(CR) The Wrong Way to use Healing Magic

[Strahan]

Amusing episode. So did Rose injure her pet just to make it believable? That's some dedication to the con, lol. Dunno why he's so aggravated at her; she did come in when she was needed. Obviously if things got worse earlier she'd have been there, so being angry she "almost got me killed" seems a bit silly.

Originally Posted by Alchemist007

Even more interested in the teacher now, hoping some of her story comes up this season.

Same; she's the most interesting character so far IMO.

Originally Posted by scififan

"I'm not going to let you sleep tonight." Is it another phrase for the night is young?

lol that was my first thought when she said that

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Strahan

Amusing episode. So did Rose injure her pet just to make it believable? That's some dedication to the con, lol. Dunno why he's so aggravated at her; she did come in when she was needed. Obviously if things got worse earlier she'd have been there, so being angry she "almost got me killed" seems a bit silly.

Uh, he has every reason to be angry. He had no idea she would step in, and just because she did so at the very last moment doesn't change the fact that it was a harrowing and stressful situation.

[Tenzen12]

For what is my opinion worth I don't think she injured Kukuru herself. It looked pretty smart and proud of It's performance. so I think it injured itself to approach Usato.

[scififan]

The kingdom's medics are known as "kidnappers" in demon army. These medics don't fight, but they are too efficient to transport injured soldiers out of battlefields.

[Rasty]

As much as it is a fun concept in a story, having your healers go to the frontlines in this setting is pretty stupid. The medics are extremely rare and highly trained guys. Losing 100 soldiers (because of getting treatment late) might be painful, but losing a single healer means you lose 25% of irreplaceable assets, and you are also likely to lose more soldiers since the rest won't be able to keep up. Not even speaking about their obvious peacetime use.

While sending the rest to the frontlines to bring up the injured is ok (those are basically combat medics), sending there the MC (who is the equivalent of an extremely skilled and efficient surgeon) is the worst strategy possible unless you are going for a decisive battle.

But ignoring pesky things like logic, this is a pretty nice-to-watch series.

[Tenzen12]

Except Usato is explicitly trained to NOT get killed and without Rose and now Usato doing their thing maybe kingdom wouldn't loose any skilled medics, but they would loose battle (which means healers would still be screwed). There medics on real battlefields , but maybe real life combatants across whole world lack in logic department as well...

[Huh...?]

Originally Posted by Rasty

having your healers go to the frontlines in this setting is pretty stupid. The medics are extremely rare and highly trained guys. Losing 100 soldiers (because of getting treatment late) might be painful, but losing a single healer means you lose 25% of irreplaceable assets, and you are also likely to lose more soldiers since the rest won't be able to keep up. Not even speaking about their obvious peacetime use.

While sending the rest to the frontlines to bring up the injured is ok (those are basically combat medics), sending there the MC (who is the equivalent of an extremely skilled and efficient surgeon) is the worst strategy possible unless you are going for a decisive battle.

The thing is, MC is a Bonus Healer to them.
No one expected that when they summon the Heroes, they would accidentally also summon a bystander, who also happens to be a rare Healing Magic user with exceptional affinity to it.

As for sending MC to the front-lines, well the main role of the Rescue Squad/Kidnappers seems to be to bring the injured front-line Knights & Soldiers to the back-line, so that they could be healed, allowing them to immediately be able to join the front-line again.

But it's quite common were even the time wasted from bring an injured from front-line to back-line might be too much to save them (in war, it's this time wasted which usually what increases death count). So, they would need someone who can also heal those injured people while they are being transported.

And while you are right that bringing a healer to the front-lines is risky and might seem stupid. But in war taking risk is also important. Because the more Knights & Soldiers die during a war, the weaker the nation defense gets.

Say, if there is no front-line healer, and it causes the army to lose 100 Knights & Soldiers, that means the countries defenses would get weaker by 100. And since the Demon Army attacks regularly, that means the number of deaths would keep on piling and slowly the numbers would add up causing the nations defense to collapse.

Also, keep in mind that it isn't easy to train Knights & Soldiers, as it takes years for someone to get to a sufficient level of expertise to be of useful in combat (unless they have broken specs like a Hero).

Even in our world, there is the concept of Combat medic, who provide emergency medical treatment in the front-line in order to increase survival rate.

Considering all this is why Rose is so hard at training MC, because the more better he is at managing his strength and skills, the higher his chance of survival is.

[ryllharu]

Originally Posted by Rasty

As much as it is a fun concept in a story, having your healers go to the frontlines in this setting is pretty stupid. The medics are extremely rare and highly trained guys. Losing 100 soldiers (because of getting treatment late) might be painful, but losing a single healer means you lose 25% of irreplaceable assets, and you are also likely to lose more soldiers since the rest won't be able to keep up. Not even speaking about their obvious peacetime use.

While sending the rest to the frontlines to bring up the injured is ok (those are basically combat medics), sending there the MC (who is the equivalent of an extremely skilled and efficient surgeon) is the worst strategy possible unless you are going for a decisive battle.

But ignoring pesky things like logic, this is a pretty nice-to-watch series.

That's exactly the difference between Orga/Ururu and Rose/Usato and the corresponding level of training. The "kidnappers" can't heal beyond basic triage first aid, so they have to bring them back to the other healers who can't handle the vanguard duty and flunked out of Rose's expectations. They're the healers you can't afford to lose.

Rose and Usato train to the point that they can't be killed.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Except Usato is explicitly trained to NOT get killed and without Rose and now Usato doing their thing maybe kingdom wouldn't loose any skilled medics, but they would loose battle (which means healers would still be screwed). There medics on real battlefields , but maybe real life combatants across whole world lack in logic department as well...

Originally Posted by Huh...?

Even in our world, there is the concept of Combat medic, who provide emergency medical treatment in the front-line in order to increase survival rate.

Considering all this is why Rose is so hard at training MC, because the more better he is at managing his strength and skills, the higher his chance of survival is.

Right, but Rose and Usato aren't just combat medics, they're fantasy-world ParaRescue. The two of them are intended to go beyond human limits for the most grievously injured and those about to be swarmed on the wrong side of the shifting front lines.

They're not just healers, they're much much more beyond that.

[grecefar]

there was something charming and relaxing in seeing blurin sleeping in all the chapter. After 3 training chapters is time for some real adventure with inukami and I think rose will die in the next battle with the demons.

[Chosen_Hero]

Anyone complaining about healers/medics being in the frontlines definitely needs to watch Band of Brothers or other war documentaries, you'd be surprised at how common combat medics are in armed forces.

[Rasty]

^ I am not complaining about combat medics being there, that's all the other guys in the kidnappers squad. They apply basic first aid and get the injured out. That makes sense. I am complaining about the ones with healing magic being on the frontlines. Those are the equivalent of trauma surgeons and should be protected and given relative peace to treat the injured efficiently. Even if we pretend that the two are unkillable (dubious), just running around will cost them a lot of mana, which they could have used on the injured instead.

Originally Posted by Huh...?

Say, if there is no front-line healer, and it causes the army to lose 100 Knights & Soldiers, that means the countries defenses would get weaker by 100. And since the Demon Army attacks regularly, that means the number of deaths would keep on piling and slowly the numbers would add up causing the nations defense to collapse.

That's why it certainly is tempting to do so but look at it from the other side. The healer mages are extremely rare, so if a big battle happens they will almost surely be over capacity. Let's say that every one of them can heal 100 people per battle. With 4 healers they can save 400 in each battle. But if even a single one of them dies running around amongst the fighting then they might save a bit more in this battle, but in all the future ones they get only 300 per battle. This in the long term will cost them significantly more lives than could be saved this way. And with the rarity of them, it will take literally decades to get a new one, so it will also affect a dozen next wars. Sure if they had thousands of them it would be reasonable, but as things stand each of the healers is irreplaceable.

Originally Posted by Huh...?

Also, keep in mind that it isn't easy to train Knights & Soldiers, as it takes years for someone to get to a sufficient level of expertise to be of useful in combat (unless they have broken specs like a Hero).

It took 3 years to train a competent soldier in ancient China. It takes only a few weeks to train peasant levies ("pointy end to the other side, follow orders" type). Now imagine how many years it takes to train a competent healing mage and how hard is it to replace someone if you need him to have a one-in-a-million talent. If you add that the magician also has to be able to competently fight and have an insane physical condition...

As I said, I can imagine throwing healing mages near the frontline if you are going for a decisive battle and need to tilt the scales, but in any other case, the risks heavily outweigh the advantages.

[Tenzen12]

You contradicting yourself here. You either are in rear or heal efficiently, but you can't have both. Also Usato and Rose aren't just trauma surgeons, they are trauma surgeons with SEALs like training. They should not be protected, they are ones protect protect others. Risks here does not outweigh rewards plain and simply.

You don't hide your most powerful weapons unless you have big adventage in war. Also how does threat of total annihilation in case of loss doesn't make it "decessive battle"?

[EroKing]

NSFW

Megami

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[Tenzen12]

Of course it would be just Suzune. Well, If she was heroine in some other show (in one where there is no Rose). I would probably be more enthusiastic about it.

[Huh...?]

YouTube

https://youtu.be/_4Jkzl6JlEE

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[Huh...?]

Originally Posted by EroKing

NSFW

Megami

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

We need a "Rose" NSFW next.

And maybe possibly an NSFW of that Demon General (or whatever she was) we saw in the last episode.

[Rasty]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

You contradicting yourself here. You either are in rear or heal efficiently, but you can't have both.

Try doing complex work like healing someone fast and without wasting mana while you are running around, arrows swishing around your head, and every other minute someone tries to stab you. That's what I mean by efficiency. If you are in the back you risk the wounds worsening or the soldier dying during transport, but you can go through much more soldiers without wasting mana on running around and you can do much better work.

If you are on the frontlines you might make it "soon enough" to soldiers in the beginning, but if the battle is long/bloody enough you will just run out of mana and then everyone seriously wounded gets no help at all.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Also Usato and Rose aren't just trauma surgeons, they are trauma surgeons with SEALs like training. They should not be protected, they are ones protect protect others. Risks here does not outweigh rewards plain and simply.

And he could be a much better healer if he wasn't doing pushups all day but instead learned how to heal people, how to do triage, increase his mana amount/efficiency/strength, etc. And in the end, you could train a dozen Seal-level soldiers (Usato or Rose just have to heal from the sidelines) and can always train new ones, but if Usato is killed then that's it. You won't get to train more healers since you have none with that talent.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

You don't hide your most powerful weapons unless you have big adventage in war. Also how does threat of total annihilation in case of loss doesn't make it "decessive battle"?

You don't push your most valuable assets right onto the frontlines since the enemy is not stupid and will destroy them. You use them from behind if you can or in an unexpected ambush to do lots of damage and pull them back before they can be targeted. And a war for annihilation isn't resolved in a single battle. There might/will be lots of smaller ones and even if the army gets destroyed a new one can be raised.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by Rasty

Try doing complex work like healing someone fast and without wasting mana while you are running around, arrows swishing around your head, and every other minute someone tries to stab you. That's what I mean by efficiency. If you are in the back you risk the wounds worsening or the soldier dying during transport, but you can go through much more soldiers without wasting mana on running around and you can do much better work.

There are healers in backline that can do that, but as you yourself said not being on frontline there is indeed risk of soldiers dying en route and even "kidnapping" injured BEFORE they are straigh down killed on spot. And don't forget there are VIPs on frontline like heroes or Sigris and loosing those could prove itself fatal.

If you are on the frontlines you might make it "soon enough" to soldiers in the beginning, but if the battle is long/bloody enough you will just run out of mana and then everyone seriously wounded gets no help at all.

Yes pacing yourself is obviously important and you are not only one who is aware of that. We can return to this particular point later once we get to actual battle.

And he could be a much better healer if he wasn't doing pushups all day but instead learned how to heal people, how to do triage, increase his mana amount/efficiency/strength, etc. And in the end, you could train a dozen Seal-level soldiers (Usato or Rose just have to heal from the sidelines) and can always train new ones, but if Usato is killed then that's it. You won't get to train more healers since you have none with that talent.

Yes, but he would be much worse battle medic and that means more dead people. And again there is only single human in whole Linger who is less likely to get killed than Usato. As long as he keep runing and saving people, without engaging with powerful foes, there is basically no danger to him. We know demons weren't able deal even with regular members of rescue squad much less with actual muscleheaded healers.

You don't push your most valuable assets right onto the frontlines since the enemy is not stupid and will destroy them. You use them from behind if you can or in an unexpected ambush to do lots of damage and pull them back before they can be targeted. And a war for annihilation isn't resolved in a single battle. There might/will be lots of smaller ones and even if the army gets destroyed a new one can be raised.

Enemy will TRY destroy them, but stationary camp is obviously easier target than individuals full speed zig-zagging through battlefield. In matter of fact it's confirmed healers are ALWAYS primary targets by demons. Usato is now both safer AND more effective than if he were just trained in healing. As for battle, did you miss that demon territory is figuratively-literaly on Linger backyard? If they lose this battle, Linger kingdom is gone. Period. Yes surviving soldier can make some foreigner legions and fight again in next country in line, but that's fairly straighforward "decesive battle" right here.

[FlareKnight]

I'm fine with the overall strategy here. Rose has some healers that just can't handle the frontline role. She's at least sensible enough to keep that guy and his sister where they are most effective. But I get her jumping all over the opportunity that Usato presents. Usato's healing ability is valuable and it's a risk having him out there. But frankly his friends are also valuable and unlike Usato...they don't really have spares.

The biggest win right now is that the rescue squad has already been established. So having Usato also running around isn't going to draw any more attention than it usually would. At least until they realize his ability to heal people on the battlefield.

In terms of story it's more entertaining if he is free to race out there to help his friends when they need it. It's within the realm of reasonable as well. He's learning how to better use his power when healing himself and it seems like the more stamina he's got the better for using healing magic anyways.

Suzune remains really cute and I'm liking the potential vibes. Though I worry Usato will end up missing too many signs. Regardless I appreciate the sense in sending one hero out for training and then the other. They desperately need combat experience before it's too late. But they can't risk them both at the same time for that.

[Rinvelt]

Honestly, there is no need to overthink it. The reason is pretty simple: you don't want someone to be killed? Then make them stronger than everyone else. That's the point of Rose's training, making Usato so strong that he can't be killed.