AnimeSuki Forums

xris · 2008-06-11, 15:40

Some of you may have noticed that a number of series have been removed from AnimeSuki, the reason is because Kadokawa Pictures USA have requested the torrents from the following 11 series to be removed from the main site.

Canvas 2 ~Niji Iro no Sketch~
Demonbane TV
Goshuushou-sama Ninomiya-kun
H2O – Footprint in the sand
Junjo Romantica
Mamoru-kun ni Megami no Shukufuku wo!
Mushiuta
Rental Magica
Shuffle! Memories
Spice & Wolf
Wagaya no Oinari-sama

Please note that Kadokawa are acting on the behalf of the Japanese IP owners, Kadokawa Pictures USA themselves do not license such series but act as a master licensor, a middle-man who sells on the license to (typically) American anime companies or T.V. networks.

At this point in time there is no indication that any of the series have been licensed. The existing discussion threads will remain in the Fansubbed forum as before, the only real change is that we will no longer list torrents.

ANN report, Kadokawa USA Orders Halt on Fansub Links for 11 Anime

WanderingKnight · 2008-06-11, 15:56

I frankly don't see the point unless they're trying to license them. Someone mentioned trying to prevent Japanese leechers from reverse-downloading the episodes (something related to a new BT service they opened in Japan). Anyways, the only series that interested me from that batch was Spice and Wolf, most of the rest seem mediocre at best.

I'm a bit put off by their focusing on AS alone--there are lots of other well-known torrent listing websites around, and it doesn't take too much of a brain to realize AS doesn't host the actual files... and that once a file hits the net, unless it's extremely uninteresting for the majority of the leechers (which would guarantee an R1 DVD failure), it's impossible to take it down.

Other than that, it was a good opportunity to laugh at the people at the ANN forums trying to get around the Animesuki filter (even more ironic considering the news article mentions the site in full). Oh, and this post is just hilarious.

xris · 2008-06-11, 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by WanderingKnight

I'm a bit put off by their focusing on AS alone

We have no information if they only focussed on AnimeSuki, we are not privy to any other C&D emails they sent.

Oh yes, a request concerning this thread. Can we please avoid any "I don't care because xxx sucked anyway" or for that matter "I hope xxx is licensed so I can purchase the DVDs". This thread isn't meant to be a wishlist of what gets licensed or not.

Green² · 2008-06-11, 16:17

Is it safe to say that of all eleven titles, that these eleven are all related to the same company / production?

....No Code Geass jokes plz.

cyth · 2008-06-11, 16:18

These kinds of skirmishes just feel so redundant I'm at a loss of words. When are they going to learn that's not how you tackle piracy. I'm really sorry you guys felt compelled to take the links off.

Vexx · 2008-06-11, 16:59

The only rationale I've ever come up with is that they think somehow that compressed videos of the broadcast episodes somehow competes with high quality region 2 DVD sales.... in other words, they're worried about the backwash from outside to otaku-land-Japan.

Its just damned silly...

***relentlessflame*** · 2008-06-11, 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green²

Is it safe to say that of all eleven titles, that these eleven are all related to the same company / production?

Yes, that's right. It's not so much that "Kadokawa are [sic] acting on the behalf of the Japanese IP owners", it's that Kadokawa is the Japanese IP owner. All of these shows are Kadokawa properties one way or another (though the Spice & Wolf anime is actually being distributed by Pony Canyon, the novels and manga are published by ASCII Media Works, which is part of the Kadokawa group, so...)

It's most likely because Kadokawa is continuing to expands its efforts in the online streaming/downloads arena. I'd expect to see something soon. Whether it affects this list of shows notwithstanding, though. This is basically just clean-up -- I think it's all the recent Kadokawa shows that haven't already been licensed.

DragoonKain3 · 2008-06-12, 01:24

I think the bigger question is, would future Kadokawa titles be treated in animesuki like MFI titles? Because in regards to my ignorant eye, it looks to be the same.

SeijiSensei · 2008-06-12, 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by xris

We have no information if they only focussed on AnimeSuki, we are not privy to any other C&D emails they sent.

Well, there's no mention of a similar action being taken against a certain "crazy" anime torrent directory, and their list of Spice & Wolf torrents continues to be posted. Perhaps since that site also lists licensed materials, Kadokawa thought it wasn't worth the effort and concentrated on the site they knew would comply?

wao · 2008-06-12, 09:59

I agree with SeijiSensei - assuming AS is the only site they contacted, I think they did it because this looks like the most likely place to actually comply. Perhaps it's a matter of show, to indicate to their investors and stuff that they're taking some kind of effort against copyright infringement and since they may not know any better, they'll just pick the easier targets? (I'm really pulling this out of my rear, I'm just guessing.)

It's the same reasoning perhaps as to why they'd be aggressive in targeting uploads of their content onto streaming websites; if it's accessible to the average person who might think it's kinda legal or "not wrong", they'd want to have it removed so that nobody gets the impression that they are tacitly allowing this sort of stuff. But it doesn't really stop the file from getting around to people who want it.

Although I think I can think of some more sites that non-hardcore people can easily find and torrent from that they might want to contact if they wanted to be consistent about it, but perhaps those sites simply haven't acted upon it yet.

Would I be right in assuming from the way xris wrote the post that they only requested for those 11 titles and not all Kadokawa things (inclusive of future works)? In that case then I guess it doesn't have to become another MFI category, although some might say listing any more shows of theirs after this would be asking for it...

Vexx · 2008-06-12, 14:02

Sometimes thats the wonderful thing about C&Ds -- you have to comply with the literal meaning and if they wrote concerning those specific items, those are the only items you respond to.

Its somewhat parallel to why the intent of lawmakers is meaningless -- its what they actually wrote that matters...

***NightWish*** · 2008-06-12, 15:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

...would future Kadokawa titles be treated in animesuki like MFI titles?

Not without another request.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wao

... they only requested for those 11 titles and not all Kadokawa things (inclusive of future works)?

Correct. The request is like the previous MFI request only in so far as we were asked to remove torrent links. As you have identified, the scope does not include future titles, only those specific titles listed.

Kaioshin Sama · 2008-06-12, 18:45

It strikes me as more Kadokawa lashing out because of their debt and trying to excerise control over the properties. Really I think they are missing another key issue here, but Xris asked us not to go down that road so...

What I think most people are asking though now is if this could mean no future unlicensed Haruhi/Lucky Star content on the front page of animesuki.

***relentlessflame*** · 2008-06-12, 19:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

It strikes me as more Kadokawa lashing out because of their debt

What debt? They did have a net loss last year, but it's not outside the realm of normal parameters, especially since they took a 4 billion yen hit in "unusual items". Their actual revenue was stable, along with most of the rest of their business. They actually paid back more of their long-term debt than they incurred last year. So, certainly, I think it was trying to keep control of their properties, but debt?

Keaton_101 · 2008-07-31, 19:30

So does this mean no more spice and wolf?

Vexx · 2008-07-31, 20:13

Please read more carefully. It means:
1) That Animesuki will no longer list the torrents. It doesn't mean the torrents don't exist.
2) The Spice and Wolf season is completed anyway. There were 12 episodes and a DVD-only episode. All have been fansubbed. The fansubs might be floating out there on the Internet anyway....
3) Spice and Wolf got pretty good rating numbers and decent sales of the DVD/books/CDs/manga. There's a fair chance of there being a second season if that's what you meant. If it does, then Animesuki won't be listing any torrents that arise from that (unless the title is different -- that's another sort of game...).
4) Google and other fansite connections could be your friend, maybe.

This question and the answer might be better placed in the Spice&Wolf subforum.

2008-06-11, 15:40	Link #1
xris Just call me Ojisan Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: U.K. Hampshire	Kadokawa Pictures USA sends C&D notice Some of you may have noticed that a number of series have been removed from AnimeSuki, the reason is because Kadokawa Pictures USA have requested the torrents from the following 11 series to be removed from the main site. Canvas 2 ~Niji Iro no Sketch~ Demonbane TV Goshuushou-sama Ninomiya-kun H2O – Footprint in the sand Junjo Romantica Mamoru-kun ni Megami no Shukufuku wo! Mushiuta Rental Magica Shuffle! Memories Spice & Wolf Wagaya no Oinari-sama Please note that Kadokawa are acting on the behalf of the Japanese IP owners, Kadokawa Pictures USA themselves do not license such series but act as a master licensor, a middle-man who sells on the license to (typically) American anime companies or T.V. networks. At this point in time there is no indication that any of the series have been licensed. The existing discussion threads will remain in the Fansubbed forum as before, the only real change is that we will no longer list torrents. ANN report, Kadokawa USA Orders Halt on Fansub Links for 11 Anime

2008-06-11, 15:56	Link #2
WanderingKnight Gregory House IT Support Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina Age: 35	I frankly don't see the point unless they're trying to license them. Someone mentioned trying to prevent Japanese leechers from reverse-downloading the episodes (something related to a new BT service they opened in Japan). Anyways, the only series that interested me from that batch was Spice and Wolf, most of the rest seem mediocre at best. I'm a bit put off by their focusing on AS alone--there are lots of other well-known torrent listing websites around, and it doesn't take too much of a brain to realize AS doesn't host the actual files... and that once a file hits the net, unless it's extremely uninteresting for the majority of the leechers (which would guarantee an R1 DVD failure), it's impossible to take it down. Other than that, it was a good opportunity to laugh at the people at the ANN forums trying to get around the Animesuki filter (even more ironic considering the news article mentions the site in full). Oh, and this post is just hilarious. __________________ Place them in a box until a quieter time \| Lights down, you up and die.

2008-06-11, 16:59	Link #6
Vexx Obey the Darkly Cute ... Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ... Age: 66	The only rationale I've ever come up with is that they think somehow that compressed videos of the broadcast episodes somehow competes with high quality region 2 DVD sales.... in other words, they're worried about the backwash from outside to otaku-land-Japan. Its just damned silly... __________________ "It Really IS Rocket Science", Novel series rough drafts; vol. 1 thru vol. 3 complete Volume 4 in work, Visit the thread for short stories!

2008-06-12, 01:24	Link #8
DragoonKain3 Osana-Najimi Shipper Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Mt. Ordeals	I think the bigger question is, would future Kadokawa titles be treated in animesuki like MFI titles? Because in regards to my ignorant eye, it looks to be the same. __________________ Yes its YOU childhood friend - source of BERZERKER RAGE since forever Childhood Friend couple STATISTICS(spoilers abound though)

2008-06-12, 09:59	Link #10
wao OK. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: The Fields of High Attus Age: 34	I agree with SeijiSensei - assuming AS is the only site they contacted, I think they did it because this looks like the most likely place to actually comply. Perhaps it's a matter of show, to indicate to their investors and stuff that they're taking some kind of effort against copyright infringement and since they may not know any better, they'll just pick the easier targets? (I'm really pulling this out of my rear, I'm just guessing.) It's the same reasoning perhaps as to why they'd be aggressive in targeting uploads of their content onto streaming websites; if it's accessible to the average person who might think it's kinda legal or "not wrong", they'd want to have it removed so that nobody gets the impression that they are tacitly allowing this sort of stuff. But it doesn't really stop the file from getting around to people who want it. Although I think I can think of some more sites that non-hardcore people can easily find and torrent from that they might want to contact if they wanted to be consistent about it, but perhaps those sites simply haven't acted upon it yet. Would I be right in assuming from the way xris wrote the post that they only requested for those 11 titles and not all Kadokawa things (inclusive of future works)? In that case then I guess it doesn't have to become another MFI category, although some might say listing any more shows of theirs after this would be asking for it... __________________ Thanks for the fish

2008-06-11, 16:17	Link #4
Green² It's bacon! Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Up and to the Left Age: 43	Is it safe to say that of all eleven titles, that these eleven are all related to the same company / production? ....No Code Geass jokes plz.

2008-06-11, 16:18	Link #5
cyth Banned Join Date: Dec 2006 Age: 38	These kinds of skirmishes just feel so redundant I'm at a loss of words. When are they going to learn that's not how you tackle piracy. I'm really sorry you guys felt compelled to take the links off.

2008-06-12, 14:02	Link #11
Vexx Obey the Darkly Cute ... Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ... Age: 66	Sometimes thats the wonderful thing about C&Ds -- you have to comply with the literal meaning and if they wrote concerning those specific items, those are the only items you respond to. Its somewhat parallel to why the intent of lawmakers is meaningless -- its what they actually wrote that matters... __________________ "It Really IS Rocket Science", Novel series rough drafts; vol. 1 thru vol. 3 complete Volume 4 in work, Visit the thread for short stories!

2008-06-12, 18:45	Link #13
Kaioshin Sama Banned Join Date: May 2004 Location: Neither Here nor There Age: 39	It strikes me as more Kadokawa lashing out because of their debt and trying to excerise control over the properties. Really I think they are missing another key issue here, but Xris asked us not to go down that road so... What I think most people are asking though now is if this could mean no future unlicensed Haruhi/Lucky Star content on the front page of animesuki.

2008-07-31, 19:30	Link #15
Keaton_101 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2008	Spice and wolf So does this mean no more spice and wolf?

2008-07-31, 20:13	Link #16
Vexx Obey the Darkly Cute ... Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ... Age: 66	Please read more carefully. It means: 1) That Animesuki will no longer list the torrents. It doesn't mean the torrents don't exist. 2) The Spice and Wolf season is completed anyway. There were 12 episodes and a DVD-only episode. All have been fansubbed. The fansubs might be floating out there on the Internet anyway.... 3) Spice and Wolf got pretty good rating numbers and decent sales of the DVD/books/CDs/manga. There's a fair chance of there being a second season if that's what you meant. If it does, then Animesuki won't be listing any torrents that arise from that (unless the title is different -- that's another sort of game...). 4) Google and other fansite connections could be your friend, maybe. This question and the answer might be better placed in the Spice&Wolf subforum. __________________ "It Really IS Rocket Science", Novel series rough drafts; vol. 1 thru vol. 3 complete Volume 4 in work, Visit the thread for short stories!