Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha Character Creation and Discussion (second reincarnation)

[synaesthetic]

Stable, safe-for-the-wielder HE rounds for a 10mm Auto are not as ludicrous as a man-portable particle beam weapon. I don't see much reason to explain beyond what's listed in 2nd phase. ^^;

AP rounds are going to do more damage to barriers because they concentrate more energy into a smaller area. We've seen from the show that barriers "shatter" like glass when struck with enough physical force (such as that of an Armed Device). An AP round would create a shatterpoint, when struck with a second round, would destroy the entire barrier.

[LoweGear]

There may be a canonical precedent to Sabot rounds being capable of penetrating barriers and shields: Vita's anti-shield attacks use two modes with sharp, conical tips (Zerstrung and Raketen Form), and when Ginga needed a shield penetrator, she used a drill.

[Tk3997]

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

That would depend on how long the overpressure wave lasts and how fast it propagates. If it's less than a few seconds, an airtight, pressure-proofed bubble shield should be enough.

Of the sort they've never once been seen to produce even in the face of a gas attack that could easily have been some kind of fast acting nerve agent... If you can't filter it in time you'd last longer on the clean air in a small bubble then you would sucking gas. No one even attempts it though so either A. the rank and file mages can't rasie such in a vauge timely fashion spur of the moment (meaning they'd never react in time to a fuel air bomb that detonates in miliseconds allowing you to murder masses of mooks) or B. they can't period which means they'd have no defense against it. I'm also ignoring the fact a fuel air bomb would also produce more then enough raw heat to cause horrific burns on anyone near it even if you survived the pressue wave.

[LoweGear]

Didn't Rein give the Forwards a Barrier Jacket modification that gave them protection against the incapacitating gas used against the Ground HQ in episode 16? It was along the gist of Rein stating the type of gas, then giving the forwards "defense data", at which point their BJ's flashed white for a second or so (Vita didn't perform this though). The scene seems to imply that as long as the type of agent is known, their BJ's can be programmed to filter it out.

[Tk3997]

Edited (purged)
Acutally no fuck this, this is the kind of shit I want to avoid talking about now.

Forget this ever came up.

[itanshi1]

Huh, seems I missed that info myself, but I worked around it well enough. Giving a poison power to my OC villain Scion Naido, it acts like a weak force field or bubble as implied here, but it's easily dissipated by overwhelming it with magic energy. It's not a defensive barrier, but an offensive one. So it'll corrode magic, and deteriorate organs depending on the design of the barrier and level of exposure.

BJs may be able to counteract it in foresight or even dynamically, but keeping up with its own innate properties is an arms race similar to plain beam spam on beam spam smut, so I don't see any problems with my character design. Just my writing skill.

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

@ATC: Sorry, but no. Voltaire is for last resort emergencies, not training sessions.

Then I better acknowledge that Summoning Voltaire isn't normal then eh?

That joke is worth the suspension of 'usual' policies to pull off. Should I have her:

A: Let him lurk around the battlefield for the remainder of the fight?

B: Have her pack him away in about five minutes?

[Jimmy C]

If you're using it for a "joke" best get him out of the way ASAP once he's done.

[stormturmoil]

Either that or Have Crash KO Caro then shit himself when Voltaire doesn't unsummon...

Crash: " you mean not only does beating his Summoner senseless NOT make him go away, all it's done is make him even more pissed at me! Can today Get any better?"

Subaru: "Booya!"

Crash: "Bugger..."

Leading directly into:

Nanoha: Mission Change! Your new Objective is to protect the new VIP...Crash!"

Teana: What you really mean is bail his ass out of the fire by trying to prevent a massively angered Voltaire turning him into a greasy smear..."

Nanoha: " That too."

[Tempy]

Se we learned that the last Saint Kaiser's name was Olivier.

I have found her.

Ladies and gentlemen,

Spoiler for Olivier:

And she's an Armstrong? We're so boned.

[MeisterBabylon]

Vivio: Eh- eh- eh- How many faces did I have...?
Saber: As many as there are humans to interpret. *serious look*
Lily: A celestial being is everything and anything at once, but a mortal can only perceive one at a time, therefore...

Vivio: Are you sure its not just misrepresentation by the SS?! I recall flailing at their ideas for spreading the Gospel!!! :flail:
Saber: And there's that too... *snicker*
Vivio: SEIBAAA!!!
Lily: Hahaha...




That's right folks; this is how the Holy Trinity actually behaves.

[Nanya01]

Originally Posted by Tempest Dynasty

Se we learned that the last Saint Kaiser's name was Olivier.

I have found her.

Ladies and gentlemen,

Spoiler for Olivier:

And she's an Armstrong? We're so boned.

"This technique of magical bombardment has been passed down the Armstrong family line for generations!"

[Tk3997]

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

Vivio: Eh- eh- eh- How many faces did I have...?
Saber: As many as there are humans to interpret. *serious look*
Lily: A celestial being is everything and anything at once, but a mortal can only perceive one at a time, therefore...

Vivio: Are you sure its not just misrepresentation by the SS?! I recall flailing at their ideas for spreading the Gospel!!! :flail:
Saber: And there's that too... *snicker*
Vivio: SEIBAAA!!!
Lily: Hahaha...

That's right folks; this is how the Holy Trinity actually behaves.

Vivio is about as "celestial" as the contents of a petri dish …

[MeisterBabylon]

Now should I use the moderate reply or the radical reply?

[Wild Goose]

Choose whichever reply you wish, but it detracts not from the truth:

Vivio Takamachi was created in a petri dish, formed not by the hands of deity, but by man. She was born not to a higher purpose, but born becuase her creators were paid to make her.

[LoweGear]

Whether something is Holy or not doesn't depend on the actual process of its creation though, but on the perception of the people who view it due to association with an event or a concept that people do consider sacred or holy. Most of the things considered "Holy" and "Sacred" in this world can objectively be viewed as objects created by man and nothing more than that - for example one can simply dismiss the Turin Shroud as nothing more than a large piece of cloth with a unique design, but to the devout it would be a sacred relic because it's supposed to be the cloth worn by Jesus in his burial. Or for example one can easily see that all the statues and idols of the Virgin Mary and Jesus are made by man using nothing more than stone or wood or any other material, and yet people still revere them as holy.

For an example closer to home... who was it who considered the 1911 handgun as "sacred" around these parts? Even if it's just joking or whatnot, it still proves my point in a way.

[Sheba]

The scientist who created Vivio is resentful about having his creation credited to such inane things as divinity. If God there is, it is called


SCIENCE

[Tk3997]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

Whether something is Holy or not doesn't depend on the actual process of its creation though, but on the perception of the people who view it due to association with an event or a concept that people do consider sacred or holy. Most of the things considered "Holy" and "Sacred" in this world can objectively be viewed as objects created by man and nothing more than that - for example one can simply dismiss the Turin Shroud as nothing more than a large piece of cloth with a unique design, but to the devout it would be a sacred relic because it's supposed to be the cloth worn by Jesus in his burial. Or for example one can easily see that all the statues and idols of the Virgin Mary and Jesus are made by man using nothing more than stone or wood or any other material, and yet people still revere them as holy.

For an example closer to home... who was it who considered the 1911 handgun as "sacred" around these parts? Even if it's just joking or whatnot, it still proves my point in a way.

How does it prove your point in any way? In fact it's like as far from your point as possible it's intended to mock the illogical obsession of people with mundane objects. It's a parody of the unthinking idiocy that runs rampant in many religions, it's meant to invoke laughter at an absurd display of devotion to a demonstrably mundane object.

Being considered holy is different from being truly divine. While the particularly fervent might consider random things “scared” they can normally be proved to be ordinary in all measurable ways. Indeed human whims are more or less the only thing controlling what is “divine” or sacred. For instance back in the middle ages a king was considered to have a divine right to rule, to oppose him was literally to oppose the will of god. Given what craven amoral monsters many of these men were I think we can agree there wasn’t a damn thing holy about them.

Which is also a large reason why I consider any holy bullshit with Belka laughable: it’s the same horseshit spewed by Dark Age despots to lord over there brutally oppressed peasants. Still when the peasant finally got feed up and decided to chop off the Kings head he bleed and died like any other mortal. So did the Kings of Belka who were eventually taken down in a series of wars and their bloodline exterminated. Only via the use of advanced modern technology was a facsimile produced to enable to the use of an old weapon.

If the cult of the Saint Church wishes to see a mundane artificially produced clone as some great holy person then so be it, but never confuse this with any sort of true divinity. There is none: Vivio is merely a clone of long dead kings who fancied themselves gods, but paid for the arrogance with there lives. If she's merely an object of illogical worship that's a sad reflection on how backwards Belkan's remain, but passable. If one wishes to try and say she truly has a shred of some divine power or spark however that's laughable foolishness.

If you want to venerate someone venerate them for there deeds, not because they happened to be born from a particular set of genes. I for instance consider the current Dalai Lama a great man worthy of the respect and devotion he enjoys, but not by right of his birth, but by his deeds in life.

[MeisterBabylon]

We can and have venerated creations of Man via a lot of reasons, and it's made easier when we are shown that a religious race was not above DNA modification, self-changes and other monstrosities that would have the Roman Catholic church raving... Lowe put it very well in that post, and that has been my stand on this issue.

But the fact is, we need context in order to see why we would do so. That is where fandom comes in, and that is just my speciality. Beyond that, its just an arguement of the atheists with the religious with the radical and the somewhere-in-between and those-who-don't-care.

And that is pretty much our secular world in a nutshell, no?


Now I will rofl if this discussion causes holy war to break out. XD

[Wild Goose]

Let me put it this way: if Vivio was truly divine, she couldn't have been cloned.

The very fact of her existence as an imperfect clone nullifies all possible claims of divinity.

Also, I never considered the 1911 as sacred. It's the union of 1911 and .45ACP that is a pure and holy union mandated by God, that none shall set apart. Like marriage.

For all the quoting of the Gospel of St. John Moses Browning, it's helpful to recall that it was written for laughs, and not meant to be taken as seriously as the Bible. (Incidentally I've always felt the NIV to be the equivalent to 1911 in Bible translations... my dad has more than a few translations, but the bible he's used all this time has been an NIV bible that's about almost 20 years old.)