Copyright infringement (DMCA) notices for unlicensed anime

[Xanas]

Just registered so I could notify that I received one of these notices from BayTSP myself and in my case it was for a show not yet mentioned (from what I've seen). Claymore. I had my internet temporarily turned off for that day until I called them and discussed it with the rep from my ISP. He was nice about it, admitted to trying limewire and such himself. Obviously the reps aren't to blame, but the situation is not good. We need to move towards a protocol that doesn't reveal IP addresses sooner rather than later.

This will of course escalate the situation and desire for laws. Odex is evil for causing this when they aren't even getting US customers. Their CEO is apparently a punk who is quite hateful as well.

[Messerschmitt_Bf-109]

I am still disturbed by the amount of guest. I wonder how many are from these corporations.

[idjot]

Anyone read this?

http://www.odex.com.sg/mediaRelease....diaReleaseId=2

[WanderingKnight]

I am still disturbed by the amount of guest. I wonder how many are from these corporations.

I think they pointed out the Slashdot effect already. Slashdot gets TONS of traffic, to such an amount that it's usual for sites linked by front page articles to fall under the weight of so many connections. Conveniently, it has been dubbed the The Slashdot Effect. AnimeSuki was linked as the main source of information for the article featuring this piece of news, and it's natural for so many non-registered users are getting their info from here. There's no reason to start hatching conspiracy theories yet.

If you pay attention, there's a lot of newly registered users that have posted on this thread, and I'm betting many of them got their tip from the Slashdot article.

(PD: Props to the server for holding up during the traffic invasion! That's something not many websites can put up with.)

[X10A_Freedom]

Companies involved with aviation is known to check Airliners.net. London Underground's (LU) upper management is known to check a forum about LU that I visit.

Therefore I wouldn't be surprised that at least a few of them are indeed corporations that are involved, while the rest would be the slashdot effect.

[hobbes_fan]

I wouldn't be too concerned. I'm pretty sure licensors come here rgularly and check what's going on, I wouldn't be surprised if the were reps from Odex and BayTSP on now. Type anime fansubs in google animesuki is like the second result. Right now this is a discussion about the validity of their tactics, whether they do have legal basis to make claims that their rights are being infringed upon by d/l outside their territory.

[Aoie_Emesai]

Originally Posted by idjot

Anyone read this?

http://www.odex.com.sg/mediaRelease....diaReleaseId=2

I don't know the laws of Singapore, so that depends on what kind of policy Singapore has on copyright infringement and private property laws.

Originally Posted by WanderingKnight

I think they pointed out the Slashdot effect already. Slashdot gets TONS of traffic, to such an amount that it's usual for sites linked by front page articles to fall under the weight of so many connections. Conveniently, it has been dubbed the The Slashdot Effect. AnimeSuki was linked as the main source of information for the article featuring this piece of news, and it's natural for so many non-registered users are getting their info from here. There's no reason to start hatching conspiracy theories yet.

If you pay attention, there's a lot of newly registered users that have posted on this thread, and I'm betting many of them got their tip from the Slashdot article.

(PD: Props to the server for holding up during the traffic invasion! That's something not many websites can put up with.)

I''ve been noticing that too, the vast amount of newly registered users posting on this thread. But I'm sorta glad, I can't gather up all the information myself ^_^

[Messerschmitt_Bf-109]

Wait, it says they are going after licensed material in Singapore, yet they go after unlicensed material in the U.S....wtf?

(That Odex article)

[Mr.B0y]

Originally Posted by Xanas

Just registered so I could notify that I received one of these notices from BayTSP myself and in my case it was for a show not yet mentioned (from what I've seen). Claymore. I had my internet temporarily turned off for that day until I called them and discussed it with the rep from my ISP. He was nice about it, admitted to trying limewire and such himself. Obviously the reps aren't to blame, but the situation is not good. We need to move towards a protocol that doesn't reveal IP addresses sooner rather than later.

This will of course escalate the situation and desire for laws. Odex is evil for causing this when they aren't even getting US customers. Their CEO is apparently a punk who is quite hateful as well.

This guy is probably an employee of the company that has been contracted to gather potential lawsuit victims. He is trying to make the multi tiered strategy they use, seem legitimate and harmless. They want you to believe that after you have your connection illegally interrupted for a totally unfounded and baseless accusation that you have "some anime, movie, whatever they have been hired to do" on your computer and that a simple call to your ISP (this call is actually routed to the company employed to screw you) or may be an entirely different number than your ISP's published support line. They will record you admitting "that you tried lime wire" and they may be nice about it. They wont be nice about it when they add you to the list of potential lawsuit victims.

Tell them you have searched your computer and you can't find any such file. Ask them if some one could have used your wireless router and downloaded it? It really is sad how low these people will stoop, I'm sure they are being paid well because unlike them I have another job, I can't be on here 24 hours a day pointing out the obvious paid lackees trying to influence this forum. Like I said earlier there is a large audience here , the audience they have targeted for legal action. Beware!

[hobbes_fan]

They may try to make the rather tenuous argument that because Singaporeans are able to access nternational fansubs, their business is compromised. I say tenuous as it isn't illegal to have a radio in most countries that can pick up transmissions on the other side of the world.

[idjot]

Yeah it's quite an old article but basically it makes clear what their tactics are, I guess now they are doing the same thing but just widened their scope.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by idjot

Anyone read this?

http://www.odex.com.sg/mediaRelease....diaReleaseId=2

Interesting article but they seem to have some weird idea that Singapore law applies somewhere outside of Singapore. BayTSP is just slapping out notices globally whether or not there's any merit ... they probably get paid by the notice, not whether it is a legit notice.

Shrug... the rationale is interesting but they're playing way outside their sandbox.

[WolfCoder]

It might be a personal agenda Odex has, they're using scare tactics to make you afraid of internet freedom.

Show them no quarter.

[crinaea]

fawkers...

[Xanas]

I guess I need to clarify. When I was talking about limewire, that is what the rep said about what he had done, not me. Also, it WAS my ISP that called me because they did turn my connection off for that afternoon until I got home to talk to them about it. No I wasn't "smart" and refused to admit it. I was honest because even though on other forums I'm instantly a liar and a thief for downloading and sharing I actually am not that type of person. I do not believe what I do harms the industry because I buy a lot of anime (and when I did not, I didn't have the money to do so).

[hobbes_fan]

Originally Posted by Mr.B0y

This guy is probably an employee of the company that has been contracted to gather potential lawsuit victims. He is trying to make the multi tiered strategy they use seem legitimate and harmless. They want you to believe that after you have your connection illegally interrupted for totally a unfounded and baseless accusation that you have "some anime, movie, whatever they have been hired to do" on your computer and that a simple call to your ISP (this call is actually routed to the company employed to screw you) or may be an entirely different number than your ISP's published support line. They will record you admitting "that you tried lime wire" and they may be nice about it. They wont be nice about it when they add you to the list of potential lawsuit victims.

Tell them you have searched your computer and you can't find any such file. Ask them if some one could have used your wireless router and downloaded it? It really is sad how low these people will stoop, I'm sure they are being paid well because unlike them I have another job, I can't be on here 24 hours a day pointing out the obvious paid lackees trying to influence this forum. Like I said earlier there is a large audience here , the audience they have targeted for legal action. Beware!

Before you get militant and start accusing everyone of being a plant by corporations, hold on wait a minute didn't you just join? Senior forum members have already pointed out how flawed your strategy is. MAybe you're the plant trying to sucker in more people to targeted by Odex. Unless you set fire to your HDD I can find any file that file you have with basic software programs even of you have formatted it, which in the case of a lawsuit will happen by a team of forensic analysts with better tools for the job. A magically destroyed HDD, coupled with logs from your IP isn't going to look too good in a civil court. If your router is unsecured well legally you're stuffed. It is your responsibility to secure it.

[DarkMirage]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Interesting article but they seem to have some weird idea that Singapore law applies somewhere outside of Singapore. BayTSP is just slapping out notices globally whether or not there's any merit ... they probably get paid by the notice, not whether it is a legit notice.

Shrug... the rationale is interesting but they're playing way outside their sandbox.

No one said that Singapore law applies outside of Singapore.

Copyrights are international. (See: Berne Convention)

As an agent of the original right holders (i.e. the Japanese studios), Odex can take legal actions against you under the laws of your own country.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by DarkMirage

No one said that Singapore law applies outside of Singapore.

Copyrights are international. (See: Berne Convention)

As an agent of the original right holders (i.e. the Japanese studios), Odex can take legal actions against you under the laws of your own country.

Well... thanks for calling me stupid but that's exactly what the article referenced had Odex implying --- and:

1) copyrights are international: pause for a duh moment ... but implementation is on a country by country basis and the rights copyright holders have *vary* from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. Fair Use also varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. I've been handling Berne Convention issues since before Timothy's little multimedia file browser was released in 1992, thanks.

2) As an agent of the original right holders (i.e. the Japanese studios), Odex can take legal actions against you under the laws of your own country.
I've not seen anything outside of their brief assertions that they're an agent for any materials other than what they list on their website in writing - and I'd insist on seeing it if I got a notice. And duh, they have to use the laws of *MY* own country -- this leaves them on slippery footing in places like Canada and parts of the EU (Germany, etc) among other places.

There's a basic economic principle not happening here -- amount of energy/$$$ invested versus returns coupled with sticks but no carrots.

I've still seen no list of what specific series they're going after though. If they are giving notice on series that are being licensed and sold in the target regions of the seeders, then I say more power to them, slay all the little bastards.
If they're going after unlicensed subs of broadcast material and they aren't selling the DVDs in that region and don't plan to before the sun gets cold.... my sympathies vanish.

Odex is trying to pull a business model game plan similar to RIAA (you only get the stuff *our* way) and more than a few RIAA members are starting to buckle as the flames of former profits rise higher and higher. http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/11/16/1733216 (Warner CEO says War on Consumers was wrong)

Provide a distributed network of current anime with subtitles for international audiences --- and when you sell DVD collections in those regions you may just sell a hell of a lot more.

[WolfCoder]

However, a slow reformat of a HDD will zero-set the data of everything, but it is much slower than the quick reformat option. Also, it will erase all data.

[valet]

Odex sales of anime declined more than 60% in the past two years, a drop that the company attributes to an increase in file sharing, particularly among individuals using software applications like BitTorrent and eDonkey, which are optimized for downloading large files like movies, software and television shows.

This is clearly the root of the pain, but given the attitudes toward Odex, I don't think they're going to be selling a lot of anime over the next two years either regardless of what they do now. If they starve to death, it might serve as a signal that pursuing your customers with threats of lawsuits in small markets is just not a wise way to proceed. It's hard to starve a big industry with lots of customers (like the RIAA), but consumers have a little more leverage in smaller worlds. I generally hate to see companies fail in the anime world, because ultimately you want to see money getting back to the production studios (because profitable anime means more anime next year), but these guys just seem to be bad for everybody involved. I'd like to think the foreign anime market is still a little too young for licensors to be going (MP|RI)AA all over their customers.

Also...

Originally Posted by Mr.B0y

If any one has doubts look it up for your self and heavily suspect any one that is on the forum trying to scare you when they just joined today. PHU LEEEAZZZE!!!!!

I'll admit to being a new poster as of today (long-time lurker, though), and I'm weighing in, like a lot of first-time posters here, I'd imagine, because this has caught my attention and I've been following it fairly closely. If I *am* going to be The Man, though -- and bear with me, because I think this is a totally reasonable request -- I'd like some dark glasses and a fancy armband that *says* I'm The Man, just so everyone around me is totally aware that I'm not to be trusted. Any combination of red, white, or black is fine, but please avoid blues and grays because I have a lot of sweaters that color and I don't want to be clashing all the time. Send it to Comcast (or BayTSP, if I've been reassigned to them now that Comcast is a little less suspect) via TCP. Make sure you send it with a spoofed source address, please, so that I will be certain to receive it.