(L) UQ Holder (Ken Akamatsu's new series)

[AstroNerdBoy]

Originally Posted by Shinji103

But speaking as an Eva fan now, I demand we have at least one story arc where Eva is robbed of whatever magic allows her to change her form so we can see old Eva again. Just for the proverbial bone throw.

I could go for that, but I would want it done as a segue to explore Eva's past right after she was made a vampire, but had no powers. Seriously, Akamatsu-sensei could spend an entire volume on that (or more) and I think he should.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

That's one thing, but i belive her time spend with Touta plays equaly important role. Taking care about something force someone mature, which is something she never had to do in her whole immortal life

I agree. While she may have founded UQ Holder, that's not the same as maternally caring for someone. So, the girl who could never have a child suddenly becomes foster mother to ten year old boy and has to provide and care for him. The result is Yukihime (though the folks at UQ Holder knew her as Yukihime prior to her taking care of Touta).

[aidos]

To the ppl who read all the chapters I want to ask something, after a long time finally I completed Negima and i want to know if UQ Holder is really a sequence, I saw some post and view a few pages of first chapter so I know that the first chapter dont say too much about negi and the others, but after so many chapters do we get some info about them?
Because for me negima ended with so many things unfinished and i dont want to waste my time again with this serie and have another unfinished end

[AstroNerdBoy]

Negi, Al, Chachamaru, Mana, Fate, Kaede, and Zazie get a cameo (I've got an image here).

Additional: Has anyone purchased the Japanese tankoubon for volume 1?

[OverMaster]

Originally Posted by Hollownerox

Also what is with Japan's obsession with protagonists that are stupid? Negi was a refreshing character simply because he had some form of common sense (Though he still had his moments, but the guy was ten). Seriously, you don't need to be intellectually deficient to have suicidal heroic resolve, I miss the times where determination wasn't correlated with stupidity.

I'd really like to see a series where the protagonist's idiot tendencies actually do what behaving like an idiot in a real world dangerous setting would do, and screw his team over, because the thing with these series is they actually never punish (or worse, even reward) stupid or reckless behavior, or at most someone smarter covers for them, then the idiot outdoes them and he's never really called out on it beyond a few token insults that fly right out of his other ear at most.

Touta being so careless about turning into a nearly mindless monster is something that doesn't relate in any way to anyone who isn't mentally ill would ever do. Hell, the idiocy or airheadness isn't even a real excuse, because even Makie, Miss No Worries herself, would worry in a situation like this (one of the main reasons why she was so careless was she was actually leading a fairly positive and well set life. Even in Mundus Magicus, she landed better than most- she wasn't treated like a slave or had a bounty on her head). It makes him less of a character and more of a walking glut of exaggerated Shonen traits. Yes, even 'dumb' people can worry, can fear for their own stability and what it means for others. Being 'dumb' isn't a free pass to behave like an... alien sort of thing who lives to have stock reactions.

Most of it is from people who are still bitter over Negima's ending.

Antecedents mean a lot. An author doesn't magically become a different person to be judged anew after starting another series, especially one set in the same universe and using the same mythology. Even if it's a different work, it still comes from the same guy; that's why, to take an admittedly extreme but clear example, you already can smell what's coming whenever a new Uwe Boll movie is announced, and no one will tell you then 'Oh, you're just saying that because you're still bitter about Alone in the Dark or Bloodrayne'. Especially considering most authors tend to reach a peak and then a declive point they rarely can recover from (the infamous Jump the Shark-Fallen Creator point). Until that recovery point is reached, it's perfectly valid considering their already observed flaws and missteps, and suspecting the patterns will repeat themselves again (especially since UQ is already showing, and augmented, many of Negima's worst vices, like the exaggerated fixation on the protagonist's powering up).

is due to how hard it hit her to end up parting with everyone from Negima as she lived on while they all died from natural age

We have no idea about them all dying of natural age. Seeing how the world, while they still were of an age to be alive, was ravaged by disasters of a global nature the likes of which the real world has never seen during the history of mankind, not even close, I'd think at least a few of them, who were likely in the lines of danger, died prematurely.

I'd hope for the UQ headquarters or the Elevator at least to have some memorials to those who made them possible in the first place, regardless of how they died. I mean, that's basic respect for those without whom the Magical World wouldn't even be there by then. Harp on me for defending Negima if you want, but the fact is the setting is basically sweeping all the non immortals and what they did under the rug as if they never existed at all, seemingly mostly for the sake of gratuitously keeping readers in the dark instead of letting the series develop their own mysteries, not living on the rent of those of the previous series.

And even if you want to argue the world turned against Negi and what he stood for for the most part after whatever happened with the Lifemaker, Eva would know better, at least in HER place there should be some token she actually gave that people some respect instead of brushing them under the rug and walking away without ever looking back. There's a difference between moving on and just dropping all memories of those who made their own share of sacrifices like a bad habit.

You don't even have to devote that much time to it, if you want the series to stand on its own legs (for which it being its own universe would have been better anyway). Just some quick 'oh by the way, this was your freaking grandmother, she was a great person, these are her comrades, they did a lot, you weren't born from thin air, blah blah let's go eat' would at least show they somewhat care.

It's just that the girls ratio is waaaaaaaay lower than what we got for Negima, even after it became a shounen, so you might find it lacking.

Why must it always be either Pink Bishoujo Ghetto or Male Ghetto (especially in a series set in the future, where you'd think women became more active and prominent, instead of the genders taking ten steps back)? Why can't they ever reach a balance between the genders?

[Requiem-x]

Originally Posted by OverMaster

Touta being so careless about turning into a nearly mindless monster is something that doesn't relate in any way to anyone who isn't mentally ill would ever do. Hell, the idiocy or airheadness isn't even a real excuse, because even Makie, Miss No Worries herself, would worry in a situation like this (one of the main reasons why she was so careless was she was actually leading a fairly positive and well set life. Even in Mundus Magicus, she landed better than most- she wasn't treated like a slave or had a bounty on her head). It makes him less of a character and more of a walking glut of exaggerated Shonen traits. Yes, even 'dumb' people can worry, can fear for their own stability and what it means for others. Being 'dumb' isn't a free pass to behave like an... alien sort of thing who lives to have stock reactions.

Agreed, and this is really the big problem with Touta, he's just a mishmash of shounen cliches, as if gathering as many tropes as possible would create the quintessential protagonist. You'd think someone with enough talent to turn a harem into a pretty good shounen would know the difference.

Worst of all, the respective tropes are dumbed down themselves, or deformed to suit whatever view of Touta we're supposed to have. Let's take a look:

-Touta's dream? get to the top of a tower, which is a variation of "I'm climbing that mountain because its there!", the most basic, barebones idea of "hotblood" and "romance". I don't know if Oda would approve, but I hope he doesn't.
No interest whatsoever in the opposite sex? Touta won't just act like it, he'll outright say it, while only having any kind of feelings for the girl that is basically his mom. Worst part is, I can see that gender neutral attitude as a reason to make girls fall for him.
-Look up to someone else and struggle to be like them? Touta can do that in a couple days, and then improve upon his idols just like that.
-Worrying about the world and its current state? You can totally do that after a couple weeks in the slums, most of it offscreen.
-What the hell was up with that "these kids beat you, not me" part? Sure, that one kid was incredibly brave, I wish we could follow someone like that instead of mr incompetent, but something there still felt lacking, like, we haven't given enough reason for Touta to say that.
-Him not giving the whole magia erebea deal a second thought? As common as that is in shounen manga, usually the characters going through something like that want to find out about it when given the chance, or at least have some sort of excuse to disregard it like "at least I can use it to help others", which Touta doesn't have because he doesn't seem to like using it that much.

I hope we can get something like afterwords or character profiles soon, because I want to know what the hell was the thinking process behind this kid.

Originally Posted by OverMaster

Why must it always be either Pink Bishoujo Ghetto or Male Ghetto (especially in a series set in the future, where you'd think women became more active and prominent, instead of the genders taking ten steps back)? Why can't they ever reach a balance between the genders?

I was saying that only in regards to negima, I don't mind if this doesn't become a harem fest as long the characters aren't utterly unlikable. Of course you can have balance, look at Neuro, which had like, what, three or four relevant females (outside of specific arcs, that is) in its 200 chapters running.

[AstroNerdBoy]

Overmaster and Requiem-X -- you two have pretty much nailed it.

I was working on my blog review for volume 1 of the manga. (Which BTW, has anyone picked up the Japanese tankoubon? I'm curious if Kodansha Comics scrapped any extras that might have been in the manga.) As I reread the first six chapters, I became somewhat depressed as I remembered how I'd hoped that Touta's and Eva's journey (along with the eventual Kuroumaru) would be one where Touta was educated about immortality, thus giving us a means to explore Eva's past, and even Kuroumaru's past, to say nothing of giving us actual character development. Alas, that was not to be.

[Requiem-x]

Originally Posted by AstroNerdBoy

Overmaster and Requiem-X -- you two have pretty much nailed it.

Thank you. I find it a compliment that someone as good with in-depth thinking for manga as yourself says that. And thanks for keeping up the good, detailed replies, Overmaster.

Originally Posted by AstroNerdBoy

I was working on my blog review for volume 1 of the manga. (Which BTW, has anyone picked up the Japanese tankoubon? I'm curious if Kodansha Comics scrapped any extras that might have been in the manga.) As I reread the first six chapters, I became somewhat depressed as I remembered how I'd hoped that Touta's and Eva's journey (along with the eventual Kuroumaru) would be one where Touta was educated about immortality, thus giving us a means to explore Eva's past, and even Kuroumaru's past, to say nothing of giving us actual character development. Alas, that was not to be.

That's never a good sign for any manga Yeah, we deviated fast and hard from what seemed the obvious path to follow. Was it an attempt to make it closer to negima, I wonder? Because if that's the case, it's not working. The only upside I see to this is that we got some huge negima references fast, and of course, the beautiful and awesome Karin Ok, so maybe it wasn't such a bad idea It seems no matter how you cut it, Touta is the problem.

[Dargor]

Originally Posted by Requiem-x

It seems no matter how you cut it, Touta is the problem.

If Touta (wanked or not) was the only problem this series had, it wouldn't be that egregious. The narrative is structured haphazardly while doing nothing to expound on what might be some of the more interesting aspects of dealing with a immortal crew. Instead of clearing the underground labyrinth in just eight months, it should've taken a few years at least to hammer home the whole "Holy shit, you're immortal" aspect. ME, plot tumor that it is, should have been saved at the very least for the second arc so that the first one can actually be used to give some characters proper development, giving Kuro and anyone else a little time to shine. We should've had a proper starter villain as opposed to Kaito and Nagumo, who would better serve to kick start whatever 'plot' this series is going for, and the ME plot give me would not look anywhere near as bad if it was saved until them.

The series is just put together poorly as a whole. There's something resembling a cool story underneath, but Akamatsu doesn't seem to have the writing chops (or interest) he had a few years ago. This is very by the books and mediocre as a whole. Not appallingly bad, but just sort of...there.

[Requiem-x]

I understand and agree with your points, however, most of the choices in terms of plot, while not the most apprppiate, have at best gotten a "huh, that's weird" out of me, but Touta in general confuses and bores me. I believe any series can be salvaged regardless of plot if the characters are good enough, so that might be it.

I'll correct my statement then: The series has quite a few problems, but I'd say Touta is the worst so far.

[Avrorrange]

Spoiler for chapter 33:

Turns out Kirie did try to tell Touta what happened, but she only wanted to do so at the last minute because the more changes there are in the past, the more the future deviates.If he knows what would happen in advance, he would most likely do something unnatural and alert the assassin(and he almost did when he got told what happened). In the six times Kirie got killed,she told Touta to touch her just so they can go back into time together.However, Touta would run off each time trying to chase the assassin. As it turned out, the assassin is hired by UQ Holder's main enemy, Fate Averruncus. Fate is now the STRONGEST MAGICIAN OF THE SOLAR SYSTEM.It's also been revealed that Negi is Touta's MATERNAL grandfather. When Kirie told Negi that Fate is his maternal grandfather's friend,rival and ally he has no idea how his grandfather's related to anything they are doing or how his grandfather knows such a person.

[felbermudez]

could it be that fate is possesed by the mage o the begining like zect and nagi?

[Dargor]

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by Moe Connection

Spoiler for chapter 33:

Turns out Kirie did try to tell Touta what happened, but she only wanted to do so at the last minute because the more changes there are in the past, the more the future deviates.If he knows what would happen in advance, he would most likely do something unnatural and alert the assassin(and he almost did when he got told what happened). In the six times Kirie got killed,she told Touta to touch her just so they can go back into time together.However, Touta would run off each time trying to chase the assassin. As it turned out, the assassin is hired by UQ Holder's main enemy, Fate Averruncus. Fate is now the STRONGEST MAGICIAN OF THE SOLAR SYSTEM.It's also been revealed that Negi is Touta's MATERNAL grandfather. When Kirie told Negi that Fate is his maternal grandfather's friend,rival and ally he has no idea how his grandfather's related to anything they are doing or how his grandfather knows such a person.

The word you're looking for is fraternal. You can't say someone is their maternal father because of obvious reasons.

Spoiler:

As for everything else, let the Fate shilling and convenient plot give mes to make him a threat begin. Fate was certainly a powerful fighter in Negima, but he was not a top tier fighter. All the high end fighters outstrip him by far, and now he's...what, the strongest Mage out there? And UQ Holder, a group of flubbing immortals, has nothing to match him? Let me guess, Eva was depowered because of some convenient thing that happened in the past to try and artificially up the tension to make Fate a legitimate threat. For gods sake, the boy already has the ability to petrify people. That alone should actually make him a threat to UQ Holder. You don't need to introduce anything new Akamatsu. No, really, you don't.

Its only fair to wait for the actual chapter, but if all of that is accurate...well, I'm really not that surprised at this point. Here's to hoping its not.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Dargor

Spoiler:

As for everything else, let the Fate shilling and convenient plot give mes to make him a threat begin. Fate was certainly a powerful fighter in Negima, but he was not a top tier fighter. All the high end fighters outstrip him by far, and now he's...what, the strongest Mage out there? And UQ Holder, a group of flubbing immortals, has nothing to match him? Let me guess, Eva was depowered because of some convenient thing that happened in the past to try and artificially up the tension to make Fate a legitimate threat. For gods sake, the boy already has the ability to petrify people. That alone should actually make him a threat to UQ Holder. You don't need to introduce anything new Akamatsu. No, really, you don't.

Its only fair to wait for the actual chapter, but if all of that is accurate...well, I'm really not that surprised at this point. Here's to hoping its not.

Spoiler for new chapter:

Fate wasn't a top tier fighter in Negima? Seriously? He was clearly quite a bit better than his brother and sister Averrunci. The only people I would say were above him were Rakan, Nagi, Negi, Eva and the Lifemaker. It's been over 70 years since then and unlike his brethren, Fate can learn and grow. I don't find it surprising if he got stronger.

[Dargor]

Spoiler:

Seriously. Fate was consistently trounced by said top tier, and he would've ultimately be overshadowed by the Lifemaker had the series actually continue. I still find it somewhat ridiculous that there's no one in a group of immortals that can actually match him through magic save Eva, but if she actually turns out to have regressed for whatever reason...meh. Like I said, he doesn't even need any improvement to actually be a powerful threat to UQ Holder. The petrification by itself would solve a lot of the problems one would deal with when it comes to immortals.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Dargor

Spoiler:

Seriously. Fate was consistently trounced by said top tier, and he would've ultimately be overshadowed by the Lifemaker had the series actually continue. I still find it somewhat ridiculous that there's no one in a group of immortals that can actually match him through magic save Eva, but if she actually turns out to have regressed for whatever reason...meh. Like I said, he doesn't even need any improvement to actually be a powerful threat to UQ Holder. The petrification by itself would solve a lot of the problems one would deal with when it comes to immortals.

Spoiler for new chapter:

It's been around seventy years since then, and Fate, unlike his brethren can change and grow, so I don't see what's so outrageous about him getting stronger.

Being immortal doesn't exactly equal being super amazing at magic though. Al is older than Eva, would you say that he's stronger than her? We know for a fact that he's weaker than Nagi, who is practically a baby by his standards. There's nothing odd about anyone other than Eva not being able to match him.

[amtro]

Spoiler for :

Touta detractors and reincarnation theory faboys got BTFO. Magia is confirmed to be inherited by the descendants of Negi. Page upon page with speculation and denial, made null and void in one fell swoop. Feels soooo good.

[kagato3]

Originally Posted by Dargor

The word you're looking for is fraternal. You can't say someone is their maternal father because of obvious reasons.

Spoiler:

As for everything else, let the Fate shilling and convenient plot give mes to make him a threat begin. Fate was certainly a powerful fighter in Negima, but he was not a top tier fighter. All the high end fighters outstrip him by far, and now he's...what, the strongest Mage out there? And UQ Holder, a group of flubbing immortals, has nothing to match him? Let me guess, Eva was depowered because of some convenient thing that happened in the past to try and artificially up the tension to make Fate a legitimate threat. For gods sake, the boy already has the ability to petrify people. That alone should actually make him a threat to UQ Holder. You don't need to introduce anything new Akamatsu. No, really, you don't.

Its only fair to wait for the actual chapter, but if all of that is accurate...well, I'm really not that surprised at this point. Here's to hoping its not.

No it is maternal

Spoiler for it didn't say father:

As in the Grandfather on the mother's side of the family.

[Avrorrange]

Originally Posted by Dargor

The word you're looking for is fraternal. You can't say someone is their maternal father because of obvious reasons.

Spoiler:

As for everything else, let the Fate shilling and convenient plot give mes to make him a threat begin. Fate was certainly a powerful fighter in Negima, but he was not a top tier fighter. All the high end fighters outstrip him by far, and now he's...what, the strongest Mage out there? And UQ Holder, a group of flubbing immortals, has nothing to match him? Let me guess, Eva was depowered because of some convenient thing that happened in the past to try and artificially up the tension to make Fate a legitimate threat. For gods sake, the boy already has the ability to petrify people. That alone should actually make him a threat to UQ Holder. You don't need to introduce anything new Akamatsu. No, really, you don't.

Its only fair to wait for the actual chapter, but if all of that is accurate...well, I'm really not that surprised at this point. Here's to hoping its not.

It is from the actual chapter and I've read it.

[Rava]

Originally Posted by Dargor

The word you're looking for is fraternal. You can't say someone is their maternal father because of obvious reasons.

You don't use fraternal for anything other than twins, brothers or fraternities.

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by Dargor

The word you're looking for is fraternal. You can't say someone is their maternal father because of obvious reasons.

Um, no.

Maternal - related to one's mother. A maternal uncle is your mother's brother.

Paternal - related to one's father. A paternal grandmother is your father's mother.

Fraternal - related to siblings. Not used in the same context since any relative of a full sibling is necessarily of the same relation to you. For example, twins who are only as similar as normal siblings (non-identical DNA, born from separate zygotes), are called "fraternal" to differentiate them from "identical" twins (identical DNA, born from the same zygote).

You can't call someone your "maternal father" in the way you mean because the "father" relationship is yours, not your mother's. Grandparents (and certain other familial relations) can be differentiated because there are two separate sets of them on each of your parents' sides of the family.

You can call someone a "maternal father", but that changes the meaning of maternal to mean "acting like a mother". Basically, a house dad type.