Fate/stay night Episode 14 Discussion thread

[Blade_Lord]

Caliburn killed Berserker with it's special effect, which is only activated when in King Arthur's hand, so Archer holding it will gain no profit from it. Also, it is downgraded to B rank when projected, and using Broken Phantasm on a Noble Phantasm actually doesn't use the weapon's original strength to deal damage, but the explosion caused by the weapon.

Special effects? Isn't that is the true power of calliburn? Wait your saying archer can traced calliburn but dont know how to use it??

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Zarxs

Oh, forgot about that requirement :\

The reason Berserker was that strong is because he was well prepared for 10 years, unlike other servants. If you take take 5th HG war Berserker back to 4th HG War, apart from Caster, every other servants should be able to take him down with no problem at all. (Saber with a proper master can use Excalibur 3 times in a row, Gilgamesh can even finish Berserker at his weaker form during the 5th, Lancer's lance nullifies God Hand, Rider's got 2 Noble Phantasms with rank higher than A, and Assassin...can go straight for the master? There really is no proper magicians in Fate/Stay Night...)

[Blade_Lord]

There is a chance... if archer used excallibur beam, he'll definitely fry berserker and die due to mana drain but it still a win to archer,....But really from 25 to 1000 who would've thought that archer could evolve from shirou...

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

There is a chance... if archer used excallibur beam, he'll definitely fry berserker and die due to mana drain but it still a win to archer,....But really from 25 to 1000 who would've thought that archer could evolve from shirou...

Unfortunately Excalibur is only a A++ ranked Noble Phantasm. Tracing it will create a B++ ranked Noble Phantasm. In terms of destruction, it's good, but the strength is still not enough. Archer did mention this in UBW route, as well.

[Blade_Lord]

In terms of destruction, it's good, but the strength is still not enough.

What strength? Archer's or Excallibur?

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

What strength? Archer's or Excallibur?

Traced Excalibur.

[Blade_Lord]

In what way it isn't enough?

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

In what way it isn't enough?

Berserker's God Hand completely negates everything below A rank. Traced Excalibur is at B++ rank, so it's slightly not enough.

[Blade_Lord]

How in the world did archer defeat Berserker 6 times then??

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

How in the world did archer defeat Berserker 6 times then??

Seeing that an A++ noble phantasm can take away 12 of Berserker's life in one go, all Archer has to do is to trace an A+ rank Noble Phantasm and use Broken Phantasm on it, but that's just my speculation. (Archer's mana reserve is not great enough to trace an A++ ranked Noble Phantasm AND use Broken Phantasm on it, he can only do one of them)

[Blade_Lord]

One question, does one servant mana reserve changes with its master? Let's say will archer mana reserves be less with its master shirou then with his master rin??

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

One question, does one servant mana reserve changes with its master? Let's say will archer mana reserves be less with its master shirou then with his master rin??

The maximum mana capacity usually doesn't change, and the mana reserve depends on the condition of the servant. For example, if Saber is summoned completely with a proper ritual, she can have approximately 3000 mana count, while Shirou's Saber only have 1/3 of it due to improper summoning.(The summoning circle that summoned Saber in the 5th HG war is actually just a recovery magic circle for spiritual beings)

Also some equipments increases one servant's max mana capacity. Avalon gives Saber an additional 1000 mana, and perhaps increased mana recovery rate.

Some equipments provides the wielder with extra mana source apart from conventional mana recovery methods(reserve/food/sleep/etc.). The Jeweled Sword Zelretch allows the wielder to draw mana from alternate universes, providing an infinite supply of mana.

[Blade_Lord]

AH the sword of zelretch...

BTW what about archer's complaining he's being incomplete summoned that's why he lose his memory but still retain his fighting skill is that true??If it is how in the world did he retain his fighting skill?

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

AH the sword of zelretch...

BTW what about archer's complaining he's being incomplete summoned that's why he lose his memory but still retain his fighting skill is that true??If it is how in the world did he retain his fighting skill?

That is actually two problems in one. First off, there is no proof that Archer is lying or not, so the bit about him loosing his memory cannot be verified at all.

Secondly, Archer's actually holds limited fighting on his own. His fighting skill actually come from his traced weapons. Weapons traced by Archer have their own history and memories of being wielded and fought with in the past. These experience flow backwards into the Archer/Shirou when held, allowing to fight the way their previously owners do.

[Blade_Lord]

But the way shirou fight Berserker using calliburn is not very good, he barely survive Berserker strike....

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

But the way shirou fight Berserker using calliburn is not very good, he barely survive Berserker strike....

Not sure what do you mean, can you explain more clearly? (we're now jumping to episode 15...)

[Blade_Lord]

(Okay I know should we jump to that thread now then?)
Berserker hit shirou and shirou barely block it with the sword and went flying...If it really gives exp like you said shouldn't he be able to block Berserker sword and retains his stance??

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

(Okay I know should we jump to that thread now then?)
Berserker hit shirou and shirou barely block it with the sword and went flying...If it really gives exp like you said shouldn't he be able to block Berserker sword and retains his stance??

Multiple Choice question:
1. The traced Caliburn was imperfect
2. Shirou cannot use mana burst the way Saber does. To know the technique and to be able to execute it is two different thing.
3. There is still a huge gap between servant and humans(even Saber in her life time won't be able to beat servant Berserker)
4. Shirou's body cannot keep up.
5. Nasu wants it that way.
6. All of the above.

[Blade_Lord]

I thought the archer's noble phantasm controls the body not the body remembers the noble phantasm technique??

[iamandragon]

Originally Posted by Blade_Lord

I thought the archer's noble phantasm controls the body not the body remembers the noble phantasm technique??

That is correct, but...