Code Geass (Generic discussion thread)

[Kang Seung Jae]

Originally Posted by Narona

That's no proof kang. The fact that kallen shows her feelings doesn't mean that lelouch shown anything romantic towards her.

I don't say that I am right (I could be wrong XD ), but as far as I see it, I don't see any romantic reactions towards her shown by lelouch. (and for those who will bring the "live on", I really see it as far fetched to see that as Love confession or such things)

People are always talking about c.c.'s feelings, kallen's feelings etc. But me I ask for proof about lelouch's feelings.

Kallen showed her interest towards him a lot, does that mean that he feels the same, I mean a romantic feelings? Not necessarily.

If I tell you that I love you and that I will chase you up to the center of the earth, does that mean that you will obviously love me because I put a lot of efforts in it? No. ^^

I would consider episode 7 as proof of Lelouch having "romantic" feelings


But yes, you're correct: The only SOLID proof of Lelouch having romantic feelings is with Shirley. As for his feelings on Kallen, I await the sound dramas.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Lie

There is a not-so "canon" way to judge what characters mean to one another. While seiyu may not know much about the script and what character interactions are meant to mean down the road, they are told by Taniguchi how to act their parts. What emotions to inflect and what to make the general mood come out to be. He has to tell them this. This is why he had to tell Amesuki about the meaning of the kiss, she has to know how to act the part, what emotion to put in her voice, and so on. If we look at Yukana's role, it has never been elaborated on to have any form of romantic meaning within it. Yukana herself said she saw the two as mother and child, and this, while not from the mouth of god, still gives us an idea for what Taniguchi wanted to put forth because she (Yukana) is the one putting the emotions into what C.C. says and does. This idea does run aground somewhat when you look to Jun Fukuyama though it arguably fits if we look at it as his character is an absolute idiot when it comes to romance.

It was not in a recent interview. It was discussed many times here. Things change with time. We can even see it in 24, that was the first time she refered to him by called him a "man" and not boy.

Originally Posted by Kang Seung Jae

I would consider episode 7 as proof of Lelouch having "romantic" feelings


But yes, you're correct: The only SOLID proof of Lelouch having romantic feelings is with Shirley. As for Kallen, I await the sound dramas.

The boy was about to use refrain. I don't think he was in his normal state. Anyway, you have a point since it could be true ^^

[Lie]

Originally Posted by Narona

It was not in a recent interview. It was discussed many times here. Things change with time. We can even see it in 24, that was the first time she refered to him by called him a "man" and not boy.

Yukana's blog is regularly updated with what she thinks about her character and I was talking more about her blog than that interview. I must not have been clear enough as I was not focusing on anything specific. She's not always refered to him as boy, which he was at 18 years old, so that hardly even amounts to being something I'd label as development in terms of romance, which is what I was talking about. Going from boy to man can be easily be maternal.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Lie

Yukana's blog is regularly updated with what she thinks about her character and I was talking more about her blog than that interview. I must not have been clear enough as I was not focusing on anything specific. She's not always refered to him as boy, which he was at 18 years old, so that hardly even amounts to being something I'd label as development in terms of romance, which is what I was talking about. Going from boy to man can be easily be maternal.

Provide links to the articles+dates+translations, please.

About the maternal love, I only remember one interview (who was discussed here) and it was back from season one. (and I never even saw that interview myself)

[darthfury78]

Originally Posted by Kang Seung Jae

I would consider episode 7 as proof of Lelouch having "romantic" feelings


But yes, you're correct: The only SOLID proof of Lelouch having romantic feelings is with Shirley. As for his feelings on Kallen, I await the sound dramas.

I don't believe that Lelouch had had any romantic feelings for any of the girls involved. We don't even know what his feelings might have been for Milly. However, the only clues that I have spotted was that they enjoyed each other's company, as well as feeling VERY relaxed whenever they were close to each other. Perhaps it was a mutual chemistry, or something even more. But there is no question that both Milly and Lelouch are very good with hiding their feelings around other people.

[Lie]

Originally Posted by Narona

Provide links to the articles+dates+translations, please.

About the maternal love, I only remember one interview (who was discussed here) and it was back from season one. (and I never even saw that interview myself)

You want me to sit and translate all of Yukana's blog? I don't have infinite time.
Maternal love was an interview nearing the end of season 1 or at the end of it if I'm not mistaken. But that was an example on which you are over focusing, Yukana has never said anything to make me assume her perception ever changed.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Lie

You want me to sit and translate all of Yukana's blog? I don't have infinite time.
Maternal love was an interview nearing the end of season 1 or at the end of it if I'm not mistaken. But that was an example on which you are over focusing, Yukana has never said anything to make me assume her perception ever changed.

Then you have no proof to show that I can be wrong about C.C.'s feelings towards lelouch in R2.

[FoxxFireArt]

Originally Posted by Narona

People are always talking about c.c.'s feelings, kallen's feelings etc. But me I ask for proof about lelouch's feelings.

Kallen showed her interest towards him a lot, does that mean that he feels the same, I mean a romantic feelings? Not necessarily.

Well, if you wanted to go into detail Lelouch did panic when she was taken captive. That surprised everyone. Part of his return to Japan was intending to rescue her. She was the first thing he asked about once the battle was won and enraged when he heard Suzaku took her.
At the end of the extended preview for episode 18. At the end Lelouch called out, "I must save Kallen!". Not to forget that in just about every previews, extended or regular, since her capture Lelouch mentioned her in almost all of them.
In episode 18 Kallen was priority target number 2. Nunnally being number 1, obviously. Guren was number 3.
In episode 19 Lelouch apologized for not coming fro her sooner and asked for her forgiveness.
He purposely lied to her to save her life. He thought he was going to die right there. He could of let her walk away hating him, but he wanted her to know his last words.
While going off to seal himself with Charles forever he thought of how he could trust Kallen to take care of C.C.

He asked for a detour with her and while gave everyone else the cold shoulder he broke character with her. He talked about Ashford bringing back memories. Despite not saying anything to her he also showed that he wouldn't even lie to her.
He certainly seemed to enjoy that kiss. He had his mouth open and eyes closed during this one. Though I can't remember if we ever got a very good look at Lelouch's face during that kiss with Shirley. Not to mention the one with Kallen was the last of the series that was seen. The whole scene felt like he wanted to see her one last time face to face before he went through with Zero's Requiem.
During the flashes of Lelouch's memories. Kallen didn't appear in a friendly setting or in combat. She appeared as the women who tenderly kissed him.

Taking all this into account. I think it can only really show that he didn't think of her as just a friend. There is a deep caring there. I'm also sure you can find just as many points with C.C. That' can't be ignored. Though when pressed by Kallen if she loved Lelouch. C.C. wouldn't, or couldn't give a straight answer.
Neither of these three were straight with their emotions and that is probably just where the writers wanted it.

Though in all honesty. The only proof of a woman he loved is for Euphy and Nunnally. They were the only girls he ever openly admitted his love for.

He showed he cared deeply for both Kallen and C.C., but as to whether it was love. I doubt we will ever get a straight answer on that one.

[lovecakecookies]

Did the magazines come out yet.. maybe there is no info on code geass?

p.s
You guys are having an interesting discussion, and making good points, but take it to the romance thread!!

[Narona]

Originally Posted by FoxxFireArt

Well, if you wanted to go into detail Lelouch did panic when she was taken captive. That surprised everyone. Part of his return to Japan was intending to rescue her. She was the first thing he asked about once the battle was won and enraged when he heard Suzaku took her.
At the end of the extended preview for episode 18. At the end Lelouch called out, "I must save Kallen!".
In episode 19 Kallen was priority target number 2. Nunnally being number 1, obviously.
In episode 19 Lelouch apologized for not coming fro her sooner and asked for her forgiveness.
He purposely lied to her to save her life. He thought he was going to die right there. He could of let her walk away hating him, but he wanted her to know his last words.
While going off to seal himself with Charles forever he thought of how he could trust Kallen to take care of C.C.

He asked for a detour with her and while gave everyone else the cold shoulder he broke character with her. He talked about Ashford bringing back memories. Despite not saying anything to her he also showed that he wouldn't even lie to her.
He certainly seemed to enjoy that kiss. He had his mouth open and eyes closed during this one. Though I can't remember if we ever got a very good look at Lelouch's face during that kiss with Shirley. Not to mention it was the last of the series that was seen. The whole scene felt like he wanted to see her one last time face to face before he went through with Zero's Requiem.
During the flashes of Lelouch's memories. Kallen didn't appear in a friendly setting or in combat. She appeared as the women who tenderly kissed him.

Taking all this into account. I think it can only really show that he didn't think of her as just your friend. There is a deep caring there. I'm also sure you can find just as many points with C.C. That' can't be ignored. Though when pressed by Kallen if she loved Lelouch. C.C. wouldn't, or couldn't give a straight answer.
Neither of these three were straight with their emotions and that is probably just where the writers wanted it.

Though in all honesty. The only proof of a woman he loved is for Euphy and Nunnally. They were the only girls he ever openly admitted his love for.

He showed he cared deeply for both Kallen and C.C., but as to whether it was love. I doubt we will ever get a straight answer on that one.

Yup Don't forget what he has done for c.c. in 15, and the famous unfinished line "She's my...! my...!"

+ "I won't have you take away anymore from me"

[Lie]

Originally Posted by Narona

Then you have no proof to show that I can be wrong about C.C.'s feelings towards lelouch in R2.

You have no proof to the contrary. You've jumped to a conclusion that makes me want to stop even posting. I was not trying to contest anything I was putting forth a way that one can look at what the seiyu's say and use it to their opinion. Point of the matter was Yukana has never stated anything about her character liking Lelouch in the way you seem to want her too, and seiyu's loose opinions can be used to give us some idea of how the characters themselves feel, which is why I mentioned Amesuki and Fukuyama who often bickered, teased, or argued over the relationship of their respective characters with one another. It is just another way to look at this.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Lie

You have no proof to the contrary. You've jumped to a conclusion that makes me want to stop even posting. I was not trying to contest anything I was putting forth a way that one can look at what the seiyu's say and use it to their opinion. Point of the matter was Yukana has never stated anything about her character liking Lelouch in the way you seem to want her too, and seiyu's loose opinions can be used to give us some idea of how the characters themselves feel, which is why I mentioned Amesuki and Fukuyama who often bickered, teased, or argued over the relationship of their respective characters with one another. It is just another way to look at this.

True. And I have never denied that. However about her view on lelouch

- It was back in season one
- A famous member here (Koshimizu) even told us to not trust VA's opinions. IIRC especially about fukuyama who is still a rookie when it comes to make statements about the characters he plays. He even said in one interview that kallen will not be a LI for lelouch. And Koshimizu said to us to not trust that.

And no I don't jump to conclusion.

[FoxxFireArt]

Originally Posted by Narona

Yup Don't forget what he has done for c.c. in 15, and the famous unfinished line "She's my...! my...!"

+ "I won't have you take away anymore from me"

Right. Just like that scene in episode 9. After Kallen fell on top of Lelouch. She suddenly asked him why he came back. He didn't answer that, but responded with asking her to join him back at Ashford when it was all done. This surprised Kallen. All Lelouch got out was "I-" when out of literally nowhere C.C. cuts in asking about her hot sauce. (I'm still curious with how C.C. got in that room without either of them noticing. She looked like she had been sitting there for a while.

This does how that originally Lelouch intended to go back to his life at Ashford.

This series is jam packed full of "Relationsist-interruptuos". A contagious and wide spread disease. Apparently, the only cure is a couple of kunais to the back and what should of been a fatal fall off a cliff.

Originally Posted by Narona

True. And I have never denied that. However about her view on lelouch

- It was back in season one
- A famous member here (Koshimizu) even told us to not trust VA's opinions. IIRC especially about fukuyama who is still a rookie when it comes to make statements about the characters he plays. He even said in one interview that kallen will not be a LI for lelouch. And Koshimizu said to us to not trust that.

And no I don't jump to conclusion.

Also sarcasm in text form never translates well. I remember that interview also pointing out his laughter at points.
We also learned from Koshimizu Ami's interview that Kallen didn't realize she was in love with Lelouch until she kissed him. That wasn't just her speculation. That is what the director told her about the scene.

She claims surprise, but knowing directing I doubt that. You need to tell the actors often times the motivations of the character in moments or you never get the depth of feelings you want.

[Lie]

Originally Posted by Narona

True. And I have never denied that. However about her view on lelouch

- It was back in season one
- A famous member here (Koshimizu) even told us to not trust VA's opinions. IIRC especially about fukuyama who is still a rookie when it comes to make statements about the characters he plays. He even said in one interview that kallen will not be a LI for lelouch. And Koshimizu said to us to not trust that.

Then don't say that I don't have proof. Calling me out on the fact that you can't read Japanese has nothing to do with what proof I have. Saying such just makes me feel like you don't want to listen to me.
And would you stop focusing on one point when I've not even been talking about that at all in my last post? Never said to trust seiyu's either, I said to take what they say with a grain of salt because they are told how to enact scenes and have some idea of emotions are meant to appear in the scene, something that does not always translate to the audience.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by FoxxFireArt

Right. Just like that scene in episode 9. After Kallen fell on top of Lelouch. She suddenly asked him why he came back. He didn't answer that, but with responded with asking her to join him back at Ashford when it was all done. This surprised Kallen. All Lelouch got out was "I-" when out of literally nowhere C.C. cuts in asking about her hot sauce.

This does how that originally Lelouch intended to go back to his life at Ashford.

This series is jam packed for of "Relationsist-interruptuos". A contagious and wide spread disease. Apparently, the only cure is a couple of kunais to the back and what should of been a fatal fall off a cliff.

True

Originally Posted by Lie

Then don't say that I don't have proof. Calling me out on the fact that you can't read Japanese has nothing to do with what proof I have. Saying such just makes me feel like you don't want to listen to me.
And would you stop focusing on one point when I've not even been talking about that at all in my last post? Never said to trust seiyu's either, I said to take what they say with a grain of salt because they are told how to enact scenes and have some idea of emotions are meant to appear in the scene, something that does not always translate to the audience.

I am not talking about blog or anything that no one or only a few saw, I only talk about the show and the interviews that a lot of people already saw. That's the difference. So, that's why I asked for links, because it's easy to make up things. So at leats give links to the poor people who can't read japanese. Then I can ask translations to some people if you don't have the time. Thanks.

I am always among the ones who say that a lot of things are possible. My first comment to kang's post was not serious, because when I read someone saying that lelouch has no romantic feelings towards c.c., I can say the same about kallen.

While me personnaly, I think that he can have feelings towards kallen or c.c. or both.

My point was that we don't know lelouch's feelings. About C.C.'s feelings, I have my own view of the show. While me I see her showing something in 24, another person could see nothing. All in all, imo c.c. has real problem when it comes to love and how to show her feelings.

I can admit things, I am not a so biased person here, even if I can also be biased at times.

[hero147]

Lol....What kind of a mother comforts their 17~18 year old son like that? Isn't that a little too close? Moreover, what kind of mom kisses their son on the lips? Freaky and powerful stuff....

[lovecakecookies]

Originally Posted by hero147

Lol....What kind of a mother comforts their 17~18 year old son like that? Isn't that a little too close? Moreover, what kind of mom kisses their son on the lips? Freaky and powerful stuff....

Who cares? everyone sees things differently....

Now back on topic, can anyone confirm if those tidbits about C.C and Nunnally in 6 months or whatever be true?

[Narona]

Originally Posted by hero147

Lol....What kind of a mother comforts their 17~18 year old son like that? Isn't that a little too close? Moreover, what kind of mom kisses their son on the lips? Freaky and powerful stuff....

Good point. Even for a memory transfer, I will not eat that the only way is to kiss the person. It's not an eroge anime. C.C. used kisses, but that doesn't mean it was the only way to do a transfer.

And yeah, a mother who kisses her son on the lips

[FoxxFireArt]

Originally Posted by Narona

True

Side effects to the cure do appear to be unexpected pregnancies.
Slow acting pregnancy at that. Two months after Ougi is captured she's still running around and fighting and not even showing. She must of just found out about her pregnancy withing a few days or so. There was that one month time jump before.

The level of pregnancy Villetta shows kind of dated when Kallen reads off the epilogue. Somewhere I'd say from 5 to 6 months of the events of Lelouch's Death.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by FoxxFireArt

Side effects to the cure do appear to be unexpected pregnancies.
Slow acting pregnancy at that. Two months after Ougi is captured she's still running around and fighting and not even showing. She must of just found out about her pregnancy withing a few days or so. There was that one month time jump before.

The level of pregnancy Villetta shows kind of dated when Kallen reads off the epilogue. Somewhere I'd say from 5 to 6 months of the events of Lelouch's Death.

Haha, so true

Well, I wonder if some contraceptive methods exist in Code Geass. ^^

I would say maybe more than 6 months ^^