Signature of the Month Contest Generic Discussion Thread

[KiNA]

Very well then, I'll see to it until you've return.

Yoroshiku onegaishimassu minna

[Solace]

If you check the opening post of this thread, I've edited it to start the FAQ that's been on hold forever. I've started some early questions/answers, but if there's anything that you guys think should be added, please post them.

@cicido - I was going to put that wall you made to use, but it won't load for me. If you are still interested I can add it to the FAQ.

[Marina]

It seems to me that lately in the sotm entry thread, there has been discord. What would be the best thing to do when certain individuals seem to be there for trouble, or simply just can't help but put others down? This competition is not soley for the entry of high-level sigs, and I don't ever feel the impulse to belittle someone else's work whether they be a beginner or not just because I feel like some 'elitist' that sees their work as a waste of time. This kind of competition is all about improvement and support and most importantly: having fun. I've been seeing this sort of rude behavior lately and it makes me irritated that I can't really do anything about it; however, the people in question don't really break the rules either, but continuously justify his/her actions in a way that makes it difficult to pinpoint the problem and fix it.

To what extent would such a situation have to escalate before someone is forced to kick like person from the competition?

[KickHopper]

Personally, I would say when the person being criticized by the elitist is actually offended by what the person is saying and contacts an admin or something. Every person is different as I, for one, have developed a tough shell on the internetz, especially in the tagging community.

You just have to learn to ignore some of it and look at the criticism that benefits your improvement.

[KiNA]

Originally Posted by Marina

It seems to me that lately in the sotm entry thread, there has been discord. What would be the best thing to do when certain individuals seem to be there for trouble, or simply just can't help but put others down? This competition is not soley for the entry of high-level sigs, and I don't ever feel the impulse to belittle someone else's work whether they be a beginner or not just because I feel like some 'elitist' that sees their work as a waste of time. This kind of competition is all about improvement and support and most importantly: having fun. I've been seeing this sort of rude behavior lately and it makes me irritated that I can't really do anything about it; however, the people in question don't really break the rules either, but continuously justify his/her actions in a way that makes it difficult to pinpoint the problem and fix it.

To what extent would such a situation have to escalate before someone is forced to kick like person from the competition?

I know who you refering too.. and as much as I hate it, I flexed my rep muscle on the said person just to remind him. I treat every one here as my family and I dont tolerate peoples making fun just because they thought their skills justified them.

Other then that, just tag the offending post as rude comment and let the mods deals with it.

I dont think kicking them from the competition will do anything, the best I say let them, we have a unique taste in voting. What may look good for them may not so to our eyes and they will taste defeat if they fail to adjust to the crowd here.

[Ice Climbers]

Yes, I have sensed such a ruckus on the thread these days, and as KiNA said, there isnt much to deal with this. Umm, well what can I say..to a certain extent constructive criticisms are welcome because they help the improving of one's skills but destructive criticisms are not appreciated, but there is not much to be done here other then marking it as an offensive post.

I think kicking them off would not help either, adding on to what KiNA said, because that just defeats the purpose of our rule of letting everybody join in the SOTM.

[escimo]

I was a bit sorry to see those posts in the submit thread. I've liked the fact that people here have so far been quite capable of giving constructive criticism. Not that I'm afraid that it isn't going to go on as so.

It's a bit sad when someones forget that constructive criticism is called constructive criticism because it's supposed to be constructive. (did I say constructive many times enough?) Because if the criticism isn't constructive it's just bashing and that helps absolutely no one. I've enjoyed my stay here because of the lack of raving loons so I was actually considering popping the cherry of my ignore list.

Play nice kids, pretty please.

[KiNA]

Just for the record.. there's 6 constructive word in your post.. Very constructive post from a constructive person I must say

[Solace]

I'll comment on this more later, but for now I wanted to point out how the contest handles such issues according to the rules:

Every month, a new entry thread is created. Each month's entry thread is a central spot meant to give contestants a chance to create and improve their entries as well as their skills, in addition to providing them a place to post their official submissions.

The thread is solely about helping contestants with entries, and as such these things will not be tolerated:

1. Nonconstructive and negative criticism (if you truly dislike something about an entry, be polite and helpful)

2. Comments, questions, or complaints about General SOTM affairs

3. Flaming, trolling, and other uncivil behavior that breaks Forum Rules

Anyone disrupting the thread will be asked to take it privately, to the SOTM Generic Discussion Thread, or if the offense is severe enough - reported to the moderators.

Bold is mine. For now, the matter is resolved....but I'll make a statement about this particular issue in a bit.

[Solace]

Originally Posted by Marina

To what extent would such a situation have to escalate before someone is forced to kick like person from the competition?

Since I don't have any idea on what was actually said, I can't remove the person from the contest. But suffice to say, for future reference it would have to be something completely uncalled for - a comment that did nothing but insult another member.

Originally Posted by KickHopper

Personally, I would say when the person being criticized by the elitist is actually offended by what the person is saying and contacts an admin or something. Every person is different as I, for one, have developed a tough shell on the internetz, especially in the tagging community.

You just have to learn to ignore some of it and look at the criticism that benefits your improvement.

Yeah, we're the weird community. I figured my first post about that in the entry thread should have made the point clear...guess not.

Originally Posted by KiNA

Other then that, just tag the offending post as rude comment and let the mods deals with it.

Right. Go through the proper channels. Contact myself and the moderators, don't get stuck in the middle of a flame fest. This goes for anyone who thinks there's a problem.

Originally Posted by Ice Climbers

I think kicking them off would not help either, adding on to what KiNA said, because that just defeats the purpose of our rule of letting everybody join in the SOTM.

The person in question will not be removed, for the moment. But if the person is a persistent trouble maker they will be prevented from participating, yes.

Originally Posted by escimo

I was a bit sorry to see those posts in the submit thread. I've liked the fact that people here have so far been quite capable of giving constructive criticism. Not that I'm afraid that it isn't going to go on as so.

It's a bit sad when someones forget that constructive criticism is called constructive criticism because it's supposed to be constructive. (did I say constructive many times enough?) Because if the criticism isn't constructive it's just bashing and that helps absolutely no one. I've enjoyed my stay here because of the lack of raving loons so I was actually considering popping the cherry of my ignore list.

Play nice kids, pretty please.

Constructively creating competent criticism can curtail creative crashes. Say that five times fast! (and yes, good points all around)



Now, for the rest of the post.




/gets on podium

It's the nature of competition to bring out the best and worst in people. While I do try to make the contest as open, friendly, and fair as possible it is inevitable that some will find issue with how things are done.

Something I want all potential competitors to know, is that this community is not like other art communities. We don't flame people. We don't call them noobs, or tell them they should reconsider their efforts because the creation is terrible, etc.

What we do is say nothing if we can't say something nice. Now, constructive criticism doesn't have to be all sunshine and flowers. Sometimes being "mean" or "insensitive" to an artist is important to the criticism.

But choose your words carefully. If you have to point out something negative, point out something positive as well. If you have to point out how they need this added touch here, compliment them on their choice of something else they've done. If the whole work is a mess from your perspective, offer technical advice. Mention that you think the style is interesting (a good word to use when you don't want to sound enthused), but that (insert technical things here) might help the piece out because (insert reason here).

Remember to show courtesy and respect. It sounds silly, especially on the internet where everyone can be a moron and generally get away with it, but if you want people to treat you well, you must do the same for them. People are more receptive to kindness - even if it's hollow but well intentioned as it generally is when people are anonymous.

I say these things, not because I wish to single people out. I say them because I want people to be here, to stay here, to be happy with the things they do and to share those things with the rest of us. That's the real point of a community.

This community is full of artists of many kinds, from all walks of life and experiences. If you take a bit to appreciate the variety of art we do here, you might come away with more than one might expect.

Remember the two most important rules in life:

1. Keep plugging away at it. Even insurmountable challenges and epic failures can provide great lessons and benefits.

2. Stay humble. No matter how good you are, there's always someone better.

Enjoy the community and the SOTM. But remember your roots. Everyone was a noobie at some point.

Thank you.


/gets off podium

[Ice Climbers]

*clap clap clap clap*

[KiNA]

I suggest we enforced a bit strictly for dateline submission on the next SotM.. Even if you didnt have the time to create the voting thread yet, send a pm to NW to close the thread first or just post a little short notice that entry phase over and we will not accept entries past that post.

While this contest are unofficial, I prefer that we at least prepare them for dateline crunch.. I dont know how schools/college are in other part of the world, but mine are quite strict and I sort of get use in beating dateline because failure to adhere to it are most of the time, severe. And the habit are actually very beneficial in working environment

[Solace]

Originally Posted by KiNA

I suggest we enforced a bit strictly for dateline submission on the next SotM.. Even if you didnt have the time to create the voting thread yet, send a pm to NW to close the thread first or just post a little short notice that entry phase over and we will not accept entries past that post.

It wasn't a matter of time. I purposely set the dates to allow for last minute submissions due to time zone differences. I believe this is the first month I've ever extended the date to right before the Voting thread is up.

I have told contestants no, in previous contests.

While this contest are unofficial, I prefer that we at least prepare them for dateline crunch.. I dont know how schools/college are in other part of the world, but mine are quite strict and I sort of get use in beating dateline because failure to adhere to it are most of the time, severe. And the habit are actually very beneficial in working environment

I understand what you mean. Exceptions like this month are rare, specifically so people don't get used to the idea that "I can be as late as I want because Solace will let me in anyway".

[Solace]

~SOTM DECEMBER EVENT DISCUSSION~

**cracks fingers** lets do this.

It's hard to believe it, but the SOTM has been running for almost a year now. So, I think it's time to celebrate the end of the year with a little bit of a bang. So, here's some ideas I'm working on:

1. The SOTM will be suspended for the month of December while this celebration occurs.

2. The winner of the November contest will be able to choose the theme for the January contest.

3. I want this to be big.

4. A different set of rules will apply to this celebration.

5. The theme for the celebration will be decided by the community.

I've heard some suggestions for a banner contest. I'd like to explore this idea further. Keep in mind however that any banner contest that we'd wish to have displayed at the top of the forums would need to be approved by the moderators. If there's a consensus that we would want to have such a contest we would have to appeal to them.

We could also run an independent banner contest - something like the top 10 entries would be rotated in the SOTM monthly threads for the next year.

I'm sure there are other ideas of what we could do, so please add your thoughts and suggestions! The reason I'm starting this now is so that we have time to iron out any plans before December actually arrives.

[KiNA]

1. Talk to the mods and replace it with banner contest.
2. No problem whatsoever with this
3. Very vague to be honest.. How big? We invade GD for more exposure?
4. Lets use banner contest rule.. 3 entries per contestant @.@
5. If (1) accepted then its the mod's decision for theme?

[Solace]

Originally Posted by KiNA

1. Talk to the mods and replace it with banner contest.
2. No problem whatsoever with this
3. Very vague to be honest.. How big? We invade GD for more exposure?
4. Lets use banner contest rule.. 3 entries per contestant @.@
5. If (1) accepted then its the mod's decision for theme?

1. I won't propose anything to the mods until things are more concrete. They'll want specifics.

2. Seems fair

3. Nah, not invading. I don't want it to be disruptive, just open to more people than the usual FC traffic. Builds awareness for the SOTM, and things are more fun when more people are involved. ^^

4. If we go with the banner contest idea we'll just rip the rules from previous banner contests.

5. Most likely it will be a proposal of ideas that will be narrowed down with the moderators saying "this works, this doesn't".

[KiNA]

Which is why the (1) would be important to sort out first.. Banner contest is one idea, no idea on what else to do . We could also think big and do a graphic theme for the forum, but that requires more then just graphic knowledge. Of course we need the majority consensus first.

And the invade GD section is a tongue in cheek suggestion. Of course we just make one thread in GD and ask for a sticky status for the whole duration of it

[Daniel E.]

Originally Posted by Solace

1. I won't propose anything to the mods until things are more concrete. They'll want specifics.

Well, you could always ask them if the door is open for a new competition.

Beyond that, is the matter of the prize (not needed IMHO), the theme (anything that could work for a long period of time) and the rules, wich would end up being the same ones from before as you just mentioned.

A little thread to see how interested people actually is could help too. (although, this one could help just as well. )

[Solace]

Originally Posted by Daniel E.

Well, you could always ask them if the door is open for a new competition.

Well, yeah. I'm not saying that asking them is out of the question, just that since we have no real plan for *what* we want to do, it's kind of pointless for now to move in any direction until we've ironed out what we'd like to do, and then propose that. At least an outline, I figure. I think they'd be more apt to consider a proposal if there was an idea and a show of interest behind it.

That said, the banner contest idea isn't a bad one, but it does come with problems. Banner contests tend to have high turn outs, which is good, but they also run longer because of the high turn out. For instance, our Sky contest that was run last year went on for almost two months and had three separate threads. Anything that involves changing the forum would require moderator/admin involvement and approval as well. And the theme would be held to stricter standards - it would have to be something that would have lasting appeal for months, unless banner contests became more regular (which they tend not to be because of the effort involved in organizing them).

On the other hand, there are some other ideas would could explore. Here's a few I've been entertaining in addition to the one we're discussing:

1. The SOTM banner. Not as glorious as being at the top of the forums, but each month could feature a different winner from December.

2. A "no limits" SOTM. Relax the limits on the size and dimensions of the entries but with the condition that the entries could not be used as forum signatures.

3. A "no theme" SOTM. Basically let people make whatever signature they want. This could be rolled into the "no limits" SOTM though, I suppose.

4. A dual theme SOTM. Basically, create two themes and have sign ups to create two teams, one for each theme. Have two voting phases. The first voting phase, people pick the best entry from each team. The second voting phase, pit the entries against each other.

I'd really like to hear ideas though. I don't care how silly they are, we can fine tune them as we go. They can't be any worse than my crappy suggestions.

[markesellus]

The banner contest sounds cool but it seems like it would be a bit of a hassle to get going. I like some of the other ideas though.
I think no limits/no theme would be kind of fun because

1. It forces people to use their imagination
2. You can see what people will come up with without a theme to base it on.
3. You don't have to worry about all the technical stuff.

Also The dual theme sounds cool. Kind of like Battle of the Sigs. Lol. How are we going to decide the two themes though? With the winners from the previous month and then the winner from December picks January?