(CR) Yuri!!! on Ice

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by monir

Watched episode 2. Thank you, Manju! I thought this season was lost.

Question: You are a healthy heterosexual male who is also an aspiring figure skater. You're having a down time and then comes along a coach who can get you to the next height. His condition is he wants you to satisfy him.

Would you?

You didn't mention that the coach is objectively quite gorgeous-looking . So I guess it comes down to which role would he want you to play really . Depending on the answer... maybe .

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by mweloo

I think a Russian teenager sneaking out of the country on his own would be pretty implausible, for starters.

Yeah, especially someone who is also reasonably famous. And doesn't this kid have like, parents/guardians/an agent/etc? And how is he supporting his stay in Japan, and is he, at 15, in complete control of his finances? What about his visa? (I'm not an expert on Russian legal system but I'd wager that he's still a minor by law...) Also, how come the Russians can communicate with Japanese people in Yuuri's town, I'm fairly sure that the chances of finding random people in a backwater town like this who speak English well enough to communicate with them is fairly low. Also, the buzz about Viktor and then Yuuri being there is waaaaaayy too low, considering who they are and what they're doing there. Also doesn't Viktor have an agent and staff or something to handle his interviews and appearances? Doesn't Yuri? They also had the Russian coat of arms the wrong way around (flipped, to be exact). Also I just can't believe that Yuri would leave such a cute and pretty cat behind, I mean really, come on, that was such a cute cat.

Originally Posted by monir

Question: You are a healthy heterosexual male who is also an aspiring figure skater.

Now now, you're assuming. Look at all those posters he used to have in his room. There's admiring someone, and there's... that.

Originally Posted by LKK

Yuri's nose is also red like Viktor's. My guess is that their noses are red as a visual shorthand stereotype to indicate their Russian nationality. I'm sure Viktor loves a good stiff drink now and then though.

So much about Viktor would make more sense, though, if he was basically drunk all the time...

[Triple_R]

Implausibly independent/powerful teenagers are kind of a staple of anime in general.

Not saying you can't criticize this, but rather that it simply comes with the territory, usually. So I guess that sort of thing just completely goes by me when I'm watching anime.

Yuri on Ice has a serious sports side, but it's also very much anime.

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Implausibly independent/powerful teenagers are kind of a staple of anime in general.

Not saying you can't criticize this, but rather that it simply comes with the territory, usually. So I guess that sort of thing just completely goes by me when I'm watching anime.

Yuri on Ice has a serious sports side, but it's also very much anime.

Man how many anime and manga have kids who's parents "work overseas" while they live largely independently at home. In most first world countries that would be largely illegal and tantamount to neglect. In Your Lie In April, we never even saw Arima's dad, just heard that he existed...somewhere.

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by Cloudedmind

Man how many anime and manga have kids who's parents "work overseas" while they live largely independently at home. In most first world countries that would be largely illegal and tantamount to neglect. In Your Lie In April, we never even saw Arima's dad, just heard that he existed...somewhere.

Indeed. Curiously, this is *more* realistic in many of the otherwise big shounen anime... where parental figures are usually absent too, but that's in general explained by them being either dead or huge dicks (see: Ging Freecs, Monkey D. Dragon) .

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Implausibly independent/powerful teenagers are kind of a staple of anime in general.

Not saying you can't criticize this, but rather that it simply comes with the territory, usually. So I guess that sort of thing just completely goes by me when I'm watching anime.

Yuri on Ice has a serious sports side, but it's also very much anime.

I know, it's just that when one (fairly significant) part of it is not working my immersion is broken and I just can't help noticing the stuff I normally would handwave away...

[Wandering Soul]

The two Yuri's provide a nice contrast to each other. Attitude aside, I can understand where the Russian Yuri is coming from.

The comedy doesn't bother me and this show has done a good job of mixing the comical moments with the emotional ones.

[BPD Renegade]

Originally Posted by Moroboshi-kun

WTF?

Victor is your basic overbearing seme. Japanese Yuri is your basic reluctant and shy uke. Russian Yuri is your basic reluctant and aggressive uke.

All extremely standard stuff in any yaoi-anime.

Except that unless we see explicit sex, this isn't yaoi. I feel like nowadays, anything with BL or BL undertones is automatically classified as "yaoi."

That aside, I think it's an over-trivialization to call these characters "basic <insert yaoi role here>." Sure, there have only been two episodes so far, but in these two episodes there has been such a plethora of possible symbolism, foils in characterization and culture, and beautiful animation, yet all you can get from that is, "He's the seme and the other guys are the uke"? It's your choice to continue watching it mindlessly, nothing wrong with that, but to me, this seems like a series that will be more meaningful if we look beyond the surface level. Of course, it could always turn into a train wreck, but I'll give Yamamoto the benefit of the doubt for now.

Originally Posted by monir

Question: You are a healthy heterosexual male who is also an aspiring figure skater. You're having a down time and then comes along a coach who can get you to the next height. His condition is he wants you to satisfy him.

Would you?

Doesn't matter male or female, figure skating or whatever, I'd give the middle finger, and the person would lose my respect on a personal level. There's a difference between mutual attraction and taking advantage of someone, and any "success" I might gain would always be tainted by the sacrifice of my dignity.

But as a sort of counter-question, isn't it possible for a heterosexual person to be in an intimate relationship with someone of the same sex? Someone's sexuality is defined by attraction, and it's possible to be intimate with someone without being attracted to that person -- a symbiotic relationship, so to speak. So if a person doesn't place much value in physical intimacy, is the person losing anything by selling the person's body in order to succeed?

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

Yeah, especially someone who is also reasonably famous. And doesn't this kid have like, parents/guardians/an agent/etc? And how is he supporting his stay in Japan, and is he, at 15, in complete control of his finances? What about his visa? (I'm not an expert on Russian legal system but I'd wager that he's still a minor by law...) Also, how come the Russians can communicate with Japanese people in Yuuri's town, I'm fairly sure that the chances of finding random people in a backwater town like this who speak English well enough to communicate with them is fairly low. Also, the buzz about Viktor and then Yuuri being there is waaaaaayy too low, considering who they are and what they're doing there. Also doesn't Viktor have an agent and staff or something to handle his interviews and appearances? Doesn't Yuri? They also had the Russian coat of arms the wrong way around (flipped, to be exact). Also I just can't believe that Yuri would leave such a cute and pretty cat behind, I mean really, come on, that was such a cute cat.

The cat also concerned me... I'm assuming, with the love of felines that he shows, that his parents are taking care of the cat. (Looking at the state of his room, I'm assuming he has parents.)

And yeah, I've noticed things as well, but I like the comedic bits, and I find that it's because of those comedic bits that it's easy not to take the show too seriously and to dismiss things like why they're speaking Japanese and random bits of English and Russian. In a way, the addition of the comedy lowered my expectations for the series, so I'm able to enjoy it more.

[MagnaAngemon]

Originally Posted by monir

Watched episode 2. Thank you, Manju! I thought this season was lost.

Question: You are a healthy heterosexual male who is also an aspiring figure skater. You're having a down time and then comes along a coach who can get you to the next height. His condition is he wants you to satisfy him.



Would you?

If we're referring to Yuuri? Heterosexual, is that a joke?

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by MagnaAngemon

If we're referring to Yuuri? Heterosexual, is that a joke?

Well, he looks attracted to his married childhood friend, so at least he must be bi .

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by BPD Renegade

That aside, I think it's an over-trivialization to call these characters "basic <insert yaoi role here>." Sure, there have only been two episodes so far, but in these two episodes there has been such a plethora of possible symbolism, foils in characterization and culture, and beautiful animation, yet all you can get from that is, "He's the seme and the other guys are the uke"? It's your choice to continue watching it mindlessly, nothing wrong with that, but to me, this seems like a series that will be more meaningful if we look beyond the surface level. Of course, it could always turn into a train wreck, but I'll give Yamamoto the benefit of the doubt for now.

Well yeah, I mean it's not like a character can only be uke or seme, look at Viktor for example, he could be either with any of the two younger guys! Or both at the same time! And there are so many variations on both seme and uke! And pairings can be reversible!

A bit more seriously, though - while all the "omg so gaaay gimme the eye bleach" or "this is just yaoi" etc. whining about this show is annoying and eyeroll-inducing, let's not pretend that the show is pure and innocent and it's only viewers with dirty minds who see too much into it. Yamamoto knows perfectly what she's doing and for whom, and she probably has a reason for being so blatant about it. You can't exactly fault people for taking note of it and giving it the attention it's supposed to get.

That said, in case of this particular series so far I'm not seeing it as particularly complex or "deep"... I might be wrong but after these two episodes I don't think it's ever going to be, at least it doesn't really seem like it's trying to. It doesn't mean the show is a trainwreck, of course. But so far I don't see it as particularly beautiful (animation aside, although so far Endless Night still beats it on the visuals front, the animation may not be as smooth but it just looks so much better) or meaningful.

Originally Posted by BPD Renegade

Doesn't matter male or female, figure skating or whatever, I'd give the middle finger, and the person would lose my respect on a personal level.

But... maybe they just want you to treat them to their favorite food or something... "satisfaction" can mean so many things.

Originally Posted by BPD Renegade

The cat also concerned me... I'm assuming, with the love of felines that he shows, that his parents are taking care of the cat. (Looking at the state of his room, I'm assuming he has parents.)

Right? It was such a cute kitty, I hope it's getting proper care. <- clearly focusing on the important things

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

A bit more seriously, though - while all the "omg so gaaay gimme the eye bleach" or "this is just yaoi" etc. whining about this show is annoying and eyeroll-inducing, let's not pretend that the show is pure and innocent and it's only viewers with dirty minds who see too much into it. Yamamoto knows perfectly what she's doing and for whom, and she probably has a reason for being so blatant about it. You can't exactly fault people for taking note of it and giving it the attention it's supposed to get.

That said, in case of this particular series so far I'm not seeing it as particularly complex or "deep"... I might be wrong but after these two episodes I don't think it's ever going to be, at least it doesn't really seem like it's trying to. It doesn't mean the show is a trainwreck, of course. But so far I don't see it as particularly beautiful (animation aside, although so far Endless Night still beats it on the visuals front, the animation may not be as smooth but it just looks so much better) or meaningful.

Yeah, I take it as what will probably amount to a good and entertaining sports show, with the customary rivalry, striving TO BE THE BEST and so on. I enjoy the fact that it's not too serious and I enjoy that it's an anime original, meaning it will probably reach a satisfying conclusion and will have brisk pacing - two qualities that anime adaptations of sports manga often lack.

[Pen3]

I was actually surprised that coach asked Yuri if he had romantic feelings for Minako sensei because we all know this show is going full yaoi undertone. Still, i wouldn't mind a twist in the end that he does get together with Minako or any other female for that matter.

[BPD Renegade]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

Well yeah, I mean it's not like a character can only be uke or seme, look at Viktor for example, he could be either with any of the two younger guys! Or both at the same time! And there are so many variations on both seme and uke! And pairings can be reversible!

A bit more seriously, though - while all the "omg so gaaay gimme the eye bleach" or "this is just yaoi" etc. whining about this show is annoying and eyeroll-inducing, let's not pretend that the show is pure and innocent and it's only viewers with dirty minds who see too much into it. Yamamoto knows perfectly what she's doing and for whom, and she probably has a reason for being so blatant about it. You can't exactly fault people for taking note of it and giving it the attention it's supposed to get.

That said, in case of this particular series so far I'm not seeing it as particularly complex or "deep"... I might be wrong but after these two episodes I don't think it's ever going to be, at least it doesn't really seem like it's trying to. It doesn't mean the show is a trainwreck, of course. But so far I don't see it as particularly beautiful (animation aside, although so far Endless Night still beats it on the visuals front, the animation may not be as smooth but it just looks so much better) or meaningful.

I'm not faulting people for making note of it or denying it. It's obvious this is the type of show that's pushing us to see these things. But I am trying to say that the characters are more than "basic seme" or "basic uke." The typical hentai/yaoi series seldom has characters beyond a one-dimensional level (usually along the lines of wimp and smooth macho). I'm not seeing that in the Yuri on Ice characters so far. Yeah, Victor has the smooth part down, and Yuri might seem like a wimp at times (but not really), but you can't say that that's all they are.

But... maybe they just want you to treat them to their favorite food or something... "satisfaction" can mean so many things.

Reread the couple paragraphs you wrote before this, and let's be real. We all know what we were supposed to think by "satisfy."

Right? It was such a cute kitty, I hope it's getting proper care. <- clearly focusing on the important things

Clearly.

[Sheba]

It's so FABULOUS I am crying rainbows.

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by BPD Renegade

and Yuri might seem like a wimp at times (but not really), but you can't say that that's all they are.

If anything Yuri is a stereotype of sports anime, not of yaoi; someone who seems a wimp at the beginning but actually has bursts of hidden talent and develops a lot of confidence along the way.

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Gan_HOPE326

If anything Yuri is a stereotype of sports anime, not of yaoi; someone who seems a wimp at the beginning but actually has bursts of hidden talent and develops a lot of confidence along the way.

There's a reason why sports anime tend to be popular with the BL crowd. It's not just because they're filled with hot guys, but because many of those guys personalities also align with BL stereotypes. Yuri is no exception here. He's just as much a BL stereotype as he is a shounen protag sports one.

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by Cloudedmind

There's a reason why sports anime tend to be popular with the BL crowd. It's not just because they're filled with hot guys, but because many of those guys personalities also align with BL stereotypes. Yuri is no exception here. He's just as much a BL stereotype as he is a shounen protag sports one.

Hm, fair enough.

[Moroboshi-kun]

Originally Posted by Cloudedmind

There's a reason why sports anime tend to be popular with the BL crowd. It's not just because they're filled with hot guys, but because many of those guys personalities also align with BL stereotypes.

No, not really. It is because recent years sports anime makers consciously add in homo-innuendo into the series to attract larger audience.

Remember series Abarenbō Rikishi!! Matsutarō couple of years back? That should've been fujoshi dream: hot beefy guys wrestling only in loinclothes! And to add to the joy Matsutarō was an asshole like any best seme!

Didn't click as it was based on 70s manga and didn't have any hints of homo-relations.

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Moroboshi-kun

No, not really. It is because recent years sports anime makers consciously add in homo-innuendo into the series to attract larger audience.

Remember series Abarenbō Rikishi!! Matsutarō couple of years back? That should've been fujoshi dream: hot beefy guys wrestling only in loinclothes! And to add to the joy Matsutarō was an asshole like any best seme!

Didn't click as it was based on 70s manga and didn't have any hints of homo-relations.

A show doesn't have to have homo relations or innuendo to be popular with fujoshi. The guys in Abarenbō Rikishi!! Matsutarō would be considered Bara at best and not the hot kind. So no surprise it didn't gain much traction with the BL crowd. Please go back and re-read my statement. I said that sports anime are also generally popular with the BL crowd, not just because there filled with hot guys, but because many of those guys personalities also align with BL stereotypes. Meaning both conditions (hot guys with BL stereotypical personalities) are often present.