2018-04-14, 13:05 | Link #2001 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
Here's the difference between Hiro and Ichigo. He regrets his actions when he sees the plain take zero two away. Ichigo does not, and she is going to be the reason someone dies because of her actions. Actions that actively damage her squad because it's to protect hiro, it's for Hiro. But in reality it's completely and only for herself and only herself. If it was for Hiro than she wouldn't have forced herself on him.
__________________
|
2018-04-14, 13:12 | Link #2003 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
|
Quote:
And I'm sure whether IRL or in anime, tragic past does not excuse assaulting others. If my gf beating up all my friends(and probably family as well since the children only live by themselves), I'd be angry with her too. Zero Two has shown to be someone more knowledgeable in relationship more than the sheltered children here? Except Hiro seemed to be the one who's actually working to make it permanent and something deeper while 02 was perfectly content with the usual flirting and piloting. |
|
2018-04-14, 13:16 | Link #2004 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Okay, I've seen the episode and taken notes:
Spoiler:
So I'm left wondering... why are some people treating this like the end of the world and Ichigo is the spawn of the devil? Zero Two didn't try to apologize to them. Not Hiro. To them. She openly admitted she didn't care about things like Teammates after Ichigo admitted she tried to welcome her in, which we've seen time and time again from the Beach Episode, and when she put her foot down as leader Nana had already arranged for her to be gone because Hiro can't ride with her with his yellow count going higher. When she finally loses her patience, Goro is the one who gets backhanded into a window, yet he's the one trying to keep the peace. Goro and Kokoro, the two most empathetic people in the series and both in love (well, Goro with Ichigo anyway with Kokoro being possibly in love with Mitsuru) ultimately decide to let her go see him. And when he's escaped, she loses what little patience she had and believed that they tricked her, despite the fact they were obviously piecing it together, and promptly floored them. Hiro comes in to see the downed bodies of his teammates, who has known longer than her, and about how she was calling humans weak. He called her exactly what she was acting like when she revealed she did all that because she didn't get her way, a monster. Not how she looked or her blood, but because she had just hurt everyone. He wasn't happy about it considering he did like her, but he couldn't keep indulging her either and Ichigo stopped him from going after given what just happened. That had gotten to be a really unhealthy relationship. Some separation will do them some good. As for the kiss... what about it? Ichigo never said she loved Goro and her interests have largely been about Hiro, who was in a relationship that left him with bruises and he could have been turning into someone who just kicked the collective ass of their group because she wasn't having her way? I feel bad for Goro, who the series seems to want to suffer, but other than that Zero Two is in the wrong here and it hurts me to say that because I love her.
__________________
Last edited by Twi; 2018-04-14 at 13:27. |
2018-04-14, 13:26 | Link #2005 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Age: 38
|
Ichigo just blindly in love and craving for the D in Darling, you know the adults don't teach them what it can be used for
Zero Two was treated like an animal since she was a kid to make her comply to these so-called adults. Hell, they aren't that different than Hydra from the Marvel Universe from what was shown in the previous episode. She was molded to be a stone-cold killer, can't expect any kind of rational feelings out of her without some serious therapy and healing.
__________________
|
2018-04-14, 13:33 | Link #2007 | |
Kamen Rider Muppeteer
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Unknown
Age: 39
|
Quote:
Anyway, this was an absolutely amazing episode all around. The team standing up for their teammate, even though they might have overdone it a little. Then there's 02 reaping what she sows. There are some lines you do not cross, girl. ...And of course people misuse the phrase "NTR" again. And re: friend zoning. I do not like that word. Saying Ichigo "friend zoned" Goro makes it sound like she wronged him in some way. I mean saying she wronged Goro would be like saying she was obligated to answer Goro's feelings for some reason. She most certainly did not give him any conflicting answer. Sure she didn't outright turn him down but she most certainly did not accept. She was being honest. Btw, I don't expect her and Hiro to go anywhere. Hiro clearly does not see her that way. He clearly still has feelings for 02, which I completely understand. So there. |
|
2018-04-14, 13:35 | Link #2008 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Texas, US
|
Now that I think about it, this episode is like the end of the picture book. The Princess flies away. Now it's up to the Prince to forge a new ending I guess.
Quote:
|
|
2018-04-14, 13:43 | Link #2009 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
|
Do you realize she probably doesn't even know what apologizing means? I mean, she lived all her childhood in isolation. They would only let her out to be tortured and experimented on. Then when she grew up she was forced to pilot some stupid robot and partner with people who didn't care about her and saw her as a monster.
You people are expecting her to behave like a fully social and emotionally-functional person. That makes no freaking sense.
__________________
|
2018-04-14, 13:44 | Link #2010 | |
Kamen Rider Muppeteer
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Unknown
Age: 39
|
Quote:
Actually, I'm just expecting her to behave like a human being. Which, by Hiro's own admission, she was not doing. There were hundreds of other actions she could have taken from a purely pragmatic perspective, social norms be damned, and she willingly chose the most self destructive one. |
|
2018-04-14, 13:46 | Link #2011 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Quote:
At that point, Ichigo had no reason to believe anything she said and they were looking out for Hiro. And when they did give her what she wanted and Hiro wasn't there, she snapped. People were hurt, the kids we actually liked instead of the adult mooks she normally throws around and we cheer. Her past may be an excuse up until then, but she said she understood what Hiro meant now about wanting to talk while deciding not to talk to them about it so they could understand why she wanted to see him. Quote:
She's not that little red girl in the snow anymore who couldn't speak. She actively made her decisions here with a mind capable of comprehending actions and consequences, hence she knew she fucked up and considered what happened at the end a punishment. And if she couldn't apologize, what was she going to say to Hiro? The past plays an influence on the present, but she's responsible for her actions.
__________________
|
||
2018-04-14, 13:49 | Link #2012 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Texas, US
|
Quote:
|
|
2018-04-14, 13:50 | Link #2013 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
She isn't human, no one outside of the squad and Nana are (and they are only because of an experiment), they have all since lost what it means to be human. 02 was the only one who was treated like the monster she was born as. By this shows actual monsters. You can't expect her to act human. Because she has never experienced true humanity until Hiro and never since.
__________________
|
2018-04-14, 13:53 | Link #2014 | |
Kamen Rider Muppeteer
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Unknown
Age: 39
|
Quote:
|
|
2018-04-14, 13:58 | Link #2015 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
You really need to go back and watch those episodes because she was never welcomed into the group, she was always outside it, she only interacted with Hiro. The only episode she interacted with anyone else in the group was the boys vs. girls episode and that was because to the other girls she was screwing up their stance. She was never truly a part of it
__________________
|
2018-04-14, 14:01 | Link #2016 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Quote:
The beach episode she was welcomed in, Zero Two decided to stay away to keep swimming. She's been pushing them away, not the other way around. As Dengar put it, this was her decision because she believed that she couldn't mesh with them, so she didn't bother giving them a chance. These kids were easily the most accepting group she'd ever find, even after they learned about her three ride rule and she manhandled Mitsuru (he was asking for it), and she treated them like they were fodder and admitted it. Remember, this episode Goro and Kokoro were the ones who decided to try and convince Ichigo to let her see Hiro even after that and she still beat them down. The girl sabotaged herself.
__________________
|
|
2018-04-14, 14:04 | Link #2018 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
|
That's not how things work. It's really hard for kids who weren't loved to learn to care later on in their lives. And for her it's worse because she was treated like shit and tortured. It doesn't matter what she saw as a teenager. At this point she's already predisposed to not trust anyone. She has no reason to feel like she has to apologize to anyone and she's not gonna change unless someone actually makes the effort to help her change. And there's a chance it's already to late even for that. Maybe at this point all Hiro can do for her is to accept her as a monster and become a monster himself to be with her.
__________________
|
2018-04-14, 14:08 | Link #2020 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Oh, yeah. Nine Alpha was enjoying it. He's the one who told Ichigo after all.
Quote:
We can pity someone for their past, but... she hurt the people who were trying to help her. Ichigo was the first to defend her against the Nines and Hiro tried to accept her for who she was, but they weren't good enough for her. She was going to kill Hiro and when the others caved in she still hurt them because Hiro wasn't there.
__________________
|
|
|
|