Androphobia - fear of men

[-KarumA-]

Originally Posted by Comrade

Ok, I feel wise now might as well try to write something wise as well.

About the bullying. When I was in little, about 10 years old, I loved to bully others. Me and my brother often picked fights with other children in our neighborhood. When I went to school I also bullied some of my classmates (at least until one of them gave me a nice beating, that cured me of my nasty habit.)
However, I always followed a couple of rules.
1. Don't bully someone with a couple of friends behind your back.
2. DON'T BULLY GIRLS!- That's low.
3. Pick a target of your own age or much better, someone older, but leave the little one alone.

There are some things that can be deduced from these rules.
1. If someone picks on you with friends behind his back. It means, that he:
a. either feels insecure about his strength and needs backup in case something goes wrong.
b. needs someone to show off his strength to, in order to prove that he's the man.
c. is scared of you.
a&c are pretty similar, the difference is that the "C case" is less motivated to pick on you and will leave you alone much often than "A case".

How to solve this problem (sort of)?
Be aggressive, don't show that you are intimidated by the number of "enemies", don't go entirely on the defensive. For guys, if the situation resorts to a fight, hit back, as strong as you can. Of course you will be beaten bloody, when the entire "pack" jumps at you. But you will let them know, that you're not afraid of them. Very important, if the said person is picking you for the first time.
For girls, I don't think that the physical method is very popular (I'm a guy after all), my advice would be, don't remain silent. Be on "aggressive defense" (you're outnumbered after all)
A very useful method I always use is to remain polite. No matter how hard it is for yourself to be polite towards someone you don't like, smile, don't interrupt him, speak in normal volume, reply without swearwords, especially if every second word, coming from the other person is f***k, s***t or b***h. Talk, as if you are talking to a friend.
Nothing annoys the attacker, than a polite answer. By using swearwords, he is trying to provoke a similar action from you. However, if you remain calm and polite, he will start to feel like an idiot, because he is the only one who can't keep his temper.

2. I a guy is picking on a girl then he is ... I don't know what to say. Even at my school there were very few cases like this.
A guy, who is picking on you (for no apparent reason) has more problems than you. Either he is an impotent, or he has an older sister, who is bullying him. Anyway, guys like these need a specialist's help ... ASAP. No, seriously, a normal healthy guy doesn't bully girls.

3. Bully is a coward. Picking on younger people, means, that these are the only safe targets. Anyone older than his target is definitely a dangerous target.
Solution? Strike back. (I had a similar problem with a guy, who was two years older than I. Of course I lost the fight, but he left me alone after that incident.)

Of course, these assumptions are based on my past experience and thoughts. It doesn't mean, that they are foolproof.
Now, that I am older I leave others alone. In fact, now I am more of a diplomat, who tries to solve things peacefully.

... Comrade feels much better now ...

well not everyone played by the rules, i was teased from kindergarden up to 3rd year in high school and for starters i am a girl and at somepoint i was teased by my entire class, my teacher asked them before the question why, but they just said *shrug* i dont know...

in Highschool i ran away from gym class once cause they were all yelling at me for my preformance during baseball and when the principal found me he had a chat with me and eventually with the class as well, the class hated me even more after that, but it wasnt just me who was getting teased, they would follow me home and stand on the rooftop of a couple of garages behind our house and imitate my mother and act like idiots, my mother is a bit over weight, but not a lot, she is just like the parents of everyone of the kids that used to tease me and her

in highschool i got a Gymnasium recomendation (which is like the highest level to do in highschool) i was happy first because that meant goodbye previous classmates in Junior Hight and hello to a whole new class that thought bullying was silly, but my Junior High teacher told them that i had to be put down 2 levels for my mental health (teasing wasnt all, i was raped by my grandfather in the past and mentally abused by my sister because she flipped due this experiance, i never talked to a psy about it because i didnt talk to strangers at all, i didnt trust them let alone he was male so i was like leave me alone or i stab you with my pen, which i did and thank god he didnt sue me for it) so eventually i was put down 2 levels right in the class with all my teasers again, it was a horrible 2 years... teasing without reason even upper classmen i didnt know tried to hit on me and harras me and they would tease me eventually.. but it all bottled up and one day it all came lose and before i knew it i was trying to drown one of them in the fountain o.o; ever since the story thickened up and people were scared of me

i do agree with one thing you said and that is to be agressive, there was no way that teachers would help me out, in all the 12 years they bullied me they did nothing... i had to do it myself by having the courage to just say no and beat up a guy for it to end, words didnt help, trust me i tried to yell back at them they would just laugh and leave for the moment and come back later to start all over again

the bad thing is that people who tease dont usually know what they do with the person, for starters you put down their self confidence, thats what everyone knows, but do they actually know what it means? the confidence isnt just build up when you stop the teasing, there are tons of scars left that change your behavior in certain situation, when you go to a disco i feel like everyone is staring at you and is judging you and you get very nervous, when you go to a party with adults, like a relative festivity, you get scared of the people because there are men that you dont know, when you need to do a project in front of the class or read something out loud you shake and sometimes cant even speak because of the fear that someone might laugh in the back or call out your 'nickname' for not going by their standards, i find it stupid that teasers dont know what theyre doing to a person its mental abuse that can change a person forever and will haunt someone for the rest of their lives even if you think it will all be beter when they stop teasing, it takes years to even get the guts to introduce yourself to new people again without fearing that they will start teasing you or that they will hate you, it has been 9 years since ive been bullied but i am still very nervous about everything and still believe that people will tease me if i dont go by their standards and its not something that can be solved with words

[2H-Dragon]

You guys make the poor parts of Amsterdam sound like an Utopia. Sure I got beaten(I was outnumbered mind you) up twice in the 17years, I lived there. Those weren't because of classmates though. More like bored people. o_O

BTW there's nothing wrong to have a fear of men. Men are overrated anyhow. xD

Guys vs Girls is normal at primary school. Hell our whole class was basically divided in 2 factions, but we where a nice bunch of kids we didn't do much to hurt each other. The guys vs girls thing ended in the final 2 years of primary school. Guess we hit puberty fast?

[-KarumA-]

Originally Posted by 2H-Dragon

You guys make the poor parts of Amsterdam sound like an Utopia. Sure I got beaten(I was outnumbered mind you) up twice in the 17years, I lived there. Those weren't because of classmates though. More like bored people. o_O

BTW there's nothing wrong to have a fear of men. Men are overrated anyhow. xD

Guys vs Girls is normal at primary school. Hell our whole class was basically divided in 2 factions, but we where a nice bunch of kids we didn't do much to hurt each other. The guys vs girls thing ended in the final 2 years of primary school. Guess we hit puberty fast?

true, i always guessed Amsterdam was worse than my town on the eastern side of holland even if it is known to be very .. what you call it in english.. dutch is associaal, basically means people are rude, pick fights, hustle on the streets, drink in public and destroy gouverment property on a daily basis

[Traece]

I'll be honest. Despite the fact that I myself am I guy, I DO NOT like guys. Some people think it's the oddest thing but really I just can't stand dealing with them, they tend to get on my nerves easily. Very rarely do I meet a guy I can deal with on a friendly level. I've opened up a bit more recently but still I just can't find myself liking guys too much. I think it's how I grew up, all my friends have always been girls. So I ended up being a guyish-guy with lots of female friends. ^_^ You don't really have to fear guys, a majority of guys are perfectly harmless and a good half of them are probably just teddy bears on the inside. It's just about being smarter than the guys you deal with, you have to have a strong and sure aura that transmits pure self-confidence! You should never worry about what random guys say to you.

[Comrade]

-KarumA-

Hard to believe, that there are people like them out there. Where do such people come from?
About the part where all bottled up emotions come loose, I know how it feels. I myself have a temperament that could be classified as "A long fuse with lots of TNT at the end." And seriously, it can sometimes cause some serious problems. It's important to vent out these feelings once in a while. Play some sports or something else where strength is required, work yourself until you are exhausted, that helps a lot. And you feel better afterwards.

... Comrade feels much better now ...

[-KarumA-]

Originally Posted by Comrade

-KarumA-

Hard to believe, that there are people like them out there. Where do such people come from?
About the part where all bottled up emotions come loose, I know how it feels. I myself have a temperament that could be classified as "A long fuse with lots of TNT at the end." And seriously, it can sometimes cause some serious problems. It's important to vent out these feelings once in a while. Play some sports or something else where strength is required, work yourself until you are exhausted, that helps a lot. And you feel better afterwards.

... Comrade feels much better now ...

I dont know ask them, i never understood why they picked on me and why everyone just joined in on them, i guess it was like you have to join on the teasing to be part of the cool group yourself

[SeijiSensei]

Really, Gemstar, do you have clue how immature a comment like that makes you look when you post it to a serious thread like this one? Did you stop and think about how nathalie or Karuma might feel when they read it? Do you think it would encourage them to have a more positive view of men?

Usually I just shake my head and move along in cases like this one, but here I couldn't keep quiet.

Oh, and I'm another of those men who don't really like men in general all that much. Most seem so oblivious to the world of emotions and so uninterested in learning about them. It's like they cut themselves off from half their humanity.

Good luck to all of you who have posted such personal matters in this thread and kudos for sharing them here in public with the rest of us on AS.

[kujoe]

@Gemstar: Dude, what the hell?

Even if you were trying to be funny (read: you weren't), that wasn't a proper joke at all.

[Raykun]

wow i didn't even kno guys were that bad (im a guy ) and ya guys should never bully girls or touch em since it makes em lower then a useless dog yet its kinda depressing to hear this and dunno wat to say and for elementary school students bullying a girl .....dat is so rong....

[Shinndou]

Ouch, I guess that my attempt at bringing a few innocent smiles in this discussion failed miserably. I apologize.

To make up for it, I can only offer my humble personal opinion on the matter in return, if you are interested in reading it. I am no psychologist, therapist, or anything related to it, but I have a mother who's suffered of schizophrenia since and even slightly before I was born (I am an only son), so somehow I grew up used to deal with delicate matters. She's almost fully recovered now anyway, both thanks to the cure and to the fact that me and my dad always tried to support her and make her feel comfortable even in critical situations. Anyway, for your case and your fear of men, as far as I (and the other people here, I guess) can speculate on it and based on what you said so far, I can only suppose that it's caused by your fear of losing your intimacy and your privacy. I don't know what events and facts during your life shaped your personality like this, but it does seem that a combination of extreme shyness, introversion, fear of being "hurt" (whether it's phisically, emotionally, or mentally) has somehow lead you to this current phobia. I also don't know if you've ever been good or bad at socializing with people (but I could guess you might not be) so that might be have been an other factor. If it's just an unlucky combination of these factors (but as I said I don't know your personal situations or the events in your life that might have somehow conditioned you) then it's no big deal to worry about, as long as you are really willing to defeat your phobia. It takes courage, determination, and most of all it takes faith in yourself. Have confidence. If you don't have, find a reason to find it, set a clear defined goal to reach, and proceed step by step (even if those steps are little, as long as you're moving forward and improving your ability to relate yourself with guys and people in general). Men are not rabid beasts, just like any other being, there can be good and bad examples. But just like there's lot of "bad" people there's a lot of nice people, among men and women. The fact that you found the courage to talk about this, even if it's on the internet, it's already a sign that you do wish to defeat this phobia. Be more confident in yourself, and have no fear asking for help or simply an opinion to the people you trust (whether it's your family or your friends) on how to approach someone you don't know. As long as you get started, and you advance (even if it's slowly), you'll gradually defeat your fear. For example (this is just a very very vague possibility) if you have female friends to hang around with, you could ask them to bring along a guy they well know and trust, so that you can slowly begin to get used to it. It's usually a good thing to have a small group (even if it's just two or three people) to start getting used to it and to slowly build up confidence. Just don't give up, as long and as tough the path it may seem, all you have to do is to have confidence and proceed. There's lot of good people, men and women, who can help you, who can befriend you and who can share good memories with you. You're still in the teens so you're far from being "doomed", you have a whole life in front of you that you can use as you want. Look at me: I grew up with a schizophrenic mother but I never had any problem talking about it, and now she's practically fully recovered and is a normal person like any other. If something like schizophrenia can be defeated, even your fear of men can be, if you will.

[ImClueless]

Unfortunately in any social hierarchy there always has to be someone at the bottom of the pile. This can be observed in anything from children to a pack of wolves to a flock of chickens. The Omega wolf of the pack gets picked on by everyone, is the last to eat and likely stuck there for a lifetime. As adults it less obvious since we've had a whole bunch of rules drilled into us regarding proper conduct in modern society, but children are much less constrained by such things. Besides we can simply avoid such unpleasent people, while it is impossible in school. My guess would be that a study of playground politics would yield how everybody would interact if there was anarchy on earth. People join in the bullying because they are afraid that if they are not the bullys then one day they might become the bullied.

The Androphobia of the people posting here seems to be because they were bullied as children by guys. I don't think guys are more likely to bully than girls, but that just happened to be the experience of the posters here. I know I was a bit of a social outcast and bullied in elementary. I would stay in the classroom to avoid going out to the playground during recess and lunch. Eventually most of the people around me simply seemed to outgrow the whole bullying thing. They formed cliques instead, but thats a whole other can of worms. I was (and am) a softy nerdy guy with thick glasses which made me a pretty easy target.

[Kingdom]

Originally Posted by nathalie112689

Wow, this thread got a lot of feedback. I'm surprised.

By telling my story, I didn't mean to "öut"guys just because of what I've been through. I don't want anyone to get the wrong idea. But I do know my fear is quite irrational at times. I mean, guys in this thread are sympathesizing with me. I guess I'm a little surprised because I never thought about the possibility of it. I'm a little sad I'm am so ignorant.

For everyone who were asking about whether I am still in high school or not, the answer would be a no. I already graduated this June, and I'm starting college in September.

Well ... I am hoping college is going to be a lot better than high school. I still don't know how to move forward, though. Like Shana, when I was harassed, I would make my face look blank. But I didn't start out doing that. In the very beginning, I looked scared. Though I know even if I tried to make my face have no emotion, they would still know I was afraid b/c I wouldn't say anything. This is the method I've been hanging onto when I entered high school.

A possible solution (I think..?) would be talking about this with my therapist. Maybe that would be the beginning bridging to a solution?

Yes, I have a therapist. I recently started seeing one in late June, but the main reason why I have a therapist in the first place isn't because of guys. That's another story.

We're in the same boat (I'll be attending post-secondary in September too!). Anyways, I'm sorry to say I can't say I understand what you're going through but if it helps, I know most people our age have done a lot of growing up and most people that will encounter you (myself and probably almost everyone in this thread included) will accept you for who you are. I hope everything goes well for you in the future.

[Gemstar]

Is androphobia girls getting bullied ? Anyway if so. Make it a public scene. They target you specifically. So in other words make the happening that's happening to you noticeable to everyone there has to be someone out there willing to help and I don't think that is allowed in your school. I haven't read the posts to know but that can work. And if you have friends get them involved use them. What are they there for ? This is a problem YOU have and YOU have to deal with it and if you don't deal with it then never ending the problem is. Remember and if your friends don't have that problem might as well deal with your own right. Don't know if you are brave enough to try that if you are tell me if that works, can't think of anythign else that would work unless you beat them up yourself. Violent means. Peaceful means talk it out use psychology. If you really really want them to stop your words will get through that's humans for ya, they can feel even if they are evil they are born from good which is there parents. Without good evil cannot live, and that is fact. Anyway really really use your words you don't know how powerful it is. The mouth which God gave us very powerful. Take Presidents and Leaders for example impossible with words for them to be. Right, so...use your words and your brain. Mix up words, create ideas, and have faith in yourself, it should work.

[2H-Dragon]

Originally Posted by Gemstar

Is androphobia girls getting bullied ? Anyway if so. Make it a public scene. They target you specifically. So in other words make the happening that's happening to you noticeable to everyone there has to be someone out there willing to help and I don't think that is allowed in your school. I haven't read the posts to know but that can work. And if you have friends get them involved use them. What are they there for ? This is a problem YOU have and YOU have to deal with it and if you don't deal with it then never ending the problem is. Remember and if your friends don't have that problem might as well deal with your own right. Don't know if you are brave enough to try that if you are tell me if that works, can't think of anythign else that would work unless you beat them up yourself. Violent means. Peaceful means talk it out use psychology. If you really really want them to stop your words will get through that's humans for ya, they can feel even if they are evil they are born from good which is there parents. Without good evil cannot live, and that is fact. Anyway really really use your words you don't know how powerful it is. The mouth which God gave us very powerful. Take Presidents and Leaders for example impossible with words for them to be. Right, so...use your words and your brain. Mix up words, create ideas, and have faith in yourself, it should work.

androphobia=/=girls getting bullied, but girls getting bullied by boys gets them androphobia.

That's the whole problem though. Humans are a real bitch at that age. Logic doesn't work(hell even with full grown adults logic doesn't work politics anyone?). It might also surprise you what a bunch of cowards people are. People are help full, but in a situation where they might get a scar they do nothing. Hell they will even watch. The only people that tend to help are friends, but that applies to boys only most of the time. Teachers are a useless bunch if we talk about bullies and violence good at other stuffs though. D:

Originally Posted by -KarumA-

true, i always guessed Amsterdam was worse than my town on the eastern side of holland even if it is known to be very .. what you call it in english.. dutch is associaal, basically means people are rude, pick fights, hustle on the streets, drink in public and destroy gouverment property on a daily basis

o_O I always thought we where known as the nicest type of people going on the reaction I get from people. I worked in a giftshop. xD Though the people that think we are nice are actually people that came here. /yay for teh Netherlands.

Originally Posted by Traece

I'll be honest. Despite the fact that I myself am I guy, I DO NOT like guys. Some people think it's the oddest thing but really I just can't stand dealing with them, they tend to get on my nerves easily. Very rarely do I meet a guy I can deal with on a friendly level. I've opened up a bit more recently but still I just can't find myself liking guys too much. I think it's how I grew up, all my friends have always been girls. So I ended up being a guyish-guy with lots of female friends. ^_^ You don't really have to fear guys, a majority of guys are perfectly harmless and a good half of them are probably just teddy bears on the inside. It's just about being smarter than the guys you deal with, you have to have a strong and sure aura that transmits pure self-confidence! You should never worry about what random guys say to you.

You and me both, but I need some1 to play Pro Evo soccer with and Soul Calibur. D: No offense to girls, but they're not that fun when playing basketball or soccer. xD And when picking up girl it's better up to have wingmen no?


============================================

The best thing imo is to get a lot of gf's and hope you become lesbian!(and be my friend always wanted a lesbian friend D: ) or fall for a guy which serves for motivation to get over the fear(bad way to solve a problem tbh ) , but that's probably the most stupid suggestion I made, but I made it for the sake someone will get motivation to be lesbian. xD

Just keep in in mind it never hurts to have a lot friends(female or male) and even though there's a slim lightning strikes twice there's a bigger chance it doesn't.

[kujoe]

Originally Posted by 2H-Dragon

The best thing imo is to get a lot of gf's and hope you become lesbian!(and be my friend always wanted a lesbian friend D: ) or fall for a guy which serves for motivation to get over the fear(bad way to solve a problem tbh ) , but that's probably the most stupid suggestion I made, but I made it for the sake someone will get motivation to be lesbian. xD

While it can be said that there's a gender issue (and not of sexual identity per se) underlying their problems, I think you're taking it a bit too lightly when you put it that way.

Moreover, it doesn't really address the fundamental concern here.

[mrvetle]

...........

[Gemstar]

Originally Posted by kujoe

While it can be said that there's a gender issue (and not of sexual identity per se) underlying their problems, I think you're taking it a bit too lightly when you put it that way.

Moreover, it doesn't really address the fundamental concern here.

It's not a matter of taking it lightly. It is a problem. Maybe she cannot solve the problem and when you have a problem ; to solve it you try everything you can. And if it is a very deep problem you try ANYTHING you can. The problem is so difficult try no matter what you do, does not work. Nothing is impossible. Ever heard that saying. WHo knows if you look under a rock it might solve her problem. But here oyu have to be logical right, and what he says has logic to it even if you think it is light it is a way to deal with the problem despite what his sentence may be. It is still A WAY to approach her problem. ( You ain't tryin if you ain't cheatin ) Do you get what I am saying ? Just because you solve a problem certain ways does not have to be the same way another has to solve it. Try to see things from another's point of view. <--- Sentence of the day

[Diaboso]

I do admit that most guys these days are becoming more unethical. I mean what ever hapened to the days when respect ment everything? now most guys (even girls) do horible things to each other for no good reason other than a base desire or just being stupid. its sick really this slop has become so wide spread that people who refuse to accept being part of it have a hard time (including me). i mean it dosent ruin my life but it dose make it a little harder to find a girl friend because I just dont fit in with all this rudeness. but i think im straying from the subject.

so base line is this crud is becoming an everyday thing abd stuff happens...(think of it like being bit by a dog. to stupid and misbehaved to know what their doing)

[kujoe]

Originally Posted by Gemstar

It's not a matter of taking it lightly. It is a problem. Maybe she cannot solve the problem and when you have a problem ; to solve it you try everything you can. And if it is a very deep problem you try ANYTHING you can. The problem is so difficult try no matter what you do, does not work. Nothing is impossible. Ever heard that saying. WHo knows if you look under a rock it might solve her problem. But here oyu have to be logical right, and what he says has logic to it even if you think it is light it is a way to deal with the problem despite what his sentence may be. It is still A WAY to approach her problem. ( You ain't tryin if you ain't cheatin ) Do you get what I am saying ? Just because you solve a problem certain ways does not have to be the same way another has to solve it. Try to see things from another's point of view. <--- Sentence of the day

I said, "I think..." As in, "in my opinion," which is also an unsaid way of opening up the discussion further regarding this problem. Just like what you're doing right now. Of course, that's what I intended it to sound like.

Moreover, I was more focused with the way the thought was delivered and not just the thought itself. And in that case, you're right; it's exactly not about "taking it lightly". But it sounded that way to me, and I figure I'd mention it. I certainly wouldn't want to make a joke about it by mistake, or at least come across that way.

That wasn't the only thing I was commenting about either.

As for seeing other points of view, we are talking about this issue here, aren't we?

[2H-Dragon]

Originally Posted by Gemstar

It's not a matter of taking it lightly. It is a problem. Maybe she cannot solve the problem and when you have a problem ; to solve it you try everything you can. And if it is a very deep problem you try ANYTHING you can. The problem is so difficult try no matter what you do, does not work. Nothing is impossible. Ever heard that saying. WHo knows if you look under a rock it might solve her problem. But here oyu have to be logical right, and what he says has logic to it even if you think it is light it is a way to deal with the problem despite what his sentence may be. It is still A WAY to approach her problem. ( You ain't tryin if you ain't cheatin ) Do you get what I am saying ? Just because you solve a problem certain ways does not have to be the same way another has to solve it. Try to see things from another's point of view. <--- Sentence of the day

The dude has a point.

I tried to make it look I really don't know how to solve that problem since I'm not a girl and I don't really have a fear for woman and the girls I know should develop a fear for men imo. xD

My real advice was this though;

Originally Posted by 2H-Dragon

Just keep in in mind it never hurts to have a lot friends(female or male) and even though there's a slim lightning strikes twice there's a bigger chance it doesn't.

Originally Posted by kujoe

While it can be said that there's a gender issue (and not of sexual identity per se) underlying their problems, I think you're taking it a bit too lightly when you put it that way.

Moreover, it doesn't really address the fundamental concern here.

Well the main point is how to get rid of androphobia no? Might be a weird solution, but hey it's something.