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Old 2018-02-14, 21:42   Link #1
shadow1296
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Another shooting in Florida

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Old 2018-02-14, 21:47   Link #2
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united stats of amerishoot
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Old 2018-02-16, 01:12   Link #3
serenade_beta
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I tell myself that maybe something will be done after the 10000th death and I'm just counting down.
Well, to be truthful, it's a pain to try and keep track, but something along that line, surely.
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Old 2018-02-16, 09:59   Link #4
Sugetsu
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Nothing will change until corporations stop being in charge of our political system. So move along people, just another "normal" day here. Cable news will squeeze all the ratings posssible out of this "juicy" story this week and then move on to the next "explosive" headline that demands little critical thinking prowes from gullible viewers.
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Old 2018-02-16, 11:48   Link #5
shadow1296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugetsu View Post
Nothing will change until corporations stop being in charge of our political system. So move along people, just another "normal" day here. Cable news will squeeze all the ratings posssible out of this "juicy" story this week and then move on to the next "explosive" headline that demands little critical thinking prowes from gullible viewers.
also nothing will change until america stop ignoring the mental health of the people in it's country. stricter gun regulations and wrenching control from corporations is all well and good but if you ignore the signs a mentally ill person is dangerous which Americans tend to do tragedies like these will continue, this kid who was shooting was according to witnesses was disturbed for months before this happened and barely anything was done about him, most that was done is someone and only one person reported him to the FBI for the possibility he could cause a shooting and there excuse that nothing was done is that they couldn't find him,
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Old 2018-02-16, 17:30   Link #6
GDB
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And if they did something, the gun advocates would be screeching that they're rounding up those with guns and they're infringing on his second amendment rights.

Also don't ignore that he was reported to the school and police multiple times, and all that happened was he was expelled. No real police follow-up.
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Old 2018-02-16, 19:00   Link #7
Toukairin
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It's one of those days when I believe the NRA should be treated on equal standing with the tobacco companies in the way they sell BS to people even when they knew about lethal dangers out there. They should be sued and dragged all the way down to hell for starters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow1296 View Post
also nothing will change until america stop ignoring the mental health of the people in it's country.
This is the part where I'm rooting for an approach that is directly copied from Japan. If you or your relatives and friends have mental issues, it's no-no for guns.
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Old 2018-02-16, 21:42   Link #8
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https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/...orida-shooting

God, reminds me a number of sociopaths back then that cracked a mofo's head open and nothing gets down.

At least the FBI apologized. Little good that does.
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Old 2018-02-16, 22:59   Link #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toukairin View Post
It's one of those days when I believe the NRA should be treated on equal standing with the tobacco companies in the way they sell BS to people even when they knew about lethal dangers out there. They should be sued and dragged all the way down to hell for starters.



This is the part where I'm rooting for an approach that is directly copied from Japan. If you or your relatives and friends have mental issues, it's no-no for guns.
Yeah good luck with that.

Glad I got my lifetime membership there, as well as my father and several of my friends. o/
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Old 2018-02-16, 23:38   Link #10
Eisdrache
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Glad for belonging to and supporting an organization that is the main reason that America cannot pass stricter gun control laws?

It is very sad that this is already the third school shooting in the USA that resulted in a student injuring or killing others according to snopes yet senators like Rubio go on air the same day stating that "this is not the time to discuss stricter laws" and that it is "not fair to blame lawmakers" for this situation.
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Old 2018-02-17, 01:49   Link #11
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toukairin View Post
It's one of those days when I believe the NRA should be treated on equal standing with the tobacco companies in the way they sell BS to people even when they knew about lethal dangers out there.
Quite the opposite, welcome to a world where in the USA firearms companies are treated just like big pharma who is making a profit out of the opioid crisis, both kind of companies are literally making money out of innocent usa citizens deaths and tomorrow and the day after that nothing will have changed (ok, everyday the usa inchs closer to becoming a banana republic).
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Old 2018-02-17, 02:40   Link #12
justinstrife
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisdrache View Post
Glad for belonging to and supporting an organization that is the main reason that America cannot pass stricter gun control laws?

It is very sad that this is already the third school shooting in the USA that resulted in a student injuring or killing others according to snopes yet senators like Rubio go on air the same day stating that "this is not the time to discuss stricter laws" and that it is "not fair to blame lawmakers" for this situation.
I would agree with Leftists about restricting the ability of the mentally ill to purchase or possess firearms, and I am fine with background checks. Hell I think we need to bring back Mental Wards(one of many things I think Reagan did wrong). Beyond that, I'm fine with private citizens owning everything the military has access to in terms of personal arms, as they did during the revolutionary war, civil war, and first world war and beyond(they even had access to cannons and warships back then as well).

The tools are not the problem. My Ar-15, and those owned by my friends and family have never hurt anyone. And in our hands, they'll never hurt anyone, save for those who try and bring harm to us.

There's also this pesky little thing called the 2nd Amendment. The only Amendment with the words 'shall not be infringed', in it. If you want to change it, you'll have to bring another Amendment in to modify it, or eliminate it. And that isn't going to happen.

The warning signs were everywhere on this teenager being a danger to everyone. Yet not one thing was done to stop him. No feel good law is going to stop someone from doing something evil.

So rant and rave all you want, but you offer no real solutions to a problem that has only truly come about in the last several decades.
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Old 2018-02-17, 05:13   Link #13
serenade_beta
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Ah yes, it's a mental problem blah blah blah.
*looks at statistics comparing to other countries*

Anyways, I'm always curious what those people(?) would say when the one dead is their own family member, but meh, I don't prefer spending my time on those people to go beyond thinking it.

Oh, and the NRA lackey might try to say something about what it might say, but I suggest it save the calories used from typing that convenient thought.
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Old 2018-02-17, 09:38   Link #14
CrowKenobi
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Just a reminder that this thread is about the tragic school shooting in Florida and NOT about gun control or the like.

Thank you.
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Old 2018-02-17, 13:31   Link #15
Eisdrache
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There is so much wrong with that argumentation. Why do civilians need assault weapons to protect themselves? How many bullets do they plan on putting into a robber or thief? Why is it possible for a mentally ill person to easily purchase a weapon in states like Florida (and many others) ? A weapon with automatic fire and large magazines? There is also the BS of 'if someone really wants to commit evil, they will find a way'. Yes, but you can their path easy or you can make it hard. I have absolutely no idea why it is so difficult to understand that the more hurdles there are for potential shooters to overcome, the less likely they are to commit the crime. Gun laws aren't a miraculous solution to solve the problem but they would damn well reduce it.

Additionally the access to mental health treatment is extremely poor not only in Florida but also in the United States as a whole. Mental Health America reports that 56% of adults did not receive treatment. The process of finding the right path to prevent these tragedies will have to include improving health care but of course this is only one of many things to consider. Unfortunately this doesn't seem to be a sentiment shared by certain senators like John Kennedy who thinks 'idiot control' will solve the problem.

The Florida shooting may or may not have happened with stricter laws but they certainly would have made it less likely.

Last edited by Eisdrache; 2018-02-17 at 13:42.
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Old 2018-02-17, 15:03   Link #16
justinstrife
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisdrache View Post
There is so much wrong with that argumentation. Why do civilians need assault weapons to protect themselves? How many bullets do they plan on putting into a robber or thief? Why is it possible for a mentally ill person to easily purchase a weapon in states like Florida (and many others) ? A weapon with automatic fire and large magazines? There is also the BS of 'if someone really wants to commit evil, they will find a way'. Yes, but you can their path easy or you can make it hard. I have absolutely no idea why it is so difficult to understand that the more hurdles there are for potential shooters to overcome, the less likely they are to commit the crime. Gun laws aren't a miraculous solution to solve the problem but they would damn well reduce it.

The Florida shooting may or may not have happened with stricter laws but they certainly would have made it less likely.
The 2nd Amendment isnt about hunting or protection from robbers.

I agree with your stance about Mental Health treatment at least. The rest of it, not so much.

And had I lost someone to a shooting like this, I would be wondering why the Authorities did NOTHING about this kid. He was a clear and present danger to everyone and the signs were out there for months.

https://youtu.be/ZHS4qRJ8cFI

Pretty much a summary of where those of us on the right stand, dealing with those on the left on this issue.
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Old 2018-02-17, 15:52   Link #17
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrowKenobi View Post
Just a reminder that this thread is about the tragic school shooting in Florida and NOT about gun control or the like.
It would be better to change the the thread name to "mass shootings in the USA" since there will be more incidents where a lone attacker will take the lives of civilians and will be shortly after stopped (dead or alive) but the arguments will be the same. As a matter of fact, the crisis in syria thread will be long forgotten before the endemic mass shootings in the usa are.
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Old 2018-02-17, 15:54   Link #18
Toukairin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisdrache View Post
There is so much wrong with that argumentation. Why do civilians need assault weapons to protect themselves? How many bullets do they plan on putting into a robber or thief? Why is it possible for a mentally ill person to easily purchase a weapon in states like Florida (and many others) ? A weapon with automatic fire and large magazines? There is also the BS of 'if someone really wants to commit evil, they will find a way'. Yes, but you can their path easy or you can make it hard. I have absolutely no idea why it is so difficult to understand that the more hurdles there are for potential shooters to overcome, the less likely they are to commit the crime. Gun laws aren't a miraculous solution to solve the problem but they would damn well reduce it.

Additionally the access to mental health treatment is extremely poor not only in Florida but also in the United States as a whole. Mental Health America reports that 56% of adults did not receive treatment. The process of finding the right path to prevent these tragedies will have to include improving health care but of course this is only one of many things to consider. Unfortunately this doesn't seem to be a sentiment shared by certain senators like John Kennedy who thinks 'idiot control' will solve the problem.

The Florida shooting may or may not have happened with stricter laws but they certainly would have made it less likely.
I agree with those points.

First on the AR-15 itself, I just cannot, for the life of me, understand why anybody would need a military grade weapon that is basically the same as the M4 on which soldiers are trained to fire in semi-auto mode. HUNTING? Regular hunters keep saying that the AR-15 offers little stopping power except for smaller animals, and that it only empowers sloppy, “spray and pray” hunters to waste ammunition. This ain't a video game, people. But as gamers would say among themselves: git gud or piss off. I never hunted in my lifetime, but I know I would use a bolt-action rifle if I do. HOME DEFENSE? It's not good to use in tight spaces, and you risk sending bullets through walls and into your neighbor's house. I read that from an article written by someone who is for the Second Amendment.

On the topic of mental health, things are going to shit in big part because of the lack of a more inclusive and accessible health care plan. Not that far from the US, right up in Canada, there are provincial legistlations that made sure that people can receive some mental health support for free at the very least. If the only thing clinicians prescribed to M. Cruz was pills, then it shows the kind of abject failure the Floridian health care system is. Governor Scott should be taking flak himself because his own local government does nothing to help its citizens. Health care is still mostly under state jurisdiction, no? So instead of criticizing the FBI, who accepted their part of the blame, he should ask why things also failed in his own backyard.

Last edited by Toukairin; 2018-02-17 at 19:11.
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Old 2018-02-17, 19:03   Link #19
Ithekro
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The Colt AR-15 is popular on both sides of the issue because it is designed to "look cool". In actual functionality, it is just a rifle. It is not an assualt rifle nor is it a "assault weapon". It is just a rifle that is patterned after a famous military weapon (the M-16). It fires a .223 cal bullet (5.56mm) with a rifle casing for a rifle. It is semi-automatic, which actually means that the mechanism will reload a new bullet into the chamber when you fire it, but you have to pull the trigger each and every time you want to fire it. This is not an automatic weapon. It cannot fire full auto, nor can it for in three round burst. It can only fire one bullet at a time, every time the trigger is pulled.
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Old 2018-02-17, 19:25   Link #20
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
The Colt AR-15 ...It is semi-automatic, which actually means that the mechanism will reload a new bullet into the chamber when you fire it, but you have to pull the trigger each and every time you want to fire it. This is not an automatic weapon. It cannot fire full auto, nor can it for in three round burst. It can only fire one bullet at a time, every time the trigger is pulled.
FALSE

"For as little as $99, you can get a bump stock, a spring-loaded stock that, with one pull of the trigger, keeps the weapon firing using its own recoil. It can enable the weapon to fire at a rate of 600 rounds a minute or more."

https://www.thejournal.ie/ar-15-gun-...53825-Feb2018/

... and the bump stock ban (which mas mentioned after the vegas massacre is DOA thanks to the NRA, as usual.

Before you say, "Hey, you need know about the bump stock to actually get one" I am not interested in modern firearms in the least, probably have played a total of two hours of first person shooters in my entire life. So with all the publicity they have got, you really need to live under a rock to not know hot to make a fully automatic out of this semis, so lets quit the pretense that "hey, this are not assault rifles" just because you need to get a cheap upgrade that is easily available.
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