Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha the Movie 2nd A's Discussion Thread (spoilers)

[Keroko]

Oooh, subs are out? Which group picked it up?

Originally Posted by Demi.

Hmyeah, pretty much what we'd figured. Would've been better if they made the doctor her guardian though.

Originally Posted by Demi.

Also why the BoD activates is sortof explained as well.

Spoiler:

Because of Vita be cornered by Nanoha, and the inevitability of being shot point blank by her divine buster, the book decided the knights were fighting a losing battle and deactivated them so it could take over. The book is more of a sentient being in the movie, and makes more complex choices, compared to the series.

Edit: Finished rewatch, and with subs this time. Don't care what anyone says, movie was great. The emotion was on par with A's if not higher. And the improved animation definitely made the action more enjoyable. Only real complaint (same as when I watched it the first time) was how scenes transitioned too quickly at times. I wouldn't say it felt disjointed, but I wish some scenes lasted just a little longer.

Originally Posted by bhl88

Forgot that part (and they didn't fill us much on the Wolkenritter, it was a montage). It was written as:

Spoiler for Actar:

Hayate saw the Defense Program (instead of the fake Nanoha and Fate) destroy the Knights and she lost her mind to despair. She was then absorbed into the book and the Consciousness of the Book of Darkness wanted to fulfill the last requests of her and her Knights. 1. To ‘destroy’ the harsh reality that took away her Knights and 2. To rid the hindrance of Nanoha and Fate (from allowing the Knights to fill up the pages of the book). But technically speaking, Reinforce, the Knights and Hayate were aware of the Defense Program. Why didn’t the CotBoD take that into consideration before acting out the final two requests or direct that anger and hatred towards the Defense Program? Well, I suppose you could say that the CotBoD was technically a ‘tool’ and only acted upon the final requests of the Knights and Hayate, despite them knowing about the program.

Right, so pretty much goes berserk "because plot" then. Not the most elegant of solutions, but with the removal of Graham this was hardly unexpected.

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

I'm the only one who find the character design for the girls in the movies a bit too round and weird?

I don't dislike it per se, it looks fine, it's just that i'm too used to the original style and like it better than this despite the quality enhacements xDU

Far from the only one. We've had arguments about the movie style all the way back to when the movie 1st was first announced.

Though every time I look back to the TV series, I'm reminded how horrible the quality was. Nostalgia makes it look good in memory alone.

[Demi.]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Right, so pretty much goes berserk "because plot" then. Not the most elegant of solutions, but with the removal of Graham this was hardly unexpected.

Spoiler:

Yes, but it went into pretty good depth on why it went berserk. And that the program (Nacht) is only a tool, and despite Reinforce being fully aware that this isn't the greatest choice, she could do nothing to stop it. And it was the only way Hayate could depart happily, within a peaceful dream. Since it was above Reinforces power to do anything else.

As for subber, I'm not sure. I downloaded a raw, and then uploaded the subs through a sub file. My guess is that these are the original subs that came with the BD release, but they were refined by someone from 4chan (supposedly) and then re-uploaded. They're not bad from what I could see.

[Takamura Mamoru]

So, I finished watching it. WAY better than I expected.

Random notes:

- Wolkenritter are badass. I mean, you know you're a badass when your introduction line is literally "Der General kommt"... But when you start wrecking Nanoha and Fate this hard, it just leaves an impression.
- Music was... good, very good. I did not expect this. When I first listened to the soundtrack I honestly thought it was mediocre compared to the other Nanoha stuff; but when I actually watched the movie? The music fits very well. Although I do think the insert song here is the worst in all of Nanoha. Not a killer flaw though.
- Lindy and Fate got a moment together. It was sweet and considering Lindy is her adoptive mother, it was about time they showed some interaction between each other.
- Reinforce is beautiful, gorgeous. Reinforce is love. This movie gave her quite a bit of focus and I love it. Best Nanoha girl!
- Reinforce vs. Nanoha/Fate was brutal... Really, brutal. Who needs energy weapons when you can chain them at the feet and smash them into the ground, huh? And yes, Reinforce "beating" Nanoha is not accurate to say in this movie. Rather, it should be Reinforce "beating the shit out of" Nanoha...
- Excelion ACS from the original A's was pretty much my favourite scene in all of Nanoha; Now, the movie definitely is weaker in the musical part of the scene (even though I already praised the movie's music, I know, but that's because the music in the original was perfect for that scene)... Uhh, but considering Nanoha was literally smashing Reinforce through multiple stone pillars, I think I can forgive that.
- This might just be my impression, but it felt like Shamal got more attention than she did in the original?
- Vita scene where she's fighting against random monsters and refuses to give up... Very emotional, improved from the original
- I think the Fate Dreamworld scene was better than in the original, too
- Kana Ueda really knows how to cry
- Overall, the intensity of the battles impressed me the most. I mean, I really did shout out IRL just because I was so shocked/impressed at what was happening on-screen.
- Did I mention that Reinforce is awesome?

Gripes with the movie:
- No Fate "saving" Nanoha scene at the beginning. This is quite bothersome because it was an amazing scene, and because the end of Movie 1st heavily hinted at this scene... So what gives? On the other hand, Fate literally saves Nanoha's life during the Reinforce fight, but it definitely did not have the same impact as the original "big damn heroes" scene
- No Reinforce Starlight breaker... That was also quite disappointing, but I think the way they cranked up the badassery to Dragonball Z levels (without the shitty choreography and animation, of course) in that fight, makes up for it.

[Demi.]

Something I noticed with the A's movie, is I seemed to actually like all of the characters. This is not the case with the series, where Some were great, some were decent, and the rest just existed. I'm not sure why this is, but I imagine there were hidden elements that were added, which didn't exist in the series. I'd need to compare and contrast the movie and series to find out.


Favorite scenes:

Nanoha and Fate's transformation. Each were nearly two minutes long, and the budget really showed. The bestial eye opening up on Fate's device was awesome.

Hayates final farewell to Reinforce. After all, she's the happiest tomb in the whole world.

Wolkenritter and Hayate bonding moments. Quite a few of them, really.

Fate dream world. The emotions were running wild with this one. Fate crying at the dinner table knowing that whats happening couldnt possibly be real, and her final farewell with Alicia. "I love, you sister" So quote, yet powerful. Wonderful scene. Dem feels.

Nanoha and Fate joint attack as well as when Fate cleaved that massive projectile to save Nanoha. All of the battles were really well done, and none seemed to suffer from still frames.

[Nanya01]

Wait, wait, wait, WAIT a MOMENT!

Fate got out of the dream world to save Nanoha...





GAH!

GODDAMMIT, TSUKI! STOP FUCKING YOUR SERIES UP SO MUCH!!!

SHEESH! First that first movie that basically was Raising Heart vs Fate the whole time and NOW you do THIS?!

So, I guess Hayate wasn't important at all, huh?

One of my favorite moments in the A's season, one of the BEST moments in the A's season was Hayate holding off the Protection Program so Nanoha could blast Reinforce, Hayate and Fate free of it.

They...

GAH!

Edit: Also, something else...

Mamoru, didn't you say this...

- Wolkenritter are badass. I mean, you know you're a badass when your introduction line is literally "Der General kommt"... But when you start wrecking Nanoha and Fate this hard, it just leaves an impression.

And, yet, Demi said this...

Because of Vita be cornered by Nanoha, and the inevitability of being shot point blank by her divine buster, the book decided the knights were fighting a losing battle and deactivated them so it could take over. The book is more of a sentient being in the movie, and makes more complex choices, compared to the series.

So... are the Wolkenritter badass and capable of wrecking Nanoha and Fate completely? Or are they weak and got really lucky the first time?

[Demi.]

First off, It's time for your blood pressure medication, again.

Secondly, Nanoha and Fate got stomped pre-device upgrade. After the upgrade, they seemed pretty evenly matched.

[Kaijo]

In the series, the NF and the Wolks were about evenly matched, until the Wolks popped cartridges and powered through through a cartridge-powered attack. Which made sense. In this instance, the cartridges are more like a shonen power-up, in that NF are helpless, totally, before the system, and then back to an even fighting edge after. It makes less sense.

They *should* be even, except when dealing with a cartridge-powered attack, since all the cartridge system does is power up a particular spell. Tactics and such should remain unchanged. Fate even managed a hit on Signum in the series, pre-upgrade.

[Nanya01]

1: The movies, so far, have sucked. Everyone just keeps going on and on about "ooh, how pretty" they are without giving anything objective about them. The only thing the first movie that most people can agree on is that they took out the first three episodes that was good, even though, looking back at it, it ties into Nanoha's character development. It was one of the reasons why she was willing to push herself so hard was because she let a Jewel Seed go out of control in Season 1. She didn't have that in the movie.

2: So, my comment still stands then, the Wolkenritter were pretty weak then in the movie if they go from "complete roffle-stomp" to evenly matched with the upgrade. In the series, Nanoha was fighting Vita fairly evenly, though Vita had a slight edge, until Vita used a cartridge and blew through her defenses. Signum was much stronger than Fate the whole time, and yet Fate STILL got a shot in on Signum in the series and could only barely keep up with Signum (who was holding back, a LOT) after the upgrade.

Also, Demi., did Arf get drained at the same time as Nanoha and Fate did? And, if so, what happened to her afterwords?

[Takamura Mamoru]

They didn't really fight though. Well, you didn't see much.

I was under the impression NachtWal decided "lol knights don't matter anymore" because... well, that's just what NachtWal does. That's the reason it's a corrupt program, isn't it? Because it takes charge no matter what the situation actually is.

[Nanya01]

Originally Posted by Takamura Mamoru

They didn't really fight though. Well, you didn't see much.

I was under the impression NachtWal decided "lol knights don't matter anymore" because... well, that's just what NachtWal does. That's the reason it's a corrupt program, isn't it? Because it takes charge no matter what the situation actually is.

Wait, the first fight we don't see much of or the Reinforce fight?

And we have seen, via flashbacks throughout the series, that Reinforce was active at the same time as the knights were in the past.

Why couldn't the book just kill the Personalities of Vita, Signum, Shamal and Zafira and forcibly go Berserk, thus having Nanoha and Fate have to fight against the full might of the Book of Darkness? would have made more sense than killing the Knights off.

[Demi.]

Originally Posted by Takamura Mamoru

They didn't really fight though. Well, you didn't see much.

I was under the impression NachtWal decided "lol knights don't matter anymore" because... well, that's just what NachtWal does. That's the reason it's a corrupt program, isn't it? Because it takes charge no matter what the situation actually is.

It activated the second before Vita was going to get hit with divine buster, and it was unblockable since she was bound. She knew this and closed her eyes awaiting the impending attack. So to me, it seemed like Natchwal deemed the knights an uncertain victory, so it decided to take over for them.

Also, Demi., did Arf get drained at the same time as Nanoha and Fate did? And, if so, what happened to her afterwords?

Yes, and she had to recover just like Nanoha and Fate. Ala R&R.

Although it didn't specifically show her getting drained. Shamal binded her and then when it transitioned back to her, she was unconscious. So it was either A.) she got drained or B.) Fate being drained made her go unconscious due to lack of supplied mana.

[Nanya01]

So... Arf recovered, huh?

Did she recover at the same time as Nanoha and Fate?

[Takamura Mamoru]

Originally Posted by Nanya01

Why couldn't the book just kill the Personalities of Vita, Signum, Shamal and Zafira and forcibly go Berserk, thus having Nanoha and Fate have to fight against the full might of the Book of Darkness? would have made more sense than killing the Knights off.

It took their linker cores to complete the pages of the Book of Darkness, which is first priority for NachtWal. Given that they are pretty much useless without linker cores you might as well kill them. That's what you usually do with programs that are of no use to you.

[Nanya01]

Originally Posted by Takamura Mamoru

It took their linker cores to complete the pages of the Book of Darkness, which is first priority for NachtWal. Given that they are pretty much useless without linker cores you might as well kill them. That's what you usually do with programs that are of no use to you.

So... What?

...



WHAT?!

You're telling me that the Book of Darkness could drain the Linker Cores of anything it wanted to do at any FREAKING TIME?!

So, WHY didn't it drain Nanoha, Fate and Arf completely dry and leave them unable to recover then?

At least in the series it made sense because the book could NOT do that on its own and needed someone to initiate the draining.

[Demi.]

The knights are a part of the program. The book has power over them.

[Nanya01]

Again, series, the twins had to start the draining of the Wolkenritter, not the book.

So, if the book can drain the knights, why can't it drain anything and everything without needing to be told?

[bhl88]

^ bidding time until 606 pages then absorb Wolks for another 60 pages.

XD hates the movie

[Archon_Wing]

lol could some of you actually watch the fucking movie before freaking out? I mean yes, I see some of these spoilers and realize some parts must be broken and badly put in, but taking things out of context doesn't help matters.

I mean at least the few of us that don't like Force actually read the some of the damned thing before littering the screen.

Of course, if you won't, that to me just justifies that the writers are a bunch of hacks that only care about making money. :]

[Sansker]

Well, we do need to see the movie first. So far it sounds and it looks good but I am not sure. I will need to watch the movie by myself and form an opinion there is no point on getting angry when you haven’t see the thing and you really have no idea what is going on there.

[guest]

Has anyone noticed that Raising (raging?) heart has improved its English A LOT since the TV series?