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View Poll Results: Should Shiori run away with Sei? | |||
Yes they should have run away together | 20 | 35.09% | |
No Im glad they didn't | 30 | 52.63% | |
I don't know.. | 7 | 12.28% | |
Voters: 57. You may not vote on this poll |
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2004-04-05, 17:27 | Link #2 |
~Lost in the Moonlight~
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I am personally glad they did not because if they had sei would not have been in the story. That would have affected the whole season and the storyline without her. I love the way she is always teasing Yumi. She seems to me to be the most lighthearted fun loving of the bunch.
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2004-04-05, 20:05 | Link #3 | |
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Also what do you think would have happened to them had they ran away? and why do you think Shiori desided not to go at the last minute? just trying to get a little conversation going. Shiori is personally one of my favourite characters and I think that she would have be discontent with her life had she ran. that and in the end I think it would have ended badly hurting them both more then it did. I actually find it rather curious that Sei has such a large following as Im somewhat wary of her. I like her but some aspects of her character seem to me to be somewhat .. hmm. tainted? And its also interesting how Shiori never was considered to be Sei's soeur and thus I think it creates noticable differance or separation between their relationship and that of any of the other characters' relationships. ohkay I will be quiet now :P |
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2004-04-05, 21:32 | Link #4 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
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I think part of the reason Shiori decided not to go was that in coming to a decision to be a nun Shiori would've had to decide at one point to dedicate her life to God above all else. We don't really know anything about Shiori's religious experience, perhaps it had something to do with her parents death. In any case, we can infer that her faith is a very important part of her as something that gives her life meaning and comforts, supports and strengthens her. To leave with Sei would mean leaving all of that behind. The other reason I think she left is for Sei's own sake. Sei was so single minded about Shiori that she was missing the bigger picture about their relationship and about life in general. As viewers, we can see how Sei missed Youko's genuine concern for her until the end. Also I think a lot of Sei's attraction to Shiori was to the sense of religious serenity that Shiori exudes. The irony is that by having Shiori, she would lose the part of Shiori that attracts her the most. So I agree with you that running away probably wouldn't have worked out in the long run and that it would've hurt them both a lot more. The whole running-away was very much a spur of the moment decision, and actually I found that whole scene pretty cliched. Quote:
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Sorry for the long post... Last edited by atua; 2004-04-05 at 22:52. |
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2004-04-06, 01:21 | Link #6 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: France
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I just know the anime, not novel. but i'm glad they didn't.
because Sei won't be happy with a girl who wants to be nun --> some day, Shiori would have perhaps regretted. and Sei, obviously, would have reproach herself to be on the way of Shiori destiny. And in the anime, we don't feel Shiori likes Sei.... maybe a little, but not how Rei likes Yoshino, Yumi likes Sachiko, or Sei likes her :-( So, it's definitively better that they didn't run away. The elder sister of Sei and Youko are SUGOIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII. I'm happy that they were here to help and comfort Sei... |
2004-04-06, 12:12 | Link #8 | ||||||
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2004-04-06, 15:13 | Link #9 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: France
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Maybe i think that because the anime shows Shiori in only one episode, i don't know the novel. For me, a love between two girls is an exclusive feeling. Sei can't deal with God... Shiori can't exclusivly love Sei and God. i think... So it's better for Sei that Shiori gives up.... even if Sei suffers a lot... I think she would more and more suffer if Shiori has accepted the "escape". |
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2004-04-06, 16:09 | Link #10 | |
Gomen asobase desuwa!
Join Date: Nov 2003
Age: 43
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Back onto the subject of "did Shiori love Sei," yes she did - very much so that she chose not to runaway with Sei. Two teenagers that runaway would pretty much end up dead (as in Suga Sei's "Ibara no Mori") and Shiori did not want to see that happen to her beloved Sei - so she chose not to come, especially after seeing Sei at the train station. |
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2004-04-06, 17:41 | Link #11 |
guess
Join Date: Nov 2003
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I presume that most people here, including myself, haven’t read the novels. I think we really should not interpret anime before we know the content in novels. We all know that anime cut out A LOT from novels. Therefore, any judgment /argument / interpretation / issue just from anime is incomplete and most likely not fair. Just from anime, it’s not clear why Sei loves Shoiri or vice versa, not clear why Shiori decides not to run away, not clear just what kind or how deep or whatever of relationship they have. Actually, it’s not even clear what Sei means when she says that her attitude in class becomes strange. It may sound not important, but if one wants to analyze the situation, especially like the one here, he/she should really learn as much as possible before reaching conclusion. There are just examples of the issues in the anime. If people have read the novels, they may have different, very different, thoughts about this matter.
This is just like the age-old argument: if the survey says that certain brand of cereal is the best, most people might believe it and fail to take into account that they do not reveal the source, i.e. how this survey was conducted etc. It could very well be that 8 out of 10 people have ever had cereal before. That’s the results of this survey. Hence, I think, one can only use general assumption in this case such as; two teenage girls running away usually result in unhappy ending, things like general facts. Sorry that I may sound harsh and I am in a hurry, but this really is only personal opinion. |
2004-04-06, 18:53 | Link #12 | |||||||||
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Though I agree we must recognize our limited ability and not jump to conclusions hastily. Quote:
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2004-04-07, 00:53 | Link #13 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: France
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I really like your thoughts, then ok I give up ;-) The anime cut too much scenes I believe. there are not enough time to like Shiori, not time to understand her... thus I will trust you, if their love is dedicated (in the novel) to the failure/death, then yes sincerely I prefer that they didn't run away together! And with what you say, I begin to like Shiori... |
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2004-04-07, 01:23 | Link #14 | |||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
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WARNING: Long Post Ahead! Apologies in advance...
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Also I don't believe Sei really knew Shiori as a person, eg when Sei was totally caught off guard by Youko's revelation about Shiori. I get the sense that she loved Shiori more as an ideal and not as a person. *** PERSONAL RANT ALERT *** In my opinion, one prerequisite (amongst many) for a successful relationship is knowledge, both self-knowledge and knowledge about your partner. What I mean is that people need to know who they are and what they want in life, and how that fits in with their partner's personality and goals if a relationship is to work out. Often couples break up because they discover down the track that they have very different and incompatible goals in life. Being in love and having a partner doesn't magically make your own problems go away. You still need to figure out how to deal with them yourself, albeit with some help sometimes. Each person in the pair are still individuals who need to learn how to be strong as people by themselves. Even in a relationship, one needs to live for themselves first and foremost. There'll be times when this is not the case, but for the most part, I think that it should be. Living for someone else all the time will just make you miserable and bitter. *** END RANT *** As for how all this relates to Sei and Shiori, Sei made the mistake of assuming that Shiori will give up her life goals for Sei. Also Sei tried to use Shiori to solve her personal problems without actually looking at her own underlying issues. If the only thing that Sei learnt from the whole Shiori incident was that she needs to start living for herself, then that would've been a valuable lesson. On a more shallow note, I'm glad she learnt this lesson since that's why we get treated to some of Sei's more outrageous antics. Quote:
People choosing to live for someone else's goals often end up very bitter about the whole situation. I wouldn't have wanted to see Shiori ended up hating Sei. Quote:
In the same way, the white rose family mambers (I'm including Shizuka here) also follow a certain archetype, but their similarities are based more on personality traits than appearance. Here's a list of some characteristics I think they have in common:
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2004-04-07, 02:27 | Link #15 | |
Gomen asobase desuwa!
Join Date: Nov 2003
Age: 43
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[excerpt page 275 from "Ibara no Mori" - "Shiroki Bara" Chapter] 『私は、あの時本当にあなたと一緒に生きていけたらいいと思いました。けれど、ホームで私を待つあなたの横 顔を見ているうちに、それはとても困難であることがわかったのです。私とあなたが一緒に旅立った先に、何が 待っているでしょう。私は、私と出会ったことで、あなたをこれ以上傷つけたくはないのです。』 "At the time, I thought it would be dear to go by living along side with you. But, as I glimpsed your face at the station, I have realized how hard that reality would be. What will await us as we head for the unknown. I do not want to hurt you any more further because of me." Maria-sama ga Miteru Ibara no Mori, 1999.5.10, Konno Oyuki, printed by Shueisha/Cobalt Magazine Last edited by kj1980; 2004-04-07 at 02:46. |
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2004-04-07, 12:00 | Link #17 | |
the Iniquitous
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2004-04-07, 12:59 | Link #18 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Nobody even brought up that in Catholicism if you have a same-sex relationship you are committing a sin.
It's not a sin to be gay, they teach that someone may be 'wired' that way, but they should not give in to it. It's a sin if they then pursue a relationship. I honestly could care less, but I thought it was worth mentioning since Shiori was going to be a nun and seemed very devout in her religion. |
2004-04-07, 13:10 | Link #19 | |||||||||
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Now to go a little off topic.. Quote:
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Anway what Im trying to say is that I think people should live for others but must not forget themselves in the process. moving back on topic.. Quote:
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2004-04-07, 13:50 | Link #20 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: France
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yes Sei feels a destructive love for Shiori.
When I said that love between girls is "exclusive", I said that because at one time of my life, I had the same feeling as Sei's one. even if the girl who we love is near us, even if this girl loves us too, the conclusion is the hell: the obsession that we simply can't stop. Then the only "drug", which can help us to cure, is a sudden separation. Maybe Shiori has understand that and that's the reason she says she doesn't want to hurt Sei any more. Sei nourishes her feeling as long as she sees Shiori. Then it's really a good thing that Shiori hasn't come at the station... the day when the Sei's wound will have healed, she will be able to love again. but it takes time ;-) This form of love (Sei's love) can't be supported by anyone, even not Shiori who is a nun in her heart. to be a nun is not the reason to push back somebody. I think the author used this with an aim of perhaps make understandable that even a person who is a nun cannot support to be loved thus, while being the principal obsessions' subject of someone...ne ? |
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