Playstation 4

[ReaperxKingx]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

It is suppose to refer to graphics having diminishing returns ?

No idea, though it is interesting that there is a female character in Killzone. Hey Chaos, any news of anymore new exclusives on the PS4? I checked a lot of stuff on the net, there isn't a peep out of anybody.

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by ReaperxKingx

No idea, though it is interesting that there is a female character in Killzone. Hey Chaos, any news of anymore new exclusives on the PS4? I checked a lot of stuff on the net, there isn't a peep out of anybody.

Well... There's this little curiosity...




PlayStation Facebook teases ‘When Worlds Collide’

[ReaperxKingx]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

Well... There's this little curiosity...




PlayStation Facebook teases ‘When Worlds Collide’

I am guessing that is not the actual title, it seems like Playstation is doing a great job keeping things under wraps this time around.

[Chaos2Frozen]

There's also this... Although it's for PS3...


Suda51 Teams Up With Namco Bandai And Akira Creator For New PS3 Game

The game is based on Akira creator Katsuhiro Otomo’s upcoming film, Short Peace, which will play in theaters later this month. The film is made up of four short films with different styles and stories, directed by Otomo and others. Ranko Tsukigime’s Longest Day will be considered the fifth short story of the film, but it’s a video game.

[Newprimus]

Originally Posted by ReaperxKingx

I am guessing that is not the actual title, it seems like Playstation is doing a great job keeping things under wraps this time around.

I read an article that says it could be a tease for the PS4's release date, for november 3. Reason because a solar eclipse will be occurring on that day.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

It is suppose to refer to graphics having diminishing returns ?

There were a number of people who claimed that graphics on the PS3, 360 and Wii U had gotten about as good as they were going to get, and that any more visual power would only lead to diminishing returns. The popular visual example of this was an image showing less and less difference as it was created using more and more polygons. Obviously, this isn't true as there's always more that can be done in terms of texture quality, anti-aliasing, draw distance, lighting and so on.

[SummeryDreams]

I don't think that gaming consoles will end soon.. But I do believe that tablets, cellphones, for games are increasing there market as well.. So maybe a time would come, but I don't think it's way too soon as SOON..

[felix]

Originally Posted by SummeryDreams

I don't think that gaming consoles will end soon.. But I do believe that tablets, cellphones, for games are increasing there market as well.. So maybe a time would come, but I don't think it's way too soon as SOON..

They're increasing because there was a market and it wasn't exploited before they came along. They're not actually affecting consoles, pcs, etc, since it's hardly the same market. At best they're affecting flash sites and facebook games. And if they were so popular as people claim why aren't they putting books into extinction?

I have a tablet. I bouth Mtg2014 recently. Guess what, I got it on my PC as well. Because (a) online, (b) I want to play on a big screen too (tablets will always be small), (c) infinite power supply. Admittingly online is more of self imposed limitation on the game but if I'm at home and I have a big screen why would I play on a tiny one. Tablets are also a commodity, PC's are universally useful, and for gamers consoles are infinitely more useful by comparison and virtually the same price.

Phone and Tablet games are also mostly garbage too. So like I said it's unlikely people subscribed to the pc/console market are actually moving to tablets and phones, it's more that people that would otherwise not game at all previously are now creating a market. This generalization of everyone into one big lump is likely the same failed logic that lead microsoft to the xbone.

[4Tran]

I think that tablet and smartphone games do erode the handheld and casual audience. For a lot of people in these groups, a minor game that can serve as a diversion will be enough to satisfy them. It will hurt the Vita, 3DS, and general Nintendo audience especially as parents can let their kids play games without having to shell out for a dedicated gaming device.

However, it still won't do much to affect the home console market as those gamers are looking for experiences that mostly can't be fulfilled by tablets and so on. A good indication of this is that only two major publishers are doing very much in this space: EA because they bought into the market, and Square Enix because they're struggling to find a reliable revenue stream. The likely upswing is that the Wii U, PS4 and Xbone are likely to sell less aggregate than the Wii, PS3, and 360. However, the amount of AAA and non-casual games sold will probably stay about the same. There will be some losses from casual gamer purchases, but they will be made up for by the growth in the market. The biggest danger here is the migration of gamers to the PC.

Of course, all bets are off if China decides to open its doors to game consoles.

[GDB]

The only thing it'd affect on handhelds is shovelware. Like felix said, most of those games are crap. If you just want a distraction, sure, they work. But most people, even children (or perhaps, especially children) want certain things from games. Real games. And that's what the likes of Nintendo and Sony are for.

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

I think that tablet and smartphone games do erode the handheld and casual audience. For a lot of people in these groups, a minor game that can serve as a diversion will be enough to satisfy them. It will hurt the Vita, 3DS, and general Nintendo audience especially as parents can let their kids play games without having to shell out for a dedicated gaming device.

Just a minor quibble: I don't think the Vita should be particularly affected by the migration of casuals from handhelds to tablets and phones mostly because the PSP crowd just wasn't casual to begin with. Most people who bought into the PSP were the so-called core gamers that are looking for RPGs and Platformers. At least that was the impression that I got from the system and the Vita, even with all it's gimmicks, doesn't seem to particularly break the mold when compared to it's predecessor.

The 3DS (and whatever comes next from Nintendo) on the other hand is going to suffer pretty hard with this shift. A good chunk of the DS player base were casuals playing stuff like Brain Training and alike and those are rather swift to switch to the more useful phones and tablets that can do those games as well as browse the web, look at videos, listen to music, amongst other things.

Also: note that laptop sales have been affected by the growth in tablets. It's not just a myth. Plenty of people feel perfectly comfortable with a purely consumption device like a Tablet and, when time comes to buy hardware, choose to buy one when they would previously go for a laptop. This is aided by the fact that in the last 5 years or so computers have gotten "good enough" for most people and are starting to become useful for longer periods of time. Before you would feel the need to replace your computer in around 4/5 years time but now you can probably go 8 without a new computer or even 10 if it was particularly well specced to begin with. It parallels what happened with the current generation of consoles actually (PS3/360) where they managed to outlast virtually every other console cycle because everyone felt they were "good enough" for quite some time now.

People may joke about that "diminishing returns" line but it was true for quite a long time this generation. Sure you can add extra post-processing effects and the current crop of consoles were particularly struggling for memory to pull off stuff like full 60fps 1080p, better textures and better anti-aliasing algorithms but fixing those things 2/3 years ago would make the new consoles probably as ridiculously priced as the PS3 was at launch (or worst).

People may not have noticed but from 2008 onwards or so we went through a price hike in all kinds of memories. Tablets, Smartphones and the move from spinning disks to SSD put quite a burden on the world supply of memory chips and prices sky-rocketed because of it. It's probably why Sony was originally considering only 4GB or ram for the PS4 I reckon.

[blakstealth]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

Well... There's this little curiosity...




PlayStation Facebook teases ‘When Worlds Collide’

Something Insomniac related.

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by blakstealth

Something Insomniac related.

Heroes return? Ratchet & Clank, calling it now.

[Westlo]

Originally Posted by blakstealth

Something Insomniac related.

Yep it is.

Ratchet and Clank: Into The Nexus.

Ps3.

Edit - This is a good sign that the series isn't dead from an Insomniac point of view, I'm sure a PS4 game will be launched in 2015 since the R&C Movie is due to come out that year.

I myself haven't played a game in the series even though the PS3 game was bundled with my ps3 lol, I still have it, I just bought the HD Collection off the US PSN sale, was like $7.50 for PS+ users, bargin.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Dextro

Just a minor quibble: I don't think the Vita should be particularly affected by the migration of casuals from handhelds to tablets and phones mostly because the PSP crowd just wasn't casual to begin with. Most people who bought into the PSP were the so-called core gamers that are looking for RPGs and Platformers. At least that was the impression that I got from the system and the Vita, even with all it's gimmicks, doesn't seem to particularly break the mold when compared to it's predecessor.

I think the joke is that it won't affect Vita and Wii U because they don't sell anyways.

More seriously, the PSP was popular among casual gamers in Japan. These gamers migrated to smartphones instead of Vita. This, coupled with Nintendo sniping Monster Hunter away is why the Vita is in such poor shape.

Originally Posted by Dextro

People may joke about that "diminishing returns" line but it was true for quite a long time this generation. Sure you can add extra post-processing effects and the current crop of consoles were particularly struggling for memory to pull off stuff like full 60fps 1080p, better textures and better anti-aliasing algorithms but fixing those things 2/3 years ago would make the new consoles probably as ridiculously priced as the PS3 was at launch (or worst).

A good sign that a console generation is too long in the tooth is when there's tons of graphics technology available that simply can't be realized using current hardware. I'm pretty sure this is one of the reasons why the PC has become so much more popular - it can show off all of that eye-candy that the consoles can't handle. The next big thing this time 'round is that games will have access to 5-7GB of RAM. Previously, even PC titles used 32-bit .exes, and so were limited to about 2GB of system RAM.

Originally Posted by Dextro

People may not have noticed but from 2008 onwards or so we went through a price hike in all kinds of memories. Tablets, Smartphones and the move from spinning disks to SSD put quite a burden on the world supply of memory chips and prices sky-rocketed because of it. It's probably why Sony was originally considering only 4GB or ram for the PS4 I reckon.

I doubt it. The PS4 was designed with a 8x2 clamshell memory layout. Sony couldn't be sure that they could secure enough 4Gbit GDDR5 RAM chips so they assumed that they'd have to use 2Gbit chips. And when they could get the 4Gbit chips, they simply updated the specs sheet. They should be moving to 8Gbit chips in early 2014, so that will help out their BoM. Too bad we won't see a specs upgrade, price drop or revision then though.

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

I think the joke is that it won't affect Vita and Wii U because they don't sell anyways.

Ouch, Sony and Nintendo should be applying cold water to the wound cause that was one massive burn

Originally Posted by 4Tran

More seriously, the PSP was popular among casual gamers in Japan. These gamers migrated to smartphones instead of Vita. This, coupled with Nintendo sniping Monster Hunter away is why the Vita is in such poor shape.

Yhep, the Monster Hunter snipping was pretty critical but calling that a casual game sounds a bit of a stretch. It's like saying World of Warcraft is a casual game. It may have a huge audience that isn't particularly aligned with traditional core gamers but you can't really call them casuals.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

A good sign that a console generation is too long in the tooth is when there's tons of graphics technology available that simply can't be realized using current hardware. I'm pretty sure this is one of the reasons why the PC has become so much more popular - it can show off all of that eye-candy that the consoles can't handle. The next big thing this time 'round is that games will have access to 5-7GB of RAM. Previously, even PC titles used 32-bit .exes, and so were limited to about 2GB of system RAM.

Sadly that was true almost from day 1 but the main culprit of that behaviour was Microsoft. By putting the 360 on DirectX 9 they made sure that most developers would ignore future revisions of the API in the future.

The iPad and the iPhone seem to have done a better job at pushing graphics technology forward with their push of OpenGL and it's more recent revisions. That API sported features that DirectX 9 was just too old to support and it's my belief that game developers toying with these mobile devices is what ended up pushing the need for newer graphics features in PC games.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

I doubt it. The PS4 was designed with a 8x2 clamshell memory layout. Sony couldn't be sure that they could secure enough 4Gbit GDDR5 RAM chips so they assumed that they'd have to use 2Gbit chips. And when they could get the 4Gbit chips, they simply updated the specs sheet. They should be moving to 8Gbit chips in early 2014, so that will help out their BoM. Too bad we won't see a specs upgrade, price drop or revision then though.

You actually seem to agree with me there if you claim Sony was unsure if they could get enough chips (btw you probably meant bytes, not bits). Note that the shortage wasn't just companies padding their bottomline, the factories were running full steam and there were even some raw material shortages.

EDIT: complete forgot about this. Here's an interesting tidbit about Knack development for the PS4. Apparently the team built a Dualshock that was 50% larger to help developers understand how an 8 year old kid plays the game.

link: Mark Cerny created a giant PS4 DualShock to aid Knack development @ Eurogamer

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Dextro

Ouch, Sony and Nintendo should be applying cold water to the wound cause that was one massive burn

I just bought a Vita, but it's obviously a dead platform for now.

Originally Posted by Dextro

Yhep, the Monster Hunter snipping was pretty critical but calling that a casual game sounds a bit of a stretch. It's like saying World of Warcraft is a casual game. It may have a huge audience that isn't particularly aligned with traditional core gamers but you can't really call them casuals.

Monster Hunter is pretty casual in Japan. The reason why it's so popular is that it's a game that a group of people can play in co-op. It works as socializing tool for offices and the like. It's also why all of the hunting games feature local co-op.

Originally Posted by Dextro

Sadly that was true almost from day 1 but the main culprit of that behaviour was Microsoft. By putting the 360 on DirectX 9 they made sure that most developers would ignore future revisions of the API in the future.

The iPad and the iPhone seem to have done a better job at pushing graphics technology forward with their push of OpenGL and it's more recent revisions. That API sported features that DirectX 9 was just too old to support and it's my belief that game developers toying with these mobile devices is what ended up pushing the need for newer graphics features in PC games.

The pressures for better looking games always originate on the PC - nVidia and ATI keep on trying to one up each other, and Microsoft putting new features into the DirectX toolset. Also, developers want the latest toys to make their games look better - the Metro and Witcher series are pretty good examples here.

I'd say that the main culprit is that both the PS3 and 360 had only 512MB total RAM. That kind of limitation makes it very difficult to pull off some of the fancy effects and nice textures.

Originally Posted by Dextro

You actually seem to agree with me there if you claim Sony was unsure if they could get enough chips (btw you probably meant bytes, not bits). Note that the shortage wasn't just companies padding their bottomline, the factories were running full steam and there were even some raw material shortages.

With the GDDR5, it's not a question of supply, but one of whether the technology would advance quickly enough to allow for higher density chips. Shortages don't play into this because they're new parts that had never been available before, hence nobody was buying them before.

Right now, Sony is the largest buyer of 4Gbit GDDR5 chips in the world by a very large margin. And since they're the largest buyer, they can bump everyone else in priority.

4Gbit = 512MB, so the 16x 4Gbit = 8GB RAM. Chip densities are measured by bit.
Technically, the proper abbreviation is 4Gb, but I added the last part to make it easier to differentiate.

[Chaos2Frozen]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

Of course, all bets are off if China decides to open its doors to game consoles.

China likely to lift foreign game console ban

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

I'd say that the main culprit is that both the PS3 and 360 had only 512MB total RAM. That kind of limitation makes it very difficult to pull off some of the fancy effects and nice textures.

100% agree there.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

With the GDDR5, it's not a question of supply, but one of whether the technology would advance quickly enough to allow for higher density chips. Shortages don't play into this because they're new parts that had never been available before, hence nobody was buying them before.

Right now, Sony is the largest buyer of 4Gbit GDDR5 chips in the world by a very large margin. And since they're the largest buyer, they can bump everyone else in priority.

GDDR5 is not a new technology. It's relatively common on discrete graphics cards for PCs since 2008 or so and you can't really call it new tech. Sony will force the production to ramp up but that's besides my point.

The issue with supply was related not to the specific GDDR5 but to the cells themselves. When the majority of memory sold on consumer devices went from being mainly on spinning disks to solid state you immediately hit issues with production no matter what type of BUS you put on them or what kind of clock you drive them at.

It's a bit of moot point though. Sony somehow managed to get enough quantities of GDDR5 memory to put 8GB of it in every PS4 and to me that sounds like the best thing in this next generation of gaming. 512MB was low even by 2006 standards.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

4Gbit = 512MB, so the 16x 4Gbit = 8GB RAM. Chip densities are measured by bit.
Technically, the proper abbreviation is 4Gb, but I added the last part to make it easier to differentiate.

It crossed my mind that you meant that but for some reason I went full silly there. My mistake.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

China likely to lift foreign game console ban

This is huge news for Sony as it opens up a market potentially rivalling the U.S. It's rather less good for Nintendo as they likely have no strategy for expansion. It's sort of awful for Microsoft as they have no stock of Xbones to allocate to China, and may not have any significant quantity until 2015. I bet that the latter wish that China holds off on the decision until next year.

Of course, this is all contingent of being able to convince Chinese gamers to pay for their games - currently the most popular games are free to play PC games (and Angry Birds ).

Originally Posted by Dextro

GDDR5 is not a new technology. It's relatively common on discrete graphics cards for PCs since 2008 or so and you can't really call it new tech. Sony will force the production to ramp up but that's besides my point.

GDDR5 has been around for a while, but only in 2Gbit density. Even the $1000 GTX Titan uses these chips. The availability of 4Gbit chips was only announced this year. Microsoft didn't know about them or else they wouldn't have been caught so off-guard.

Originally Posted by Dextro

The issue with supply was related not to the specific GDDR5 but to the cells themselves. When the majority of memory sold on consumer devices went from being mainly on spinning disks to solid state you immediately hit issues with production no matter what type of BUS you put on them or what kind of clock you drive them at.

Memory cells? Are you referring to the actual RAM chips? As far as I know, nothing other than the PS4 uses 4Gbit GDDR5 chips so there wouldn't be any competition for them.