2010-07-07, 14:46 | Link #13281 | |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2010-07-07, 14:48 | Link #13282 | ||
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Of course: Kinzo can refer to Kanon, therefore since "Kinzo" was excluded from "everyone else" then Kanon could have been in any kind of place.
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
|
||
2010-07-07, 14:50 | Link #13283 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Buffer overflow
|
Quote:
In other words, if Erika makes a blue truth that's logical and Beato doesn't respond, Beato dies (almost) instantly. On the other hand, if Erika doesn't guess the truth right on her first try, by "loading her gun" with all the blue truth she thinks she needs, she dies (almost) instantly as well. This is why Erika couldn't then, for example, check the closet for Kanon's corpse or even see who it was in there, if anyone. The instant Beato's red truth of "Kanon isn't in the guest room" took effect, the game was already over since Erika didn't have any blue prepared for that.
__________________
|
|
2010-07-07, 14:51 | Link #13284 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
Her theory was that his real name was George right? In this case we're theorizing he's a girl and that his real name is Rosa, Maria, or Eva or something like that.
Well I only see Kinzo's being referred to there, but whatever. I was thinking she escaped the check by just leaving before it was sealed.
__________________
|
2010-07-07, 14:58 | Link #13285 |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
|
Nothing prohibits Kanon from escaping the location check by being named Rosa, Maria, Kyrie, Natsuhi, or Eva, but it does prohibit him from being the rescuer. Since we know he is the rescuer, that can't work. Also, to escape the location check as anyone but Kinzo, Kanon has to be in the same room as the person being so named.
So it's unlikely he's one of the FT victims in name. Maybe Battler. But really, the Kinzo or one-of-the-five theories are the most viable ones.
__________________
|
2010-07-07, 15:01 | Link #13286 | ||
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Quote:
Quote:
PS: Ah you meant the 5 of the first twilight? Even those in the neighboring room are five! Well as Renall... ha... Erika didn't spot a possibility... I'll use Natsuhi as an example: Natsuhi was killed by Erika, but later she was transported inside the cousin's room. no need to explain why. At the same time Kanon whose real name is Natsuhi (no comment!) hid inside the room where Natsuhi was murdered (I said no comment!). In that way when Natsuhi's position was stated it was actually Kanon/Natsuhi's position, and Ushiromiya Natsuhi was among the everyone else in the cousins's room.
__________________
|
||
2010-07-07, 15:02 | Link #13287 | |
Shall we do it?
Graphic Designer
|
Quote:
That means Kanon is the lie. Because Kanon is the cake.
__________________
|
|
2010-07-07, 15:02 | Link #13288 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
|
I'd like to point that Shannon was in the neighboring room too, and only the seal of the door was checked for that room. She could have escaped from the window and with a kanon mask ( not simply necessarly, if the kanon+shannon theory it's true, there's no red that denies Shannon having multiple names ( Kanon, for instance ). When she checks for Kanon, she could not find him because she would check for the person she belive is Kanon, not Shannon ( who could have been in the closet instead )
As support of my theory, the only 2 red truth Battler used. # The neighboring room was certainly sealed, but at the time of the logic error, only the seal on the door was confirmed to be intact. # The people who were in the neighboring room at the time it was sealed were Hideyoshi, George, Kumasawa, Shannon, and Nanjo. And, there were exactly five people in the neighboring room. No one other than the people corresponding to those five names existed! All names refer only to the actual people! if this theory fails, RED me! |
2010-07-07, 15:07 | Link #13289 | |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
Quote:
Honestly people don't think it's denied they just think it's too obvious and convoluted, and lame. I've read some text in the duel that suggests Erika ghost too. and your wrong there is this red The only one who can claim Kanon's name is the person himself! and you have to twist it to either say "Shannon had his name the whole time" or "claiming names is not the same as inheriting them" for shkanon to work.
__________________
|
|
2010-07-07, 15:17 | Link #13290 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
|
Quote:
Her existance was denied just after Battler broke out of the logic error. More than a ghost she simply did not exist inside of Rokkenjima. Her actions never changed anything just because even if they welcome her, the actual number of people is seventeen. You cannot deny her existance out of the island, but you can deny it INSIDE. |
|
2010-07-07, 15:18 | Link #13291 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
|
Quote:
EDIT: can i also theorize that Knox 3rd ( It is forbidden for hidden passages to exist. ) may have been forced to restrict the game master actions. We know that Kuwadorian exist, and from ep (4?) we know that an hidden passage exists that leads to kuwadorian. I'm talking about the dungeon where Krauss and the other have been held when Crazy Goldsmith appeared. The original knox rule 3 said " no more than one" so we can theorize that at least one hidden passage exists |
|
2010-07-07, 15:20 | Link #13293 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
And duh again, That's the conclusion everybody comes to. But you have to acknowledge that until this episode you have had to twist the red this way for it to work, which this episodes emphasizes with it's peculiar reds that we shouldn't do. That's all I'm saying.
__________________
|
2010-07-07, 15:23 | Link #13294 |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
|
Honestly, I want there to be a solution not dependent on either Shkanon or Erika not existing. More than anything, that would be fantastic. However, as yet, I've not heard any theory that even comes close to that prospect. Even if you give Kanon another way out, you still have the number issue to deal with.
__________________
|
2010-07-07, 15:24 | Link #13295 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
I have proposed it once before. If we take the actual person reds literally. Since the names Genji and Jessica are not referred to in EP6 it is possible they are not actual people or they're names are not exclusive.
__________________
|
2010-07-07, 15:26 | Link #13296 | ||
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Quote:
This doesn't mean at all that the Game Master was disallowed from constructing a story where the window seal was broken. Considering this fact, ironically, the seal on the blue truth was more of a bother for the human side than for the witch side. In fact Erika find herself unable to formulate her theory and had to tell Dlanor to remove the seal. Quote:
__________________
|
||
2010-07-07, 15:28 | Link #13298 |
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
|
Let me formulate that mess with Kanon's name a bit more strictly.
The red "The only one who can claim Kanon's name is the person himself!" seems to explicitly deny the possibility of anyone posing as Kanon, and various Shkanon variants tend to assume a third person to which both names "Shannon" and "Kanon" legitimately belong, however, the way it is worded is patently weird. Just what is "claiming name"? Common language would hold that saying "I am Kanon" or doing anything to that effect is claiming Kanon's name. Responding to being addressed as Kanon is not necessarily "claiming his name", it is instead "claiming his place". If someone tells me, "Mr. X, please do so and so," when my name is actually Y, I may actually do that out of courtesy or for numerous other reasons without bothering to disillusion the person, and I can still be said not to be claiming the name X, just acting in X's place. I didn't say my name was X, I just let you think that I am. Now, if someone explicitly asked me to confirm my name is X, I would be claiming it if I responded, but nobody did that. Curiously, such behavior matches Kanon's usual style. Let me count the scenes where he does clearly claim the name "Kanon":
In fact, Kanon avoids saying his own name as if he hates it with a passion, which honestly, would not surprise me at all. While characters generally recognise each other and avoid introductions, for most of them, a moment comes up when someone asks "Who is it?" and they introduce themselves, or a different case where they affirm these names are actually that -- except for Kanon, who essentially only does it once in the entire series. As such, it is still possible for anyone to be presumed to be Kanon by responding to Kanon's name, if that interpretation of the red is accepted. The problem with that interpretation is that it renders the red about claiming the name simply meaningless. My guess would be that it is actually a clue instead, and something much more interesting had to require that particular phrasing.
__________________
|
2010-07-07, 15:31 | Link #13299 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
|
Quote:
|
|
2010-07-07, 15:31 | Link #13300 | |
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Or that his real name is Kinzo. It's not like I believe this, I'm simply reporting the most popular theory to explain Kanon's escape from the cousin room after Shkanon.
Quote:
__________________
|
|
|
|