AnimeSuki Forums

Utsuro no Hako · 2014-07-17, 12:55

The revelation that nobody was killed is hard to swallow -- no rescue workers, no maintenance men, no one trapped in the elevators?

And how stupid are the police that they didn't notice that the YouTube riddle was two-four-three instead of four-two-three?

Xeiros · 2014-07-17, 13:03

Japanese in charge of mispronouncing Oedipus like it's going out of style.

bakaouji · 2014-07-17, 13:10

Even though Shibasaki had a short screen time, this episode was mainly about him returning to the police force. I'm assuming he was a former detective and I'm sure he was proficient at his job, but like in every cop drama something must've happened in a case that traumatized him enough to make him quit and settle for a desk job at the Archives Administration.

It's interesting to note that the Numbers don't disguise their voices in the videos they upload to announce their next attack. They definitely don't seem to care about body count, in fact, they're going out of their way to make sure there are no fatalities caused by their bombs. It didn't look like their second bomb produced any serious casualties either.

I'm guessing they're gonna get more audacious and creative with their homemade explosives with every successive attack and Shibasaki will be chasing their shadows.

So yeah, liked the episode overall but I'm not sure what to make of the B-plot involving the girl who's being abused at home by her overprotective/obsessive mother.

Irenesharda · 2014-07-17, 14:56

I am so at the edge of my seat with this series! Every episode feels like part of a movie.

The beginning seconds were rather haunting; tell me if the bombing site in the beginning didn't look like Ground Zero right after 9/11.

I am very surprised that no one died in the bombing, and from the way the kids are timing all of these, their objective is not to take lives but to breed terror and to send a message. I can't wait to see what their endgame is too this.

So, what does the story of Oedipus have to do with the boys? I'm guessing since they named themselves Sphinx and are using riddles from that story, I'm thinking it has a deeper meaning but I wonder what it is?

I also wonder what they are going to do with Lisa's character? She doesn't do much of anything and the boys don't seem to be including her in their plans at all. Her home life is very crappy though, I do feel sorry for her there. Twelve is seriously the creepy one, and I would definitely watch out for him if I was her.

I'm loving the police and forensic procedural. I learned about the thermite reaction and phreatic explosions, and being a chemist it is awesome to me to see that being put into play here. Also, they continue to leave the calling card of VON.

Does it mean "hope" like some are speculating?

I can't wait to have the detective join in, though he does seem to have a dark past which caused him to stop being a detective?

All these questions! I'm so excited.

Kanon · 2014-07-17, 15:06

That was a major step down from the first episode. The police being this retarded was very hard to swallow. None of them were familiar with Oedipus, and after investigating the story, they didn't even realize the riddle wasn't the same. It doesn't take a genius to figure this out. They had to make the other detectives dumb as hell in order to make Shibasaki look smart, which is as poor as writing can get.

I was also disappointed they're apparently going to make the two protagonists "nice terrorists". They're trying to flush evil out with terrorist acts, but without ever causing a single casualty. Yeah, sure.

Lisa's subplot is pretty generic so far, but it has potential. I could see this ending as badly as in Punpun for her, especially given she's going to hang out with a psycho like 12 now. That guy won't be a good influence on her.

I'm still very intrigued by this show, but I think I'm going to have to lower my expectations. This won't be as morally gray and realistic as I thought it would be.

Reckoner · 2014-07-17, 15:16

On the contrary, I actually thought this was thoroughly gripping from start to finish again. The fact that the terrorists are taking care to not actually kill people, but are still creating terror actually gives it more moral ambiguity because if they had killed tons of innocent people, then it would be just the opposite. Mass murderers have no moral ambiguity. There is no justifiable reason to kill tons of innocent people.

Now the question is, what do our two little terrorists have as end goal here. What are they trying to pick a fight with the country about? I'm all in on this show, and look forward to more.

Fellen · 2014-07-17, 15:17

The biggest problem with this episode was how stupid the police were and since the police were the focus for like half the episode the problem was even worse. Twelve and Nine could be interesting and Lisa's story has some potential so it's the same as episode 1 it has potential but really that's mostly it right now for those three. But it was still a great episode.

Key Board · 2014-07-17, 15:22

Spoiler:

Yeah.. I don't think I'm the target audience for this.
I've way overgrown this phase

Irenesharda · 2014-07-17, 15:23

I too was wondering how come no one knew the story of Oedopius or the very familiar riddle. I didn't remember the second version offhand, but I immediately knew the "man" answer right away, and I wondered why it was taking the police so long to make the connection.

However, other than that, the episode really went at mach 5 for me. I loved it.

Wandering Soul · 2014-07-17, 15:27

I am rather surprised that no one died in the first bombing. But it could be rather interesting seeing those two try to strike terror in the country while keeping the body count as low as possible. I am still interested in Twelve and Nine's story and I really want to see what the story does with Lisa.

The low point of this episode was how dumb the police were. They were seriously too stupid too check if they had the right riddle or even remember what the riddle was the first time. Hell Twelve was giving hand gestures as they told the damn riddle. The police seriously need that detective he is more competent than half the police force.

Konja9 · 2014-07-17, 15:34

This story is very interesting. I'm wondering how it will continue to develop this story.

I was surprised that there aren't deaths in these explosions, but I guess Nine and Twelve want to spread terror with the fewest deaths.

Lisa's story seems interesting, but I wonder what is her role in this story.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

I too was wondering how come no one knew the story of Oedopius or the very familiar riddle. I didn't remember the second version offhand, but I immediately knew the "man" answer right away, and I wondered why it was taking the police so long to make the connection.

However, other than that, the episode really went at mach 5 for me. I loved it.

Well, it is possible that this myth isn't well known in Japan, perhaps the schools don't teach much about Western myths.

I never heard the second enigma and took me by surprise.

Irenesharda · 2014-07-17, 16:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konja9

Well, it is possible that this myth isn't well known in Japan, perhaps the schools don't teach much about Western myths.

I never heard the second enigma and took me by surprise.

Even if that was true, my only issue with that was that there are teams of detectives and investigators on this and they were poring over that video for hours. You can't tell me that one internet search of Sphinx and the key words from the riddle wouldn't have come up with something. And there has to be someone who at least mentioned Oedipus, you can't tell me that not a single detective out of all of those at that meeting have never heard of him. And even in the unlikely chance that they didn't, any kind of research would have revealed the story.

Stark700 · 2014-07-17, 16:58

I'm pretty curious to see when they will do a flashback episode soon as I am very interested in knowing both of those terrorists, in particular Twelfth with his trollish personality in the latest episode.

Also, it seems like Lisa's family isn't exactly heartwarming judging from the beginning there. Episode 2 was pretty well done though of course.

bakato · 2014-07-17, 17:05

Anyone else notice the manga on the shelves? I think I saw Pandora Hearts.

hyl · 2014-07-17, 17:21

There are multiple versions of the sphinx riddle , the one with man is just one of them (and the one in the anime does not seem to be true in real life though). And i dont think that the oedipus story is very known in japan, so i can't blame the cops

Konja9 · 2014-07-17, 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

Even if that was true, my only issue with that was that there are teams of detectives and investigators on this and they were poring over that video for hours. You can't tell me that one internet search of Sphinx and the key words from the riddle wouldn't have come up with something. And there has to be someone who at least mentioned Oedipus, you can't tell me that not a single detective out of all of those at that meeting have never heard of him. And even in the unlikely chance that they didn't, any kind of research would have revealed the story.

Well, we don't know how long they were seeking information. Technically they found the information about Oedipus, but this was only the best known version (4-2-3).

Maybe they had to seek more information (maybe they find the version 2-4-3), but I guess it's a race against the clock (they don't know when the bomb would explode)

dniv · 2014-07-17, 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanon

That was a major step down from the first episode. The police being this retarded was very hard to swallow. None of them were familiar with Oedipus, and after investigating the story, they didn't even realize the riddle wasn't the same. It doesn't take a genius to figure this out. They had to make the other detectives dumb as hell in order to make Shibasaki look smart, which is as poor as writing can get.

I was also disappointed they're apparently going to make the two protagonists "nice terrorists". They're trying to flush evil out with terrorist acts, but without ever causing a single casualty. Yeah, sure.

Lisa's subplot is pretty generic so far, but it has potential. I could see this ending as badly as in Punpun for her, especially given she's going to hang out with a psycho like 12 now. That guy won't be a good influence on her.

I'm still very intrigued by this show, but I think I'm going to have to lower my expectations. This won't be as morally gray and realistic as I thought it would be.

You do realize that in Japan, they don't necessarily read much Western Literature. Greek literature is a deep part of Western culture... as for Japan... Oedipus is certainly NOT a deep part of their culture.

I've been to Japan once, and a lot of people there have never heard of Harry Potter let alone Oedipus Rex... and these are cops, which probably have OTHER specialized knowledge anyway rather than knowledge about Oedipus.

Flower · 2014-07-17, 19:12

Ep 2

Another very engaging episode for me.

I do not know if this is necessarily about "nice terrorists" or no, though I could certainly see someone coming to that conclusion and/or feeling that way.

The most interesting element going on in the series thus far is Lisa - I think she will be the wildcard that will sabotage things.

The story seems to be more of a not taking sides kinda thing. People had horrible things done to them and are now taking revenge (both of which are inexcusable, of course). But we do not yet know all the aspects of the story. There is nothing wrong, I believe, with saying "this is wrong" or "that should not be done", but I think the series may do more than simply attempt to not excuse such activities or actions and emphasize that those involved are people like us (though of course that is fine) - I am very curious to see if it will give us something else....

Reckoner · 2014-07-17, 19:15

And it's not like they didn't figure out that it was related to Oedipus. They did, but they were mistaken about which form of the riddle it was.

Our own real world military/police services prove far more incompetent than the police in this show seemed. I doubt our very own LAPD proves that competent in the way they hunted down Chris Dorner not that long ago. One of the most embarrassing spectacles you'll see.

So no, I don't think the police in this show are retarded. I actually thought watching this that they made the police seem interestingly competent in the way they were trying to dissect the video.

MCAL · 2014-07-17, 19:50

I'm not even sure what "nice terrorists" is supposed to mean.

Yeah, I thought the episode was fantastic too. And I agree. While having Nine and Twelve not kill anyone isn't a 100% guarantee of moral ambiguity, the chances of moral ambiguity are much higher than if they had killed.

And the direction continues to be off the charts. It's more than enough to forgive a few flaws in the writing (If there are any at all).

2014-07-17, 13:03	Link #82
Xeiros Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007	Japanese in charge of mispronouncing Oedipus like it's going out of style. __________________

2014-07-17, 14:56	Link #84
Irenesharda Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Chicago	I am so at the edge of my seat with this series! Every episode feels like part of a movie. The beginning seconds were rather haunting; tell me if the bombing site in the beginning didn't look like Ground Zero right after 9/11. I am very surprised that no one died in the bombing, and from the way the kids are timing all of these, their objective is not to take lives but to breed terror and to send a message. I can't wait to see what their endgame is too this. So, what does the story of Oedipus have to do with the boys? I'm guessing since they named themselves Sphinx and are using riddles from that story, I'm thinking it has a deeper meaning but I wonder what it is? I also wonder what they are going to do with Lisa's character? She doesn't do much of anything and the boys don't seem to be including her in their plans at all. Her home life is very crappy though, I do feel sorry for her there. Twelve is seriously the creepy one, and I would definitely watch out for him if I was her. I'm loving the police and forensic procedural. I learned about the thermite reaction and phreatic explosions, and being a chemist it is awesome to me to see that being put into play here. Also, they continue to leave the calling card of VON. Does it mean "hope" like some are speculating? I can't wait to have the detective join in, though he does seem to have a dark past which caused him to stop being a detective? All these questions! I'm so excited. __________________ "Someone who cannot forgive lies or secrets, will never trust another." - Major Kyosuke Hyobu

2014-07-17, 15:06	Link #85
Kanon Kana Hanazawa ♥ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: France Age: 37	That was a major step down from the first episode. The police being this retarded was very hard to swallow. None of them were familiar with Oedipus, and after investigating the story, they didn't even realize the riddle wasn't the same. It doesn't take a genius to figure this out. They had to make the other detectives dumb as hell in order to make Shibasaki look smart, which is as poor as writing can get. I was also disappointed they're apparently going to make the two protagonists "nice terrorists". They're trying to flush evil out with terrorist acts, but without ever causing a single casualty. Yeah, sure. Lisa's subplot is pretty generic so far, but it has potential. I could see this ending as badly as in Punpun for her, especially given she's going to hang out with a psycho like 12 now. That guy won't be a good influence on her. I'm still very intrigued by this show, but I think I'm going to have to lower my expectations. This won't be as morally gray and realistic as I thought it would be. __________________

2014-07-17, 15:17	Link #87
Fellen Insert user title here Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: The police station (Don't ask!)	The biggest problem with this episode was how stupid the police were and since the police were the focus for like half the episode the problem was even worse. Twelve and Nine could be interesting and Lisa's story has some potential so it's the same as episode 1 it has potential but really that's mostly it right now for those three. But it was still a great episode. __________________

2014-07-17, 15:22	Link #88
Key Board Carbon Join Date: Nov 2003	Spoiler: Yeah.. I don't think I'm the target audience for this. I've way overgrown this phase __________________ "Legitimacy is based on three things. First of all, the people who are asked to obey authority have to feel like they have a voice—that if they speak up, they will be heard. Second, the law has to be predictable. There has to be a reasonable expectation that the rules tomorrow are going to be roughly the same as the rules today. And third, the authority has to be fair. It can’t treat one group differently from another.” Malcolm Gladwell

2014-07-17, 12:55	Link #81
Utsuro no Hako Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011	The revelation that nobody was killed is hard to swallow -- no rescue workers, no maintenance men, no one trapped in the elevators? And how stupid are the police that they didn't notice that the YouTube riddle was two-four-three instead of four-two-three?

2014-07-17, 13:10	Link #83
bakaouji Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013	Even though Shibasaki had a short screen time, this episode was mainly about him returning to the police force. I'm assuming he was a former detective and I'm sure he was proficient at his job, but like in every cop drama something must've happened in a case that traumatized him enough to make him quit and settle for a desk job at the Archives Administration. It's interesting to note that the Numbers don't disguise their voices in the videos they upload to announce their next attack. They definitely don't seem to care about body count, in fact, they're going out of their way to make sure there are no fatalities caused by their bombs. It didn't look like their second bomb produced any serious casualties either. I'm guessing they're gonna get more audacious and creative with their homemade explosives with every successive attack and Shibasaki will be chasing their shadows. So yeah, liked the episode overall but I'm not sure what to make of the B-plot involving the girl who's being abused at home by her overprotective/obsessive mother.

2014-07-17, 15:23	Link #89
Irenesharda Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Chicago	I too was wondering how come no one knew the story of Oedopius or the very familiar riddle. I didn't remember the second version offhand, but I immediately knew the "man" answer right away, and I wondered why it was taking the police so long to make the connection. However, other than that, the episode really went at mach 5 for me. I loved it. __________________ "Someone who cannot forgive lies or secrets, will never trust another." - Major Kyosuke Hyobu

2014-07-17, 15:27	Link #90
Wandering Soul Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: America	I am rather surprised that no one died in the first bombing. But it could be rather interesting seeing those two try to strike terror in the country while keeping the body count as low as possible. I am still interested in Twelve and Nine's story and I really want to see what the story does with Lisa. The low point of this episode was how dumb the police were. They were seriously too stupid too check if they had the right riddle or even remember what the riddle was the first time. Hell Twelve was giving hand gestures as they told the damn riddle. The police seriously need that detective he is more competent than half the police force. __________________

2014-07-17, 16:58	Link #93
Stark700 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Somewhere on Earth	I'm pretty curious to see when they will do a flashback episode soon as I am very interested in knowing both of those terrorists, in particular Twelfth with his trollish personality in the latest episode. Also, it seems like Lisa's family isn't exactly heartwarming judging from the beginning there. Episode 2 was pretty well done though of course. __________________

2014-07-17, 17:05	Link #94
bakato Senior Member Join Date: May 2014	Anyone else notice the manga on the shelves? I think I saw Pandora Hearts.

2014-07-17, 17:21	Link #95
hyl reading #hikaributts Join Date: Feb 2009	There are multiple versions of the sphinx riddle , the one with man is just one of them (and the one in the anime does not seem to be true in real life though). And i dont think that the oedipus story is very known in japan, so i can't blame the cops

2014-07-17, 19:12	Link #98
Flower Blooming on the mountain Join Date: May 2010 Location: Deep in their roots, all flowers keep the light....	Ep 2 Another very engaging episode for me. I do not know if this is necessarily about "nice terrorists" or no, though I could certainly see someone coming to that conclusion and/or feeling that way. The most interesting element going on in the series thus far is Lisa - I think she will be the wildcard that will sabotage things. The story seems to be more of a not taking sides kinda thing. People had horrible things done to them and are now taking revenge (both of which are inexcusable, of course). But we do not yet know all the aspects of the story. There is nothing wrong, I believe, with saying "this is wrong" or "that should not be done", but I think the series may do more than simply attempt to not excuse such activities or actions and emphasize that those involved are people like us (though of course that is fine) - I am very curious to see if it will give us something else.... __________________

2014-07-17, 19:50	Link #100
MCAL Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2012	I'm not even sure what "nice terrorists" is supposed to mean. Yeah, I thought the episode was fantastic too. And I agree. While having Nine and Twelve not kill anyone isn't a 100% guarantee of moral ambiguity, the chances of moral ambiguity are much higher than if they had killed. And the direction continues to be off the charts. It's more than enough to forgive a few flaws in the writing (If there are any at all).