yeah, hopefully uh characterization starts trucking because so far I'm just at loss about what to do with the characters in general. My favorite is Yuki, but Marito and Slaine are also good. I guess of the younger girls, Inko might become my favorite with some tweaks. It really threw me off none of them reacted strongly to a friend's death.

Originally Posted by playmaker2k

About VVV:

It's been said earlier, but it's a nice reunion to see almost everyone show up except KleenexGhost and Destined Fate.

Yes, it is. Nice to see you all, guys!

[.Mero]

Don't really like Slain, he's as much an archetype as Inoha tbh.
Mostly interested in developement of Asseylum and Rayeth even though Rayet is in the same position als Slain (kind of)

[Thess]

Originally Posted by .Mero

Don't really like Slain, he's as much an archetype as Inoha tbh.

Archetypes don't matter, it's how they are written.

Originally Posted by .Mero

Mostly interested in developement of Asseylum and Rayeth even though Rayet is in the same position als Slain (kind of)

She doesn't. Nobody is bullying or beating up Rayet so far. She was established (in a picture) to have lived happily with her father too. She's also part of a conspiracy to assassinate someone to start a war. Gets no sympathy points from me. She doesn't even care about her actions or her father's actions, all she is sad about is that her father is dead (she was even smug and satisfied with the results before this happened). Slaine, in the meantime, was displayed very upset about the war and not just about Asseylum's death. There's such a difference in moral compass I can barely start... I don't know if they are trying to sold her as "sympathetic", but they surely failed if they were aiming for this which, again, I attribute to poor writing.

[DevilHighDxD]

You guys forgot finalfury, secretly hoping that there something again that will trigger another Tripe_R vs Thess. That beside watching Valvrave was the main attraction on the VVV forum for me. Don't hate me! XD

Now back to topic, no love for the females? The princess is really warming me up to her, I mean where else can I gets such a trigger happy princess? Beside the facts that she friggin cute(not as much as Saki), she is actually doing something instead of being idle!

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

You guys forget finalfury, secretly hoping that there something again that will trigger another Tripe_R vs Thess. That beside watching Valvrave was the main attraction on the VVV forum for me. Don't hate me! XD

Now back to topic, no love for the females? The princess is really warming me up to her, I mean where else can I gets such a trigger happy princess? Beside the facts that she friggin cute(not as much as Saki), she is actually doing something instead of being idle!

For females, well, most of them haven't had much screentime so I can't really pick a favorite yet. Asseylum is much more interesting than i thought she would be, so she definitely gets some extra points. But I also like Yuki and Inko as well. And Darzana could be interesting. So, it'll take a bit before I can pin down one I especially like.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

You guys forget finalfury, secretly hoping that there something again that will trigger another Tripe_R vs Thess. That beside watching Valvrave was the main attraction on the VVV forum for me. Don't hate me! XD

Oh the Shoko debate, but I'll say Triple_R and I get along reasonably well outside of that big debate we had. Those were the times.

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

Now back to topic, no love for the females? The princess is really warming me up to her, I mean where else can I gets such a trigger happy princess? Beside the facts that she friggin cute(not as much as Saki), she is actually doing something instead of being idle!

Yuki is the best character for me: she's balancing her act and has a consistent characterization and sympathy points (she also almost makes Inaho interesting in the scenes they share: kind of a feat). Something I can't tell about any of the other female characters so far. I agree partly with some of the observations made against Asseylum's portrayal. She's not so well written. I like her character, but the writing at times... could be better.

I have high hopes pined on Inko. Rayet could be interesting, I suppose, depends again how they'll approach her. I'm all for self-serving, selfish borderline sociopath characters as long they have some decent justification or charisma (two things she's sorely lacking so far).

So in order of interest: Yuki first, Inko distant second, then the princess and lastly Rayet. The other female characters look a bit more secondary and it's to early to tell.

[.Mero]

Originally Posted by Thess

Archetypes don't matter, it's how they are written.


She doesn't. Nobody is bullying or beating up Rayet so far. She was established (in a picture) to have lived happily with her father too. She's also part of a conspiracy to assassinate someone to start a war. Gets no sympathy points from me. She doesn't even care about her actions or her father's actions, all she is sad about is that her father is dead (she was even smug and satisfied with the results before this happened). Slaine, in the meantime, was displayed very upset about the war and not just about Asseylum's death. There's such a difference in moral compass I can barely start... I don't know if they are trying to sold her as "sympathetic", but they surely failed if they were aiming for this which, again, I attribute to poor writing.

Both their parents are dead, both saved by the opposite party, both fighting against their 'own' people. When push comes to shove, they're gonna be in a world of hurt.

As far is known story goes, Slain has it better. why? his parents cause of death is unknown to us, he has the princess that knows his story and cares for him (either as a friend or whatever)

Rayet saw her father killed, was betrayed by her own people, has no one left.

As far as martian hierarchy, the sleeper agents sent to earth where promised knighthood, meaning they where probably piss poor on Mars.

And fuck Slain, even though his own feelings towards the war or the death of the princess, that didn't stop him from flying that plane and killing his own people. Not until he saw the princess alive did he take selfish action.

And you claim Rayet's moral compass is fucked up? Just because she's on the other side of the fence, she fought for what she believed in, for her people and planet, untill she was betrayed.

Slain was following orders, just because he was to told to do so and because he was scared to get caned again, without taking his own responsibility.

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by .Mero

didn't stop him from flying that plane and killing his own people

Don't know what series you're watching but Slaine never killed a Terran as far as we know it.

Originally Posted by .Mero

she fought for what she believed in, for her people and planet, untill she was betrayed.

No, she fought because they were promised Knighthood. That's selfish no matter how you look at it.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by .Mero

Both their parents are dead, both saved by the opposite party, both fighting against their 'own' people. When push comes to shove, they're gonna be in a world of hurt.

Like Asseylum, you mean? She's helped by the Terrans and fought against her people. Oh and her parents are dead (of course, presumably since there's not even a picture of her mother). Unlike Asseylum and Slaine, Rayet wanted to start a war for her own self-interest. The other two wanted peace.

Originally Posted by .Mero

As far is known story goes, Slain has it better. why? his parents cause of death is unknown to us, he has the princess that knows his story and cares for him (either as a friend or whatever)

Oh sure, he has it so much better that the show beats him in the face all the time while Rayet is coddled with the Terran heroic group even if she was with the people who caused this mess in the first place and smirked satisfied while millions of people lost their lives.

Asseylum isn't there anymore and I'm sure she'll befriend Rayet because of poor writing irony.

Originally Posted by .Mero

Rayet saw her father killed, was betrayed by her own people, has no one left.

Yeah, so? She's now in a heroic band who will forgive her no doubt.

Originally Posted by .Mero

As far as martian hierarchy, the sleeper agents sent to earth where promised knighthood, meaning they where probably piss poor on Mars.

She's well-eaten and well-dressed and she looked happy in the picture. Until we actually see her suffering on screen, I couldn't care less about conjecture.

Originally Posted by .Mero

And fuck Slain, even though his own feelings towards the war or the death of the princess, that didn't stop him from flying that plane and killing his own people. Not until he saw the princess alive did he take selfish action.

He didn't kill anyone except the traitor who planned to assassinated the princess. He was even unable to shoot Calm down who was a sitting duck.

Originally Posted by .Mero

And you claim Rayet's moral compass is fucked up? Just because she's on the other side of the fence, she fought for what she believed in, for her people and planet, untill she was betrayed.

Rayet is portrayed as a borderline sociopath without any guilt for her actions. Slaine feels bad about it and shakes even by shooting the guy who obviously deserved it. Rayet is nothing else but a self-serving unsympathetic bitch.

Now self-serving bastards can be interesting too, L-Elf was certainly one of those but he had charisma and coolness to actually pull it off to make the audience not hate him. Something Rayet lacks so far. When she gains it, my opinion of her will change. I don't mind obviously moral corrupted characters, I quite enjoy them a bit, but they need to be charismatic too. Hey my favorite Seed character is Fllay who is similar to Rayet but she actually had... a personality? Rayet so far doesn't even have a personality to tell she's interesting or not. Even Inaho is more defined than she is.

Originally Posted by .Mero

Slain was following orders, just because he was to told to do so and because he was scared to get caned again, without taking his own responsibility.

Yeah, and? He was self-doubting and upset. Rayet was giddy about the war. She only felt bad because her dad is dead. So sympathetic!

[.Mero]

hmz you're right it's worse then that, he just sits in his cockpit with his eyes closed while all around him F22's are being shot out of the sky by Trillram and a helpless guy on a parachute gets splattered by his fuselage.

Oh and he shoots at Calm with intend to kill, plus poitns for apologizing before trying to turn him into swiss cheese though.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by .Mero

hmz you're right it's worse then that, he just sits in his cockpit with his eyes closed while all around him F22's are being shot out of the sky by Trillram and a helpless guy on a parachute gets splattered by his fuselage.

Oh and he shoots at Calm with intend to kill, plus poitns for apologizing before trying to turn him into swiss cheese though.

Yes, because he had that shield expanded and not Trillram (dude his plane doesn't have any special shield, it was Trillram who activated it) and he actually tried to kill Calm and didn't aim at his feet to disable his machine and stop firing once this happened (after Calm opened fire at him first). Did you actually watch the show? Slaine feels bad about it like a normal person with feelings in a complex situation he can't change and not someone who smiles pleased about the slaughter resulted as Rayet did before her daddy died.

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by .Mero

Oh and he shoots at Calm with intend to kill.

He didn't want to kill the other guys but he suddenly decides to kill this one... Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

He didn't want to kill the other guys but he suddenly decides to kill this one... Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

He fired on the ground first. He was obviously trying not to deal a fatal blow.

Slaine's the person described made of kindness at the core, the guy feels bad when he shoots down a total snake who treated him like filth and tried to kill his beloved princess. Rayet felt good when the world was burning around her as long it doesn't affect her directly. If .Mero had said they were meant to be polar opposites in a similar situation, maybe he would be close to the truth. It doesn't make Rayet a bad character (the writing so far does, until she gets more characterization; not that Slaine is a great character, he's passable), just a bad person. Bad people can be interesting characters and can change with character development. Something some people don't grasp.

I think is more fair to label this, following troupes as generalization, she's the Token Evil Team Mate of Earthlings to Slaine's Token Good Team Mate of Martians.

[Darthtabby]

I thought Rayet had just smiled while reassuring her father that the mission hadn't been a burden for her, but after reviewing that bit it does seem like she smirks a bit afterwards. Could be the animation not giving quite the right impression but with the generally high production values on this show that's less likely than with a lot of other series.

She could potentially serve the role of a typical Martian who looks down on earthlings who ends up having a change in perspective. One does get the impression contempt for earthlings is fairly widespread among the Martians.

Though actually here's one big problem with Rayet's character: if she's been on Earth a long time, then shouldn't she have connections there? And if its just a short term mission then why did daddy even bother to bring her along?

I'll also admit her character highlights how cute girls often get a free pass where a male character might not.

[MK-95-]

Tbh, I acknowledge that Slaine is a treasure trove of untapped character potential & development. You guys also know how much of an L-Elf fanboy I am, but for some reason, I just can't get into Slaine. I know he's the most "human" character so far, but I'm not really a fan of reserved characters or characters that are completely submissive to others.

In this regard, I find myself liking Inaho more, despite the flaws & machine-like behavior, I'm holding onto the fleeting hope that character development will fix this problem.

I also look more forward to Inaho's interactions with the princess over Slaine's. That's because all Slaine's gonna do is blush at every sentence she says & be like "Princess" while making a worried face. At least with Inaho, we'll get to see some actual conversation. Besides, we can already tell that Slaine loves her, so there's not really much to expand on except for making the feelings mutual, in Inaho's case, that's a treasure trove for development & interaction waiting to happen.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

You guys forgot finalfury, secretly hoping that there something again that will trigger another Tripe_R vs Thess. That beside watching Valvrave was the main attraction on the VVV forum for me. Don't hate me! XD

Maybe you'll get lucky, and Asseylum will end up being like Shouko. And it is great to see so many VVV viewers here again for this show. You, Mangakid, Irenesharda, Thess, finalfury, myself, etc... Let's hope that Aldnoah is flashy and fabulous enough to lead to the sort of conversations that VVV inspired.

But Thess is correct that outside of the last few episodes of Valvrave, the two of us have gotten along pretty well.

Right now, I agree with Thess on Slaine, and I'm still deciding what I think of Asseylum and Inaho. All three characters have good potential, but Slaine is the one that feels the most real and sensible to me so far.

Playmaker2k put it very well with...

Originally Posted by playmaker2k

For me, I really like Slaine.

He's the one I'm looking forward to seeing because his situation is the most interest to me. It's untapped character development for a solo act.

Unlike Inaho who has a sister, friends, and now Marito's crew to support him, Slaine has no one on his side.

The only reason Slaine keeps quiet is not because he wants to, but if he lashes out, it'll only make things worst.

Remember this guy is the only Terran living in a Martian environment where everyone hate his guts. He has no rights.

He could be maimed or killed without no one batting an eyelash.

Slaine puts up with physical, mental, and verbal abuse on a daily basis (for probably the last 5 years), but he's still able to crack a smile from time to time.

This doesn't make him a sissy, that just shows his inner strength.

That's exactly right, I think. Slaine's lack of response to discriminatory abuse doesn't make him weak, it just makes him sane, frankly. If Slaine had chosen to fight back earlier, he'd probably end up killed or thrown into a deep dark dungeon somewhere.

The only thing I find a bit puzzling about Slaine is why he chose to join the Martians in the first place, although I suppose if his father dragged him along at a young age there wasn't much a kid could do about that. All of Slaine's words and actions in the anime thus far make perfect sense to me, and in fact are nicely balanced.

He really had no choice but to gun down Trillram if he wanted to ensure Asseylum's safety, but even then, you could tell he's not some cold-blooded murderer. So that showed courage on his part, in my view. He didn't do it because he enjoyed it (however much we the viewers might have enjoyed it ), he did it because it was likely necessary in order to protect someone important to him.

[Wandering Soul]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

You guys forgot finalfury, secretly hoping that there something again that will trigger another Tripe_R vs Thess. That beside watching Valvrave was the main attraction on the VVV forum for me. Don't hate me! XD

Now back to topic, no love for the females? The princess is really warming me up to her, I mean where else can I gets such a trigger happy princess? Beside the facts that she friggin cute(not as much as Saki), she is actually doing something instead of being idle!

When it comes to females I am quite interested in Asselyum since I had much different expectations for her. The fact she doesn't seem to be afraid to resort to violence is also interesting. Yuki and Inko also seem like they have potential and I like them so far. I still want to see what the show chooses to do with Rayet though. I need more time before I can pick a favorite.