2016-08-10, 09:33 | Link #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: East Cupcake
|
This thread is dedicated to discussion of the upcoming US Presidential, Gubernatorial and Congressional elections in November 2016 (as well as and ballot you might be interested in). The purpose of this thread is to discuss the various candidates, their positions, and the various other positions being voted on across the country. All news and discussion of the upcoming election will be placed in this thread, and once the results are in a possible new thread dedicated to the 115th Congress could be made.
The usual forum rules apply (be considerate of others and their opinions, no flaming or cyclical posting, try and provide sources when possible, etc), and try not to get too caught up in the News coverage of the elections (i.e., we all know the mainstream media is inherently biased (toward the right and the left), so try not to create too much discussion based on how bad you perceive the individual networks are skewing the various elections). To clarify further, you can post any clips or excerpts you feel will add to this thread (as so long as they are actual news clips and not simply talking heads), but do not get too focused on the source of the information (which is partially irrelevant to the discussion topic)... I will update this OP with recent information as it is presented (e.g., Presidential Candidiates; various primary results; and then finally Hilary vs...?; etc) This is the "sequel" to the US Election 2008 thread, US Elections 2012 Part I and US Elections 2012 Part II. Us Election 2016 Part I. Please visit those threads if you wish to learn how this discussion is held (or visit to read your old posts, and reminisce on happier times .) --- Current Presidential Candidates: Democratic Bids: Former Senator and Secretary of the Navy Jim Webb; former Senator and Secretary of State Hilary Clinton; former Republican Senator then former Democrat and Independent Governor Lincoln Chafee; former Governor Martin O'Malley; former Representative and current Senator Bernie Sanders; and probably (almost former) Vice-President Joe Biden...so far. Republican Bids: former Governor Jim Gilmore; former Representative and current Governor John Kasich; Governor Scott Walker; Governor Chris Christie; Governor Bobby Jindal; Donald Trump ("businessman"?); former Governor Jeb Bush; former Governor Rick Perry; current Senator Lindsey Graham; former Governor George Pataki; former Senator Rick Santorum; former Fox News host (and also a former Governor) Mike Huckabee; neurosurgeon Ben Carson; Businesswoman Carly Fiorina; Senator Marco Rubio; Senator Rand Paul; Senator Ted Cruz;...so far. 3rd Party/Independent: former Commissioner of Internal Revenue Mark Everson (not declared yet); Jack Fellure (Prohibition Party); Dr. Jill Stein (Green Party); Darryl Cherney...supposedly (Green Party); Robert David Steele (Libertarian); Gloria La Riva (Socialist); James Hedges (Prohibition); Roseanne Barr (Peace and Freedom); and various - Dan Bilzerian, Zoltan Istvan, Terry Jones, Juaquin James Malphurs (Waka Flocka Flame), Vermin Supreme, Ted Williams, Deez Nuts...so far. And here are the non-Presidential listings for the 2016 elections (as they currently stand by region, specifics will be added later): 2016 House of Representatives elections 2016 Senate elections and 2016 Gubernatorial elections (technically there are still elections for Governor in Kentucky, Louisiana and Mississippi scheduled for later in 2015). Also, here is a fun website that details local and federal ballots and initiatives. |
2016-08-10, 09:37 | Link #2 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 38
|
Trump says protestors should be hurt; that there need to be consequences for protesting.
Trump responds to question about a protestor being punched, saying that's what we need more of. Trump saying he'd defend those who attack protesters in court. If you see someone getting ready to throw a tomato, 'knock the crap out of them' Advocating roughing up a BLM protester for being "loud and obnoxious" Quote:
|
|
2016-08-10, 10:04 | Link #3 | ||
My posts are frivolous
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 35
|
Quote:
Quote:
In this case, I read the full quote and disagree with the media's narrative. He was talking about the second amendment people having sufficient political power to perhaps have a chance to influence the Supreme Court appointments, no matter how small that chance may be. All this talk about supporting assassination is based on a highly contrived interpretation - as contrived as the interpretation that imputes violence into Obama's line long ago about bringing a gun to a knife fight with Republicans. By the way, what's your opinion on the rest of my previous post: Quote:
__________________
|
||
2016-08-10, 10:16 | Link #4 | |
cho~ kakkoii
Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 3rd Planet
|
Quote:
A president picks a supreme court judge by his or her choice. No one has any say in it. It is one of president's duty as outlined in our constitution.
__________________
|
|
2016-08-10, 10:23 | Link #5 | |
My posts are frivolous
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 35
|
Quote:
In the case of the US, Supreme Court judges aren't truly non-partisan, as outlined by the discussion in the previous thread, so political pressure does play a role, though it may be small. Another source of political pressure is that the senate can veto the choice, but this probably isn't relevant since it's currently a Democrat senate.
__________________
|
|
2016-08-10, 10:34 | Link #6 | |
Part-time misanthrope
Join Date: Mar 2007
|
Quote:
Also you have a history of blatantly ignoring other people's posts with an aggressive-condescending attitude based on faulty arguments. Let's not repeat that mistake again. |
|
2016-08-10, 10:56 | Link #7 | |
cho~ kakkoii
Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 3rd Planet
|
Quote:
To me, this was a statement that should not have been made in such a way because it can be interpreted along those particular thought process. And there are people in this country that will make an attempt to act on certain views and interpretation violently. Not so long ago, when congress made an uproar about the Planned Parenthood after a certain video surfaced, a guy armed with a long gun took it upon himself to seek vengeance for all the dead babies. He managed to kill 3 and injured 9 others. What Donald Trump meant to say should not have been left for interpretation considering how big of a problem gun-violence has been for this country for so long.
__________________
|
|
2016-08-10, 11:02 | Link #8 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 38
|
Having the "process" rigged to favor the rich is different from rigging a national election. Rigging the primaries that you have control over and rigging a general election are two different things as well. All the glass ceiling stuff is identity politics, rather than any actual rigging that he's talking about.
|
2016-08-10, 11:51 | Link #9 | ||
✘˵╹◡╹˶✘
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Australia
|
Quote:
There you goes, all of the problem with 2016 US election within one post: lots of completely unrelated character attack to divert audience attention away from the complete void of substances Quote:
__________________
|
||
2016-08-10, 12:37 | Link #11 |
✘˵╹◡╹˶✘
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Australia
|
This is what US has turned into btw:
Hillary Clinton strategist Bob Beckel called for WikiLeaks editor Julian Assange to be assassinated. #DNCLeak
__________________
|
2016-08-10, 12:48 | Link #12 | |
Sekiroad-Idols Sing Twice
|
Quote:
~Akuma Kousaka, 2016
__________________
|
|
2016-08-10, 14:59 | Link #13 | |
AS Oji-kun
Join Date: Nov 2006
Age: 74
|
Quote:
I believe Trump was suggesting armed insurrection, not assassination, especially with his "horrible" comment at the end of his remarks. There's no plausible interpretation of his remarks that indicated it had anything to do with political pressure. Trump made a ridiculous and aggressive comment and was called on it. His campaign and surrogates are just engaged in damage control. I have mixed reactions to Tom Friedman's columns, but I recommend reading this one about why events like this matter when you're running for President: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/10/op...nt-people.html
__________________
|
|
2016-08-10, 16:42 | Link #14 | ||
My posts are frivolous
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 35
|
Quote:
My logic in concluding that Trump was talking about political power is that he specifically said there's something the 2nd amendment people could do, which implied that there was something they could do that the average person couldn't. The only thing that the 2nd amendment group has that others don't is political power. Interpreting the statement as assassination or armed insurrection doesn't make sense because everyone has access to the same weapons, not just the 2nd amendment group. Had the statement been, "You could use your 2nd amendment rights," or something to that effect, then I would agree with those interpretations. What I agree with is that Trump should have framed it a different way, and that this statement is one of the many political gaffes that's hurting his campaign. Quote:
Of course, carrying out actual rigging of elections is on a whole different level altogether.
__________________
Last edited by frivolity; 2016-08-10 at 17:14. |
||
2016-08-10, 17:45 | Link #15 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 38
|
Quote:
Know what they do have? Guns. And he referenced this after saying there'd be nothing you could do about her selections once she's elected. Unless you have guns, then maybe you can do something, he doesn't know. If he was just calling on political power, why just call out the Second Amendment People? Why not call on all republicans? Or the GOP's old standby of state rights groups? |
|
2016-08-10, 20:48 | Link #16 | |
cho~ kakkoii
Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 3rd Planet
|
Quote:
Once a president makes his/her pick a simple majority vote of the Senators present is required for the nomination to be confirmed. If Donald Trump is the president he can get his USSC pick confirmed through the GOP controlled senate without any issue. On the flip side, if Hilary is the president she will face the same obstacle as Obama is facing currently with his pick for the confirmation process. Republican senate majority leader is not even bringing up Obama's pick for a debate let alone held a vote. So yeah, if the Senate majority doesn't change where Republican keeps control for the next 4 years, Hilary can't appoint any Supreme Court Judge even if she is the president of the US.
__________________
|
|
2016-08-11, 02:31 | Link #17 |
Gamilas Falls
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Republic of California
Age: 47
|
Remember there are Constitutional procedures for any changes to the Constitution, and that includes changing any part of the Bill of Rights (which the Second Amendment is a part of). If the change cannot be made in Congress (that requires two-thirds in both houses to pass), than it has to go to the states and pass three-quarters of them to change the Constitution in that large a manner.
27 out of 33 constitutional amendments have been passed in the last 227 years. It takes a lot of effort and agreement nationwide to change the Constitution, and that is on purpose.
__________________
|
2016-08-11, 04:13 | Link #18 | |
My posts are frivolous
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 35
|
Quote:
If he was indeed talking about armed insurrection, then he would have referred specifically to people who own guns (not all people who support the 2nd amendment have guns, and not all people who are against the 2nd amendment don't have guns), or he would have talked about the actual use of 2nd amendment rights. The reason why he talked about Second Amendment people is, once again, because this is a group with high political influence who are also very passionate about the cause. He could have talked about state rights groups of course, but they aren't as powerful as the Second Amendment groups in terms of pushing for their cause. In any case, the point is pretty clear. There are multiple valid ways of interpreting Trump's statement, and the media is - rightly or wrongly - jumping on the interpretation that suits their narrative. I fully agree with the point being made earlier that Trump should have been more explicit with his views instead of letting his words get twisted.
__________________
|
|
2016-08-11, 10:15 | Link #20 | |
Sekiroad-Idols Sing Twice
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
|
|