AnimeSuki Forums

Neon01 · 2004-02-10, 15:51

What do people see in this show? I thought it was mildly entertaining; managed to watch the whole thing even... Toward the end it does have some nice character development and actual plot, but I don't get it. Didn't particularly like any of the characters - flat out despised Fay (wasn't that her name?). Most of the episodes seemed so pointless. This sure wouldn't rank within even my top 10 anime choices. The movie seemed even worse than the series. What am I missing? Is the whole film noir appeal that attractive?

Go-lytely · 2004-02-10, 15:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neon01

What do people see in this show? I thought it was mildly entertaining; managed to watch the whole thing even... Toward the end it does have some nice character development and actual plot, but I don't get it. Didn't particularly like any of the characters - flat out despised Fay (wasn't that her name?). Most of the episodes seemed so pointless. This sure wouldn't rank within even my top 10 anime choices. The movie seemed even worse than the series. What am I missing? Is the whole film noir appeal that attractive?

Its impossible to explain why an overwhelming number of people like something while a certain few do not. Everyone has their own preferences and it up to us to respect each one. I for one, liked the characters and I thought the movie was fantastic. I wouldnt rank it as top 10, maybe in the top 20.

Ballz · 2004-02-10, 16:05

With the possible exception of Lupin, there was no other anime out there like it.

In anime, anything remotely original scores brownie points in my book.

JOJOS'STAR · 2004-02-10, 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neon01

What am I missing?

The whole point. Cowboy bebop one of the best serie I know, and trust me I know a lot. No need to discuss about it if you dint like it you dint like it end of the thread ^^

RichMan · 2004-02-10, 16:12

The show is great and you can tell that many like it cuz it's has always been on Adult Swim(it was there at the beginning and it's there now!).

The movie was good, but it wasn't great. It was worth the $10 I spent on it.(I bought it used at Blockbuster, then I got Malibu's Most Wanted for free! LOL. buy 1, get 1 free~)

Neon01 · 2004-02-10, 18:06

I'm certainly not trying to offend anyone with this post. Perhaps I came off too confrontational.... I'm not trying to develop an interest in the show, I'm trying to see if I missed some critical nuance of the show. When an overwhelming number of anime fans think the world of a series and I disagree, I wonder, that's all.

**ElvenPath** · 2004-02-10, 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neon01

What am I missing?

The great music composed by japanese maestro Yoko Kanno.

flammie · 2004-02-10, 18:15

The reason I like cowboy bebop is because it is similar to reading a collection of science fiction short stories, except animated with exceptional animation quality.

Neon01 · 2004-02-10, 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sway

The great music composed by japanese maestro Yoko Kanno.

You know what, I meant to edit my first message; you are exactly right. I really did enjoy the music.

kj1980 · 2004-02-10, 19:19

I can give you several reasons from a Japanese perspective why this anime was very popular in Japan. Although, please keep in mind I have no idea how big "Cowboy Bebop" is over in your country. But by the looks of it, it probably was very big hit as much as it was over here.

"Cowboy Bebop" was shown here in rather peculiar way. In 1998, "Cowboy Bebop" aired on two different channels. One on VHF - TV Tokyo, and the other on BS satellite - WOWOW.

However, due to reasons known only to TV Tokyo (and society issues at the time), TV Tokyo screwed up the airing process.

The first episode shown on TV Tokyo was...Session #2.
The second episode shown on TV Tokyo was....Session #3
And the third episode shown on TV Tokyo suddenly jumped to....Session #7

As many of you may say: "WTF!?"

I understand Session #1 was entirely cut out since it dealt with drug dealings...but how do you explain the jump from 3 to 7? Many people who were watching this show on VHF found the story to be interesting...but were confused that how Faye who left at the end of the second episode (session #3) was suddenly walking around like nothing ever happened in the third episode (session #7)

The problem here also lies that while "Cowboy Bebop" was being made into production, the times drastically changed for censorship in what can be broadcast on VHF.

The first notion of "Cowboy Bebop" being in production was in the January 1997 issue of Newtype Magazine (it actually goes on sale on early December 1996) so at least "Cowboy Bebop" was being in production at the time.

Social events and tragedies that changed the course of what can be broadcasted on VHF since 1996

May 1997: An very shocking incident occurred in Kobe where a mentally challenged 11 year old specials student was brutally murdered and his decapitated head was displayed perched above a middle school gate. In June, the country of Japan was even more shocked as police investigators arrested a 14 year old middle school student as the perpetrator. He also confessed that he also had beaten two elementary school girls to death several months before. With Japan, totally unprepared for such minors doing such grave acts of violence, the VHF TV studios self-imposed a stricter censorship among what was being showed at the time. (Unfortunately, due to Japanese law at the time, the 14 year old culprit only had to go to juvenile hall for his crimes)

December 1997: Pokemon epilepsy incident

January 1998: Another shocking incident occurred in Komatsu City, Aichi Prefecture where a 19 year student and a gang of four other 14 year olds, murdered a unrelated 14 year old student for the reason "he bumped into me." The point here that was addressed by the networks is the murder weapon involved - a butterfly knife. The 19 year who was arrested claimed he saw Kimura Takuya (a famous actor/singer) in the J-drama "Gift" wielding and playing around with a butterfly knife, and "it looked cool to swivel around with knives like that." He later proclaimed "it was the TV studio's fault for showing that drama in the first place, it should be cancelled." Yeah, whatever. Take your own responsibility man. But, for some reason, society took sides with the "poor kid who was brainwashed by the violence on TV" (anyone wonder about the poor kid who was killed?) and society forced TV station to further their censorships even further.

March 1998: "Kodomo no Omocha" TV show ended, new anime, "Cowboy Bebop" to start airing in April.

April 1998: "Cowboy Bebop" started airing on TV Tokyo

As you can see, "Cowboy Bebop" finished their production and began showing at the worst possible time. People still had profound doubts on showing violence on VHF TV broadcasts with such gruesome images of the said above.

Henceforth, you had this weird showing of skipped episodes on TV Tokyo.

Word of mouth spread that this was due to censorship and that what is being shown on TV Tokyo is not in its entireity. If you add what was shown on TV Tokyo, they only showed 12 episodes out of the entire 26 Sessions.

And what do people want when stuffs are censored?
Exactly - non censored in its full form.

That's what was aired on BS-satellite WOWOW channel.
And if it's censored, people have expectations and wonders.
Hence, the popularity.

But of course, there are numerous of other reasons such as combining Lupin-esque theme with Science Fiction. Probably also had to do with one of the last animes made majority by cel-anime. And of course, Kanno Yoko's music.

But to me, and probably most people who loved "Cowboy Bebop" here, would most likely say - "because we were dissatisfied with the original TV Tokyo airing."

daliinn · 2004-02-10, 19:56

Its an anime that you can enjoy without having to think about it. Every episode is like its own little movie.

I don't really understand how you don't like the characters. To me Spike seems to be the guy everyone wants to be like. The amount of coolness that goes in too him is a key aspect of the entire show.

Neon01 · 2004-02-10, 20:47

Wow, thanks for taking the time KJ. No doubt those factors played strongly in the reception it got in Japan. As for Spike's cool guy appeal, I suppose I can understand your point there too, but it just didn't set it apart for me. I've seen too many of the super-cool-and-confident characters in anime I think (Hellsing, Vampire Hunter D, pretty much all of the Macross', etc).

Umbrae · 2004-02-10, 23:10

thanks kj1980 that was quite informative.

Tboz · 2004-02-11, 08:35

I'm not that big a fan of Cowboy Bebop, but I think the show is great in its own right. IMO, Cowboy Bebop is all about style. Seldom do I see a show that's able to create such a fitting atmosphere portraying a group of oddballs kicking ass or having their ass kicked with so much flair and class. The animation is smooth and the jazzy background music is versatile at matching every turn of the pace be it lazy or action-packed. I think its a case of very good directing from Watanabe.

Briareos · 2004-02-11, 09:49

I'm a bit of a long-time anime buff. Kimba (Jungle Emperor Leo) and Battle of the Planets (SNTGotchaman) were my introduction to Japanese animation when they aired on US TV back in the late 70's and early 80's. I bought fansubbed VHS tapes of all the Ghibli films I could find, and started heavily watching anime when I went to College in '88. Cowboy Bebop showed up as something really fresh, yet vaguely familiar.

I loved Kanno's music for Bebop. I liked the variety of each episode. I loved the quirkiness of the characters (Ed! LOL). The oozing style was wonderful, as was the variety. I liked the show so much that I watched each episode twice (in a row) when they aired on the Cartoon Network.

The show works well as an episodic piece, however, for those willing to invest a little more into the show, it becomes something very special. The common thread through all the episodes is (of course) the characters. However, you don't get to know them in a forced way. Throughout the series, you see them in various situations and get to know them gradually. Neither Spike, Faye or Jet are the type to be up front about personal matters (Faye couldn't even be up front about her impending feeling of loss at Spike's final departure), so you have to learn about them by watching the subtle hints that show up along the way. The three of them put up a tough facade, but it's the mystery behind those masks that makes them interesting. The release of information is slow and deliberate and wonderfully woven into the series of short stories that make up the bulk of Bebop.

If you've invested enough thought into really getting to know the characters, then you can't help but be moved by the events of the last three episodes. The song "Call Me" still brings me to tears.

See you around, Space Cowboy.

oXKeNsHiNXo · 2004-02-11, 20:34

The series was great. Although many of the episodes didnt tie too well into each other they were most likely there to build up the characters. If you notice each of the characters pasts are dug *delved* into which helps the viewer to understand the characters more. Many animes do this but the pasts of the main characters actually helped form the characters and make them who they are. I dunno i kinda liked how they did it all and the plot came to a close later on which all flowed together well. The situations theyre in is also comical along with all the action blablabla appealing to all audiences in my opinion... but thats my 8.306623863 cents.

TangentZ · 2004-02-11, 23:10

Hey Neon01, I just wanted to say that you're not alone. I also "dreaded" watching all 26 episodes of Cowboy Bebop (original Japanese, not English dub).
I literally dozed off for a few minutes in the middle of some episodes. I'm not kidding.

What don't I like about it? Well, I don't generally like episodic series. Cowboy Bebop is one of them. Some episodes hardly make sense fitting in the rest of the story, whatever little there is.

I like long arching stories linking several episodes, or even the entire series. Seeing "To Be Continued ( つづき )" is even better.

I guess that's why I normally prefer manga-based anime series.

7thMethuselah · 2004-02-12, 16:03

well to me cowboy bebop is one of those series you need to "get into". At first I didn't like it very much but after seeing a couple of episodes I kinda started to like the style of the characters and the rather cool atmospere which was present in each episode. I actually started to familiarise with some of the characters. basically Cowboy Bebop puts you in a good mood and makes you feel awesome for quite a while...

Later on in the series a nice story develpos as well. It's not the best show I've ever seen but it was well worth the money i spent on the DVD's...

SpikeSpencer · 2004-02-13, 11:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sway

The great music composed by japanese maestro Yoko Kanno.

Thats the main reason I can still watch it ...well that and Edward Wong Hau Pepelu Tivrusky IV ...always gonna be one of my favorite characters

EliteJounin · 2004-02-21, 03:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by JOJOS'STAR

The whole point. Cowboy bebop one of the best serie I know, and trust me I know a lot. No need to discuss about it if you dint like it you dint like it end of the thread ^^

Yeah... well... uh... no one can really trust you on that because they dont really know you. They can only judge you on your words and choose to believe or not. And besides, in your opinion, it is one of the best. Others may not think so, for example, the person who started this thread.

2004-02-10, 15:51	Link #1
Neon01 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Alexandria, VA USA Age: 44	Cowboy Bebop What do people see in this show? I thought it was mildly entertaining; managed to watch the whole thing even... Toward the end it does have some nice character development and actual plot, but I don't get it. Didn't particularly like any of the characters - flat out despised Fay (wasn't that her name?). Most of the episodes seemed so pointless. This sure wouldn't rank within even my top 10 anime choices. The movie seemed even worse than the series. What am I missing? Is the whole film noir appeal that attractive?

2004-02-11, 23:10	Link #17
TangentZ 神の一手 Join Date: Nov 2003	Hey Neon01, I just wanted to say that you're not alone. I also "dreaded" watching all 26 episodes of Cowboy Bebop (original Japanese, not English dub). I literally dozed off for a few minutes in the middle of some episodes. I'm not kidding. What don't I like about it? Well, I don't generally like episodic series. Cowboy Bebop is one of them. Some episodes hardly make sense fitting in the rest of the story, whatever little there is. I like long arching stories linking several episodes, or even the entire series. Seeing "To Be Continued ( つづき )" is even better. I guess that's why I normally prefer manga-based anime series. __________________ 飛天御剣流ー天翔龍閃

2004-02-10, 16:05	Link #3
Ballz <3 Boogiepop Join Date: Dec 2003 Age: 43	With the possible exception of Lupin, there was no other anime out there like it. In anime, anything remotely original scores brownie points in my book.

2004-02-10, 16:12	Link #5
RichMan ???? Join Date: Jan 2004	The show is great and you can tell that many like it cuz it's has always been on Adult Swim(it was there at the beginning and it's there now!). The movie was good, but it wasn't great. It was worth the $10 I spent on it.(I bought it used at Blockbuster, then I got Malibu's Most Wanted for free! LOL. buy 1, get 1 free~)

2004-02-10, 18:06	Link #6
Neon01 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Alexandria, VA USA Age: 44	I'm certainly not trying to offend anyone with this post. Perhaps I came off too confrontational.... I'm not trying to develop an interest in the show, I'm trying to see if I missed some critical nuance of the show. When an overwhelming number of anime fans think the world of a series and I disagree, I wonder, that's all.

2004-02-10, 18:15	Link #8
flammie White Dragon Join Date: Dec 2003	The reason I like cowboy bebop is because it is similar to reading a collection of science fiction short stories, except animated with exceptional animation quality.

2004-02-10, 19:19	Link #10
kj1980 Gomen asobase desuwa! Join Date: Nov 2003 Age: 43	I can give you several reasons from a Japanese perspective why this anime was very popular in Japan. Although, please keep in mind I have no idea how big "Cowboy Bebop" is over in your country. But by the looks of it, it probably was very big hit as much as it was over here. "Cowboy Bebop" was shown here in rather peculiar way. In 1998, "Cowboy Bebop" aired on two different channels. One on VHF - TV Tokyo, and the other on BS satellite - WOWOW. However, due to reasons known only to TV Tokyo (and society issues at the time), TV Tokyo screwed up the airing process. The first episode shown on TV Tokyo was...Session #2. The second episode shown on TV Tokyo was....Session #3 And the third episode shown on TV Tokyo suddenly jumped to....Session #7 As many of you may say: "WTF!?" I understand Session #1 was entirely cut out since it dealt with drug dealings...but how do you explain the jump from 3 to 7? Many people who were watching this show on VHF found the story to be interesting...but were confused that how Faye who left at the end of the second episode (session #3) was suddenly walking around like nothing ever happened in the third episode (session #7) The problem here also lies that while "Cowboy Bebop" was being made into production, the times drastically changed for censorship in what can be broadcast on VHF. The first notion of "Cowboy Bebop" being in production was in the January 1997 issue of Newtype Magazine (it actually goes on sale on early December 1996) so at least "Cowboy Bebop" was being in production at the time. Social events and tragedies that changed the course of what can be broadcasted on VHF since 1996 May 1997: An very shocking incident occurred in Kobe where a mentally challenged 11 year old specials student was brutally murdered and his decapitated head was displayed perched above a middle school gate. In June, the country of Japan was even more shocked as police investigators arrested a 14 year old middle school student as the perpetrator. He also confessed that he also had beaten two elementary school girls to death several months before. With Japan, totally unprepared for such minors doing such grave acts of violence, the VHF TV studios self-imposed a stricter censorship among what was being showed at the time. (Unfortunately, due to Japanese law at the time, the 14 year old culprit only had to go to juvenile hall for his crimes) December 1997: Pokemon epilepsy incident January 1998: Another shocking incident occurred in Komatsu City, Aichi Prefecture where a 19 year student and a gang of four other 14 year olds, murdered a unrelated 14 year old student for the reason "he bumped into me." The point here that was addressed by the networks is the murder weapon involved - a butterfly knife. The 19 year who was arrested claimed he saw Kimura Takuya (a famous actor/singer) in the J-drama "Gift" wielding and playing around with a butterfly knife, and "it looked cool to swivel around with knives like that." He later proclaimed "it was the TV studio's fault for showing that drama in the first place, it should be cancelled." Yeah, whatever. Take your own responsibility man. But, for some reason, society took sides with the "poor kid who was brainwashed by the violence on TV" (anyone wonder about the poor kid who was killed?) and society forced TV station to further their censorships even further. March 1998: "Kodomo no Omocha" TV show ended, new anime, "Cowboy Bebop" to start airing in April. April 1998: "Cowboy Bebop" started airing on TV Tokyo As you can see, "Cowboy Bebop" finished their production and began showing at the worst possible time. People still had profound doubts on showing violence on VHF TV broadcasts with such gruesome images of the said above. Henceforth, you had this weird showing of skipped episodes on TV Tokyo. Word of mouth spread that this was due to censorship and that what is being shown on TV Tokyo is not in its entireity. If you add what was shown on TV Tokyo, they only showed 12 episodes out of the entire 26 Sessions. And what do people want when stuffs are censored? Exactly - non censored in its full form. That's what was aired on BS-satellite WOWOW channel. And if it's censored, people have expectations and wonders. Hence, the popularity. But of course, there are numerous of other reasons such as combining Lupin-esque theme with Science Fiction. Probably also had to do with one of the last animes made majority by cel-anime. And of course, Kanno Yoko's music. But to me, and probably most people who loved "Cowboy Bebop" here, would most likely say - "because we were dissatisfied with the original TV Tokyo airing."

2004-02-10, 19:56	Link #11
daliinn Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Age: 35	Its an anime that you can enjoy without having to think about it. Every episode is like its own little movie. I don't really understand how you don't like the characters. To me Spike seems to be the guy everyone wants to be like. The amount of coolness that goes in too him is a key aspect of the entire show.

2004-02-10, 20:47	Link #12
Neon01 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Alexandria, VA USA Age: 44	Wow, thanks for taking the time KJ. No doubt those factors played strongly in the reception it got in Japan. As for Spike's cool guy appeal, I suppose I can understand your point there too, but it just didn't set it apart for me. I've seen too many of the super-cool-and-confident characters in anime I think (Hellsing, Vampire Hunter D, pretty much all of the Macross', etc).

2004-02-10, 23:10	Link #13
Umbrae Generic Human Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: here	thanks kj1980 that was quite informative.

2004-02-11, 08:35	Link #14
Tboz Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003	I'm not that big a fan of Cowboy Bebop, but I think the show is great in its own right. IMO, Cowboy Bebop is all about style. Seldom do I see a show that's able to create such a fitting atmosphere portraying a group of oddballs kicking ass or having their ass kicked with so much flair and class. The animation is smooth and the jazzy background music is versatile at matching every turn of the pace be it lazy or action-packed. I think its a case of very good directing from Watanabe.

2004-02-11, 09:49	Link #15
Briareos Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan, USA Age: 53	I'm a bit of a long-time anime buff. Kimba (Jungle Emperor Leo) and Battle of the Planets (SNTGotchaman) were my introduction to Japanese animation when they aired on US TV back in the late 70's and early 80's. I bought fansubbed VHS tapes of all the Ghibli films I could find, and started heavily watching anime when I went to College in '88. Cowboy Bebop showed up as something really fresh, yet vaguely familiar. I loved Kanno's music for Bebop. I liked the variety of each episode. I loved the quirkiness of the characters (Ed! LOL). The oozing style was wonderful, as was the variety. I liked the show so much that I watched each episode twice (in a row) when they aired on the Cartoon Network. The show works well as an episodic piece, however, for those willing to invest a little more into the show, it becomes something very special. The common thread through all the episodes is (of course) the characters. However, you don't get to know them in a forced way. Throughout the series, you see them in various situations and get to know them gradually. Neither Spike, Faye or Jet are the type to be up front about personal matters (Faye couldn't even be up front about her impending feeling of loss at Spike's final departure), so you have to learn about them by watching the subtle hints that show up along the way. The three of them put up a tough facade, but it's the mystery behind those masks that makes them interesting. The release of information is slow and deliberate and wonderfully woven into the series of short stories that make up the bulk of Bebop. If you've invested enough thought into really getting to know the characters, then you can't help but be moved by the events of the last three episodes. The song "Call Me" still brings me to tears. See you around, Space Cowboy.

2004-02-11, 20:34	Link #16
oXKeNsHiNXo Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Seattle WA... well Federal Way Age: 37	The series was great. Although many of the episodes didnt tie too well into each other they were most likely there to build up the characters. If you notice each of the characters pasts are dug delved into which helps the viewer to understand the characters more. Many animes do this but the pasts of the main characters actually helped form the characters and make them who they are. I dunno i kinda liked how they did it all and the plot came to a close later on which all flowed together well. The situations theyre in is also comical along with all the action blablabla appealing to all audiences in my opinion... but thats my 8.306623863 cents.

2004-02-12, 16:03	Link #18
7thMethuselah Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Antwerp area, Belgium, Europa Age: 48	well to me cowboy bebop is one of those series you need to "get into". At first I didn't like it very much but after seeing a couple of episodes I kinda started to like the style of the characters and the rather cool atmospere which was present in each episode. I actually started to familiarise with some of the characters. basically Cowboy Bebop puts you in a good mood and makes you feel awesome for quite a while... Later on in the series a nice story develpos as well. It's not the best show I've ever seen but it was well worth the money i spent on the DVD's...