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Old 2021-05-04, 08:43   Link #61
Guardian Enzo
Seishu's Ace
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Old 2021-05-04, 09:21   Link #62
SeijiSensei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudedmind View Post
I'm also not seeing a pattern yet. If feeling apathy was the trick I don't see how that applies to Kureno, since he doesn't appear to feel apathetic toward Akito, and his curse broke back when they were both kids.
Maybe apathetic is not quite the right take. It could be that breaking the curse simply requires denying Akito's premiership. Given how deeply deference to her is grilled into every Sohma that's probably hard to overcome.

Curse-breaking looks to be a trend over the next block of episodes. If so, perhaps we should keep a list with the reason each Sohma broke the curse. My memory isn't the best these days. I'll start with these and let you all edit them.

Momiji - I have no idea. It just happened alongside his growth spurt.
Kureno - He has no idea.

Haru's curse broke as well, right, because of his anger over Akito pushing Rin out the window? What about Rin herself? Hiro?

In Momiji and Kureno's cases, Akito complains furiously about "those eyes" which, in her view, don't display enough love and deference for her any more.
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Old 2021-05-04, 09:30   Link #63
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Originally Posted by SeijiSensei View Post
Haru's curse broke as well, right, because of his anger over Akito pushing Rin out the window? What about Rin herself? Hiro?
Haru's "rope" frayed but it didn't break like with Kureno and Momiji.

I don't think they key is denying Akito's premiership. Plenty of them do that, but it was established she has a supernatural hold over them. That's probably even the reason Haru didn't/couldn't cave her face in despite how angry he was.
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Old 2021-05-10, 13:02   Link #64
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It takes a minute to adjust to Rin without her luscious, long, dark locks but she's managed to make her forced haircut into a solid punk bob cut. I prefer her with her long hair, but Rin's making her current situation work .

Tohru and Rin finally reunite! And Haru is enjoying it the most .

It almost felt like Shigure was rubbing it in to Rin what happened to her and how she was used even if he ended up revealing to her the truth about how the curse is ending and how they're at the last banquet. All of the Zodiac are alive in a single generation to single the end of the curse and the messed up bond they shared. Although of course even Shigure makes something ostensibly good sound pretty sinister .

Tohru finally gets to meet the real Shigure and desperately clings to the idea of the curse ending if it means freeing Kyo, but it's not going to be so convenient to end soon enough to save him, and there's nothing the Zodiac can do because to them the Cat is the one comfort they have as monsters because he stands as an example of a fate even worse. And faced with that, Tohru freaks out at Shigure. You can tell how much this is effecting her .

Tohru clung to the memory of her mother and Kyoko being her most important person for so long and as the one thing keeping her going that realizing that that person is now Kyo and that's the reason she's so desperate to end the curse and save the rest of the Sohma's is breaking her emotionally. She's done so much selflessly for the Zodiac in her mother's memory, but deep down she finally has something she wants more than anything...to save Kyo, and to be with Kyo .

Kyo doesn't visit Kyoko's grave with Tohru but he visits on his own time and finds Tohru's grandap, who reveals to him just how badly the death of Tohru's father effected the family. Kyoko utterly broke down and was barely able to function and Tohru resented her father for it, but even so she chased after the memory of her father and the kind of person he was to emulate him for the sake of her mother, which kept Kyoko going. Tohru's persona is partially constructed like she's trying to be her father because that's the only thing a child could think of to save their mother. It's just so sad .

Oh hey, Kagura! She's realized she's lost Kyo to Tohru and she's still trying to process that, even if it means trashing Kazuma's dojo, but he takes it better than Shigure (at least she cleans up after herself there). Although while the last cat's lover was with him and bore his child out of pity, which is a cruel kind of love, Kagura is able to recognize and slap some sense into Tohru that her love with Kyo is more than that, because she knows what it's like to feel a love and affection born from pity and she knows Tohru's feelings, selfish as they are, are more genuine than that .

Tohru is despondent and on the verge of breaking while struggling with all her emotional issues, but as always Kyo is there for her to comfort and listen to her and let her know she can cry and let it out. They even embrace each other, which is all the more adorable because Kyo still transforms at the end of it .

What is keeping these two from confessing and getting together like they deserve to be? Well, Kyo apparently has a very traumatic moment with Kyoko that led her to say she would never forgive him with her covered in blood and Tohru is still struggling to accept her feelings for Kyo versus the memory of her mother. Why can't it be smooth sailing for this poor couple ?
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Old 2021-05-10, 14:15   Link #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
What is keeping these two from confessing and getting together like they deserve to be? Well, Kyo apparently has a very traumatic moment with Kyoko that led her to say she would never forgive him with her covered in blood
Was that Kyoko in the flashback scene?? I thought it was Kyo's mother just before her death. Kyoko doesn't strike me as someone who'd say she would never forgive someone.
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Old 2021-05-10, 14:50   Link #66
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Originally Posted by LKK View Post
Was that Kyoko in the flashback scene?? I thought it was Kyo's mother just before her death. Kyoko doesn't strike me as someone who'd say she would never forgive someone.
That was Kyoko. Just keep watching until the end of the series and you will understand why she said that.
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Old 2021-05-10, 15:58   Link #67
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That was Kyoko. Just keep watching until the end of the series and you will understand why she said that.
Count on it.
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Old 2021-05-10, 18:32   Link #68
Kanon
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Can Shigure possibly be more of a dick? He purposefully said the most hurtful thing he could think of to Tohru. Yes, it's the truth, but he didn't have to tell her.

Is this the first time we've been told the 12 Zodiacs had never been assembled before this generation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
Was that Kyoko in the flashback scene?? I thought it was Kyo's mother just before her death. Kyoko doesn't strike me as someone who'd say she would never forgive someone.
It's not the first time we've seen that scene. I don't know how exactly Kyoko and Kyo met but they seemed close enough she would tell him about her family situation. And as you said, Kyoko is the kind of person who would use her last breath to curse someone. It's totally going to end up being one those cases where Kyo didn't hear the full sentence. She probably told him something like "if you don't make my daughter happy, I'll never forgive you". I don't know why he thinks she would blame him though.
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Old 2021-05-10, 18:47   Link #69
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Is this the first time we've been told the 12 Zodiacs had never been assembled before this generation?
Yes, I believe so. I was surprised to hear it.
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Old 2021-05-10, 19:10   Link #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Can Shigure possibly be more of a dick? He purposefully said the most hurtful thing he could think of to Tohru. Yes, it's the truth, but he didn't have to tell her.
Although, as infuriating as it is, it probably helped spur Tohru to realize her feelings when she so desperately clung to the idea that Kyo might be saved because of the curse breaking...even though it's not that simple .
Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
Yes, I believe so. I was surprised to hear it.
Yeah, you'd think having all 12 together would be more common. I mean, obviously there's an age gap with the younger and older zodiac but now apparently in the past some never showed up for years or (presumably) after another passed away .
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Old 2021-05-10, 20:15   Link #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Can Shigure possibly be more of a dick? He purposefully said the most hurtful thing he could think of to Tohru. Yes, it's the truth, but he didn't have to tell her.

Is this the first time we've been told the 12 Zodiacs had never been assembled before this generation?



It's not the first time we've seen that scene. I don't know how exactly Kyoko and Kyo met but they seemed close enough she would tell him about her family situation. And as you said, Kyoko is the kind of person who would use her last breath to curse someone. It's totally going to end up being one those cases where Kyo didn't hear the full sentence. She probably told him something like "if you don't make my daughter happy, I'll never forgive you". I don't know why he thinks she would blame him though.
Shigure may have been a dick but he was being blunt about things Tohru herself should have already figured out. He also finally got Tohru to accept her feelings.

I agree that there is no more to Kyoko's final words to Kyo than we heard.
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Old 2021-05-10, 20:40   Link #72
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Rin looks really mature with her new hair cut and its good to see Kagura again even though she destroyed another door and part of a wall
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Old 2021-05-11, 05:39   Link #73
Liddo-kun
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episode 1:

don't care about Akito, so the first 10 minutes is trash. Kureno (due to the mental disorder of being too kind) who cling like a magnet to toxic person like Akito is one of the main source of drama in this show. At this point, I simple would rejoice if Akito and drama king Kureno both met horrible deaths. Where is truck-kun when you need him?

sweet when Kyo picked up the scarf for Tohru.

Last edited by Liddo-kun; 2021-05-11 at 06:41.
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Old 2021-05-11, 10:52   Link #74
SeijiSensei
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I, too, was surprised to see Kyoko and Kyo together. Have we been told how they met or what their relationship is? Also the scene where Kyo looks in on little Tohru came out of nowhere. I must have missed the part where his relationship to the Honda family was depicted. Back in season one perhaps?
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Old 2021-05-11, 11:06   Link #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeijiSensei View Post
I, too, was surprised to see Kyoko and Kyo together. Have we been told how they met or what their relationship is? Also the scene where Kyo looks in on little Tohru came out of nowhere. I must have missed the part where his relationship to the Honda family was depicted. Back in season one perhaps?
There's been hints that he knows more about Tohru and her family than he let on in season 1, but the most direct was when he flashed back to Kyoko during that episode where he confronts Akito in season 2.
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Old 2021-05-11, 18:14   Link #76
Kanon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeijiSensei View Post
I, too, was surprised to see Kyoko and Kyo together. Have we been told how they met or what their relationship is? Also the scene where Kyo looks in on little Tohru came out of nowhere. I must have missed the part where his relationship to the Honda family was depicted. Back in season one perhaps?
It was never properly explained. We just know from season two that Kyoko gave him advice and talked to him about her daughter, and that he checked in on Tohru once. So basically what we saw in this ep.
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Old 2021-05-12, 04:11   Link #77
serenade_beta
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Ah yes, the relatives that tell the little children they don't look like their dead parent which is bad for the remaining parent. Ahh yes. Ahh yes, crap, I like someone else too now. I shall make this entire thing a(nother) dramatic situation. Ahh yes, I'm starting to find myself not being able to take this story seriously.
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Old 2021-05-17, 13:00   Link #78
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Kyo and Kyoko talked about her having to deal with her husband's death and life with Tohru, and Kyo asks her if she still misses her husband...and Kyoko seems to wonder when kids his age will find their reason for living, as Kyo now is plagued by guilt and trauma over the death of his mother and Kyoko that he witnessed and how that makes him feel like he doesn't deserve love or only causes harm to those he cares about. Which is why he can't believe Tohru loves him. Jeez, that's rough .

Shigure and Ren are like two peas in a pod, two people who act nice and sociable but are really vile and manipulative. Is it any wonder they slept together? But to Shigure, Ren only looks like the kind of beauty Akito could have been had she been raised as a woman, which is probably what he was thinking while they were having sex. Way to kill the mood of a seduction and deflate Ren, Shigure .

Ren was the only one there who was willing to console and be there for Akito's father Akira while he was so lonely as the last god of the Zodiac, and that's how they fell in love, but Ren became...maybe a little too enraptured with her husband, to the point of obsessing over him and nothing else. It's like Kyoko if she'd stopped caring about Tohru completely after Katsuya's death .

Although even when Akira was alive, Ren wanted nothing to do with Akito. She threatened to abort the child if they didn't raise her as a boy because she didn't want that kind of competition for Akira from her own child and treated having a child like a mistake. She treated her own child like a pest and showed her no love, feeling she was the only one who deserved Akira's attention and that Akito was just in the way. Is it any wonder Akito ended up so messed up and focused on the curse as a way of finding love when her own mother would never show it to her and her father was too far gone to be there as a support system ?

The Sohma's are so messed up. Something that was meant to support a child grieving their father became so warped and messed up because they were so young and emotionally damaged that a box with a fake soul could become so twisted and drive a mother to almost kill their child over nothing .

And just when it looks like Akito might actually kill Ren...Hiro's bond breaks, and he gets to finally embrace his sister and be embraced by his mother without transforming. He may feel mixed emotions about it, but it's all so wholesome amidst all the attempted murder .

Can Akito change? After all this time? I mean, it's partially Kureno's fault that he let it get to this point by staying with her instead of letting her grow past the curse, but that didn't mean he needed to get stabbed by her for penance. And then Arisa sees a dead bird in the rain...Oh jeez, not Kureno .

It looks like Tohru is about to finally confess to Kyo, but I don't think he's in a good mood to receive it .
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Old 2021-05-17, 18:46   Link #79
Kanon
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Imagine hating your daughter because you're afraid she'll steal your husband. Things may have turned out differently if Akito or that bitch of a domestic (she's mostly in the background but she played a major role in Akito turning this way) that sticks to her like glue had properly relayed Akira's final words to her. His greatest regret was that his wife never got along with her daughter.

Even after getting stabbed by her, Kureno still put Akito first. He's never going to learn, is he?
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Old 2021-05-17, 19:11   Link #80
Frontier
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Even after getting stabbed by her, Kureno still put Akito first. He's never going to learn, is he?
I mean, she's a mentally unstable woman with a knife who has committed several counts of attempted murder...probably safer to have someone make sure she doesn't actually kill anyone .
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