Nanoha - StrikerS - Episode 19 Discussion / Poll

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight.

What do you mean? When you can fly, you can blast floors and ceilings as well.
See episode 1.

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

AND, wouldn't want to hit poor, little, innocent, mistreated Vivio.

In episode 12, it's stated that Vivio can survive a direct blast from Dieci's cannon.

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by Nightengale

Well, I just hope Nanoha actually suffers

Sigh... You're as low as Jail.

Originally Posted by Nightengale

I mean, A's had them talking about how cartridges and Full Drive may cause heavy strain blah blah stuff that are supposed to make us worry for them within those 13 episodes

Nope, stuff that explains why Nanoha didn't use her big badass attacks before episode 11.
That way, she was at Vita's level during most of the series, and at Reinforce's level when needed.

A dangerous tool is not one that will surely harm you, but one that isn't to be used unless you have no choice and are ready to take the risk. This was explained by Signum in StrikerS ep 9.

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by Fabien

What do you mean? When you can fly, you can blast floors and ceilings as well.
See episode 1.

"Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight." By C2F.

A 3-dimensional maze is more complex than a 2-dimensional one. There would be alot more possibilities to the right answer. Going straight isn't the absolute answer.

See Logic.

Originally Posted by Fabien

In episode 12, it's stated that Vivio can survive a direct blast from Dieci's cannon.

Yes, and Nanoha knows this through divine intervention.

You have a habit of not looking from characters' point of view, haven't you.... With this, and back with Vivio strapped onto the table.

[Nightengale]

Originally Posted by Fabien

Sigh... You're as low as Jail.

Well, sorry for that. For your information, I LOVE seeing main characters going through an emotional and physical mind-fuckish hell before obtaining their happy ending.

I thrive in happiness obtained from suffering. For now, Nanoha's suffer-level hasn't filled my quota, though Vivio had contributed a lot. Much less needs to be said about some other characters, but since Nanoha is the title character and the one linked to "so-called strains", and a deeper emotional bond to the plot-device that ties StrikerS just like how S1 was Fate/Alicia/Precia and A's was Hayate/Reinforce, I want to be hopeful.

[An Hero in Disguise]

Originally Posted by Fabien

Freid's surprised look at 10:35 is priceless

Spoiler for size:

I demand a shop of the words "O RLY?" at the second pic!!!

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by Nightengale

Well, sorry for that. For your information, I LOVE seeing main characters going through an emotional and physical mind-fuckish hell before obtaining their happy ending.

Yup, exactly like Jail, except that he might not have the same definition of "happy ending".

I'm completely the opposite: I really like it when nothing bad is happening. That's why Card Captor Sakura is the anime series I like the most.

The MGLN staff knows that, and created different episodes to fit our different needs

[An Hero in Disguise]

Originally Posted by Fabien

Yup, exactly like Jail, except that he might not have the same definition of "happy ending".

I'm completely the opposite: I really like it when nothing bad is happening. That's why Card Captor Sakura is the anime series I like the most.

The MGLN staff knows that, and created different episodes to fit our different needs

It's no fun when nothing really bad happens, I like the feeling when it's uncertain if any of the main characters sees the ending at all. So I completely support Nightengale's point of view.

MGLN staff is overprotective imho. They're afraid to let even the minor characters die.

[Jimmy C]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

"Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight."

When you are at the starting point, know the direction of your destination, can fly and have the firepower to blow away all obstructions in your path, the problem is still reduced to a straight line.
Of course, that only works if they know exactly which room she's in, so they can avoid blowing it up. Otherwise, can't blow away multiple walls with one shot, too risky.

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by Fabien

Yup, exactly like Jail, except that he might not have the same definition of "happy ending".

I'm completely the opposite: I really like it when nothing bad is happening. That's why Card Captor Sakura is the anime series I like the most.

The MGLN staff knows that, and created different episodes to fit our different needs

a kind of "childish" way of thought but what the heck ~ we all like different things and i do admit that i would just love to see nanoha get beaten up (the girl has been haxx all her life >.> not counting that accident but that is all in the past...)

problem with this series is that it can hardly be called "mahou shoujo" while it was for S2 and S2 ~ i would just like it better if the producers realised that the girls have grown up enough to face some real disasters...so fars its going good but im not sure if they are willing to push it that much further...

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

It's no fun when nothing really bad happens

Anybody can make an interesting anime by making characters suffer.
But making a good anime where nothing bad happens, requires real talent.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

, I like the feeling when it's uncertain if any of the main characters sees the ending at all. So I completely support Nightengale's point of view.

It seems that there are two kind of viewers: those who are interested in the story, and those who are interested in the characters. You seem to be more in the first category; I'm definitely completely in the second one.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

MGLN staff is overprotective imho. They're afraid to let even the minor characters die.

Yup, for guys like me, who care about the characters.

In a war anime, when the Good Side wins, all's fine, even if dozens of characters were killed in the process. If possible, the hero (if any) should be alive, but that's all.

But Riot Force 6 just doesn't feel like a military division. It's more like a family. So if anyone is dead, there can't be a happy ending. Everything's fine inbetween (characters too hurt to have an active part anymore, Fate being tortured by her own mother, Reinforce slowly killing Hayate from the inside and hating herself for it, Ginga brainwashed, Vivio in a not-so-comfortable position and Nanoha forced to watch, etc.), but you have to have a true happy end, with every Good Guy and every redeemable Bad Guy alive, happy and friendly.

[johnjefferson3]

appearly jail is so evil that it looks like he made, the creators of the strikers website forget to renew their domain name, it was working yeasterday but for at least the next 12 hours,it now leads to something totally differnet, but yes, it still is www.nanoha.com, i would like to get your opion on what in the hell is going on, but this is really dissapointing news to hear though, i hope at least someone copied all the numbers information in graphic form!!!!

p.s from looking from the prewiew and with the next fgew epsiodes allready named, it looks like the main battle is going to start alot eailer than people though, and will start to speed up dramatically right now!!!!!

[arkhangelsk]

Originally Posted by Fabien

A dangerous tool is not one that will surely harm you, but one that isn't to be used unless you have no choice and are ready to take the risk. This was explained by Signum in StrikerS ep 9.

Yeah, but the way it ended up, it made a real joke out of the whole proposition of danger, which is then crudely integrated in StrikerS Ep9. I'm not saying Nanoha has to puke blood in a forest like Zest, but at least do something that makes it clear it was close - a couple of cracks on Raising Heart, maybe Nanoha fainting like Hayate, even a brief spell of nausea would do.

[An Hero in Disguise]

Originally Posted by Fabien

Anybody can make an interesting anime by making characters suffer.
But making a good anime where nothing bad happens, requires real talent.

You have a point, but StrikerS pretend to have a serious plot, so when the main villain, who is also portrayed like quite a mad freak, starts to make excuses for not killing anybody it just doesn't feel right.

It seems that there are two kind of viewers: those who are interested in the story, and those who are interested in the characters. You seem to be more in the first category; I'm definitely completely in the second one.

I'm interested in the characters too, but I think at least some of them could contribute to the whole picture better if they died dramatically.

Yup, for guys like me, who care about the characters.

In a war anime, when the Good Side wins, all's fine, even if dozens of characters were killed in the process. If possible, the hero (if any) should be alive, but that's all.

But Riot Force 6 just doesn't feel like a military division. It's more like a family. So if anyone is dead, there can't be a happy ending. Everything's fine inbetween (characters too hurt to have an active part anymore, Fate being tortured by her own mother, Reinforce slowly killing Hayate from the inside and hating herself for it, Ginga brainwashed, Vivio in a not-so-comfortable position and Nanoha forced to watch, etc.), but you have to have a true happy end, with every Good Guy and every redeemable Bad Guy alive, happy and friendly.

But it is a war anime (presumably), and RF6 is a military division. So they could've make the general mood more fitting to that.

True happy end isn't my thing I'm afraid. And it's quite unrealistic either. I don't ask for something like the endings of Saikano or Texhnolyze, just a bittersweet one would suffice.

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by Deathkillz

([Nanoha] has been haxx all her life

Well, if she wasn't exceptional, there would be no point in making an anime centered on her.

(In fact, the most incredible thing about her is that she has a normal family: a father and a mother, and two siblings, all alive, healty, and who love her.)

Originally Posted by Deathkillz

problem with this series is that it can hardly be called "mahou shoujo" while it was for S2 and S2 ~ i would just like it better if the producers realised that the girls have grown up enough to face some real disasters

The girls did grow up, but the audience didn't.
The target audience for StrikerS is the people who liked A's. So, it's pretty normal to make an anime with roughly the same structure as A's, only twice as long.
1st phase: introducing the characters; everyday life, with a few little fights. 8.5 episodes in A's, 15 episodes in StrikerS.
2nd phase: now for a serious problem. 3 episodes in A's (middle of ep 8 -> middle of ep 11), at least 4 episodes (and probably more -- maybe two more or so) in StrikerS.
3rd phase: It's time to stop weeping and to kick ass instead. 1.5 episodes in A's (the second half of ep 11, and ep 12); length unknown in StrikerS (something like 3 or 4 episodes, probably).
4rd phase: epilogue, tying up loose ends. 1 episode in A's; 1 or 2 episodes in StrikerS I suppose.

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

You have a point, but StrikerS pretend to have a serious plot,

You're right. It pretends to have a serious plot.
The real plot is "Nanoha gets new friends".

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

so when the main villain, who is also portrayed like quite a mad freak, starts to make excuses for not killing anybody it just doesn't feel right.

If he's a mad freak, how can you foresee what he'll be thinking?
Besides, the explanation that a creator of life is reluctant to destroy life, seems reasonable to me.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

I'm interested in the characters too, but I think at least some of them could contribute to the whole picture better if they died dramatically.

It'd be nice if your parents (or your kids, your wife, whatever) died dramatically, it'd make your life more interesting
Yes, I know, MGLN is just an anime. But an anime where the viewer is meant to care for the characters.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

But it is a war anime (presumably), and RF6 is a military division. So they could've make the general mood more fitting to that.

There are dozens of war animes. Why make yet another one?
The "military" thing has never been taken seriously in MGLN. Just look at Lindy in season 1. (Chrono is trying to create a "military mood", but he fails against Lindy and Amy. I can imagine his suffering when Lindy waves her handerchief at him in ep 8, or when Amy tells Nanoha to comes and play on the military ship in ep 13 )

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

True happy end isn't my thing I'm afraid.

I'm afraid MGLN isn't your thing.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

And it's quite unrealistic either.

And I suppose you think magic is realistic?

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

I don't ask for something like the endings of Saikano or Texhnolyze, just a bittersweet one would suffice.

There's a hell of a lot of animes where that happens. I like MGLN because it's different from the crowd.

[serenade_beta]

Originally Posted by johnjefferson3

appearly jail is so evil that it looks like he made, the creators of the strikers website forget to renew their domain name, it was working yeasterday but for at least the next 12 hours,it now leads to something totally differnet, but yes, it still is www.nanoha.com, i would like to get your opion on what in the hell is going on, but this is really dissapointing news to hear though, i hope at least someone copied all the numbers information in graphic form!!!!

Wow! This IS wierd. I got to a home selling thing... Well, I saved all of the Numbers profiles as well as Scaglietti and Lutecia, so oh well...

[An Hero in Disguise]

Originally Posted by Fabien

You're right. It pretends to have a serious plot.
The real plot is "Nanoha gets new friends".

I don't find it good.

If he's a mad freak, how can you foresee what he'll be thinking?
Besides, the explanation that a creator of life is reluctant to destroy life, seems reasonable to me.

I was protecting Jail in several threads earlier and everybody tried to convince me that he doesn't really care for human lives. Now I suggest him to be more cruel and meet opposition again. Oh irony

It'd be nice if your parents (or your kids, your wife, whatever) died dramatically, it'd make your life more interesting
Yes, I know, MGLN is just an anime. But an anime where the viewer is meant to care for the characters.

Some people died (probably not dramatically enough though), more will follow, myself included, it's life.
MGLN is an anime where heroes are supposed to face quite serious threats. When nobody ends up dead or at least hurt noticably it just doesn't contribute to the mood. For example I don't consider Jail&Co as dangerous as I could if they acted a bit different. I'd like their characters much more in such case. I care for the characters but in a different way it seems. I don't think about them as some fragile cute dolls I should adore and protect from any troubles.

There are dozens of war animes. Why make yet another one?
The "military" thing has never been taken seriously in MGLN. Just look at Lindy in season 1. (Chrono is trying to create a "military mood", but he fails against Lindy and Amy. I can imagine his suffering when Lindy waves her handerchief at him in ep 8, or when Amy tells Nanoha to comes and play on the military ship in ep 13 )

Like we don't have enough anime filled with cute characters doing nothing.

Military not taken serious makes TSAB look incompetent and absolutely incapable of the achievements they claim to have reached. Not a good thing imho.

I'm afraid MGLN isn't your thing.

Yeah, sure, thanks for the enlightenment.

And I suppose you think magic is realistic?

They try to describe it as realistic as they can.

There's a hell of a lot of animes where that happens. I like MGLN because it's different from the crowd.

And twice as many where it doesn't. Anyway seasons 1 and 2 were really different from the crowd, StrikerS I wouldn't call that.

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

I don't find it good.

I noticed that (I even wonder why you watch the series).
I was just trying to explain how the three seasons of MGLN work.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

I was protecting Jail in several threads earlier and everybody tried to convince me that he doesn't really care for human lives. Now I suggest him to be more cruel and meet opposition again. Oh irony

I kinda was in the "Jail's not a complete monster" side.
Besides, one can try to avoid needlessly killing, and still do what needs to be done to achieve his goals.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

Some people died (probably not dramatically enough though), more will follow, myself included, it's life.

Yeah, it's life -- each one of us will die eventually. But you seem to have missed the "It'd be nice if..." part.
[I'm not sure I'm too clear here. If not, just read on...]

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

I care for the characters but in a different way it seems. I don't think about them as some fragile cute dolls I should adore and protect from any troubles.

You wanted some characters to die. Now, please name some characters you want to see dead, and tell me you care about them.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

Military not taken serious makes TSAB look incompetent and absolutely incapable of the achievements they claim to have reached.

Well, compare Lindy who looks like a airhead but gets the job done, and Regius who's overly serious but completely incompetent.

Originally Posted by An Hero in Disguise

Anyway seasons 1 and 2 were really different from the crowd, StrikerS I wouldn't call that.

Do you really think there's a big difference between the first two seasons and the third?

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by johnjefferson3

the creators of the strikers website forget to renew their domain name

That's incredibly lame of them.
For now, just go to http://202.133.123.135/.


(Just in case someone is interested, here's how I got the address:

First, I went to the Nanoha page on animenfo. I clicked on "Studio: ivory", which brought me to http://www.ivory.co.jp/.
With a "nslookup -ty=NS ivory.co.jp", I got Ivory's nameserver: ns4.cpi.ad.jp.
Then I asked that server what the right address for www.nanoha.com was: "nslookup www.nanoha.com ns4.cpi.ad.jp".)

[krisslanza]

Hmmm... Saw the episode and I have one question really... What were the things the Numbers attacked and destroyed? Anyone know? They look like weapons.