Madoka Magica - Movie 3 Spoilers and Speculations

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

I read that and it's mostly rehashed points and things I think are pretty tangential.

No, there's plenty of new points that I'm raising here.


In any event, here's one of the main reasons I dislike your interpretation. In my view, it strips Homura of her humanity. It's only human to have at least some doubts about the desires and wishes and choices of other people, even people that we love and know well. And I like how Homura, in this movie, speaks to that human fallibility that we all have.

What I see with Homura in this movie is a very human person, wrote well, who is trying hard to determine what it is that her most cherished person truly wants, and would make her happy. I find that very emotionally compelling. Much moreso than a person with supposedly complete confidence about another person, but she keeps displaying doubt and uncertainty (through her actions and questions) anyway.

In my interpretation of Homura, I see an impressively loyal and caring person trying her best to reach the person she loves, and trying to understand that person, and doing all she can to help that person as she sees it. In your interpretation of Homura, I see a walking contradiction - A person with complete confidence, but who acts nothing of the kind.

[night_sentinel]

Yey, your still discussing rebellion. ^^

Originally Posted by Triple_R

I think that Homura was surprised by both. Or, perhaps more accurately, Homura was surprised that Madoka's powers manifested themselves, while she was distraught by Madoka's answer.

No, not really. Madokami's smiling happy expression while she comes to collect Homura, combined with her panic reaction to Homura overwhelming her, makes it very clear to the audience that this is not what Madoka wanted.

I think on this part, I lean on Monoriu.

I watched the flower scene and the last part (epilogue) about ten times now. And I feel that for Homura, it should not come any surprise that Madoka will chose Law or her duty/good of other people over her own desires. Homura freaking watched timeline upon timeline of Madoka sacrificing for other people. She complained in the anime that Madoka is too kind, too self-sacrificing. It would be really weird if Homura just came to this realization now. She should have known this part of Madoka's personality timelines ago.

And she did. The flower scene boils down to Homura accidentally giving a hypothetical situation regarding Madokami's ascension, asking if Madoka would be happy with that? (A paraphrase of the Law and Desire question.)

Madoka answered no. And the interviews said that it was Madoka's true feelings. Madoka further implied that she can't go through or won't chose such difficult ordeal ever. Madoka said that she's not strong enough for that.

But, Homura's response to that is pretty telling.

Homura believes that Madoka will be strong enough for that. If push comes to shove, Madoka will pick duty and go through the terrible ordeal because Madoka is that kind of person (strong, selfless, kind). And with that came the realization that Homura should not have let her. Should have done something about it.

Kicking start the beginning of Akuma! Homura.

To summarize, I believe that Homura did what she did knowing that it was against Madoka whether human! Madoka or God! Madoka. Knowing that it might land her as Madoka's enemy. Because to Homura, Madoka's happiness matter a lot more.

And if being Madoka's enemy, opposing Madoka's very wish will do it, she'll do so.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by night_sentinel

Yey, your still discussing rebellion. ^^

Thank you. Though I do find it a bit odd that you're happy with this when you seem to completely disagree with me.

I think on this part, I lean on Monoriu.

Then why does Homura keep asking Madoka the questions that she does? There is no good reason for Homura to do that unless she has at least some doubt over what the answers are.

Don't you think it's very extreme to think that one person can completely and totally know another person, without the slightest smidgen of doubt? I find that downright inhuman, honestly.

It's only human to have some doubt about the desires and wishes and choices of other people, and that's obviously true for people you doubted the very existence of!

I watched the flower scene and the last part (epilogue) about ten times now. And I feel that for Homura, it should not come any surprise that Madoka will chose Law or her duty/good of other people over her own desires.

Law and "good of other people" are not one and the same. I think that recognizing that is part of the reason why Homura is not 100% completely certain without a shadow of a doubt, as you and Kazu-kun appear to believe.

Homura freaking watched timeline upon timeline of Madoka sacrificing for other people.

Did she sacrifice for Mami in Episode 4? Did she wish for Mami to come back to life in that episode? Did she have the courage to make that decision? Or did she hate on herself during the confrontation with the TV-witch because of her inability to do that? If you want to know my take on it, just re-read this.

So it's not inconceivable that Homura has seen moments in various timelines where Madoka did not rise to the occasion, and where Madoka chose self-preservation over self-sacrifice.

I don't like the way that you and Kazu-kun seem to be trying to box in these characters, and make them highly simplistic characters that could never change their minds or make different types of choices depending on different circumstances.

I think that Homura and Madoka are more complex than what you and Kazu-kun are giving them credit for.

She complained in the anime that Madoka is too kind, too self-sacrificing. It would be really weird if Homura just came to this realization now. She should have known this part of Madoka's personality timelines ago.

It's part of her personality, but it's not the only part, and it's not always the overriding part.

Madoka answered no. And the interviews said that it was Madoka's true feelings. Madoka further implied that she can't go through or won't chose such difficult ordeal ever. Madoka said that she's not strong enough for that.

Just like Madoka actually wasn't strong enough in Episode 4 of the TV series.

Look, these characters are wrote very human-like, with human fallibility and flaws and inconsistencies just like you and I have. That's much of what I like about them. They're not perfectly consistent, and they're not above some degree of self-contradiction. And that's why, as is the case with real humans, figuring them out is not some easy, clear-cut thing without any doubt whatsoever.

The world of Madoka Magica is not that black-and-white and overly simplistic.

To summarize, I believe that Homura did what she did knowing that it was against Madoka whether human! Madoka or God! Madoka.

I strongly disagree. Because if she truly knows that then there's no good reason whatsoever to question Madoka about it after the fact.


There's one thing I really want to stress here. I think that taking an ironclad line on Madoka Magica and its characters and their understanding of themselves is a dangerous approach to take. I think that the main reason why many people have had such a hard time accepting this movie's ending is because they build up a very ironclad take on Madokami and Homura; one that made it extremely difficult for them to roll with this ending. For example, some people were completely sold on the idea that Madokami was omniscient, based on taking a line or two in Episode 12 completely literal without allowing any room for exaggeration, or hyperbole, or all the other things we humans do frequently. And look at how much weight is now being put into the same sort of approach to one line in this movie.

Just because a character says something doesn't mean they have actual complete 100% confidence in it, and aren't exaggerating in the least. In fact, it may very well be the case that they're trying to convince themselves, and/or are exaggerating.

[night_sentinel]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Why are you glad that I'm discussing it when it sounds like you disagreed with everything I just wrote?

Its always nice to hear your opinion even if I'm in the opposite side?

Then why does Homura keep asking Madoka the questions that she does? There is no good reason for Homura to do that unless she has at least some doubt over what the answers are.

Don't you think it's very extreme to think that one person can completely and totally know another person, without the slightest smidgen of doubt? I find that downright inhuman, honestly.

It's only human to have some doubt about the desires and wishes and choices of other people, and that's obviously true for people you doubted the very existence of!

*whisper* Its a pretty nice book end/beginning for SHAFT. (but let's focus on IC reasons).

I think that was Homura steeling herself. Basically, its an ultimatum. She's saying if Madoka wishes to put Law or people's well being above her personal happiness, Homura will be her enemy. And yes, its pretty extreme for another person to know another one completely. But, this isn't any complete knowledge. This is basically Madoka 101. I would be hardpressed to find someone I know who has working knowledge of the series who will answer that "Madoka will choose Desire on Homura's questions."

And on the knowing someone, I believe that even if one cannot know someone completely. We can at least know someone partially.

Law and "good of other people" are not one and the same. I think that recognizing that is part of the reason why Homura is not 100% completely certain without a shadow of a doubt, as you and Kazu-kun appear to believe.

I agree that Laws is not equal good of other people. But, in this equation when the Law is for the good of other people specifically magical girls then, we can equate it.

But, I do realize that yes, Madoka did not specifically say good of other people. And yes, you can take that literally. If so, Madoka is endorsing LAW over DESIRES. Following this train of thought, Madoka upholds the Law even if certain people suffers for it which is what I'll get from that.

Then, this means, Madoka's contention in Season 2 would be because Homura broke the system to give happiness to individuals.

.... ok. Weird. But, possible. If Madoka's stint as a living law changed her.

Did she sacrifice for Mami in Episode 4? Did she wish for Mami to come back to life in that episode? Did she have the courage to make that decision? Or did she hate on herself during the confrontation with the TV-witch because of her inability to do that? If you want to know my take on it, just re-read this.

So it's not inconceivable that Homura has seen moments in various timelines where Madoka did not rise to the occasion, and where Madoka chose self-preservation over self-sacrifice.

I really don't like the way that you and Kazu-kun seem to be trying to box in these characters, and make them highly simplistic characters that could never change their minds or make different types of choices depending on different circumstances.

I've always thought that was because Madoka contracting and wishing Mami to life would have not done anything. That and Homura is around spouting gloom and doom that for those who care for her Madoka should not contract. But, for the sake of discussion. I'll agree that human beings are complex and they could have any self-contradiction. On the other hand, this does give me fodder on why Homura will ask that question though.

It could be Homura was hoping against hope that this would be the rare times which Madoka would not rise to the occasion. Thus, the question even if she strongly suspect that it would not be a favorable answer.

And thus her decision, even hearing the confirmation, shows how much invested she is on this.


PS. Triple, could you please confirm your interpretation of LAW for the sake of this discussion. If Homura's question regarding LAW isn't duty or good of everyone to paraphrase, what is it? You said it isn't equal to good of everyone but the preceding example was self-sacrifice...

... We might be arguing on different tangent. lol. So could you define it, for me? Pretty please with cookie on top? ^^

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by night_sentinel

Its always nice to hear your opinion even if I'm in the opposite side?

Well, thank you. It's nice to hear your opinion as well.

*whisper* Its a pretty nice book end/beginning for SHAFT. (but let's focus on IC reasons).

I do like the symmetry with the repeating hallway confrontations here, which does give the work a nice "going full circle" feeling. But I always like having an IC explanation for things as well.

I would be hardpressed to find someone I know who has working knowledge of the series who will answer that "Madoka will choose Desire on Homura's questions."

Actually, Madoka never struck me as particularly Lawful in the TV series. I mean, going by D&D moral alignments, I'm not sure I'd classify Madoka as "Lawful Good". I think I'd lean towards "Neutral Good". At least prior to the rise of Madokami.

Let's say Madoka was switched with Maid Marian. Would she chide Robin Hood for going against the law? Would she say this?: "You should respect the law of Prince John, and the law of the Sheriff of Nottingham, and the more essential law against thievery. We must do this even if it goes against our desires for ourselves and our loved ones."

I'm honestly not sure. I think I could see her supporting Robin Hood and his band of merry men, even as they were thieving from Madoka's rich friend, Hitomi, and giving to her poor friend, Sayaka.


That being said, being Madokami might have changed this. Being a Law unto yourself could well make someone more Lawful in their thinking.

But, I do realize that yes, Madoka did not specifically say good of other people. And yes, you can take that literally. If so, Madoka is endorsing LAW over DESIRES. Following this train of though, Madoka upholds the Law even if certain people suffers for it which is what I'll get from that.

Then, this means, Madoka's contention in Season 2 would be because Homura broke the system to give happiness to individuals.

Yes, I think this could be part of Homura's concern. That Madoka will hold "breaking the system" against her just like Sayaka did. And if Madoka holds that against her, then well, they really are enemies then.

It could be Homura was hoping against hope that this would be the rare times which Madoka would not rise to the occasion. Thus, the question even if she strongly suspect that it would not be a favorable answer.

I can probably agree with that. Perhaps this is an acceptable middle ground between my take and Kazu-kun's.

PS. Triple, could you please confirm your interpretation of LAW for the sake of this discussion. If Homura's question regarding LAW isn't duty or good of everyone to paraphrase, what is it?

The concept of Law is a very difficult concept. Lots of philosophers have different takes on it.

Just think of what "Lawful" means in the D&D moral alignments. That's probably a reasonably good standard to go with.

"Law" isn't necessarily "for the greater good". It's about valuing order and structure and consistency and balance and equilibrium.

One could argue that Homura's universe has made some people happier, but thrown things out of whack; out of balance. A very lawful person may well not be content with that.

[night_sentinel]

Did we just reached a middle ground? Somehow I'm strangely sad. Weird. It was too short. ^^
And Madokami, it looked like we were arguing different tangents. AWW.

So you took the law vs. desire question literally. And I took it as good of others vs. oneself specifically Madoka's good. Following your tangent. Then, Homura would be unsure of the Law vs. desire question. Would Madoka approve of this world that broke the system, Madoka's own law even if Homura made some people happier?

Ok. Using that question, I can see Homura not knowing that answer specially since I agreed that Madoka is not a static character and thus might be affected by her experience as Madokami (living law).

On the other hand, I took that question and interpreted it in the context of the movie as a good of a the puella magi (law) vs. Madoka's personal happiness (desire). Using that question, I thought it was no brainer that Madoka's answer would be good of the a ridiculous amount of people (All the Puella Magi in history).

Anyway, I digress. This started with the question if Homura knows Madoka's answer in the Law vs. Desire. And Madoka answered Law.

I can also live with this middle ground, Homura strongly suspected the answer but there was a tiny hope in her heart that Madoka will answer differently. ^^

[MYWA]

I think it's important to link relate to the parallels of the flower fields scene and that penultimate scene in the school hallway. For one thing, Homura shows the same kind of surprised expression in both scenes.

I would agree that Homura is surprised by both Madoka's powers and her answer. But in different ways. Clearly, Madoka manifesting her god mode powers was not in Homura's plans, and it's just a startling thing to see anyway. When she is able to calm Madoka down a little and asks her the law/desire question., her surprise is deepened by Madoka's answer, and seems mingled with a tinge of the despair she expressed in the flower field when she says she feels like she never truly knew Madoka at all. But even in the flower fields, Homura contradicts Madoka's claim that leaving people behind would be too much for her to bear. The thing is, a question like that, even Madoka doesn't quite know herself too well on that particular issue, in much the same way that Ep 1 Madoka likely had no idea she had it in her to become ultra badass Madoka in Ep 12.

However, Homura has always, at least on some level, known that Madoka will choose "law" (i.e., she will sacrifice herself for what she thinks is right) over "desire" when confronted with the choice. Homura's known it since the first timeline in Ep 10 when Madoka fights Walpurgis Night despite her pleadings, and she has always been dismayed at the fact. What surprises her in the flower fields is just how much Madoka has to lose because of how much she cherishes her life and the people in it. This has been a recurring theme from the very first episode of the series ("Do you treasure the life you currently live?"). Conversely, what surprises her in the hallway scene is just how much Madoka will strive towards "law" despite her feelings, despite what she herself had said. At the end of the day, Homura seems to have to protect Madoka not from Walpurgis Night, or becoming a witch, or even stupid friggin' Kyubey; she has to protect Madoka from her own damn self, and by the end of Rebellion, Homura makes it pretty clear that she's sick of her sh!t.

Also, I don't think Homura went insane, or even that anything even snapped in her mind for any length of time. She simply made a rational choice based on her convictions. It's kind of (but to a rather lesser degree) like how I it annoys me a bit when people say Mami went insane upon finding out magical girls become witches in Ep 10. No - it makes every sense in the world that someone like Mami, who has a kind of motherly affectation about her and puts a lot of stock in doing the right thing and protecting people from witches would wish to euthanise magical girls before they become witches, herself included (it's basically a...cruder version of what Madoka finally gets to accomplish with her wish), and I feel like to not understand that is to not understand Mami at all. Similarly, though it's more opaque in Homura's case, she merely took advantage of an opportunity that opened itself to her and used it to recreate the universe her own way, revealing that Homura the stoic is deep down a hedonist.

[AuraTwilight]

Actually, Madoka never struck me as particularly Lawful in the TV series. I mean, going by D&D moral alignments, I'm not sure I'd classify Madoka as "Lawful Good". I think I'd lean towards "Neutral Good". At least prior to the rise of Madokami.

This is pretty much my take on the issue. In my mind, Madoka was Neutral Good, then became a Lawful Good goddess. I choose to believe that while she was Neutral Good again in Homura's dream world, she's Lawful Good as a mortal in the ending.

...And that might be something that will catch Homura in upset in season 2. The Madoka she pulled out of the Law of Cycles isn't the one she tried to bring back, even if lit's like...95% similar or whatever.

Homura, meanwhile, is pretty much Chaotic Neutral at this point, and is starting to gain a tendency towards possible evil.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by night_sentinel

Did we just reached a middle ground? Somehow I'm strangely sad. Weird. It was too short. ^^

The discussion might not end hear. I'm still curious to see if Kazu-kun or Monoriu or anybody else have anything to write in reply to either your posts or mine or both (mind you, the Christmas season is coming, so I might not be here much over the next few days).

You're willing to meet me half-way here, and I appreciate that. But other people might not consider this an acceptable compromise, and if not, there could be some more back-and-forth to have.


There's also MYWA's post that offers up an interesting theory itself. Rather than a compromise, his theory seems at my first glance to be a carefully calibrated fusion between the different sides of this discussion (or, if not quite that, then a theory that he carefully designed to be palatable to the different sides of this discussion). So it's an interesting theory that I want to think about for a bit.

And Madokami, it looked like we were arguing different tangents. AWW.

I think Homura was holding out some faint hope that Americanized Madoka might agree with Homura's own Revolutionary War of Independence.

Speaking of which, I finally see a possible motive for Homura making Madoka a transfer student from America. Maybe Homura was hoping that lengthy exposure to a national culture that stresses LIBERTY and FREEDOM and THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS might make Madoka more comfortable pursuing her own liberty, freedom, and personal happiness.

A bit of a stretch, I'll certainly admit, but I kind of like the idea.

Then, Homura would be unsure of the Law vs. desire question. Would Madoka approve of this world that broke the system, Madoka's own law even if Homura made some people happier?

I think that's probably in the back of Homura's mind, yes.

I can also live with this middle ground, Homura strongly suspected the answer but there was a tiny hope in her heart that Madoka will answer differently. ^^

I'm glad we can agree on this middle ground. My view is that Homura would have been overjoyed at Madoka answering "Desires" because that means that Madoka would support what Homura is doing. Homura doesn't need that support, she's going to go through with this anyway, but it would have been comforting for her to think "If Madoka knew the truth, she'd still support me anyway!"


@AuraTwilight - Yeah, I think you're probably right. While caught in Kyubey's machines, and with her memories transferred to Sayaka, Madoka was essentially back to being the girl she was prior to making her final timeline wish. But once freed from Kyubey's machines, that changed.

However, I'm not sure which of the three Chaotics I'd class Homura in, though she is one of them.

[Monoriu]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

No, there's plenty of new points that I'm raising here.


In any event, here's one of the main reasons I dislike your interpretation. In my view, it strips Homura of her humanity. It's only human to have at least some doubts about the desires and wishes and choices of other people, even people that we love and know well. And I like how Homura, in this movie, speaks to that human fallibility that we all have.

What I see with Homura in this movie is a very human person, wrote well, who is trying hard to determine what it is that her most cherished person truly wants, and would make her happy. I find that very emotionally compelling. Much moreso than a person with supposedly complete confidence about another person, but she keeps displaying doubt and uncertainty (through her actions and questions) anyway.

In my interpretation of Homura, I see an impressively loyal and caring person trying her best to reach the person she loves, and trying to understand that person, and doing all she can to help that person as she sees it. In your interpretation of Homura, I see a walking contradiction - A person with complete confidence, but who acts nothing of the kind.

Look, I don't think I used the word "complete". I simply said Homura knew Madoka, and she knew Madoka would answer "law". It is you who keep adding the word "complete" to the discussion. You are making it more black and white than it needs to be.

I consider myself a big Homura fan, and my posts have made that clear. I don't think my interpretation of Homura on this aspect strips her of her humanity. I find it hard to believe that after all these timeloops that she went through, she would be surprised by Madoka's "law" answer. Evidence:

Timeline 1: Madoka chose death over Homura's pleas to flee

EP5, alley scene: Madoka chose to help Sayaka, just after Mami's death, knowing that magical girls do die in battle.

EP8, bench scene: Madoka again chose to help Sayaka, knowing that magical girls are zombies. Homura said it right there: Madoka was too self-sacrificial.

EP11: hug scene: Madoka tried to persuade Homura to let her become a magical girl and fight together, knowing that magical girls eventually become witches

EP12: Madoka chose to become a deity, knowing it will erase herself from existance.

Flower fields scene: Homura said so herself. She knew it for a fact that Madoka would always choose her duties over her desires. Again, I feel necessary to repost this line "Even knowing how hard it will be, you have the courage to make that decision. When you know there is something only you can do, you are much kinder and stronger than you realize yourself." Homura knew right there and then that Madoka would choose her duties. I know you have responded to it, but just because you have responded to it doesn't invalidate it. I feel that conversation is a heart-to-heart one, not Homura putting up a brave face. Homura likes to put on brave faces, yes, but not in front of Madoka. Homura tried to put on a brave face in EP11 hug scene. She totally broke down eventually.

Madoka consistently chose her duties over her own welfare, and Homura expressed on more than one occasion that she knew that aspect of Madoka well. Accepting the theory that Homura was surprised by Madoka's law answer would mean that Homura barely knew Madoka after all the timeloops. I find that hard to believe.

I can also live with this middle ground, Homura strongly suspected the answer but there was a tiny hope in her heart that Madoka will answer differently.

Agreed. I can live with this as well.

[AuraTwilight]

@AuraTwilight - Yeah, I think you're probably right. While caught in Kyubey's machines, and with her memories transferred to Sayaka, Madoka was essentially back to being the girl she was prior to making her final timeline wish. But once freed from Kyubey's machines, that changed.

However, I'm not sure which of the three Chaotics I'd class Homura in, though she is one of them.

Going by how D&D defines it, Good is sacrificing yourself for the good of others (not just a single person; Homura's investment in Madoka is too selfish to qualify), and Evil is harming others for self-benefit. So she's Neutral, definitely, because she's not either extreme.

However, in D&D, the forces of Law, Chaos, Good, and Evil are objective cosmic forces outside of subjective interpretation, and by those definitions, Homura is decidingly, inarguably Evil because her actions diminish the universe of a tremendous force of Good, regardless of how she justifies it. I consider her obvious self-loathing and her motivations of pure love and compassion for the person closest to her to mellow her out to Chaotic Neutral (Evil-Leaning).

For pure trivia, in the default D&D universe, people of Homura's estimated alignment go to Pandemonium when they die, an Outer Plane composed of neverending cavernous labyrinths full of howling winds that drive the residents mad. The River Styx begins here, and the four layers of the plane represent Lamentation, Grief, Loss, and Isolation.

You can't tell me that isn't Homura right now.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Monoriu

Look, I don't think I used the word "complete". I simply said Homura knew Madoka, and she knew Madoka would answer "law". It is you who keep adding the word "complete" to the discussion. You are making it more black and white than it needs to be.

No, I'm not. "Know" is an inherently back and white term, and that's the term that you and Kazu-kun have insisted on using. You either know something, or you don't. With knowing, there is no room for any doubt whatsoever.

"Know" does not leave any room for "Homura strongly suspected the answer but there was a tiny hope in her heart that Madoka will answer differently."

I'll admit that I'm being a bit semantically strict here, but it's because I think that very specific word choice is important when evaluating characters.


But anyway, I'll put the other points we've made aside, at least for now, since you expressed acceptance of the compromise that night_sentinel and I have arrived at.

[Monoriu]

Originally Posted by AuraTwilight

For pure trivia, in the default D&D universe, people of Homura's estimated alignment go to Pandemonium when they die, an Outer Plane composed of neverending cavernous labyrinths full of howling winds that drive the residents mad. The River Styx begins here, and the four layers of the plane represent Lamentation, Grief, Loss, and Isolation.

You can't tell me that isn't Homura right now.

That's very interesting to know. The more I think about it, the more I like the way they portray Homura at the end of the movie. She is fundamentally a decent person who made a conscious decision to put the personal happiness of one person above everything else. She is nice enough to feel guilty about the downsides of her decision, determined enough not to waver when Madoka tells her she will choose law over desire, and tough enough that she feels necessary to put on her usual badass posture.

[MYWA]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

There's also MYWA's post that offers up an interesting theory itself. Rather than a compromise, his theory seems at my first glance to be a carefully calibrated fusion between the different sides of this discussion (or, if not quite that, then a theory that he carefully designed to be palatable to the different sides of this discussion). So it's an interesting theory that I want to think about for a bit.

I do try to please, I suppose. In any case, we all seem to be on the same page generally regarding Homura's motivations and views.

Originally Posted by Monoriu

That's very interesting to know. The more I think about it, the more I like the way they portray Homura at the end of the movie. She is fundamentally a decent person who made a conscious decision to put the personal happiness of one person above everything else. She is nice enough to feel guilty about the downsides of her decision, determined enough not to waver when Madoka tells her she will choose law over desire, and tough enough that she feels necessary to put on her usual badass posture.

I don't often like to speculate about what I anticipate will happen or should happen in a given series, but it seems, at least from my standpoint, going forward the show's task would have to include convincing us why the old boss was better than the new boss. Because from where I'm sitting, new boss's universe mostly rocks (apart from creepy familiars throwing tomatoes everywhere and the tiny matter of Madoka getting screwed over) and it hits all the fan service beats.

[Monoriu]

小池一夫：小圓如果有續篇，沙耶香有可能成為主角嗎？

虛淵玄：沙耶香在劇場版處於非常特別的位置，所以有可能成為孤高的英雄（主角），可以與焰對抗的只有沙耶香 了。

Gen Urobuchi just did an interview on the movie. I can only find the Chinese version of the transcript. Here is my translation attempt on the most important question -

Interviewer: If there is a sequel, will Sayaka become the protagonist?

Urobuchi: Sayaka is in a unique position in the movie. It is indeed possible that she may become a lone hero (protagonist). She is the only one who can counter Homura.

I don't often like to speculate about what I anticipate will happen or should happen in a given series, but it seems, at least from my standpoint, going forward the show's task would have to include convincing us why the old boss was better than the new boss. Because from where I'm sitting, new boss's universe mostly rocks (apart from creepy familiars throwing tomatoes everywhere and the tiny matter of Madoka getting screwed over) and it hits all the fan service beats.

Agree. I think there has to be a price for all the miracles that Homura performed. Maybe the law of circles is totally broken and offscreen magical girls suffer. Maybe Homura needs energy of some sort, and she needs to collect such energy, somehow. Maybe the world needs Homura's personal attention to sustain itself, and the effort will exhaust Homura soon (devil Homura's eyes seem very tired to me). Maybe all of the above. I think we can safely assume that Homura's world is unsustainable, otherwise there really is no reason why anyone wants to revert to Madokami's world. Homura being Homura, she will hide her worries, deal with them herself in the most determined manner possible, and resort to extreme measures along the way.

[Sayaka Rei]

Gen Urobuchi just did an interview on the movie. I can only find the Chinese version of the transcript. Here is my translation attempt on the most important question -

Interviewer: If there is a sequel, will Sayaka become the protagonist?

Urobuchi: Sayaka is in a unique position in the movie. It is indeed possible that she may become a lone hero (protagonist). She is the only one who can counter Homura.

If this storyline will take place, I think that I'll love this series as I loved the first! Of course we are still far from knowing what actually could happen ... Moreover for now I do not find many opportunities for advancement in the plot without her intervention ...

[woxx]

Don't know if anyone posted http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2013-12-07

After Rebellion, do you have any plans for the Madoka franchise in the future?

Iwakami: No, we don't have any plans. The world of Madoka is great, and I love all the characters, so personally, if we have a great plot scenario, I personally would love to make something else Madoka. But at this point, as of right now, we don't have any official plans.

The possibility of contination is very very vague.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by woxx

Don't know if anyone posted http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2013-12-07

After Rebellion, do you have any plans for the Madoka franchise in the future?

Iwakami: No, we don't have any plans. The world of Madoka is great, and I love all the characters, so personally, if we have a great plot scenario, I personally would love to make something else Madoka. But at this point, as of right now, we don't have any official plans.

The possibility of contination is very very vague.

How I take this:

1. They'll likely do more Madoka Magica at some point, but they haven't decided what direction they're going to go with it yet. Before they make more, they'll want to have a "great plot scenario" to go with.

2. It'll be at least two years, and probably three, before we get more Madoka Magica.

[Tyabann]

With that ending there is no way there won't be a continuation.
The entire point of Rebellion is to give the series a point to continue from, so...
Take what he says with a grain of salt, if there was anything it's not like he could confirm otherwise yet.

[speedyexpress48]

There's no way there isn't going to be a continuation; that ending makes it impossible, and Madoka is one of SHAFT's ultimate cash cows. However, they don't have any plans for where that will go...yet.