AnimeSuki Forums

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-25, 10:04

Well it sucks for NMT users because FLAC audio in video files just doesn't play at all! you see the video, but no sound!

NMT: Networked Media Tank, a device used to watch movies, play musics, stream web radio, in most of them you can put a hard disk inside, very useful and much smaller than a computer and lightweight, so very convenient when you want to bring it around!

Yes i do own a NMT, it's an eGreat EG-M32B. I can watch Final Fantasy Advent Children Complete, the video having a 1920x1080 resolution and a very high bitrate (10 to 20mbps), DTS audio, and it plays without any lag! (file is around 10gb, really big, but still plays fine)

So why typical anime Blu-Ray rips are getting FLAC audio compression when they convert instead of DTS or AC3? i just don't get it.

Now i can't watch the nice Blu-Ray rips i downloaded such as White Album, K-On! and so on...

and everybody on this forum know that they always improve and/or add bonus stuff in Blu-Ray/DVD editions! (such as uncensored stuff, more details on backgrounds or better shadings, or added scenes...)

And it doesn't seem like NMTs are going to support FLAC in video files anytime soon! ...but they do support DTS and AC3 audio files really good!

Dark Shikari · 2009-08-25, 12:04

Or perhaps you could blame yourself for buying a crappy player without realizing that it won't play the world's most popular lossless audio format?

DmonHiro · 2009-08-25, 12:33

Excuse me? FLAC? Bad? With all due respect, are you out of your mind? FLAC is the future of audio encoding, and provides excellent audio quality to supplement the great video quality of Bluray disks. You think it's bad because it doesn't work on "random media player number 32"? FLAC was made for Bluray disks and PCs. If it will work on anything else, that's gust gravy.

TheFluff · 2009-08-25, 13:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaptorZX3

NMT: Networked Media Tank, a device used to watch movies, play musics, stream web radio, in most of them you can put a hard disk inside, very useful and much smaller than a computer and lightweight, so very convenient when you want to bring it around!

As someone who has encoded more than one of these releases you complain so bitterly about: sorry, but I do not provide playback support for small plastic toys (if I did people would be going "But it doesn't play on my ToyPlayer X500! Please use codec x/scale to resolution y/disable feature z" until I was encoding 320x240 MPEG4 SP or something). Use a real computer with a real player. Or, you know, re-encode the audio to ac3 or something, it's trivial to do.

Oh, and by the way, the alternative is Dolby TrueHD, and I doubt your small plastic toy supports that either.

See also http://www.mod16.org/hurfdurf/?p=24

emptyeighty · 2009-08-25, 13:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheFluff

Or, you know, re-encode the audio to ac3 or something, it's trivial to do.

Especially since this is one of the rare cases where you have a lossless source to work with.

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-25, 19:48

sorry but ALL of the NMTs on the market doesn't play FLAC audio in video files. They play practically all kinds of audio in video files, except FLAC for some strange reasons...

FLAC is the most popular? well i still prefer MP3 only for the file size, and for the heck of it, just put 320kbps when encoding it...

plus...trivial to re-encode FLAC to AC3? you have to re-encore the whole video also as far as i know, i tried to convert/re-encode videos before, and it takes about a hour each episode (i don't have a dual/triple/quad-core CPU yet)

totoum · 2009-08-25, 20:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaptorZX3

plus...trivial to re-encode FLAC to AC3? you have to re-encore the whole video also as far as i know

If the file is an mkv you can just extract the audio file , convert it (it will take a lot less time to convert than a video file) and remux an mkv with the new audio file.

Craymel · 2009-08-25, 20:56

Stop blaming codecs for the shortcomings of the devices you use to play them.

Vexx · 2009-08-25, 21:04

Plastic box devices are exactly that... simplistic stuff that handles what Joe Public knows about. Many MP3 players won't do FLAC either. The purpose of FLAC and its strength is its losslessness - you can always re-encode to a lossy format for "field use".
People interested enough to download the hog-monsters that are blu-ray rips usually want the audio to be just as beautiful as the video.

No one sells an adequate media box (NMT whatever). Home-built still wins over all of them, especially if you know how to build a fanless box with adequate cooling.

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-25, 21:22

Plastic boxes?? watch it, because these are not the cheap-ass NMTs i'm talking about, but powerful and quality NMTs, not some crappy no-brand or cheap ones like the Western Digital media player that lags everytime you want to play a HD movie! My NMT have a Sigma Designs SMP8635, good enough to play high-bitrate HD movies without any lags.

link to processor specs (PDF):
http://www.sigmadesigns.com/Products...SMP8630_br.pdf

NMTs are made to be a great way to watch movies, less power consuming, and also at more affordable price than buying a whole computer that would cost you 500+$

Personally i like to use my NMT to watch movies and anime episodes. DTS is also a great encoding for audio, in fact, it should be DTS or DTS-HD on the Blu-Ray disc.

so then why PMPs doesn't play FLACs? mine do (SmartQ T5-II), but it's made to play AVI/MP4/RMVB/FLV/MPG movies, not MKV movie containers with FLAC-encoded audio, it doesn't play HD videos, but i'm waiting for SmartDevices to release a good-enough PMP right now

i prefer to say PMP (Portable Media Player), since they're not only MP3 players now, but multimedia players.

Vexx · 2009-08-25, 21:31

They should be able to take codec packages as they evolve and update and new ones appear. If they can't do that, they're crippled.

I'm always on the look out for such a device -- so far none has really met my expectation better than a homebrew. And no, if you have a good parts supplier in your area - it should be far less than $500 for a homebrew (unless you want some shiny splendiferous case for it).

Thanks for the PMP acronym... "mp3 player" sounds so silly any more.

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-25, 22:23

so far my NMT played ALL videos perfectly, except those with FLAC audio.

i think it's because of some copyrights reasons, not sure

synaesthetic · 2009-08-25, 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexx

They should be able to take codec packages as they evolve and update and new ones appear. If they can't do that, they're crippled.

I'm always on the look out for such a device -- so far none has really met my expectation better than a homebrew. And no, if you have a good parts supplier in your area - it should be far less than $500 for a homebrew (unless you want some shiny splendiferous case for it).

Thanks for the PMP acronym... "mp3 player" sounds so silly any more.

I haven't seen a "black box" that can do it all yet. Homebrew HTPCs still lead the pack, though some of the new ultra-tiny "nettops" might give us a very small, very quiet all-in-one solution better than the standard HTPC.

PMP (portable media player) generally refers to players prioritizing video first, everything else second, and DAP (digital audio player) refers to portables with music first, video second (or not at all)...

And considering the new Intel consumer ultra-low voltage processors, and the dual-core variants coming out soon... things might get interesting for fanless HTPC designs!

0utf0xZer0 · 2009-08-25, 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaptorZX3

so far my NMT played ALL videos perfectly, except those with FLAC audio.

i think it's because of some copyrights reasons, not sure

I will admit that if it can play all the various subtitle types out there without flaws, it's pretty impressive since I've never heard of a consumer device that could do that. That said... this sort of problem is exactly why I don't bother with these sorts of devices.

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-26, 00:45

HTPCs still take a lot of space, and requires more power than a very small NMT.

Or then you will have to buy a Mini ITX that's not even sure of playing HD videos flawlessly since they are much slower than normal CPUs, not even optimized to play videos but more for multi-tasking.

@synaesthetic: if someday they come up with FLAC compatibility for NMTs, they will just do all formats used right now, FLAC is the only one missing in there, sadly...

emptyeighty · 2009-08-26, 01:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaptorZX3

sorry but ALL of the NMTs on the market doesn't play FLAC audio in video files. They play practically all kinds of audio in video files, except FLAC for some strange reasons...

I don't think you've looked hard enough.

Quote:

plus...trivial to re-encode FLAC to AC3? you have to re-encore the whole video also as far as i know, i tried to convert/re-encode videos before, and it takes about a hour each episode (i don't have a dual/triple/quad-core CPU yet)

What the heck gave you that idea? Just demux the audio and do what you want with it, then remux. That goes for any container, not just mkv.

Quote:

Plastic boxes?? watch it, because these are not the cheap-ass NMTs i'm talking about, but powerful and quality NMTs

Quote:

so far my NMT played ALL videos perfectly, except those with FLAC audio.

i think it's because of some copyrights reasons, not sure

How are they "powerful and quality" if they don't even implement a free-as-in-beer format? There aren't any copyright reasons against using FLAC. In fact anyone can implement the format without prior permission. And as if that wasn't enough FLAC libraries are released under the business-friendly BSD license. So your NMT not supporting FLAC is just the company behind it not doing their homework.

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-26, 02:19

Personally i don't know why, just ask THEM (Syabas, the creator of PopCornHour) why!

And that's the C-200, it's going to be released soon and i heard it's got a more powerful processor as well. But the SMP8635 is good enough to play 1080p files fine, as long as it doesn't have FLAC audio...

Wow...it's funny how peoples gets offended for almost nothing, and then someone will be offended by this :-P

xris · 2009-08-26, 02:35

What exactly is the point of this thread? It seems you created it just to whinge and whine that some random black box media player doesn't work. If you have a problem with your NMT device then go and complain to NMT, what's the point of posting here.

This is the Playback Help forum, how are people expected to help you in this situation?

RaptorZX3 · 2009-08-26, 03:04

ok so which software is good for demuxing that will also keep my subtitles?

emptyeighty · 2009-08-26, 03:40

For demuxing use mkvextract from mkvtoolnix. It's a command line app. If you need a gui use mkvextractgui and extract that to mkvtoolnix's folder.

Muxing doesn't do anything to your subtitles unless you actually tell it to remove them.

2009-08-25, 10:04	Link #1
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	FLAC on Blu-Ray rips are BAD, why? check here Well it sucks for NMT users because FLAC audio in video files just doesn't play at all! you see the video, but no sound! NMT: Networked Media Tank, a device used to watch movies, play musics, stream web radio, in most of them you can put a hard disk inside, very useful and much smaller than a computer and lightweight, so very convenient when you want to bring it around! Yes i do own a NMT, it's an eGreat EG-M32B. I can watch Final Fantasy Advent Children Complete, the video having a 1920x1080 resolution and a very high bitrate (10 to 20mbps), DTS audio, and it plays without any lag! (file is around 10gb, really big, but still plays fine) So why typical anime Blu-Ray rips are getting FLAC audio compression when they convert instead of DTS or AC3? i just don't get it. Now i can't watch the nice Blu-Ray rips i downloaded such as White Album, K-On! and so on... and everybody on this forum know that they always improve and/or add bonus stuff in Blu-Ray/DVD editions! (such as uncensored stuff, more details on backgrounds or better shadings, or added scenes...) And it doesn't seem like NMTs are going to support FLAC in video files anytime soon! ...but they do support DTS and AC3 audio files really good!

2009-08-25, 20:56	Link #8
Craymel Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008	Stop blaming codecs for the shortcomings of the devices you use to play them. __________________ For proper anime playback use: CCCP--Mplayer--Perian

2009-08-25, 21:04	Link #9
Vexx Obey the Darkly Cute ... Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ... Age: 66	Plastic box devices are exactly that... simplistic stuff that handles what Joe Public knows about. Many MP3 players won't do FLAC either. The purpose of FLAC and its strength is its losslessness - you can always re-encode to a lossy format for "field use". People interested enough to download the hog-monsters that are blu-ray rips usually want the audio to be just as beautiful as the video. No one sells an adequate media box (NMT whatever). Home-built still wins over all of them, especially if you know how to build a fanless box with adequate cooling. __________________ "It Really IS Rocket Science", Novel series rough drafts; vol. 1 thru vol. 3 complete Volume 4 in work, Visit the thread for short stories!

2009-08-25, 21:31	Link #11
Vexx Obey the Darkly Cute ... Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ... Age: 66	They should be able to take codec packages as they evolve and update and new ones appear. If they can't do that, they're crippled. I'm always on the look out for such a device -- so far none has really met my expectation better than a homebrew. And no, if you have a good parts supplier in your area - it should be far less than $500 for a homebrew (unless you want some shiny splendiferous case for it). Thanks for the PMP acronym... "mp3 player" sounds so silly any more. __________________ "It Really IS Rocket Science", Novel series rough drafts; vol. 1 thru vol. 3 complete Volume 4 in work, Visit the thread for short stories!

2009-08-25, 12:04	Link #2
Dark Shikari x264 Developer Join Date: Feb 2008	Or perhaps you could blame yourself for buying a crappy player without realizing that it won't play the world's most popular lossless audio format?

2009-08-25, 12:33	Link #3
DmonHiro Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Romania Age: 37	Excuse me? FLAC? Bad? With all due respect, are you out of your mind? FLAC is the future of audio encoding, and provides excellent audio quality to supplement the great video quality of Bluray disks. You think it's bad because it doesn't work on "random media player number 32"? FLAC was made for Bluray disks and PCs. If it will work on anything else, that's gust gravy.

2009-08-25, 19:48	Link #6
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	sorry but ALL of the NMTs on the market doesn't play FLAC audio in video files. They play practically all kinds of audio in video files, except FLAC for some strange reasons... FLAC is the most popular? well i still prefer MP3 only for the file size, and for the heck of it, just put 320kbps when encoding it... plus...trivial to re-encode FLAC to AC3? you have to re-encore the whole video also as far as i know, i tried to convert/re-encode videos before, and it takes about a hour each episode (i don't have a dual/triple/quad-core CPU yet)

2009-08-25, 21:22	Link #10
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	Plastic boxes?? watch it, because these are not the cheap-ass NMTs i'm talking about, but powerful and quality NMTs, not some crappy no-brand or cheap ones like the Western Digital media player that lags everytime you want to play a HD movie! My NMT have a Sigma Designs SMP8635, good enough to play high-bitrate HD movies without any lags. link to processor specs (PDF): http://www.sigmadesigns.com/Products...SMP8630_br.pdf NMTs are made to be a great way to watch movies, less power consuming, and also at more affordable price than buying a whole computer that would cost you 500+$ Personally i like to use my NMT to watch movies and anime episodes. DTS is also a great encoding for audio, in fact, it should be DTS or DTS-HD on the Blu-Ray disc. so then why PMPs doesn't play FLACs? mine do (SmartQ T5-II), but it's made to play AVI/MP4/RMVB/FLV/MPG movies, not MKV movie containers with FLAC-encoded audio, it doesn't play HD videos, but i'm waiting for SmartDevices to release a good-enough PMP right now i prefer to say PMP (Portable Media Player), since they're not only MP3 players now, but multimedia players.

2009-08-25, 22:23	Link #12
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	so far my NMT played ALL videos perfectly, except those with FLAC audio. i think it's because of some copyrights reasons, not sure

2009-08-26, 00:45	Link #15
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	HTPCs still take a lot of space, and requires more power than a very small NMT. Or then you will have to buy a Mini ITX that's not even sure of playing HD videos flawlessly since they are much slower than normal CPUs, not even optimized to play videos but more for multi-tasking. @synaesthetic: if someday they come up with FLAC compatibility for NMTs, they will just do all formats used right now, FLAC is the only one missing in there, sadly...

2009-08-26, 02:19	Link #17
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	Personally i don't know why, just ask THEM (Syabas, the creator of PopCornHour) why! And that's the C-200, it's going to be released soon and i heard it's got a more powerful processor as well. But the SMP8635 is good enough to play 1080p files fine, as long as it doesn't have FLAC audio... Wow...it's funny how peoples gets offended for almost nothing, and then someone will be offended by this :-P

2009-08-26, 02:35	Link #18
xris Just call me Ojisan Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: U.K. Hampshire	What exactly is the point of this thread? It seems you created it just to whinge and whine that some random black box media player doesn't work. If you have a problem with your NMT device then go and complain to NMT, what's the point of posting here. This is the Playback Help forum, how are people expected to help you in this situation?

2009-08-26, 03:04	Link #19
RaptorZX3 Junior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Quebec, Canada	ok so which software is good for demuxing that will also keep my subtitles?

2009-08-26, 03:40	Link #20
emptyeighty Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006	For demuxing use mkvextract from mkvtoolnix. It's a command line app. If you need a gui use mkvextractgui and extract that to mkvtoolnix's folder. Muxing doesn't do anything to your subtitles unless you actually tell it to remove them.