Japan Earthquake and Tsunami (March 11, 2011)

[Malkuth]

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

Did you even read the article? It actually echoes my sentiment, which I've been keeping silent about out of respect for the ongoing rescue effort. There is not an iota of fear-mongering or "divine punishment" written in the piece at all, and is no more than a slightly different spin on reports published earlier this week about Japan's ability to rebuild after this triple disaster.

As for these "religious types", please do put things into perspective before you fling labels about. The Christian Science Monitor is actually one of the more serious news publications in the United States. Despite its name, it isn't necessarily a paper for frothing fundamentalists as you may be inclined to think.

Obviously different people different understanding... I agree that it is a good opportunity to improve growth, GDP, etc. But is it the time to state this? and even worse you can see in the wording a deep seated hatred, for what reason I can only guess, and rather not share.

As for the credibility, I neither know, nor really care; being credible has nothing to do with being sensitive, and splashing the christian (or any religious adjective for that matter) I expect at least the second.

[TinyRedLeaf]

Originally Posted by Malkuth

Obviously different people different understanding... I agree that it is a good opportunity to improve growth, GDP, etc. But is it the time to state this? and even worse you can see in the wording a deep seated hatred, for what reason I can only guess, and rather not share.

As for the credibility, I neither know, nor really care; being credible has nothing to do with being sensitive, and splashing the christian (or any religious adjective for that matter) I expect at least the second.

Oh, for crying out loud...

Where are the examples of so-called deep-seated hatred in the article?

Never mind. I have no wish to hijack this thread any more than need be. You are free to hate as much as you are free to cherry pick your own information.

[Kaze]

I just woke up and someone told me that the nuclear reactor was lost (i.e: out of control), this true?

What's the situation if I may ask?

[Decagon]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Simple answer; it takes years to build new powerplants, so if they just abandon these reactors Japan would be stuck with rolling black outs for the entire duration.

Would you like to be stuck with rationed electricity for two years? I think not. The plants are not for decoration; they are important part of the infrastructure. You don't want to lose what you don't need to.

The thing is, given all other things healthy I would assume they have excess capacity from other plants on the grid to account for this one plant's output. Because of the earthquake, many plants have shut down for inspection or because of damage, giving you the blackouts they currently have. The Fukushima I reactors seem slated for death either from mismanagement of public relations or from real damage regardless at this point.

[-KarumA-]

Gilbert Gottfried is being an ass again. Making not funny jokes about Japan all the time concerning the situation.
I heard he got fired as a spokesperson for AFLAC.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Decagon

The thing is, given all other things healthy I would assume they have excess capacity from other plants on the grid to account for this one plant's output. Because of the earthquake, many plants have shut down for inspection or because of damage, giving you the blackouts they currently have. The Fukushima I reactors seem slated for death either from mismanagement of public relations or from real damage regardless at this point.

It really depends. I know that Japan was still building new reactors when the Earthquake hit, so they must still be cutting it pretty close in terms of energy demand.

Most of the damaged reactors are old and would soon be shut down, but it would take time for the replacement plants to go online. So the intention isn't to keep them running forever, but to get more life from them until they can be properly replaced.

[Malkuth]

Well, another article, this time from germany about how much journalists care about the rest of the world...

Originally Posted by Spiegel

Despite government assurances, there are fears of another Chernobyl. The incident has sparked a heated political debate in Germany and looks likely to end the dream of cheap and safe nuclear power.

Full article here.

... and the coverage of the actual loss of life here is next to non-existent... dunno, I really feel that none gives a damn about all the people that have died or their lives are destroyed, and just try to capitalize on what is catchy...

[solomon]

Originally Posted by Malkuth

Well, another article, this time from germany about how much journalists care about the rest of the world...



Full article here.

... and the coverage of the actual loss of life here is next to non-existent... dunno, I really feel that none gives a damn about all the people that have died or their lives are destroyed, and just try to capitalize on what is catchy...

What do ARD and the other papers say? (Note; I'm not counting the garbage rag Bild)

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Yah!!! For some reason I thought you were in the UK at this time. Happy to hear from you.

No no... I look at the sensationalist BBC headlines and alike all the middle east drama, I have this disconnection within me thinking 'it's some place far, far away.'
Then I realise that I'm part of this mess and just sigh.

It's the first time to be part of a major crisis on a global scale, so now seeing how the BBC 'report' things while being in the inside is interesting on a media analysis level.

I was walking about in Shinjuku today dealing with legal matters without realising that radiation had aparently hit Tokyo, but I was musing to myself 'my, it's so empty here'.
(I'm on 5hrs sleep and half dead)
Now I know why, the panic and the 'staying at home' kicked in. ;_;

Originally Posted by Claies

Tokyo is detecting radiation levels up to 20 times above normal. Authorities are stressing that this level poses no biological danger.

It's exactly as someone posted on twitter:

With the nuclear crisis grabbing most of the attention, it is perhaps worth remembering that millions of people in north-east Japan are spending their fourth night without water, food or heating in near-freezing temperatures.

While the Japanese are doing what they do best, not being straight with critical or vital info if it's negative, the West sure are capitalising on the drama of us all turning into mutants:

Japan earthquake panic as radiation spreads in Tokyo

All the more to accelerate the panic scale on my parents, it's just all meh.
*sighs*

[RRW]

The National Police Agency said Tuesday afternoon that 2,722 people have died, and many thousands were still missing. Bodies continued to wash ashore at various spots along the coast after having been pulled out to sea by the tsunami’s retreat.

Some 400,000 people were living in makeshift shelters or evacuation centers, officials said. Bitterly cold and windy weather that was pushing into northern Japan was compounding the misery as the region struggled with shortages of food, fuel and water.

An explosion Tuesday morning at the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Station — the third reactor blast in four days — damaged the vessel containing the nuclear core at reactor No. 2 , government officials said, and there was a growing fear of a catastrophic meltdown.

The overwhelmed operator of the nuclear plants, Tokyo Electric Power Company, confirmed there had been radiation leaks and that water was being pumped into three overheated reactors in the Fukushima complex.

A fire that broke out Tuesday morning at a fourth reactor was extinguished by mid-afternoon, although the government’s chief spokesman, Yukio Edano, later said that temperatures were now rising inside a fifth and sixth reactor in the complex.

People living within about 12 miles of the reactors at Fukushima were ordered to evacuate, and those within about 20 miles were told to stay indoors and close all windows, doors and vents. If people had laundry hanging outside, the government advised, they should not bring it inside or touch it.


Still, there appeared to be no mass exodus. The United States Embassy, for example, was not urging resident Americans to leave.

The ambassador, John V. Roos, said that about 1,300 Americans were living in the five northern prefectures most affected by the earthquake and the tsunami. American consular officers were making their way to Sendai and other northern cities on Tuesday to conduct “welfare-and-whereabouts” checks on American citizens there.

“We are encouraging U.S. citizens to heed the instructions of the Japanese civil defense authorities,” Mr. Roos said.

The commander of American forces in Japan, Lt. Gen. Burton M. Field, confirmed that some American troops aboard three helicopters had been contaminated by radiation when they apparently flew through a radioactive plume released from the crippled nuclear complex.

“We found contamination on the clothes of several crew members, and one crew member had some on his skin,” said General Field. “The exposure rate was about the same as you would get over a monthlong period outside in the sun. We assess that as very, very low.”

He added that the crew members got a good scrubbing with soap and water and were back on duty.


The United States Geological Survey revised the magnitude of the earthquake to 9.0, from 8.9, but it was the subsequent tsunami that did the most damage. The initial wave scoured away entire communities, and desperate survivors searched Tuesday for signs of friends and relatives who remained missing.

There was plenty that was missing here in the fishing village of Minamisanriku: the city hall, the hospital, the shipyard, police stations — and 8,000 people.
The tsunami might have crashed most heavily into this town that once was home to more than 17,000. Situated at the back of a mountainous V-shaped cove, the town was swamped by the first surge of muck and seawater that was 30 feet high as it roared between the valley walls.
As the deluge pressed in on them, Sanae Sato, 71, said 400 townspeople rushed to the community center where she worked. They thought the five-story building would be high enough to protect them. But when the water reached the fourth floor, they all sought shelter in the attic.

From the attic window, Ms. Sato said, she saw the floodwaters hurling cars along, with drivers and passengers still inside. Houses broke from their foundations and were carried along, their owners perched on the ridges of the roofs.

“I saw people trying to balance on the rooftops like surfers,” she said. “It didn’t work. It was like hell.”

[WanderingKnight]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

It's technically true, it's just that instead of voluntary pork-barrelling, you are forced into essential reconstruction. It still means you would go into debt paying for it, the difference here is that you have no choice but to spend the money in the case of a disaster recovery.

I am not an economist, but I get the feeling the boost from the reconstruction will be dampened by the importing of oil and power to replace the dead nuclear generators. Plus, any boost that such an event causes to the economy is in the short-term range, as soon as the reconstruction is done all those workers are going to be unemployed again. I would think, at least.

I guess things will look good for a while, but will begin to slump later. Such a tragedy can in no way and form be considered a good thing, especially if you consider the massive losses. Some people will benefit from this, of course, and the country will be riding on their wings for a while, but it's like what happens with every crisis.

[Seiryuu]

I know that some think it insensitive when people talk about there being opportunity for growth after the quake. And depending on the specific angle and how it's presented, it may very well be. But I don't think it better for people to tell them off and say that this is going to be a major injury on all fronts, or comparing it to the "broken window fallacy".

We can't go back and undo the quake. What's happened has happened, and while it's important to recognize the devastation for what it is, there's still some value I believe in saying that there's still hope even in this, that though we cannot regain what was lost, that the story isn't over, and Japan can grow stronger for this. If you refuse to consider the possibility of finding some light in the darkness, some good in the bad, all that remains for you is despair.

Noticing the silver lining doesn't mean that you're forgetting the dark clouds. It's just one way that people try to offer encouragement and support, no matter how clumsy the attempt may be.

[WanderingKnight]

Well, as for recognizing nothing can be done about it but to clean up and start over again, there's no better people than the Japanese for that job. Some would argue that's not entirely a good thing though! Depends on who you ask.

Sometimes I fantasize about what would happen if that were to happen here, in my country. The thing would be so chaotic in almost all levels of society (including politicians running away in helicopters with bags of money, etc) it's almost funny. Though luckily enough we don't live anywhere near an earthquake or hurricane zone.

[solomon]

Saw this fax that NHK recieved from somewhere in the northern prefectures. All basic essentials are cut off or in REAL short supply, in fact the fax said that they had to split ONE onigiri (rice ball) between FOUR PEOPLE. Not to mention it's bitterly cold in many places below freezing overnight.

[yezhanquan]

It's like back at the end of WWII. It is an opportunity to start anew, on many fronts. The thing is whether the Japanese will seize the opportunity, or things will return to the same after the clean-up, besides the tens of thousands of "missing" population.

[WanderingKnight]

The context is different to WW2. For starters, there was no South Korea in the region at the time. Now with the US not needing Japan as their partner in the region as much as they needed it in the aftermath of the War I wonder how much help they will lend them. Plus, the whole world in the aftermath of WW2 was in a state of economic growth. Now, not so much.

It is similar to WW2 but it's still pretty different. Though the damage was obviously far more severe in the war despite what everyone's saying (not downplaying the tragedy at all, but a couple of washed out towns in an isolated region do not equate two atomic bombed cities and practically the whole country burning from conventional bombing).

[RRW]

Originally Posted by yezhanquan

It's like back at the end of WWII. It is an opportunity to start anew, on many fronts. The thing is whether the Japanese will seize the opportunity, or things will return to the same after the clean-up, besides the tens of thousands of "missing" population.

considering the trend (WW2, kobe) they are chance that it will hurt japan for couple of year. and bounced back latter. probably even become 2nd biggest economy again

[yezhanquan]

Definitely. It's more of an old Chinese maxim: Every crisis can be turned into an opportunity.

Recovery from WWII was given a massive boost by the Korean War, while Kobe happened in the 90s, when the economy is still pretty strong. With current resources, I really am not so sure.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by WanderingKnight

I am not an economist, but I get the feeling the boost from the reconstruction will be dampened by the importing of oil and power to replace the dead nuclear generators. Plus, any boost that such an event causes to the economy is in the short-term range, as soon as the reconstruction is done all those workers are going to be unemployed again. I would think, at least.

I guess things will look good for a while, but will begin to slump later. Such a tragedy can in no way and form be considered a good thing, especially if you consider the massive losses. Some people will benefit from this, of course, and the country will be riding on their wings for a while, but it's like what happens with every crisis.

That's why I say it is "technically" true.

Economic boasts from massive spending has always been only sustainable in the short term. Technically Japan had never stopped doing this, but it didn't work. Not even all the bridges that went nowhere helped.

Now, instead of constructing useless buildings, Japan will be constructing essential buildings instead. But the result is the same; you spend a lot of borrowed money, you get a boost, but then the debt came back. I certainly don't think the disaster "helped" Japan in any way. But for the short term, the survivors would have no trouble finding work.

[Kyero Fox]

i wonna know if we were hit by something like this, lets say, California or florida was hit by the same thing and many people died and our nucealar power plant was damaged... would anyone help us?