(L+CR) Darling in the Franxx

[zibi88]

Originally Posted by KPSJ

I enjoyed the 9's fight scene.

Sadly it was 9 vs 1 so kinda lame on their part, ganging on one girl. Too bad Hiro couldnt enter the fry, grab a gun and to the matrix thing "dodge this" poof.

Still this episode is the turning point for a revolution. Hiro saw that if the kids develop too far the adults do just mind swipe. They did to him, 02, Mitsuru, Kokoro even Nana who is now locked up in a small cell mostly to get either discarded or once again put into the memory erresure process.

Maybe Hiro will show up in Nana's cell and have a little chat with her about his experience of past and what he learned. Share info that he got memory swiped but now he remembers all and empotions are guiding him. Nana might join the kids for a better future since she saw what APE did to those plantations, just killing thousends like that with no hesitation.

02 has nightmares of those she kinda drained to death, so maybe soon she will be taken by the princess leaving Hiro behind. This would be a chance for Nana to substitute for 02 and help Hiro save the girl. Since we saw Nana as a teenage pilot for a reason. Connecting with Hiro could mostly unlock all of her erased memories

Time will show but it is kinda certain that Hiro is fed up with APE and adults doing and will mostly turn againt them soon or at least at the end of the show, maybe after hearing the reason the dinos appear.

[Skaddix]

Yes APE might just be the most incompetent "Evil Organization" since Team Rocket. And Rocket is some to be comic relief.

Only mindwiped 2...don't take the rings...probably didn't check for pregnancy...botched the talks with Klax Hime and have no idea what Dr. FranXX is up to.

[Top Sergeant]

Originally Posted by Solace

Okay, yeah, sure. I see the rings are conveniently left on the fingers and they're put back with the squad. Super advanced society, zero research done on psychological triggers. .

I saw that and to me it was a deliberate, vivcious choice by the Adults. They mind wipe the couple and when they come back the shock to their friends is compounded as they still have their wedding rings. Things look so normal on the surface, nothing changed from the moment they were taken away, but a few moments conversation reveals things have very much changed.

[_Ninja_]

There are several things people aren't considering regarding the mind wipe:

- This is an all powerful dictatorship. Do not mistake the way you, the viewer, perceives P13 to the way APE does within the context of the show. Don't overestimate how concerned they are with this one squad of kids or how threatened they are. They've intervened before in this way. See Nana. It doesn't bother them enough to pull all the plugs and burn it all down metaphorically speaking. They casually mind-wiped two, threw them back in, done. The typical arrogance of this kind of authoritarian leadership.

- APE council isn't so unified in their decision making as seen this episode.

- Dr. FRANXX still has significant influence considering he made P13 exempt from interference. Hachi brings this up even to the Nines, even though Papa send them. Papa may still value FRANXX enough not to bring it all down and just sanctions selective intervention.

- FRANXX is their science guy. He likely came up with the whole procedure and knows more about it than APE. As do the viewers in a sense that it is likely APE is not aware of the memory wipe ever being reversed. Also FRANXX or his people could just as well leave the rings on their fingers.

- I would guess no one in their society outside a handful of individuals has any idea whatsoever what those rings are.

[kampfer91]

Please do remember that team 13 is somewhat special from other team . Other team is just like mass-produced clone so less resistant to mind wipe and act like a robot .

From what i saw , team 13 is freely to express theirs feeling which trouble the APE but then again they are experimental team to test out new gen Franxx ( also dr Franxx may have a hand on this ) .

I think APE successfully mind wiped on too many parasites that they didn't think about the possibility of few parasites somehow managed to remember on special condition .

How the children gonna rise up against APE ? Run away ? I don't think taking the fight to them is a solution .

[kari-no-sugata II]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

At this point it should be abundantly clear that this is a "growing up and freeing yourself from oppressive elders" story, not a "suffering and death p0rn" show. The guys constantly calling death flags on everybody will probably leave very disappointed. Not that I am ruling out one or the other heroic sacrifice, but I seriously doubt more than two characters from the entire squad will bite it by the end.

Yup.

Putting it another way, success for the protagonists really goes hand in hand with survival.

At the start of the show, the "main threat" for the protagonists was the klaxosaurs but increasingly the APE council and their society are the main barrier to happiness for the protagonists. The protagonists probably don't see the klaxosaurs in general as being equivalent to themselves but with the introduction of the klaxosaur princess (who is a clearly an intelligent being), then once the children realise this then with the example of 02 they can perhaps shift their understanding - that it's more like the klaxosaurs are APE's enemies, not the enemies of everyone. Success no longer goes hand in hand with defeating klaxosaurs.

The children have already been able to somewhat live without magma energy etc. They might well prefer a life where they can live happily and in peace in coexistence with the klaxosaurs if it means genuine freedom. They're still a step or two away from having such a preference though - their lifelong attachment to APE and the adults has weakened massively but has not gone completely. It seems to me that Hiro and 02 have almost reached this point but it'll probably take a bit more for the others.

I don't think our protagonists will be able to achieve success simply by defeating their enemies and dying in the process. After all, none of the other children or adults are prepared for life without Papa. If both the protagonists and Papa (and perhaps all of the APE council) die then the world would likely relapse into something similar. It won't be a better world.

So "dying for the cause" has no real meaning for the group in general. Certainly some will die. Hachi seems to think that Nana might know what to say to the children. That could possibly foreshadow Nana telling the children to abandon the adults, bringing death to her and Hachi. It would not be a surprise for some of the children to die either but without them surviving to some degree, enough that they can show the way for others, then I don't think we can call them successful overall.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Kanon

I'm with Solace. Wiping out their memories and then sending them back to the same squad (who can and will help them remember) strikes me as incredibly stupid.

I initially thought the same thing, but then I remebered that Squad 13 is so far out of the norm that it would be impossible to integrate Kokoro and Mitsuru in another squad, at least not in time for the battle at hand.

They more than likely don't even care whether they remember as long as they contribute right now, which is also why they didn't just kill them.

They didn't even remove their rings!

APE seems to have moved far away fromcontemporary humanity, no shock they wouldn't recognize the symbolism of wedding rings, if they were even aware that they were having a wedding to begin with.

The Ichigo and Ikuno scene was well done. I liked the Hachi and Nana scene as well, and am curious to find out more about them.

Agreed on both. I'm really looking forward to what Nana and Hachi will do in coming episodes.

They're with a much larger group now, so I'm hoping Ikuno and Futoshi can find someone to be happy with.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Haak

This'll be the last time, I swear




No you weren't because that's not sarcasm and you clearly don't know what sarcasm means. Sarcasm is when you say one thing and mean the opposite. For example, if I told you that I think you're really really smart then that would be considered sarcasm. If you were being sarcastic when you said Grimgar was "Static panels simulator" then that would mean you're saying Grimgar has great fluid animation and you aren't because you're still complaining about it. What I said was correct and that you were resorting to hyperbole. And you don't need to point it out to me because I've already pointed it out to you. And the only reason I pointed it out was because of the sheer irony and hypocrisy of saying you don't take Obelisk seriously and needlessly insulting him, whilst you're the one being hyperbolic in your points.

In any case, what you also need to understand is that Obelisk never said anything about Grimgar's animation. All he implied was that Grimgar has a better balance between its action and character drama. Whether or not Grimgar has crap animation is totally irrelevant. Pacing is a different thing too but I'll throw you a bone here because the two are linked. But just saying that Grimgars pacing was rubbish without any elaboration is not an argument. At least not one worth taking seriously. Obelisk wasn't talking to you: he was talking to someone on the same page as him. You're not on the same page? Fine, just say you disagree and leave it there. There's no need to insult someone who made a perfectly valid point.



Actually, I understand it fine. In fact I'm pretty confident that I understand this show better than you do. Franxx is clearly inspired by Evangelion in a lot of ways and one of those ways is the character driven nature of that show. This is nothing new; Star Driver adopted a similar approach (which I think it did reasonably well) and maybe Captain Earth (I say maybe because i'm not sure if it was character driven or just so forgettable that I've already forgotten the plot). I have nothing against this approach at all and i already identified this nature early on. But I also haven't made it a secret what I think about the themes Franxx has decided to centre on. Watching educationally stunted teenagers clumsily learn about sex and romance has all the emotional depth of a neutered dog trying to hump its owners leg. I'll give the show credit for having the balls to imply that Kokoro and Mitsuru had sex but that's only one moment out of three episodes. I liked this show a lot better when it focused on ZeroTwo's past (because that episode actually had them as kids so it made sense) and how much responsibility ZeroTwo and the others had in the way they treated each other because that was actually a very complex subject that required a lot of nuance to see through and that is evident in how much debate it generated. But this isn't complex or nuanced; it's just rehashing the same "WE HAVE FEELINGS BUT WE'RE OPPRESSED" shit over and over and over again. If any of this had any application to real life like the ZeroTwo focused episodes did then it would be fine but it doesn't. It's just been episodes of episodes of stating the obvious. The only type of people who could learn from this show are similarly educationally stunted people (who probably wouldn't be watching anime) and little kids (and i wouldn't show this to little kids for a lot of reasons).

If you think differently then more power to you. But I'm well aware of what this show is trying to do thank you very much. It's not exactly subtle about it. Whether there's any value to what the show is doing is an entirely different topic.

let me put it different i was being ironic and exagerating the situation but overal that was the "anime pace and balance" you had a lot of landscape and little action(and by action i means not just battle but really any real interaction since most of the times things where offscreen in the landscape), because grimgar suffered a lot with bad animation or "lack of animation" and lack of of "balance" because you have many "nothing really happening" and by nothing even "talk", i got caught many times falling sleep during all episodes due to "how much "nothing is happening" really relevant, they tried to make the anime "depressive and "realistic" but it goes to a point where it become "stupid and boring" and hard to deal the pace of the anime turned it totally unbalanced and a very bad anime with ended being one of the fails of the season with low sales and few peoples iking it, because even for a "sol" it suffered terrible.

And going back this is a forum and if i feel a need to "point something which i do feel wrong in any post' i will talk this is how a "forum work" in the same way i "don't talked to you and you replied to me them please at last learn to no be a "bad person"


and if you really know what is the plot and bla bla bla and love to compare it with evangelio or whatever anime you want, then don't come and say "where is the plot" because that was your "complain" if you know what is the "plot" them it make you look "really "bad" for asking something you already know exist.

I'm not trying to be "smart only trying to share my opnion and knowledge as many others.

[KPSJ]

Originally Posted by zibi88

Sadly it was 9 vs 1 so kinda lame on their part, ganging on one girl. Too bad Hiro couldnt enter the fry, grab a gun and to the matrix thing "dodge this" poof.

Still this episode is the turning point for a revolution. Hiro saw that if the kids develop too far the adults do just mind swipe. They did to him, 02, Mitsuru, Kokoro even Nana who is now locked up in a small cell mostly to get either discarded or once again put into the memory erresure process.

Maybe Hiro will show up in Nana's cell and have a little chat with her about his experience of past and what he learned. Share info that he got memory swiped but now he remembers all and empotions are guiding him. Nana might join the kids for a better future since she saw what APE did to those plantations, just killing thousends like that with no hesitation.

02 has nightmares of those she kinda drained to death, so maybe soon she will be taken by the princess leaving Hiro behind. This would be a chance for Nana to substitute for 02 and help Hiro save the girl. Since we saw Nana as a teenage pilot for a reason. Connecting with Hiro could mostly unlock all of her erased memories

Time will show but it is kinda certain that Hiro is fed up with APE and adults doing and will mostly turn againt them soon or at least at the end of the show, maybe after hearing the reason the dinos appear.

I agree it's not fair but the hand to hand combat was great IMO, TBH i enjoyed the hand to hand over the mech fights up to this point. I hope the mech to mech fights top it in the final 6 episodes.

[wuhugm]

https://i.imgur.com/4V3eAGm.png

Gangba**

Pay for your sins, 02

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by _Ninja_

There are several things people aren't considering regarding the mind wipe:

- This is an all powerful dictatorship. Do not mistake the way you, the viewer, perceives P13 to the way APE does within the context of the show. Don't overestimate how concerned they are with this one squad of kids or how threatened they are. They've intervened before in this way. See Nana. It doesn't bother them enough to pull all the plugs and burn it all down metaphorically speaking. They casually mind-wiped two, threw them back in, done. The typical arrogance of this kind of authoritarian leadership.

- APE council isn't so unified in their decision making as seen this episode.

- Dr. FRANXX still has significant influence considering he made P13 exempt from interference. Hachi brings this up even to the Nines, even though Papa send them. Papa may still value FRANXX enough not to bring it all down and just sanctions selective intervention.

- FRANXX is their science guy. He likely came up with the whole procedure and knows more about it than APE. As do the viewers in a sense that it is likely APE is not aware of the memory wipe ever being reversed. Also FRANXX or his people could just as well leave the rings on their fingers.

- I would guess no one in their society outside a handful of individuals has any idea whatsoever what those rings are.

You're basically saying the same thing we are. That APE is incompetent. It doesn't matter if it's born out of arrogance or ignorance, the point is they suck at their job. I don't think they're that ignorant by the way, Nana is a prime example of mind wiping being imperfect and that was definitely reported to them. It was implied it wasn't the first time this happened too. And as the people who censor information, they must have access to it. Their underlings, the 9s, certainly knew a hell of a lot about the way things used to be. One flaw I'm sure they have and you didn't mention is that they're unable to understand people's feelings/emotions, which would explain some of their failings.

It was already brought up, but watch as it gets revealed Kokoro is pregnant and they totally missed that, even though it was the thing they were trying to avoid.

As for Franxx, I think they're done indulging him. They let him run his little experiment, saw the extremely displeasing result (to them), and decided to pull the plug.

Originally Posted by Endscape

I initially thought the same thing, but then I remebered that Squad 13 is so far out of the norm that it would be impossible to integrate Kokoro and Mitsuru in another squad, at least not in time for the battle at hand.

They more than likely don't even care whether they remember as long as they contribute right now, which is also why they didn't just kill them.



APE seems to have moved far away fromcontemporary humanity, no shock they wouldn't recognize the symbolism of wedding rings, if they were even aware that they were having a wedding to begin with.

If they don't care whether they remember, why even bother wiping out their memories in the first place? Not to mention it's a process that took weeks. If they spent that much time on it, that means it's important.

APE possibly not knowing the meaning of the rings doesn't matter. They both have a ring on the same fingers, it doesn't take a genius to figure out they should remove them just in case. Besides, it makes a lot of sense to take away any personal belongings they might have. Like they tried to do with Zero Two and her book in the flashback.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Kanon

You're basically saying the same thing we are. That APE is incompetent. It doesn't matter if it's born out of arrogance or ignorance, the point is they suck at their job. I don't think they're that ignorant by the way, Nana is a prime example of mind wiping being imperfect and that was definitely reported to them. It was implied it wasn't the first time this happened too. And as the people who censor information, they must have access to it. Their underlings, the 9s, certainly knew a hell of a lot about the way things used to be. One flaw I'm sure they have and you didn't mention is that they're unable to understand people's feelings/emotions, which would explain some of their failings.

It was already brought up, but watch as it gets revealed Kokoro is pregnant and they totally missed that, even though it was the thing they were trying to avoid.

As for Franxx, I think they're done indulging him. They let him run his little experiment, saw the extremely displeasing result (to them), and decided to pull the plug.

If they don't care whether they remember, why even bother wiping out their memories in the first place? Not to mention it's a process that took weeks. If they spent that much time on it, that means it's important.

APE possibly not knowing the meaning of the rings doesn't matter. They both have a ring on the same fingers, it doesn't take a genius to figure out they should remove them just in case. Besides, it makes a lot of sense to take away any personal belongings they might have. Like they tried to do with Zero Two and her book in the flashback.

The prime exemple is zero two which it really don't worked at the end and they where forced to "lie to her" in order to make her work for them.

For what i get the mind wipe is just a tool to keep then in control and not something really permanent but even with that, trigger memories back is not easy as we saw, hiro memories only come back thanks to zero two and nana the same her memory only come back due to her "big attachment to the kids", you need a strong trigger to make them come back and again they just don't care as they just need to do it again.

And about the time, it's looks like it can be different from person to person, for what i saw for hiro it just take one or 2 days to work while zero two was impossible, also take in account they where "little kids and it made more easy, but now being teenagers make a little more hard and take more time and more strong are that "feelings".

For me it's looks like more they "are aware of the mind wipe being not 100% perfect" and probably it never gonna be unless...

But they really don't care all they need to do is do it again because the problem is really the "human body" that is why they are planning of turning everyone in "computers" like them, because without the "body" they can proper control everyone minds and turning them in just AIs like them.

At this point since APE machine side plans is moving foward they just don't care anymore all they need to do is wipe or throw them in the jail as they did with nana.

About the rings as you told they tried to take the book but failed and let zero two have the book in the end that already show which they really don't care about it.

Like others told you are going from "our point of view' not they points, it's not a matter of being "smart" or genius, just priority and needs".

The childrens are important for them because they are they "only line of defense" against the klaxxs, them they can't afford to "kill them" since they can't mass produce them in a fast pace and as some hints are being show, the pilots are "born" and need to grow like kids, them take time to "replace" lost childrens it's not something they can instantly replace and they neither just "clone them" as we see which excluding the "nines" each pilot is really different not just a clone.
Them they can't go getting riddle of them until the klaxxs are done, them they need to keep using that fail system to keep them under control.

Worst case scenary could blackmail the kids because will be like 5 couples against a a APe army+ nines + klaxxs, while we know they will sucess because of ofcourse we gonna get a sort of "happy ending", don't chance the matter which they chances of sucess are really low and the most smart move from the childrens is keep obeying the adults if they want the best "sucess chances".

And finally as you told the APE in general lack "humanity", they lack emotions and feelings which make them do 'mistakes" because they don't take that things in account and they feel which they are just troublesome, that is why they plans is to wipe mankind "from what make them living and humans" and turning them in something more "efficent" and easy to control without a "human body"/emotions/feelings.

They are idiots and pretty bad at they jobs but it still inside what you could expectate from them based on how they "are programed" and remember in the end machines are not "perfect" and can be even worst than humans when comes to "perfection" because they decisions aways will be limited to what they "are programed" and are unable to take proper decisions because they lack some important things to make proper judgments.

the APE situation is starting to make me remember johnny deep movie where he die and his friends put his "mind inside a machine and he start to loose his humanity since he don't have anymore a "human body" with human brains to keep him "human" and take feelings and emotions in account, i believe some of the APES had they minds transfered to machines leaving they old bodys and brain make them only "rational without the "emotions".

[Wandering Soul]

Originally Posted by Kanon

The Ichigo and Ikuno scene was well done. I liked the Hachi and Nana scene as well, and am curious to find out more about them.

Agreed on both points. Can't believe that after doing virutally nothing with the guy for 17 episodes, I'm actually sort of looking forward to seeing what they do with Hachi.

[Sageblink]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

And see the guy above me for an example of what I meant. ^^

Well, it's not that I utterly want a "suffering p0rn" as you're calling it.
It's just that the show is clearly teasing us to expect the worst yet never go fully there.

When they showed us Kokoro entering Stampede mode in the PV, you would expect a dramatic fight the next week. Yet it never came because Mitsuru stopped her right away. Fine, it helps building their romance and Mitsuru as a less cold kid.

But we knew something was coming during the wedding. We have a squad taking the lovers away. Seems dramatic enough... And again, they're back, with a little bit of hope at the end when Kokoro "noticed" a sakura petal. What was the point ?
Couldn't they just focus on Nana for that brainwashing plot ?

I disagree. We don't want an edgy massacre. We don't want them to suffer to death. The authors want us to take the bait, but are too scared to fully commit to it, or clumsy while trying to build some tension. It's half-baked.

[_Ninja_]

Seems like Nana was possibly one of the doctor's early experiment subjects. Since she doesn't appear to be "indoctrinated" in the flashback. Hachi on the other hand says he has no emotions. Although he is increasingly annoyed at what is being done to the children. Possibly in the past Nana has gotten through his shell of indoctrination as we see her through his eyes and somehow he is still with her which doesn't feel like an accident.

PS. Honestly screw the people being killed potentially stuff. These days it is so wholly unsurprising that literally everyone is expecting exactly that. There isn't anyone I've seen who wasn't seeing the massive death flags. I thought Mitsuru and Kokoro would get gunned down as they ran any second for that edgy shock value.

[HtwoN]

Originally Posted by _Ninja_

Seems like Nana was possibly one of the doctor's early experiment subjects. Since she doesn't appear to be "indoctrinated" in the flashback. Hachi on the other hand says he has no emotions. Although he is increasingly annoyed at what is being done to the children. Possibly in the past Nana has gotten through his shell of indoctrination as we see her through his eyes and somehow he is still with her which doesn't feel like an accident.

Hachi loved Nana. And he also cared for the children. He indeed has emotions. He just said he didn't have emotions because he isn't supposed to have them.

[germanturkey]

no point in repeating what has been said already, but i'm dying to know more about Nana. i definitely think she'll play a big role in the next two eps.

[Blueknight78]

to be fair i'm really curious about "papa", because it's really unclear if papa is really the APE or someone else, because it's really just APe why they keep "hidding" him and don't show peoples adressing APE members as PAPA, even when nines come to talk with PAPA while looked like they where in the APE room, they don't showed them and later we don't see none of the APE members talking about it like they don't care, it's really weird it.

[HtwoN]

Originally Posted by germanturkey

no point in repeating what has been said already, but i'm dying to know more about Nana. i definitely think she'll play a big role in the next two eps.

Oh well, it's pretty obvious that Nana and Hachi will help the children escape.

[wissenschaft]

I only started watching this show yesterday and I've already watched up to episode 10. I'm honestly surprised I like this show so much. No, correction, I love this show. Pretty shocking since I didn't think I'd like it but friends pestered me into watching it. Also, I love how I have no idea where this story is going. That puts a lot of pressure on the big reveals but to me there hasn't been a bad episode yet. I am watching the English dubs though and thats coming out a little slower than the subs but the voice work is really well done.

Oh and I NEED to get the OST for this show. All the songs are amazing.

Someone said this show was star diver meets eva. Which sounds nuts but watching the show I can see where it comes form.