Psycho-Pass - Episode 22 [END] Discussion / Poll

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by justsomeguy

Sibyl doesn't have to be taken down for the plot to matter. If Akane had decided on some sort of rebellion against it, such as getting the truth to dissidents, or any action (rather than just words) symbolizing Sibyl's days being numbered, or even simply escaping with Kogami, then that would have been an improvement. Instead, she just went along with it, believing that a better society resulting from Sibyl's own manipulation will eventually end it. That's disappointingly passive for somebody supposedly growing during the storyline.

Because any rash move to bring down Sibyl would completely screw up the society that has been so neutered and made lazy by it. It's not a "good" ending per se if she did that

Originally Posted by carcanclaw

I'm not sure if it is though. In a society where individuality is paramount, like most of the Western world, we are conditioned to see symbols of cold and calculating authority as inherently threatening to our way of life. Sybil clearly believes that the ends justify the means, and is very unfeeling and efficient about keeping the peace, to the point where we see it as actively antagonistic. If it hadn't killed Kagari, many more people would have died due to mass panic.

It's also worth noting that, if Makishima had been captured and integrated, it would have prevented any other asymptomatic individual from being able to follow in his footsteps. So his death, while satisfying to those he wronged, may ultimately allow other criminals like him to continue to operate outside of the law.

I said malicious because Sibyl, in its last words to Akane seemed to hint that it still retains the human trait of malice in its former owners. Just because you make rationalized decisions and calculate everything doesn't mean you aren't scum at heart.

Malicious in this sense, I mean at its core personality

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Ultramarinus

Not just any revolution will lead to a better government though. Take for example, the two most famous revolutions: Russian and French.

I'd definitely argue that the American revolution is no less famous than the Russian or the French one. How did the American revolution turn out?

Still, I too think that Sybil needed to be overthrown right now and Akane should have tried it.

The thing with Sybil is that it's a system that will get increasingly powerful and difficult to dislodge the longer its in place. At least right now you'd have these two factors that can make the transition to a Sybil-less Japan smoother:

1. An entire generation of Japanese people that remember what life was like before Sybil. This generation could help younger generations adapt to a Sybil-less Japan as from their own personal memories they know of such a Japan and how it managed to function.

2. Former Lawyers, Judges, etc... that could be put back into their old roles and/or used to help train younger Lawyers, Judges.

If Sybil continues for another twenty years or more, you lose these two considerable aids in transitioning to a Sybil-less Japan.

I've read about the extreme difficulties that the old USSR had in transitioning from a communist USSR to a more capitalist Russia (and other former USSR states). Part of this, I think, is that nobody living in the old USSR knew what it was like to live under anything other than communism because of how long the communists were in place there. It makes it that much harder to transition to a fundamentally different form of government. And switching from Psycho-Pass readings and Sybil to old-fashioned police work and trying people in front of juries and judges is just as big a societal shift as communism to capitalism is.

It's not going to get any easier to "turn Sybil off" the longer you go without doing so. In fact, it's only going to get increasingly hard to do so. Sybil itself probably knows this. That is why they are laughing at Akane...

Akane's only hope within her current approach is to persuade Sybil to make small, but significant, changes that gradually shifts Japan more towards a pre-Sybil justice system. More humane treatment for "latent criminals" would be a start. But there's no evidence of Akane doing this.

The system made the law the means to an end when it should have the law above its own needs. It goes against its own reason of existence when it employs murderers as the governors.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by cyth

Lately, I've shifted to a more conservative stance, just to get that out of the way.

Even though a revolution is bright, as I've described it, it brings very little systematic, real change.

If you're just replacing one group of leaders with another, you're right.

But I don't think anybody is saying "Take out these 250 brains and put 250 different brains in their place".

What I've been saying is that the best solution is to "turn Sybil off" (or at least get it out of the "justice" side of things), have Shion run a Psycho-Pass facsimile for a few years while you slowly transition the people from the current legal system of Sybil Japan to one that involves old-fashioned police work, juries, lawyers, and judges.

That would constitute a systematic, real change to Japan.

But absolutely nothing changes if Sybil stays in power, and Akane doesn't win significant concessions from it. Akane could potentially use Sybil's desire to "win her over" against Sybil by using that as leverage against Sybil. "If you want me to think better of you, then this is a change you should make."

The way I see it, real change happens when people change.

For people to change, they have to know why they should change, and that typically involves them learning something new. Certain truths have to be made clear to them. Right now, several important truths are being denied them, and will continue to be so until Sybil thinks that the people won't care about those truths.

Also, let's be realistic. Would Makishima bring change if he succeeded with hyper-oats production sabotage?

Yes, he would. Sybil Japan would have had to get substantial foreign food imports. That means that Japan gets a clear, and up-close/personal picture of the rest of the world. And the rest of the world lives without Sybil. Now there's a spark for real change.

Why do you think countries like China and North Korea go to such lengths to limit their people's interaction with foreign media sources, internet pages, etc...? It's because they don't want their people to know that there's a different way of living that other people around the world currently enjoy.

Originally Posted by fict_ticious

I was hoping the knife fight would have extended into the grain fields.

This end is pretty Gen Urobuchi. Guy doesn't really like the old hero archetype or altruism and to usher in an age of "no more heroes" doesn't surprise me.

*cough!*Kaname Madoka*cough!*

[Ultramarinus]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

I'd definitely argue that the American revolution is no less famous than the Russian or the French one. How did the American revolution turn out?

American revolution is more of an independence movement rather than a true revolution, it didn't aim to overthrow the government after all. In this important aspect, it's rather different than the likes of say, Russian, French, Cuban, Iranian, German, Austrian, Turkish, Chinese, Arab (you get the idea ) revolutions. It's a different matter to state "you can't rule over our region" and "you can't rule at all" to the ruler.

And yes, some of those resulted in better regimes but many also turned out for the worse, at least for a long period before getting overthrown again.

[JiCi]

Originally Posted by GoldenLand

- The Yayoi/Shion scene. It feels really, really cheap for the series to have neglected those two characters and their interactions so badly, and yet to shove them into an after-sex scene in the last episode so that people would go "yay, lesbians!". That's not good enough, to skimp on their scenes like this. They should have paid some more attention to those characters before. Lazy, lazy writing.

Their relationship could have been better shown throughout the series... and the scene could have been longer. However, that feels forced and somehow censored. We have gotten people that got shot, stabbed, decapitated, mutilated, strangled and such in rather detailled images, as blood was aplenty... but seeing 2 ladies in a bed had to be covered. After seeing "statues" made of naked mutilated underaged schoolgirl bodies, would it really have mattered?

What I mean by "forced" is that, well, since we haven't got enough girl-girl action, they somehow had to add that in one scene. Honestly, that could have been better shown. Just have a good 5 minutes of Yayoi and Shion talking on their appartment's patio about the future of Unit One and end the conversation with a hug and a passionate kiss would have worked nicely. Right now though, it feels forced, like I said.

[MisaoFan]

Originally Posted by JiCi

Their relationship could have been better shown throughout the series... and the scene could have been longer. However, that feels forced and somehow censored. We have gotten people that got shot, stabbed, decapitated, mutilated, strangled and such in rather detailled images, as blood was aplenty... but seeing 2 ladies in a bed had to be covered. After seeing "statues" made of naked mutilated underaged schoolgirl bodies, would it really have mattered?

What I mean by "forced" is that, well, since we haven't got enough girl-girl action, they somehow had to add that in one scene. Honestly, that could have been better shown. Just have a good 5 minutes of Yayoi and Shion talking on their appartment's patio about the future of Unit One and end the conversation with a hug and a passionate kiss would have worked nicely. Right now though, it feels forced, like I said.

I really agree on this part. Yayoi/Shion relationship was so obvious and the early part of the series has lesbian written in subtilities until lesbian schoolgirl arc. I wish we need to see more of them as well Yayoi's flashback episode need to be expanded, but who knows.

[kk2extreme]

If this is a prequel of the main series, it should be renamed Phycho Pass Zero

[Mad Pierrot]

That lesbian scene really felt out of place. I mean Ginoza was facing his father's death and his new way of life, Akane was almost broken by Kogami's action and the Sybil attitude, Kagari was not even given a grave, lesbian sex scene. If somebody had missed a scene from episode 2 he would go "Holy crap Gen! Is this an apology for the lack of romance?!"

[warita]

While I expected Makishima to die and the sybil system to continue its operations, the ending was weak at best. Somehow it didnt feel like it ended at all.

[cyth]

Why are you guys making such a big deal out of the lesbian scene, lol. Better that than them sitting behind a table talking.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by cyth

Why are you guys making such a big deal out of the lesbian scene, lol. Better that than them sitting behind a table talking.

But did we even need that scene at all? Any scene can be more boring, but doesn't mean it has to exist.

[warita]

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

But did we even need that scene at all? Any scene can be more boring, but doesn't mean it has to exist.

Truth to be told, i did expect to see more of the lesbian action after episode 2 and also the episode where they have shown her, how she had a crush on that female musician.

The scene at the end was surprising, but I thought actually it is good they have shown it. Othwise the prior scenes would have been even more pointless.

[garbage]

nyaha Akane continues to surprise in this finale, giving kogami the dominator and using the gun herself then managing to get on the truck where Kou failed. Too bad events just doesn't favor her wanted ending, still it might be for the better. there goes makishima's brains...Kou shot him in the head right? or did he...there is that suspicous scene/shot of a brain in the ending. strange focusing on 1 brain.(was trying to see if it has a hole )

BTW is it just me or is Sybil or how they depict it strange WTH what's with that shuffling the brains 1 spot to another, I mean they're all interconnected right so what's the point?? I would understand it if it's to move one to "rest area" (still that's really not needed) but they're actually transferring brains from one part of the grid to another. CONTINUOUSLY too. In fact that's a lot more dangerous for the brains, all that movement & possibility of damage. just doesn't make sense.

casting ayane sakura for one scene, and wow a Minor? whoo, miss vivid red transfers dimensions ^^ hmm is that a teaser ,or shades of 2nd season to come. after all kogami is out there, and Akane still has all that rage against the system. She's just waiting for the right time and circumstance. On the other hand,that scene is a full circle from ep 1, and is somewhat a closer. especially that end phrase.

Still it was a good ride. The only thing is it makes me feel that it's somewhat incomplete (probably why I thought there might be a sequel) I'll miss the Endings though....Egoist fan here they better bring them back for the ....2nd season eheheh

[kitten320]

Duno, I liked the ending. It is not perfect and has some holes but otherwise it fits.

Series were always pretty grim so having a bit of a grim ending is fitting.

Besides It is not a full circle.

Unlike Ginoza, Akane knows the truth. Kogami is not a crazy psycho and his pass can be read. It is a step forward to crushing the system.

An open ending like this seems to fit.

P.S. Whoever was doubting Shion's/Yayoi's relation till now will have to accept it. Am pleased and surprised to get a confirmation.
I don't like how two of them were ignored for most part of the series but this scene was needed because bunch of people were still in denial despite all the hints till now.

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by kitten320

P.S. Whoever was doubting Shion's/Yayoi's relation till now will have to accept it. Am pleased and surprised to get a confirmation.
I don't like how two of them were ignored for most part of the series but this scene was needed because bunch of people were still in denial despite all the hints till now.

My bad.. but I can't say that that scene was necessary.. It's pretty out of place... Why a bed scene, c'mon of all, is there no other alternative? God..... *made me want to watch G taste right now...

The second half is the one of the worst ending I've ever seen... you could not call this a "good ending"

*press Delete on folder

To lame for my taste...nor for storage... what a waste of time...

[garbage]

Originally Posted by Kanon

Yes, it's her. Mika Shimotsuki. She was chosen by Sibyl right after graduating high school apparently. They mentioned she was still a minor.

oh she is? damn , now that's one less reason for S2 ehehe

Originally Posted by Ultramarinus

OTOH, Britain for example, had no revolution and ended up more democratic and libertarian eventually with no blood shed in the process.

oh? but then the industrial revoulution mostly started from Britain,of course it's different, but the effects where similar. shifting power to the lower classes.

Anyway the french revolution itself was very influential in Britain. It's effects was felt not just in France, but the practically the whole western world at that time. So in a sense it's not just France's revolution. British people are lucky someone else did it for them

[MisaoFan]

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

My bad.. but I can't say that that scene was necessary.. It's pretty out of place... Why a bed scene, c'mon of all, is there no other alternative? God..... *made me want to watch G taste right now...

The second half is the one of the worst ending I've ever seen... you could not call this a "good ending"

*press Delete on folder

To lame for my taste...nor for storage... what a waste of time...

If you expected too much romance in this anime, well this is not for you then. Me too expected some romance in it, but it failed to develop them. Still, it's not like the ending is pretty bad but I kinda wished it could be better.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

But did we even need that scene at all? Any scene can be more boring, but doesn't mean it has to exist.

Apparently we did need that scene since there were still some people in denial about Yayoi being a lesbian. It was the only way they had left to get the message across.

Now, was the sexual orientation of a minor character like Yayoi relevant? Not really, but that's another matter. As much as I like my yuri, I wish this had actually been a plot point. Like maybe they could have revealed Sibyl does not accept homosexuality, and Yayoi was flagged as a latent criminal for that reason. Or they could have simply developed her relationship with Shion. There were plenty of ways to make this more than fanservice.

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by MisaoFan

If you expected too much romance in this anime, well this is not for you then. Me too expected some romance in it, but it failed to develop them. Still, it's not like the ending is pretty bad but I kinda wished it could be better.

You really knew my taste huh?

Anyway.. the way they made the ending... It's like simply a wheel.. this newbie will likely experience the ones these old guys already have...

I could say, I've seen some anime with the same ending or rather movie.

I agree that they could have made this better... I would have preferred that it ended in the field... with Kogami and Akane just talking...

[MisaoFan]

Originally Posted by Kanon

Apparently we did need that scene since there were still some people in denial about Yayoi being a lesbian. It was the only way they had left to get the message across.

Now, was the sexual orientation of a minor character like Yayoi relevant? Not really, but that's another matter. As much as I like my yuri, I wish this had actually been a plot point. Like maybe they could have revealed Sibyl does not accept homosexuality, and Yayoi was flagged as a latent criminal for that reason. Or they could have simply developed her relationship with Shion. There were plenty of ways to make this more than fanservice.

Maybe we could leave these speculations in future Psycho-Pass subsequent materials such as novels or prequels then. As much as I like Yayoi, I really wished they need to explore about why she's turned into a lesbian to clear up some people's denied minds but failed to show them.

[creb]

The scene surprised me, but I'd hardly argue it shouldn't have been included. I've never understood the idea in both visual and print media that things should be stripped down to only what's necessary. Why not have things just for flavor?

It certainly spawned a lot of responses, which is hardly a bad thing.

Then again, I went into that scene, seeing as it came on the tail end of them wondering about Kogami, thinking that magnificent bastard did manage to bag the "hot blonde", so it was less about a lesbian scene, and more of a "haha" moment when it turned out to be Yayoi.