Hanasaku Iroha - Episode 11 Discussion / Poll

[DragoonKain3]

Not sure why so much hate on Ko. He's like the antithesis of the indecisive male lead of a harem anime.

Originally Posted by Jonothon

Has Minko's VA changed this episode? She sounds different to me.

What? I thought Chiaki has one of the most distinguishable voices in the industry (or one of voices that has the least variance/range, take your pick ). I'm neither a Japanese speaker, nor am I a big fan of hers, but every role she has I know its unmistakably her. This one no exception.

And speaking of seiyuus, who voiced bookstore meganekko girl who has a crush on Ko? Yeah, I'm pretty bad at recognizing seiyuus apart from a handful of people (which says something when I know its Omigawa-san XD)

[Pocari_Sweat]

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

And speaking of seiyuus, who voiced bookstore meganekko girl who has a crush on Ko? Yeah, I'm pretty bad at recognizing seiyuus apart from a handful of people (which says something when I know its Omigawa-san XD)

Yoshino Nanjou - lead singer for the "new" fripSide.

[Deconstructor]

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

Not sure why so much hate on Ko. He's like the antithesis of the indecisive male lead of a harem anime.

In Ko's case he's already admitted his feelings, once openly and now indirectly. It's quite embarrassing to confess to someone; confessing again seems not only humiliating but also self-deprecating. If you have to confess more than once to a girl, then something's a little strange with your love interest. Is she not responding because she's too shy to admit her side, or does she want to put you down gently without damaging your feelings? Due to Ohana's silence, Ko has to worry about being an annoyance to Ohana, so he's playing it safe by implying his feelings have not changed since their last encounter. Come on, fanbase... Ohana has to take some responsibility!

I don't recall Ohana ever thinking to herself "I like Ko" or any variations on the quote. There's still a chance she's not romantically attracted to Ko.

I get the feeling the "mystery guest" merely reports on the inn, and the reviewer actually types up the article based on the mystery guest's observations. Of course, since the whole system was rigged from the top anyway, there isn't much the mystery guest can do. Or maybe the woman in episode 9 was just a secretive blogger. Bummer.

[Triple_R]

Really, the way Ohana has handled Ko's confession has been pretty bad.

I know why it's been bad, but it doesn't totally excuse her, in my opinion. I mean, she's had plenty of time to think it over...

So yeah, Ohana really does have to take some responsibility here, in my view.

[Jonothon]

Definitely not. Omigawa Chiaki can easily sound kind and sweet when she needs to (for example you may check Seitokai Yakuindomo for reference).

What? I thought Chiaki has one of the most distinguishable voices in the industry (or one of voices that has the least variance/range, take your pick ). I'm neither a Japanese speaker, nor am I a big fan of hers, but every role she has I know its unmistakably her. This one no exception.

I agree that Chiaki's voice is wonderfully unique, like Yu Kobayashi's voice. They are the only two VA that I can recognize immediately.

I just didn't recognize Chiaki's voice in any of Minko's spoken lines in the entire episode which is why I was asking. It bothered me enough to ask to make sure is all..

Hmmm... I wonder if Satsuki wrote the reviews for all the inns in the area or just for Kissuoso (sp)

[revive4563]

I watched episode11 at last. I'm sure that next episode will be great ending of first half.

-I was thinking that Ohana was totally immature about the romantic love but I was wrong.
After all, I realized that there is no immature teenage girl because any girl knows well unlike guys that life is short.

-Glasses girl is possessive type. But she suits Ko-chan.

-Ohana is funny. She's shining like never before, IMO.

-But I want to dive into Minko's breast.

[DragoonKain3]

Originally Posted by DemiSoda

Yoshino Nanjou - lead singer for the "new" fripSide.

No frigging way! I just finished Koko's route in DC2 only a few days ago, and had no clue. Yeah, I'm that bad at recognizing seiyuus lol.

[germanturkey]

wonderful episode. emotionally charged, beautifully animated, and funny all at the same time. it had the proper amount of angst mixed in. the development between Ohana and her mom was great. The scene between Yuina and Ohana was funny as well. Between her and Ko, well, there's not much that needs to be said about that. Though i hope there's a good resolution with that.

[Gespenst]

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

Not sure why so much hate on Ko. He's like the antithesis of the indecisive male lead of a harem anime.

I don't know about that - he spent x years just hanging around Ohana hoping that she'd just "get it". Oh, you've been my friend for ages! That must mean you want me to be your girlfriend!

The more I talk about it the less sense it makes.

And he only confessed the day she had to flee town (I can't remember if he said it after he found out or before but either way that's pretty bad timing.)

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

What? I thought Chiaki has one of the most distinguishable voices in the industry (or one of voices that has the least variance/range, take your pick ).

Aren't those mutually exclusive? Take Chiwa Saito for example. She probably has the best range of any voice actor I've heard. I almost never know she's voicing a role until I look it up. Compare with Norio Wakamoto who's voice ranges from 9000-9001. He hasn't needed to really act (j/k) in about 20 years because everyone who hires him wants his voice. Nowadays he just has to be.

Edit:

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

(or one of voices that has the least variance/range, take your pick ).

Oops, I totally misread that. My bad.

[tezu]

Dear producers of Hanasaku Iroha, where are you taking us? After episodes 9 and 10 I thought about dropping the series but then you managed to convince me to continue the series with a very well executed episode 11. It's funny things got interesting the moment Ohana returned to Tokyo, the events at Kissuiso in the past few episodes somehow weren't very gripping (I blame you, Jiromarou, with your fanservice scenes!).

Ohana is still the stubborn and spontaneous girl who, upon reading a bad review about Kissuiso, decides to take a day off to find out who the writer of the review is. She returns to Tokyo where she threatens the magazine's editor (or whoever it is that's in charge of the matter) with her loud voice and hurt sense of justice. In real life, you'd get kicked out in no time, but since this is an anime, Ohana of course gets the information she wants no matter how irrational her method is.

And that's when things get interesting.
Satsuki, recently broken up with her boyfriend and happy-go-lucky as ever, wrote the review for her (corrupt?) higher-ups without even visiting Kissuiso. It's her job and as a grown-up she is part of a world that Ohana's youthful idealism cannot accept. Ohana tries to make Satsuki go to Kissuiso so that she can properly experience the inn's services herself and apologize afterwards. It is a surprisingly diplomatic offer Ohana comes up with; I was surprised Satsuki turned it down without thinking. I'm guessing that Satsuki still has a lot of unresolved problems with the grandmother because there was no harm in accepting Ohana's offer. We've seen several childhood flashbacks by now and while Satsuki has always been a crappy parent, she's always acknowledged Ohana's anger and her small gestures (like eating Ohana's meal in episode 2 or giving Ohana a bag with food) indicate that she at least cares about what her daughter thinks of her (as long as it doesn't collide with her own beliefs).

As you may guess, I'm not one of the Satsuki-haters out there. I don't find her loveable and she's clearly a failure as a mom, but she is very interesting as an individual, probably because right now, she's a mystery and no one understands her erratic actions. In a certain sense, Ohana is just like her. They both do whatever they want and don't really think about possible side effects. It is therefore only logical that Ohana's rash actions should fail when confronted with someone who is just like her. I've always been surprised about how the series promotes Ohana's inconsiderate/rash behavior, so I'm glad she finally met a worthy opponent. Satsuki is like the other side of the coin: The irresponsible adult provides a contrast to the" morally superior" (mark the quotation marks) heroine, but their personalities have the same root. I do not know what Satsuki's character holds in store for us - right now she is the flippant character who brings Ohana's inner turmoil to the surface but I hope that we'll get to know her as an individual soon. I'm not saying the series should suddenly come up with a redeeming background story, I just wish to get to know her true thoughts and intentions (whether they're good or bad) that are usually hidden behind that careless face.

Apart from Satsuki, there is another character who made this episode memorable: Kou. He's being nice and understanding as usual but his niceness is almost bordering on "kakkoii". It requires a lot of nerves to talk normally to someone who refuses to tell you their feelings even after almost six months. Kou doesn't chicken out but doesn't try to impose on Ohana either. He's just being the supportive friend she needs. Ohana on the other hand, finally realizes her own shortcomings and while still wanting to rely on Kou she also knows that she's being selfish and hypocritical. There are a lot of unspoken emotions in her monologues which she herself can't define yet and I think the episode ended very nicely with an Ohana and Minchi bonding moment (who just so HAPPENS to be in Tokyo - yeah, yeah, the writers lack creativity but it was nonetheless nice!). I'm looking forward to the new episodes - it's been a while since I last had that sort of feeling.

Overall, the episode deserves a 8.5/10. The only thing that substantially bothered me was that they made the love polygon even more complicated. I seriously don't like the potential misunderstandings and jealousy hidden in there, it's an awful thought. I hope they'll subdue the "romance" (for me it's more like "ship tease") a little.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Really, the way Ohana has handled Ko's confession has been pretty bad.

I know why it's been bad, but it doesn't totally excuse her, in my opinion. I mean, she's had plenty of time to think it over...

Six months, to be exact. I wouldn't like being in Ko's shoes. It must have been pure torture for him. The fact Ohana never brought up the subject again and still speaks to him as a friend must make it even worse. If I were him, I'd be wondering if she hasn't forgotten all about it already...

Any kind of reply to a confession is better than no reply at all.

[Deconstructor]

Originally Posted by Gespenst

I don't know about that - he spent x years just hanging around Ohana hoping that she'd just "get it". Oh, you've been my friend for ages! That must mean you want me to be your girlfriend!

The more I talk about it the less sense it makes.

If you're trying to argue love should make rational sense, then I don't really know what to say.

Of course Ko doesn't want to get rejected by Ohana (or annoy her), so he's been reluctant to admit his feelings. Ko was waiting for signs of Ohana sharing these feelings, but they never surfaced so he had to come out of his shell eventually.

Originally Posted by tezu

As you may guess, I'm not one of the Satsuki-haters out there. I don't find her loveable and she's clearly a failure as a mom, but she is very interesting as an individual, probably because right now, she's a mystery and no one understands her erratic actions. In a certain sense, Ohana is just like her. They both do whatever they want and don't really think about possible side effects. It is therefore only logical that Ohana's rash actions should fail when confronted with someone who is just like her.

Satsuki and Ohana do share personality similarities as mother and daughter, but experience and age separates their actions. While Ohana goes as far as protesting against what she believes to be injustice, Satsuki simply accepts the injustice as is. Satsuki knows how cruel the world is and goes with it. Ohana wants to fix everything; as a young adolescent she has the right to be idealistic. It's possible Satsuki and even Ohana's grandmother underwent the same "phase", but now they're both grounded in reality.

I've always been surprised about how the series promotes Ohana's inconsiderate/rash behavior, so I'm glad she finally met a worthy opponent. Satsuki is like the other side of the coin: The irresponsible adult provides a contrast to the" morally superior" (mark the quotation marks) heroine, but their personalities have the same root.

Hanasaku Iroha is a coming-of-age story... is this surprising? Anohana, another coming-of-age anime, also frames youthful idealism against elderly realism with it's main character Jinta.

Overall, the episode deserves a 8.5/10. The only thing that substantially bothered me was that they made the love polygon even more complicated. I seriously don't like the potential misunderstandings and jealousy hidden in there, it's an awful thought. I hope they'll subdue the "romance" (for me it's more like "ship tease") a little.

Ohana is not pleased with your review. I think she's going to protest outside where you work for the next week or so. Be prepared!

I don't quite see how the love shape is complex at this point. I can only count of four people who show signs of straight romantic attraction (Ohana, Minko, Tohru, Ko) and the relationships appear to be very linear.

[Triple_R]

This is a tangental philosophical point, but I disagree with the implicit argument made by some other posters here that being an adult means calmly accepting injustice, or rejecting one's ideals.

No, adults can choose to maintain their ideals and fight against what they perceive as injustice. It's just that adults are typically more realistic about the odds of success in such endeavors than adolescents and kids are.

In the real world, even someone like Ohana would eventually have to accept that she's not going to win every moral or ideological fight that she enters into. But that doesn't mean she has to abandon her ideals as she becomes an adult, or stop fighting for what she believes in altogether. Many adults don't.

That being said...

Originally Posted by tezu

I've always been surprised about how the series promotes Ohana's inconsiderate/rash behavior, so I'm glad she finally met a worthy opponent.

Ohana's actions are often rash, but I don't think that they're equally inconsiderate. Most of Ohana's more drastic actions are firmly based on her personal sense of justice, as well as Ohana's concern for her friends, relatives, co-workers, and place of work. So, I think that Ohana is considerate of others in a general sense.

But as part of her bull-headed nature, she doesn't often take the time to do thorough cost-benefit analysis when it comes to the actions that she takes, and so her actions sometimes inadvertently bother or upset other people.

That's fine though, as a lot of Ohana's charm as a character is her bull-headed nature, in my view.

That being said, I have to agree with the following...

Originally Posted by Kanon

Six months, to be exact. I wouldn't like being in Ko's shoes. It must have been pure torture for him. The fact Ohana never brought up the subject again and still speaks to him as a friend must make it even worse. If I were him, I'd be wondering if she hasn't forgotten all about it already...

Any kind of reply to a confession is better than no reply at all.

Definitely true.

I know that the romantic conflict has to be dragged out for drama's sake, but I hope that Okada is careful here. Ohana could come off very badly if she doesn't give Ko a proper response to his confession at some point.

[Gespenst]

Originally Posted by Deconstructor

If you're trying to argue love should make rational sense, then I don't really know what to say.

What? That's not what I said.

Look at his confession.

Spoiler for Large Image:

That's not going to work at all.

Originally Posted by Deconstructor

If you're trying to argue love should make rational sense, then I don't really know what to say.

Oh, wait. Apparently I can't read.

That doesn't really change what I said. Saying "he's in love" doesn't mean he wasn't being so roundabout that he never actually arrived at his destination (at least not before the girl he loves told him "I have no choice but to leave for the next three years"). I don't think anyone would ever turn to their best friend and say "we've been best friends for years - are you secretly in love with me?"

[Deconstructor]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

This is a tangential philosophical point, but I disagree with the implicit argument made by some other posters here that being an adult means calmly accepting injustice, or rejecting one's ideals.

I think I was rather explicit, so you should have called me out specifically. But if others are making the argument... maybe there's some merit to crushing childhood idealism?

No, adults can choose to maintain their ideals and fight against what they perceive as injustice. It's just that adults are typically more realistic about the odds of success in such endeavors than adolescents and kids are.

I'd love to respond to this, but some random American writer already has so I'll just regurgitate his thoughts.

"At 18 our convictions are hills from which we look; At 45 they are caves in which we hide."

Originally Posted by Gespenst

Oh, wait. Apparently I can't read.

Eh, happens to me all the time.

That doesn't really change what I said. Saying "he's in love" doesn't mean he wasn't being so roundabout that he never actually arrived at his destination (at least not before the girl he loves told him "I have no choice but to leave for the next three years"). I don't think anyone would ever turn to their best friend and say "we've been best friends for years - are you secretly in love with me?"

Confessing to someone is not an easy task. It probably took Ko years to summon up enough courage just to confess - Ohana's departure was the tipping point. According to Ko himself, he does everything in a roundabout way, not just love. He nearly drew the courage to visit Ohana, but gave up at the last second and went back to Tokyo. If you're criticizing Ko's personality for not making any sense, then my response is some people are illogical. But at least Ko's trying his hardest to make up for his roundabout methodology - Ohana simply leaves him hanging with no response.

[DragoonKain3]

Originally Posted by Gespenst

I don't know about that - he spent x years just hanging around Ohana hoping that she'd just "get it". Oh, you've been my friend for ages! That must mean you want me to be your girlfriend!

The more I talk about it the less sense it makes.

And he only confessed the day she had to flee town (I can't remember if he said it after he found out or before but either way that's pretty bad timing.)

Not sure what we're trying to argue about here. I said that Ko was antithesis of typical male harem lead, and all of what you posted just strengthens that.

1) He thought by staying forever by her side, she would get that he's in love with her (unlike the typical harem male lead, he knows his feelings from the get go)

2) He saw that his actions were wrong, and admits it (unlike your typical harem male lead who usually does the same thing wrong again and again because he just does not learn)

3) Once he saw his actions were wrong, he goes and tries to rectify it, in this case by confessing DIRECTLY because his SUBTLE actions before didn't work (compare this to typical male harem lead who does nothing at all until the end, and maybe not even that)

[kk2extreme]

Ko kind of reminds me of myself, his personality is quite real

At least he gets another cute girl waiting for him if Ohana does not work out

[Shyne]

If this episode is a sign of things to come I really think this will be a excellent series.

[Reckoner]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

This is a tangental philosophical point, but I disagree with the implicit argument made by some other posters here that being an adult means calmly accepting injustice, or rejecting one's ideals.

No, adults can choose to maintain their ideals and fight against what they perceive as injustice. It's just that adults are typically more realistic about the odds of success in such endeavors than adolescents and kids are.

In the real world, even someone like Ohana would eventually have to accept that she's not going to win every moral or ideological fight that she enters into. But that doesn't mean she has to abandon her ideals as she becomes an adult, or stop fighting for what she believes in altogether. Many adults don't.

No it doesn't mean people necessarily abandon what is considered "ideal," but adults do learn or cope with the fact that there is very little they can do about many injustices in their life. It's just important to note that when people are forced to make the less favorable decision idealistically, that one can only condemn that person if they are willing to condemn themselves for most likely taking the exact same decision. Otherwise people just become hypocrites.

[DragoZERO]

Originally Posted by Kanon

Six months, to be exact. I wouldn't like being in Ko's shoes. It must have been pure torture for him. The fact Ohana never brought up the subject again and still speaks to him as a friend must make it even worse. If I were him, I'd be wondering if she hasn't forgotten all about it already...

Any kind of reply to a confession is better than no reply at all.

I want to say he'd be better off without Ohana but that would open us up to a triangle with Tohru and Minko, which I really don't want. It's funny how the devoted girls who like the guy first and do the confessing always lose out.