(L) Simoun

[Sakuya]

How do the people give birth to new people if there were no males? Or can all women do both? But Neviriru mentioned that she has a father.

[zalas]

Originally Posted by Simon

It's also interesting to read Yui's point that if a Simulacran chooses to become male, they don't change instantly. So I guess their society has a number of people in their late teens / early 20s who in our world would be considered "transgendered"? I wonder how this affects their social interactions (and how accepting a Japanese audience would be of this notion)? For example, would people without a strong gender preference choose to remain female and avoid the hassle of transition? If gender is changeable, would they be less hung up on same-sex vs opposite-sex relationships?

I'm still amused by the fact that they try to parallel normal human development, as most of the gender-specific characteristics don't appear until the beginning of adolescence. So instead of starting adolescence at around 12 or so, they start at 17 and also have a choice in the matter of which gender. And just like human adolescence, their adolescence also sees a gradual growth of gender-specific features.

[Matrim]

There are males, it just seems that it takes time until one becomes fully male. In the second episode there is a fellow with a big beard, if that's female then she manages to hide this fact very well. And it's funny how I thought this technician to be male, then female, now male again.

But does it look like the males are in leading positions? That would be weird.

Maybe they are in leading position in the army, or airforce or whatever Corps Tempest is part of, while in other areas there are more female leaders? Are we sure they are male anyway, after this techinician fiasco I am going to be really careful before judging someone's sex in this series.

[Iskandar Taib]

Originally Posted by zalas

147さん on the シムーンは百合にはならない thread on 2ch suggested that テンプスパティウム be the combination of "tempus" and "spatium" into "tempuspatium", essentially "time-space"/"space-time" in Latin. Perhaps this deity they are worshipping is actually some long lost science, with a technical name like "space-time."

Spoiler:

Ooooo.... Mebbe Amuria ISN'T DEAD AFTER ALL.... ??

I went back and watched the first episode and tried to listen very carefully. Yup, the word for the pilots definitely is "Sibiru" (which I think "Sybil" would be the best interpretation). And when Amuria calls her name, it sure sounds like "Nevil" (not much trace of a vowel after the "l" if at all). I suspect they've been coached to pronounce it that way. So "Neville" does sound right, never mind what's written or the etymology of the word. And it sure does sound like "Call Tempest". I could've sworn I found that exact romaji on simoun.tv a couple days ago, but I can't find it anymore.

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Iskandar Taib

Spoiler:

Ooooo.... Mebbe Amuria ISN'T DEAD AFTER ALL.... ??

Spoiler:

I noticed that Anime News Network credits her voice actress fairly prominently, and she's in the OP... how prominently does she appear in the actual Japanese credits? (Kanji o wakaranai....)

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Simon

It's also interesting to read Yui's point that if a Simulacran chooses to become male, they don't change instantly.

A "Simulacran?" Hmm, that's interesting... does everyone on Daikuuriku start female, or just those from Simulacrum? And how does that work for people outside Simulacrum, if not? Do they have their own springs?

Originally Posted by Simon

So I guess their society has a number of people in their late teens / early 20s who in our world would be considered "transgendered"? I wonder how this affects their social interactions (and how accepting a Japanese audience would be of this notion)?

Gender transition would almost have to be just another normal part of life -- if half the population does it, then it can't possibly stand out the way that it does today. I can't speak to the audience reaction part, but anime seems to have squads and squads of gender-changing or crossdressing characters; contrast that with what shows up on Western TV. Some recent series have plots that could have been lifted directly from the sort of amateur fiction that you can find on the net that's aimed at a trans audience.

I wonder what effects if any choosing to be female has. Does that trigger fertility? And choosing male at the Spring seems a lot different than real female -> male gender transitions -- do the breasts slowly get reabsorbed? What about sex organs?

Originally Posted by Simon

For example, would people without a strong gender preference choose to remain female and avoid the hassle of transition? If gender is changeable, would they be less hung up on same-sex vs opposite-sex relationships?

Spoiler:

Well, we've seen what happens when someone goes to the Spring without a strong gender preference....

[Yui from Okinawa]

http://dempa-kitaa.hp.infoseek.co.jp....cgi?FrontPage


Japanese Language "Simoun wikipedia" page open!
The webmaster is " dempa-kitaa" , but I, Yui from Okinawa , free-editer join this project,too!

The system is "Pyuki-Wiki" system , URl is http://nekyo.hp.infoseek.co.jp/

Sorry ,I recommend the editers have to master " Foreigner who acquired Japanese Language" or "Native speaker" only.

At first, The editers have to trainnig at "Sand Box "http://dempa-kitaa.hp.infoseek.co.jp...ex.cgi?SandBox
as if Sibyllas manege to master dance "Marju" for imitated "Ri Marjon".

[lavielove]

Originally Posted by MrProphet

No offense to anyone here, but I've seen weirder cases of Engrish. In official print media too. 8)

Anyway, I think that unless we see some official confirmation, I'm going to stick to my preferred method. Of course, you are all more than welcome to use what you think is best here.

Since Doremi is kinda stalling and I've only watched the raws so far, it doesn't really matter that much to me. It's just a fansub, and I've seen some weird double reverse romanisations in my time (Akaado, anyone? 8)). So, it's not like this vital to our enjoyment of the show.

I'd rather discuss plot and characters that naming conventions. 8)

Same here.A real public wiki for simoun is already there,but there is nothing they had planned so far[or] may be they would like to hide the technology alot of sections are {stub}ed.When we watched Eureka7 we didn't even think or dicuss about what is Eureka,same goes to Noein too.No offense to anyone, just a little bit of nagging.

[DaFool]

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

With Kashimashi just over, and Simoun, Ouran High School Host Club, and Princess Princess on now, do you think that there may be some current gender instability in Japan (to say nothing of elsewhere) that is being represented in anime?

I think it's some social engineering project by the Trilateral Commission(EU, Japan, US) whose long-term aim is to slow and reduce world population by destroying traditional notions of gender identities and orientations. The US's contribution was Brokeback Mountain. No offense to anyone, but the gay agenda really is overrepresented when compared to the actual population.

Then again, it's a simple case of sci-fi....sci-fi isn't sci-fi unless it explores social ramifications.

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by DaFool

I think it's some social engineering project by the Trilateral Commission(EU, Japan, US) whose long-term aim is to slow and reduce world population by destroying traditional notions of gender identities and orientations.

To an extent, anime has been the one place where sympathetic portrayals trans, gender bending, and crossdressing could be found for quite some time, not to mention yuri and yaoi. (That's what got me interested in anime in the first place.) I've noticed an upswing in LGBT themes in the past couple of years... but the same can be said of society in general in the industrialized world.

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Yui from Okinawa

Japanese Language "Simoun wikipedia" page open!

I tried to go to it, but got "403 Access Forbidden". Is there something I'm doing wrong?

(Or are they doing road construction on the 403? I thought it was the Gardiner they were closing this weekend, not the 403.... )

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by DaFool

Then again, it's a simple case of sci-fi....sci-fi isn't sci-fi unless it explores social ramifications.

That's one of the things that really attracted me to Simoun... rather than running back over the usual sorts of cliches, the creators have done a great job of building an interestingly different world that prompts all manner of "what if" questions. And they've thrown in a hefty dose of sense-of-wonder, too, and they seem to respect the audience in ways that western TV series (and all too many printed SF novels these days!) don't.

It's rare to see SF of print quality on the screen. It's still early enough that Simoun could still jump the shark and turn out to not live up to its promise, but I'm very encouraged.

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Simon

Excuse me for squealing like an air-headed (Aeru-headed?) fanboy, but the full-length OP theme video is available for free legal download.

I love love love the music from the series, especially Utsukushii Kereba Sore De Ii, and I can't wait for the soundtrack album to become available....

[Futaba-chan]

If you consider that a lot of ceremonial magic involves inscribing magical symbols in the air with an athame or other tool, the Remergion/Ri Maajon/<whatever the correct romanization is> makes a lot of sense -- start with a magic system that involves making magical symbols with magic gems rather than knives or wands, then blow up the gem to the size of an earthball, mount it aboard an aircraft, and make ginormous magical symbols in the sky with mechanical precision to get powerful effects over a wide area.

Do the Simulacrans use the Simouns for other kinds of magic besides battle? Does Corps Tempest fly out over the fields every spring, for example, to guarantee a good harvest?

Also, are there still magic users on a smaller scale, who make magical gestures with handheld gems to create smaller effects?

(All of this, of course, is leaving aside the whole question of whether the Tempus Spatium is actually a supernatural effect, or if it's just very advanced technology from an ancient lost civilization that they're worshipping because they don't understand it.)

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Matrim

Maybe they are in leading position in the army, or airforce or whatever Corps Tempest is part of, while in other areas there are more female leaders?

I wonder if it isn't the other way around -- instead of men taking leading roles because that's the social expectation due to their gender, perhaps its just a matter that the people who tend to choose to stay in the military after retiring from being Sibylla tend to choose to become male? I have to think that it would be harder for gender to be seen as quite so high a wall in Daikuuriku as it is in contemporary society -- after all, all the men have had experience being female....

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Futaba-chan

the people who tend to choose to stay in the military after retiring from being Sibylla

Hmm. Am I making an unwarranted assumption here? Were Wacourif, Lucas, and the other men we see former Sibylla once upon a time? Or did they come from somewhere else?

[Kaoru Chujo]

I had the same trouble clicking through to the Japanese wiki. But it worked when I copied the link location and pasted it into the address box:
dempa-kitaa.hp.infoseek.co.jp/d/e/m/dempa-kitaa/cgi-bin/simoun/index.cgi?FrontPage

Nice post from Futaba-chan about how good this is as SF. It creates a real other world, rather than just dressing up ordinary people in alien costumes. It's good to see more SF that is at least partly directed at women. The extra attention to relationships is good. I've come to enjoy a lot of SF by women: Catherine Asaro, Melissa Scott, Julie Czerneda, Linda Nagata, Joan Vinge, Elizabeth Lynn, Tanith Lee, Marion Zimmer Bradley, etc.

The wiki says that the Arcus Prima ship was originally for observing the Tempuspatium. So maybe all the people there are more priests/priestesses than originally military leaders. The official site says that the Simoun Sibylla are priestesses, but it appears that Aaeru and Morinasu are part of a new breed who are not priestesses. The wiki says that Aaeru didn't have the right family background. For the Sibylla to be priestesses makes sense, since Ri Maajon appears to involve communication with the Tempuspatium. The wiki says Prima is home to two other corps besides Corps Tempest.

I don't see any info anywhere about whether other parts of this world have the same gender biology as Simulacrum, but the fact that the pilots for the other side seemed to be women, too, makes me think they might.

(I'm just going to stick with the spellings from the official site until it becomes clear exactly what foreign spelling is intended for names like Aaeru.)

[Yui from Okinawa]

Yes, copied the link location and pasted it into the address box:
dempa-kitaa.hp.infoseek.co.jp/d/e/m/dempa-kitaa/cgi-bin/simoun/index.cgi?FrontPage

Don't abuse the hack...I fatigue to noise or offensive and nonsense writing to wikipedia,please.

by the way, Shou-nation's full name is issued in public!

"Argentum Shou Nation " (アルゲントゥム 礁<=shou>国)
"Argentum " is meanings "Silver"
" 礁 " 　Kanji character has three meanings.

1:Living region ,Isolation
2:Fish-breeding ground
3: ( Coral ) reef (Remember "Eureka7")
But, Argentum Shou Nation has no sea llevel, mountain and vally nature....
The ocean spread among "Shimurarcrum Imperial princess nation" and
"Argentum Shou Nation".




The double sun(Binary, fixed-star)
It is understood that two suns (fixed star) are in the sky as long as three stories are seen.

The fixed star of a so-called, double binary star.
The vicissitude of the seasons becomes it to be very complex because of the double sun at the composition of such the sun.

In a word, cold summer and warm winter might come might come in succession, and a hot summer and cold winter come reversely extremely in the case for the double sun to queue up.

With the work "ＦＡＮＧ ＯＦ ＴＨＥ ＳＵＮ ＤＯＵＧＲＡＭ" when looking for the case that looks alike in a domestic animation work.

The "Deroia star system " has "X-nebula " that looks alike exists.

[Simon]

Hmm, lots of interesting posts here since I last visited. But it's nearly 3am in my part of the world, so for now I'd just like to say that I've created a stub English-language Wikipedia article for Simoun. It could use better layout and lots more information, but at least there's now something to edit. I've copied the translated glossary from Kaoru Chujo's blog and included a link to Yui's page - I hope neither of you mind.

One glaring omission is a translation for the OP title - can anyone here help?

Oh, and something I hadn't noticed until I was adding cast details is that Kuwashima Hōko is listed in the credits! I now consider this anime officially godlike

[Futaba-chan]

Originally Posted by Simon

One glaring omission is a translation for the OP title - can anyone here help?

"That which is beautiful is good." (Literally, "if it's beautiful, it's good.")