[Manga] Chapter 343 Discussion

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by Syndicate

who are you to say that...

Maybe someone in this forum who wanted to post his thoughts on this matter?

Talent is not something that can be clearly defined and thus people cathegorized depending on their data. It's something much more interesting. It's true that Sasuke looks much more talented (they use the word genius) than Naruto, however based on that logic it's true for the Itachi - Sasuke relation too. Then we should say Itachi is the genius Uchiha while Sasuke is the dropout Uchiha? Sasuke always had that feeling of inferiority towards Itachi, just like Naruto had towards Sasuke. But this manga is not about praising the genius, the ones who have natural talent to achieve things, it's just normal for them to be such good ninja considering their luck of being born as they are. It's much more interesting to see if someone with less talent can achieve such a level, that's a real achievment which is why this manga is not called Itachi or Sasuke. Sasuke is now stronger than Naruto and Orochimaru, but it's just natural, it was known that he will reach this level when Orochimaru first met him in the forest of death.

However i wonder what was that jutsu used by Sasuke when attacking Oro. Was it an earth element combined with lightning element? It didn't look like pure lightning element, lightning cannot be directed like that and look like a stick. Also Orochimaru never saw that kind of nature manipulation from Sasuke, so it might be a bloodline nature-mix, i mean a special kind of matter ( like the wood created by Yamato ). Maybe lightning + earth combined into some special element, which could be strong as Sarutobi's stick (the monkey henged), a material strong as diamond, something unique to Sasuke. I mean that would be Sasuke's super-jutsu, just like Naruto has his own.

[Sarugaki]

Originally Posted by ShikaShika

Here's what I think.

• Sasuke will not be able to finish off Orochimaru
• Kabuto will aid Orochimaru in the fight
• Orochimaru and Kabuto will not be able to stop Sasuke from leaving

First of all, I do not see Naruto & Co rescuing Sasuke at all. The manga shows them both walking their own paths, obtaining power, most likely to clash again somewhere in the future. Furthermore, Kishimoto just made a big deal about Sasuke and that he was still on top of Naruto. Having them rescue him would just be weird, with respect to how the storyline has been going recently... And since Orochimaru is going to take over Sasuke's body, there's nowhere the story can go if Sasuke stays, so it's obvious he's going to leave.

I totally agree with you. I think Akatsuki will interrupt their fight somehow. They wanted to hunt him down after the fight between Naruto and Sasuke. We have already seen Konoha vs Akatsuki, and Konoha vs Oro, now it would make sense to see Oro vs Akatsuki or Sasuke vs Akatsuki.

[Syndicate]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Maybe someone in this forum who wanted to post his thoughts on this matter?

yeah ok true ero.

But the problem i have with his statement or most people is that they ignore and say that facts in the story are wrong just to satisfy their fanboyism.

this is what happens.

Fact in story
oro says: sasuke is a talented ninja.

prove shown in anime he can beat an army unscratched where oro says he himself wasnt able to.

i derive from this fact an statement saying

Sasuke must be an Badass ninja for oro to say this(note i add a narutotards because i know that x Member(narutofan) will respond to butthurtness to TRY to make it seem sasuke isnt talented even though it has been proved he is so. A narutoTard still will try to prove sasuke isnt.

Actually im at home laughing now how easy it was to fool him. This is exactly how easy it is to fool naruto for ninja's in anime.

That was my intention Sinaura . Dont let your fanbioyism cloud your judgement.

[tramadrama]

Let me get someone's view on this:

What's more impressive?

Sasuke defeating 1000 ninjas?
Naruto doing KB to defeat 1000 ninja by creating 999 clones?

Personally, I think it's an even tradeoff. Not taking anything away from Sasuke because he's far stronger than Naruto at this point, but I think when it comes to how a person is defeated in the two above questions, technique is a 1 to 1 ratio. As long as the job is done, that's all that counts.

[Syndicate]

i agree with shikashika further analysis. But disagree on what he things will happen after this clash. i just dont see akatsuki bumpin in the fight.

kishimoto allways let the goodie goodie people fight the baddie baddie people. I would really like a fight between bad guys since it much more interesting. But i doubt it will happen.

Also the whole reason why i dont know what will happen with sasuke and itachi is why i am still watching the plots and way too achieve mangekyou is for me the only reason to watch.

I mean a shounen where a boy says 100000 he will be hokage dattebayo and thus you know he will be hokage lost my interest cuz i allready know he is gonna be hokage thus for me boring. itachi vs sasuke + oro fight is a complete intesresting thing.

Its like how at the chuunin exam when team 7 came to the building and where iruka said something about heaven & earth. Coming down to sakura having brains and lacking in ability to fight and naruto being a plain-idiot-aho-moron with ability to fight and sasuke having both good atributes.

oro(brains) + sasuke(ability to fight) vs itachi (who has both) note oro still sick

[ajay29]

Originally Posted by Syndicate

Fact in story
oro says: sasuke is a talented ninja.

prove shown in anime he can beat an army unscratched where oro says he himself wasnt able to.

.

Excuse me if im wrong, but my translation says Oro wasn't able to do that when he was Sasuke's age.... Doesn't mean Sasuke can take Oro now, but also doesn't mean he wont....
I would actually love it if Sasuke whipped Oro good n' proper!

[Syndicate]

Originally Posted by tramadrama

Let me get someone's view on this:

What's more impressive?

Sasuke defeating 1000 ninjas?
Naruto doing KB to defeat 1000 ninja by creating 999 clones?

Personally, I think it's an even tradeoff. Not taking anything away from Sasuke because he's far stronger than Naruto at this point, but I think when it comes to how a person is defeated in the two above questions, technique is a 1 to 1 ratio. As long as the job is done, that's all that counts.

Yeah your right on that .

everything can be seen impressive for everone else though the creditability might be sometime plausible.

Thouhg it not only sasuke defeating 1000 ninja's - its defeating 1000 ninja's without a scratch. From every fight naruto is in, naruto allways gets hit. thus with 1000 ninja's still would be hit at least once even with KB.

I agree a job done is a job done but i think there is more to job done for personal issues in the ninja world. A ninja can get the job done effectively or not. For example oro was able to kill sarutobi but due to the fact that his arms were sealed of he was sick and thuis not able to put up a good fight agaisnt tsunade and jiraya. This is why i say without a scratch what oro noticed is noteworthy

Originally Posted by ajay29

Excuse me if im wrong, but my translation says Oro wasn't able to do that when he was Sasuke's age.... Doesn't mean Sasuke can take Oro now, but also doesn't mean he wont....
I would actually love it if Sasuke whipped Oro good n' proper!

true but im not saying he can beat oro ^^.

I personally love both these characters cuz they bring some sense in how ninja's really are work.

Though i have to say what is up in his mind that the person who thought him everything a sannin that he can beat him now. probably that oro wasnt able to know he could do that chakra extension thing maybe he developed some things oro doenst know off. cantw ait for next chapter

[Zerokule]

You all forget that this is a Shonen style story and that Naruto is the main character. He will ultimately end up as the strongest, period. Even Goku had stronger opponents and in the end put them to shame. So stop with all the flaming and lets have a real conversation about the story and shut up about who is stronger than who, because in the end Naruto will be the best. That's Shonen for you. Just enjoy the story!

Now about the story, a great twist to Sasuke betraying Oro. That will be a great fight if it comes to that. Poor Naruto was about to get some TLC from Sakura and Sai and Kakashi blow it. What would be cool to see is a Naruto bushin in the library reading nin books.

[tramadrama]

Originally Posted by Zerokule

You all forget that this is a Shonen style story and that Naruto is the main character. He will ultimately end up as the strongest, period. Even Goku had stronger opponents and in the end put them to shame. So stop with all the flaming and lets have a real conversation about the story and shut up about who is stronger than who, because in the end Naruto will be the best. That's Shonen for you. Just enjoy the story!

Now about the story, a great twist to Sasuke betraying Oro. That will be a great fight if it comes to that. Poor Naruto was about to get some TLC from Sakura and Sai and Kakashi blow it. What would be cool to see is a Naruto bushin in the library reading nin books.

Uh, Maijin Buu was stronger than Goku. There is no way in heck Naruto will end up the strongest, just to clear that up. Naruto will be the most respect character, but that's it.

Anyway, the reference to all of this strength isn't necessarily flaming, IMO. It's the fact that in some cases, the formula has always been when Sasuke has X amount of strength, Naruto is equal to some degree. That's my basis off of this whole thing. Now have Sasuke challenging the likes of Orochimaru; which is almost like Naruto going to the front door of Akatsuki's hideout and challenging Itachi or something one on one. It's pretty bad ass. It's also more example of why the Time Skip did not do Naruto a bit of justice.

This was the perfect opportunity for Naruto to try some moves he picked up during the Time Skip. All he did was try the same move thrice and it was something he just learned. It's like Naruto isn't even a fighter that can build off of other moves. All he can do is KB to build some sort of combo. Pretty boy fighters like Sasuke (which by the way, Syndicate is the reason why Sasuke has no scratch) would tire Naruto out with the moves in Naruto's arsenal because his moves are the least bit small in nature. If Naruto has to bring out nukes to kill insects then that's not my idea of strength. It sucks that Naruto has a long way to go to even become par with Sasuke.

Please note: This opinion would do a complete 180 if Naruto wasn't in a sling right now.

[tatami]

Originally Posted by tramadrama

Let me get someone's view on this:

What's more impressive?

Sasuke defeating 1000 ninjas?
Naruto doing KB to defeat 1000 ninja by creating 999 clones?

Personally, I think it's an even tradeoff. Not taking anything away from Sasuke because he's far stronger than Naruto at this point, but I think when it comes to how a person is defeated in the two above questions, technique is a 1 to 1 ratio. As long as the job is done, that's all that counts.

Originally Posted by tatami

what is different between sasuke and naruto beating 1000bla bla ninja is that sasuke can do it by not killing them and not having any scratch on him and can walk away from the area...what naruto can do is kill em all in kyubified 4 tail mode...and after that he wont be able to walk around with his happy ramen face...even remember what happened and need yamato to be settled down. and also while he is killing all those ninjas he hurt himself in a very bad way...think about it sasuke as only genin took out narutos tajuu kage bunshins...1000bla bla ninja vs 1000bla bla naruto clone is not equal...

its not certain that 999 clones can take down 999 other nin. when a clone gets hit it pufs..1 man can took out massive amount of clones...(sasuke as genin took out TKB himself)

[Zerokule]

Originally Posted by tramadrama

the Time Skip did not do Naruto a bit of justice.

I agree there that in the manga that Kishi hasn't shown how Naruto has "grown" besides in height. However in the anime, I feel they did a great job in showing his improvement while fighting Kakashi. The problem with manga is that they don't always have the space to elaborate like they do in the anime. But yeah, Naruto has not shown any improvement becoming of a real ninja. He's just able to destroy a lot more when he screws up.

[neilz]

Naruto is becoming a human kyubi (in terms of dealing damage), thou I'll give a few more mangas to see on how much he improved.

About Sasuke betraying Oro, its either a test or (in a weird way) a bad dream by oro.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

Well those ninja's seemed like mere random "old genin lvl" shinobi.
And with Naruto as it is now and even in Kyuubi mode....he could easily do the same...

And it's not like it's an amazing ability to do...i cant see him (Sasuke) or anyone do this with Konoha Shinobi...

Funny enough you wrote this post not so long ago :

I think Yondi will beat pretty much everyone...he proved to be excellent vs 50 other jounins (no one did this so far...we assume the Sannin could...) through the entire Kakashi Gaiden we didnt even witnessed him being hit even once...in a era of WAR! When Kakashi was awake...Yondi obviously didnt seemed injured at all...completly unharmed..

Funny how such a feat becomes unimpressive when it's a character you dislike who do even better.

I'm mean really I don't know what's funnier between people making Sasuke the new god of this show or those who try to make this feat unimpressive whereas the whole chapter was meant as a so stupidely high hype that the spoiler script of this chapter was believed to be a fake coming from the wet dream of a Sasuke fanboy.

Originally Posted by Zerokule

I agree there that in the manga that Kishi hasn't shown how Naruto has "grown" besides in height. However in the anime, I feel they did a great job in showing his improvement while fighting Kakashi. The problem with manga is that they don't always have the space to elaborate like they do in the anime. But yeah, Naruto has not shown any improvement becoming of a real ninja. He's just able to destroy a lot more when he screws up.

You know I do think Naruto's victory over Kakuzu should have been presented in a different way but that doesn't change that he pretty much obliterated an Akatsuki in less than 5 minutes with only little help.
I don't know... Thing like "at least equal or stronger than Kakashi" kind of say it all about Naruto's improvement to me.

[tramadrama]

Originally Posted by Hunter

You know I do think Naruto's victory over Kakuzu should have been presented in a different way but that doesn't change that he pretty much obliterated an Akatsuki in less than 5 minutes with only little help.
I don't know... Thing like "at least equal or stronger than Kakashi" kind of say it all about Naruto's improvement to me.

Yeah, Naruto should not be sporting a sling after a kick ass battle like that.

Score is:

- Sakura - 1
- Naruto - 1
- Shik - 1

Wonder who is going to be the next AkatSlayer?

Originally Posted by tatami

its not certain that 999 clones can take down 999 other nin. when a clone gets hit it pufs..1 man can took out massive amount of clones...(sasuke as genin took out TKB himself)

I would agree with you if we were talking about Naruto 2 1/2 years ago, but I think that Naruto could take one of those ninjas Sasuke took on 1 on 1000 in this era. Simple reasoning is this:

- If Sasuke took out 1000 guys with taijutsu alone, then I eat my words completely.
- If any jutsu other than taijutsu was used in the process, then Sasuke doing Nagashi Chidori is the equivalent of Naruto doing KB because it's one ninjutsu being used on both sides to take out 1000 ninjas.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by tramadrama

Score is:

- Sakura - 1
- Naruto - 1
- Shik - 1

Wonder who is going to be the next AkatSlayer?

I don't think Sakura deserve a full kill : Chiyo killed Sasori, not Sakura.
She was a great help but she still was merely the support.

[tatami]

i dont say kb is a lame trick to took out 1000 nin. i only say that there is no certinity that 1000 kb can took out 1000 nin. i say it would be stupid to fight 1000 nin with kagebunshins...just summon frog master and he will take care of x3 of them i think...

what i wonder is did naruto make any more connectios to frog boss in time skip...what would sasukes counter to this summoning... i dont think its a real deal to take out 1000 ninjas both naruto and sasuke but what is imp. is their states after battle n_n

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

However i wonder what was that jutsu used by Sasuke when attacking Oro. Was it an earth element combined with lightning element? It didn't look like pure lightning element, lightning cannot be directed like that and look like a stick.

It can with Shape Manipulation.
This jutsu seems to be a Chidori-sword : another Raiton using the principle of the Chidori with higher level of Shape Manipulation.

Also Orochimaru never saw that kind of nature manipulation from Sasuke, so it might be a bloodline nature-mix, i mean a special kind of matter ( like the wood created by Yamato ).

No he recognized the Nature Manipulation but he had never seen this Shape Manipulation in the other hand.
That means Sasuke was developping jutsu in his back, not that it's a nature-mix bloodline stuff.

[tatami]

Originally Posted by Hunter

I don't think Sakura deserve a full kill : Chiyo killed Sasori, not Sakura.
She was a great help but she still was merely the support.

then so does naruto i think...kakuzu had nearly hard time when naruto arrived (died 2 times) and naruto been rescued certain death by kakashi and yamato...so naruto only finished the job n_n

[Yogi]

Pre-timeskip Naruto could defeat 1000 average Genin-level ninjas. A few mass Kage-Bunshin plus a lucky Gamabunta summon would do it. We really have no idea how powerful these ninja are, but I highly doubt a country has that many Jounin level ninjas to spare, making them either Genin or Chuunin.

Actually, I don't know which country would have 1000 ninja to spare, period. We didn't see this many during the Sand/Sound/Leaf battle. Plus, they don't have forehead protectors on. These are the ninja equivalent of Redshirts.

[tramadrama]

Originally Posted by Hunter

I don't think Sakura deserve a full kill : Chiyo killed Sasori, not Sakura.
She was a great help but she still was merely the support.

I just gave the living the credit But true nonetheless.

Tatami, it wouldn't surprise me if Sasuke can summon the snake now for the simple fact that he told Oro that there was nothing else that he could teach him.