(L) Dragon Ball Super

[Galaxian]

Originally Posted by sayde

Yeah. I remember that. But that might've just been his pride talking.

I think the recent episodes make it pretty clear that Vegeta's new form is by no means, anywhere's close to being a substitute for mastered UI. So despite what he said, I think he's going to need it to become relevant in the future.

On another note, I consider Vegeta's transformation as more of a (late) answer to Goku's SSB+Kaio Ken.

What are the odds that the next movie will reveal that Vegeta acquired and mastered UI off-screen?

[azenable]

Originally Posted by DragonOsman

^Yeah, he did say that he wants to become stronger in his own way. But he could learn Ultra Instinct. And I think Goku should train to master the true Ultra Instinct, as well as to learn how to get into it whenever he wants. Then he should combine it with Super Saiyan.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to the movie. When is it coming out? And is this the one that talks about S-cells?

The point of it is that it cannot be combine. His cell is already moving on its own and performing at above optimum capacity.

[vietthai96]

The next movie more like a storytelling than an actual Arc

[DragonOsman]

@azenable: Toriyama said it's a power different from Super Saiyan, which is why I think it could be combined with Super Saiyan. Maybe Goku in that state will instinctively go into the Super Saiyan version of the form. It's possible.

@sayde: If Toriyama's going to go into Yamoshi's story, it's going to have to be in a movie or some flashback in the story itself when it continues, right? But yeah, if the upcoming movie is about the conflict between Frieza and the Saiyans, then it's not likely for it to delve into Yamoshi's story. But in that case, maybe Toriyama will go into that in another movie.

[sayde]

Originally Posted by Galaxian

What are the odds that the next movie will reveal that Vegeta acquired and mastered UI off-screen?

You mean like SSB? lol
Yeah...odds might be higher than I'd like to admit.

Originally Posted by DragonOsman

maybe Toriyama will go into that in another movie.

Or perhaps, another series.

[DragonOsman]

In the anime, in one of the scenes where Goku and Vegeta were training on Beerus' planet, they felt something that was like a hint that they were close to getting SSB. Whis' reaction was also telling. But yeah, Vegeta getting Ultra Instinct, if it happens, might also be off-screen. But I think we at least need a hint like with SSB.

Originally Posted by sayde

Or perhaps, another series.

Yeah, that's possible too.

[Kanon]

When you think about it, Vegeta has always gotten his transformations off-screen, the only exception being the recent Beyond Blue form.

Super Saiyan = off-screen
Super Vegeta = off-screen
Super Saiyan 2 = off-screen
Super Saiyan God (manga only) = off-screen
Super Saiyan Blue = off-screen
Mastered Super Saiyan Blue (manga only) = off-screen

So it wouldn't be that surprising for him to get Ultra instinct off-screen too.

[quagmire]

Originally Posted by Kanon

When you think about it, Vegeta has always gotten his transformations off-screen, the only exception being the recent Beyond Blue form.

Super Saiyan = off-screen
Super Vegeta = off-screen
Super Saiyan 2 = off-screen
Super Saiyan God (manga only) = off-screen
Super Saiyan Blue = off-screen
Mastered Super Saiyan Blue (manga only) = off-screen

So it wouldn't be that surprising for him to get Ultra instinct off-screen too.

Does his super saiyan transformation count as off screen because they flashed back to it?

[DragonOsman]

I think it's still off-screen. It happened off-screen and then we saw a flashback.

[The Green One]

Is it really important? I don't think it is.

[Sixth]

Originally Posted by Kanon

When you think about it, Vegeta has always gotten his transformations off-screen, the only exception being the recent Beyond Blue form.

Super Saiyan = off-screen
Super Vegeta = off-screen
Super Saiyan 2 = off-screen
Super Saiyan God (manga only) = off-screen
Super Saiyan Blue = off-screen
Mastered Super Saiyan Blue (manga only) = off-screen

So it wouldn't be that surprising for him to get Ultra instinct off-screen too.

Yes only to get him trivialised by the new enemy.

New main enemy: Mastered UI? More like Mastered shit.

Goku: Vegeta..you have mastered UI. Neat. By the way, now I can use KKX40 SSB UI. Have the feeling that I am going to activate Super Saiyan Angel soon vs this new enemy arc.

Vegeta facing the ground: Fck U Kakarot

[Mad Pierrot]

If Goku keeps getting new transformations and Vegeta can't catch up, then somebody else will replace his rival kind like what Hit does in FighterZ

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Kanon

When you think about it, Vegeta has always gotten his transformations off-screen, the only exception being the recent Beyond Blue form.

Super Saiyan = off-screen
Super Vegeta = off-screen
Super Saiyan 2 = off-screen
Super Saiyan God (manga only) = off-screen
Super Saiyan Blue = off-screen
Mastered Super Saiyan Blue (manga only) = off-screen

So it wouldn't be that surprising for him to get Ultra instinct off-screen too.

wait, super sayan 2 was onscreen, when vegeta goes against goku and get the "majin burster" from babiji and dabura, he goes super sayan 2 onscreen.

[Robotech Master]

Originally Posted by Blueknight78

wait, super sayan 2 was onscreen, when vegeta goes against goku and get the "majin burster" from babiji and dabura, he goes super sayan 2 onscreen.

He's referring to him first obtaining the transformation on screen. Now granted, there are fans who think that Vegeta used the Majin power up to obtain SSJ2 right there for the first time, but there are others who think he obtained it off screen before hand and just didn't use it until he challenged Goku.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Robotech Master

He's referring to him first obtaining the transformation on screen. Now granted, there are fans who think that Vegeta used the Majin power up to obtain SSJ2 right there for the first time, but there are others who think he obtained it off screen before hand and just didn't use it until he challenged Goku.

well for it's really looked like it was on screen.

[Kanon]

It's one of the oldest DB debates that probably will never be settled unless Toriyama makes a statement, but I've always thought he had unlocked SSJ2 during the timeskip.

[vietthai96]

I agree more about Vegeta get SSJ2 by Majin Boost, and seriously he use SSJ2 only once mroe time in DBZ, and in DBS he use it only one with Beerus with Rage Boost, after that it is SSJ1 and Blue. He do use once more in manga when battle Black though. But Vegeta SSJ2 is very hard to recognize, his hair doesn't change like Teen Gohan and Goku.

[DragonOsman]

There's electricity on the form and the hair is a little longer and spikier. But yeah, given Vegeta's hair, it's harder to tell when his aura is turned off.

I agree with the notion that Vegeta got SSJ2 with the Majin boost. After all, it really didn't seem like he was strong enough to do it before that.

[GDB]

Sure, if you ignore everything he says and his character. I mean, who was he going to use SSJ2 on? Kid Trunks? Pui-Pui, who he didn't even use SSJ on? You have to actually read what the characters say, not just look at them punch things.

[Sixth]

Originally Posted by Kanon

It's one of the oldest DB debates that probably will never be settled unless Toriyama makes a statement, but I've always thought he had unlocked SSJ2 during the timeskip.

I dont really care whether Gohan was using SSJ1 or SSJ2 vs Dabura or Vegeta had unlocked SSJ2 before or after because in the end, Goku was still stronger than Vegeta in Majin Buu arc. Although these 2 debates are infinitely better than Krillin or Tien, who is the strongest human.