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Old 2013-05-08, 20:02   Link #1721
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ~BC~ View Post
Yeah, but convincing them of this doesn't really require any kind of social finesse. Especially if his own secret got out. Just a few well place stabs...

But yeah, it really doesn't behoove either them to forcefully break this stalemate they're in.
Then L-Elf is a retard and suicidal.

People are making assumptions, like "why don't L-Elf ruin Haruto" as if it wouldn't doom himself, or "why don't the world powers throw their entire army at the school" like they have the troops to spare.

Too many people here are thinking too small and completely failed to see the big picture. L-Elf can't either, which is why he is being pushed aside. His attitude got him nowhere.

L-Elf is NOT some superspy. He can kill people, but if you think he can get anywhere doing something other than killing, you are sadly mistaken.
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:05   Link #1722
Irenesharda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
What are they going to do? Tell Haruto to take his super robot and leave?

Haruto is keeping them safe. More importantly Haruto is keeping L-Elf safe.

L-Elf is confident, but that's it. He isn't any good at anything but killing people. Haruto isn't going to be ruined by rumours when he is the only thing keeping everyone alive.

You are attributing L-Elf with talent he doesn't possess. If he wants to sow chaos then he can, but he would doom himself in the process because the school is his only ally right now.
Well mob mentalities rarely make sense. Let's say that something very tragic happens that Haruto couldn't prevent, they could turn on him at any moment and use him as a scapegoat. Sort of how Flay did to Kira when Kira didn't prevent her father from dying in the beginning of SEED.

The reveal that he's not human any longer never goes well with the general populace, especially a group of Japanese anime students. (How many times have I seen that...)

And we really also have yet to see the full scale of L-11's talents, we don't know if he can play the charmer or not. He doesn't need to act with Haruto because Haruto knows who and what he is. Also he never needed to do so when he infiltrated the school because their mission was get in, steal the Valvrave and then help in the invasion. He had no reason to be nice.
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:08   Link #1723
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Originally Posted by Irenesharda View Post
Well mob mentalities rarely make sense. Let's say that something very tragic happens that Haruto couldn't prevent, they could turn on him at any moment and use him as a scapegoat. Sort of how Flay did to Kira when Kira didn't prevent her father from dying in the beginning of SEED.

The reveal that he's not human any longer never goes well with the general populace, especially a group of Japanese anime students. (How many times have I seen that...).
And then what? Haruto leaves with his giant robot and everyone else dies.

You are acting like this is Haruto vs L-Elf. When it is actually L-Elf begging Haruto to help him when Haruto doesn't need L-Elf in return. There is NOTHING L-Elf can threaten Haruto with that wouldn't screw himself in the process.

You are proposing that L-Elf threaten to destroy the school and himself with it. I am starting to think L-Elf isn't the foolish one here.

As for stealing the VVV? I love to seem him try, as it seems we have proof each unit can only have one designated pilot.
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:12   Link #1724
Destined_Fate
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L-Elf may end up being spurned repeatedly by Haruto so I can see him wanting to make a contract and getting close to Shoko because he knows Haruto loves her.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
What are they going to do? Tell Haruto to take his super robot and leave?

Haruto is keeping them safe. More importantly Haruto is keeping L-Elf safe.

L-Elf is confident, but that's it. He isn't any good at anything but killing people. Haruto isn't going to be ruined by rumours when he is the only thing keeping everyone alive.

You are attributing L-Elf with talent he doesn't possess. If he wants to sow chaos then he can, but he would doom himself in the process because the school is his only ally right now.
The kids literally decided to declare their independence because Shoko said so, they didn't even think about it as they were caught up in the moment.

I highly doubt, when they're emotional, that they will SERIOUSLY think things through when demonizing Haruto as a "Monster".
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:13   Link #1725
Irenesharda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Haruto is well known and trusted. L-Elf is an enemy spy.

L-Elf also have no skill in making anybody trust him. He doesn't know how.
You seem to be making the assumption that L-elf is nothing but a killing robot. However we know that isn't true if he's actually made a plan in order to change Dorssia from the inside out.

I'm sure that the Karlstein school taught him more than just how to kill. He would not be an effective infiltrator if he never learned how to blend in. I think you're selling L-11 a little short. Yes killing is his first option, but it is also the most efficient option. If your opponent is dead he can't come back to get you (except for space vampires that is...) but he also seems to know when NOT to kill as well. He didn't kill Yamada when he obviously could have. So there is more to him, we just need to let him be flushed out more. It has only been 4 episodes.
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:22   Link #1726
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Then L-Elf is a retard and suicidal.

People are making assumptions, like "why don't L-Elf ruin Haruto" as if it wouldn't doom himself, or "why don't the world powers throw their entire army at the school" like they have the troops to spare.

Too many people here are thinking too small and completely failed to see the big picture. L-Elf can't either, which is why he is being pushed aside. His attitude got him nowhere.

L-Elf is NOT some superspy. He can kill people, but if you think he can get anywhere doing something other than killing, you are sadly mistaken.
Suicidal yes. And that was my point. I think Haruto would realize that it might not be a good idea to back him into a corner. Ergo, why I don't think the group will actively try to blow his cover unless they feel they're forced to (which I doubt L-Elf will do because he won't benefit either).
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:24   Link #1727
Irenesharda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
And then what? Haruto leaves with his giant robot and everyone else dies.

You are acting like this is Haruto vs L-Elf. When it is actually L-Elf begging Haruto to help him when Haruto doesn't need L-Elf in return. There is NOTHING L-Elf can threaten Haruto with that wouldn't screw himself in the process.

You are proposing that L-Elf threaten to destroy the school and himself with it. I am starting to think L-Elf isn't the foolish one here.

As for stealing the VVV? I love to seem him try, as it seems we have proof each unit can only have one designated pilot.
You are acting as if they will even let him have the Valvrave. None of the students know that the machine will kill any pilot but him. They would probably gang up on him and try to take the robot for themselves, sort of what Yamada tried to do. And like I said mobs never think clearly when they're in the moment. They are thinking with anger and not about the consequences.

If there was one thing L-11 didn't do, it was beg. He never begged Haruto, he commanded him. I never said that L-11 was going to destroy the school or anything like that, but he did promise to save it. He sees this a beneficial for both of them, and he will make Haruto see things his way.

And he is right. Right now, all Shoko's plan did was put them under siege. Eventually the bigger issue of Dorssia will need to be tackled in order to truly resolve things. I stand by the fact that L-11 and Haruto WILL eventually make a contract, but Haruto's just being stubborn and deluded at the moment. Right now all he's thinking about is saving his classmates and friends, but like almost every mecha MC, he will eventually learn that in order to do this, he's got to look at the much bigger picture.
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Old 2013-05-08, 20:44   Link #1728
Duo Maxwell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irenesharda View Post
You seem to be making the assumption that L-elf is nothing but a killing robot. However we know that isn't true if he's actually made a plan in order to change Dorssia from the inside out.
If anything, he's inept at communication. You can pretty see that at how he's arguing with Haruto in the middle of infiltrating mission in episode 1, and how he's trying to recruit Haruto in recent ep. The guy is actually doing everything alone if everything that's shown is in any indication. Aside from A-Drei, and could be that eye patch guy, I don't really see anyone else actually cares about him. That says great deal about his charisma.
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Old 2013-05-08, 21:28   Link #1729
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Originally Posted by Destined_Fate View Post
The kids literally decided to declare their independence because Shoko said so, they didn't even think about it as they were caught up in the moment.

I highly doubt, when they're emotional, that they will SERIOUSLY think things through when demonizing Haruto as a "Monster".
Then you assume L-Elf is an idiot. Because you just proposed that he should destroy the school with nothing to gain.

This is NOT "can L-Elf screw Haruto", this is "can L-Elf get what he wants at all".

L-Elf have no leverage because he needed the school to survive as much as everyone else. He has nowhere to run.
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Old 2013-05-08, 21:48   Link #1730
cyoti
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destined_Fate View Post
The kids literally decided to declare their independence because Shoko said so, they didn't even think about it as they were caught up in the moment.
What else should they have done? Going with either side either meant being occupied by Dorussia or being abandoned by ARUS. They choose the lesser of the evils available to them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duo Maxwell View Post
If anything, he's inept at communication. You can pretty see that at how he's arguing with Haruto in the middle of infiltrating mission in episode 1, and how he's trying to recruit Haruto in recent ep. The guy is actually doing everything alone if everything that's shown is in any indication. Aside from A-Drei, and could be that eye patch guy, I don't really see anyone else actually cares about him. That says great deal about his charisma.
L-Elf views everything in tactical/strategic terms. It's how he was able to find the base and figure out Valrave's secret. But it makes particularly him ineffective at negotiation. He only sees Haruto's short term and long term strategic needs, he fails utterly to see Haruto's higher psychological needs or the fact that Haruto remembers being called a monster or that he almost killed Haruto.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:03   Link #1731
Duo Maxwell
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L-Elf views everything in tactical/strategic terms.
I'm not sure their strategy has arguing with random boy about ham & egg in the plan. He's emotionally unstable, too.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:03   Link #1732
Destined_Fate
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With no plan for the future at all other than "let's make our own country!".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Then you assume L-Elf is an idiot. Because you just proposed that he should destroy the school with nothing to gain.

This is NOT "can L-Elf screw Haruto", this is "can L-Elf get what he wants at all".

L-Elf have no leverage because he needed the school to survive as much as everyone else. He has nowhere to run.
I'm not saying he would do it but if he's backed in a corner he could do anything. Haruto doesn't know L-Elf other than that he's dangerous and can kill very easily. L-Elf also knows that Shoko is important to Haruto as she was with him from the start and Haruto chose "her" over him. So if Haruto tries anything to really screw over L-Elf than he could lose Shoko for good this time.

There's also hints that there will be competition for Shoko, with L-Elf's interest in her and knowing her importance to Haruto he may very well sweep her off her feet to get her on his wavelength and to pressure Haruto who will keep quiet, for Shoko's sake, and play nice to protect Shoko.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:08   Link #1733
battleengine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Official sighting of the Green Valvrave... And the fact that the pilot wears a green pilot suit. I think this confirms multiple pilots conclusively.
Ok back to the topic that is lost a few page back . who has a larger version of it and translated the text..
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:08   Link #1734
cyoti
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destined_Fate View Post
With no plan for the future at all other than "let's make our own country!".
So submit to space nazis or be abandoned by greedy space Americans is a better idea?

Quote:
There's also hints that there will be competition for Shoko, with L-Elf's interest in her and knowing her importance to Haruto he may very well sweep her off her feet to get her on his wavelength and to pressure Haruto who will keep quiet, for Shoko's sake, and play nice to protect Shoko.
I think you need to stop viewing this in shipping terms. If anything both Shoko and L-Elf represent two competing choices for Haruto.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:15   Link #1735
Kunagisa
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Random spoilers from Newtype posted by 2ch-ers (nothing too major I think, most probably be revealed in tomorrow's episode, or the poster supposedly speculates):

Spoiler for Stuff:


The conversation moves too fast for me to catch up if any of these are old information then just ignore.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:24   Link #1736
Irenesharda
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Honestly, I can't understand any of that garble that you just posted. None of it makes much sense.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:31   Link #1737
Destined_Fate
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So submit to space nazis or be abandoned by greedy space Americans is a better idea?



I think you need to stop viewing this in shipping terms. If anything both Shoko and L-Elf represent two competing choices for Haruto.
Doesn't matter, they didn't think at all about this alternative and the one guy that thought that they should at least lay out a plan was overruled as the kids prefer action over planning.

Never.
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:38   Link #1738
Irenesharda
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With the next episode coming out in a little less than 13 hours, and the first subs hopefully a few hours after that, what are everyone's expectations for this episode?

What do you think will happen in episode 5?
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:40   Link #1739
battleengine
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VVV are individual units, not parts refitted or whatever.
Saki will begin to approach Haruto starting Episode 5 (yeahh Sakiiiii !!).
Kibukawa (the male teacher) is a spy.
Kibukawa left all the work to Nanami (female teacher) and went underground.
Seems like Haruto and co. will grab all the VVV.

Are this fact stated by the creators of the anime valvrave? or just some prediction?
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Old 2013-05-08, 22:43   Link #1740
Tougarashi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kunagisa View Post
Random spoilers from Newtype posted by 2ch-ers (nothing too major I think, most probably be revealed in tomorrow's episode, or the poster supposedly speculates):

Spoiler for Stuff:


The conversation moves too fast for me to catch up if any of these are old information then just ignore.
It should be, Saki has a good potential. I don't like Shoko at all. She's a air-head. I don't like noisy girl who gets emotional every time she talk. Saki is calm and has a story under the sleeve. Long hair and big breasted , she remind me of Anri from Durarara hiding her dark story of being a Saika.
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