12-sai - chichana mune no tokimeki (seasons 1+2)

[Flower]

Season two started the other day, and like the first season it was not picked up for simulcast. Even so, moving it to the currently airing section.

[FredFriendly]

After only two episodes of the 2nd season, it sure looks like Yui-chan is going to be cheating on her boyfriend, being dazzled by a player from the cram school. I found it incomprehensible that, when he asked her to go shopping with him, she told him he couldn't do that because he has a girlfriend instead of telling him she couldn't because she has a boyfriend. Apparently she has very little loyalty to her own boyfriend. She might as well just ditch Hiyama since she now spends most of her time thinking about the playboy.

[BWTraveller]

Originally Posted by FredFriendly

After only two episodes of the 2nd season, it sure looks like Yui-chan is going to be cheating on her boyfriend, being dazzled by a player from the cram school. I found it incomprehensible that, when he asked her to go shopping with him, she told him he couldn't do that because he has a girlfriend instead of telling him she couldn't because she has a boyfriend. Apparently she has very little loyalty to her own boyfriend. She might as well just ditch Hiyama since she now spends most of her time thinking about the playboy.

I wouldn't say she's disloyal to Hiyama. Rather, she said that because she had contempt for that player attitude and thus felt that playing the field when taken trumped hitting on someone else who's taken. Either way, her love for Hiyama is far too strong for me to see her legitimately cheating on him. BTW, it's actually 4 episodes now and...

Spoiler for to the present:

Yui's relationship is indeed on the rocks, but I wouldn't call it cheating. She screws up to be sure, but not to that level. She tries to be friendly while figuring out a good way to make it clear to Inaba that she loves Hiyama alone, and combined with Inaba's determination winds up encountering him a lot. At the same time, Inaba continues his insistent cocky "I'm more suited to her" stuff and throws it at Hiyama, poking mostly at superficial problems like height but also hitting a few good points like Hiyama's occasional difficulty understanding and communicating, which has resulted in him hurting her a few times. Finally in episode 4 she gets matching bracelets (or anklets) with Hiyama to try and make it clear to him that he's the one for her, but hers falls off and he finds it, which freaks him out especially because she didn't tell him. He finds her searching together with Inaba, and she apologizes and says she was afraid she'd hurt him if he knew she'd lost it. Hiyama tells her off for simply deciding how he'd feel without saying anything, and Yui starts to cry at the realization that all her love for him is simply not getting through. While Hiyama stands there shocked and crushed that he'd brought his love to tears, Inaba grabs Yui and takes her away, saying I believe "I'll be taking her". The preview seems to show Yui and Inaba at an amusement park and Hiyama running after them; I don't for a moment believe she'll actually shift to Inaba, but rather she'll finally resolve her feelings and find a way to properly and confidently convey her commitment even as Hiyama manages to renew his own commitment to her. Here's hoping at least. A show about puppy love doesn't need lovers being stolen like that.

[FredFriendly]

Originally Posted by BWTraveller

I wouldn't say she's disloyal to Hiyama. Rather, she said that because she had contempt for that player attitude and thus felt that playing the field when taken trumped hitting on someone else who's taken. Either way, her love for Hiyama is far too strong for me to see her legitimately cheating on him. BTW, it's actually 4 episodes now and...

Yes, I've viewed all four episodes, but I still don't like the way things are going. It's very clear by the end of episode 2 that Yui-chan is already starting to have feelings for the playboy, and not at all clear to me that her love for Hiyama is far too strong for her to cheat on him, or even dump him for the playboy.

Spoiler for up to episode 4:

Plus, the mere fact that Yui-chan let the playboy take her away after that scene with Hiyama at the end of episode 4 shows that she is certainly wavering. Not only that, but she also appears to be going out on a date (is that not cheating?) with the playboy in episode 5, even riding a ferris wheel (something she probably hasn't even done with Hiyama), which is not something a girl who already has a boyfriend would normally do, so I suspect that she will, indeed, ditch Hiyama for the playboy.

[BWTraveller]

Well, episode 5 came out...

Spoiler:

As I suspected, there really wasn't anything to worry about. I actually guessed it pretty darn well. I was sure from the moment I saw that preview that Yui would be tricked into going to the park, and sure enough Inaba immediately guided Yui to "a place that would make her smile" and she didn't even wake up from her sad daze until she was inside the park. She also went on the Ferris Wheel because she felt bad about refusing even though she's afraid of heights. And all Inaba's moves up there did was make Yui realize that Hiyama had been upset because she kept holding her feelings back rather than relying on him, acting fine when she was anything but. Then Inaba pulls a really, really jerky move: he "borrows" Yui's anklet, ties it to a balloon and sends it off so that she would stop looking and remembering the sad things. Instead of moving her, it just got her to start screaming and racing after the balloon.

Ultimately, Yui didn't get the balloon, and wound up lost in a haunted house following a kid who'd caught it, and Hiyama raced in after her without paying. After guiding her out, Hiyama agrees with Inaba's words that being with him would probably make her cry again and she might be happy and free from such stress with Inaba, but he refuses to leave and swears that he'll always be the first one to come running whenever Yui's lost and troubled. Sure enough, as I thought, her feelings never truly wavered even when she thought that Inaba was a nice guy, and she tearfully tells Hiyama that he's the only one who can make her cry tears of joy or sadness with a single word. Later, the emotional moment makes them awkward to the point that people start to think they split, so she tries to get some alone time with him at the bathhouse, where she winds up discovering that he's been working to try and get his parents to buy him a cell phone, so that Yui would always be able to contact him in an instant if something happened. Finally, Hiyama repeats/reveals the wish he made on the anklet, wishing on a rainbow that he would be able to hurry and become the sort of grown up that could protect Yui properly.

Yet another good episode, and my assessment of Yui seemed to be pretty accurate: her feelings are strong enough that they won't sway so easily. She's just not really good at turning people down when she likes them, even platonically, which results in her easily getting put in situations that trouble her or look bad. Here's hoping she eventually manages to get over that habit. Even if she's mistaken and a boy doesn't have feelings for her, telling a male friend that she'd rather not be that close to someone besides her boyfriend is definitely better than leaving things vague and open to misinterpretation by all parties.

[FredFriendly]

Well, after episode 5 it looks like Hiyama is in for a rocky road. Yui lost her anklet which means that her wish "to always be with Hiyama" will not come true. No doubt at some future point in time some other handsome dude will come along to make her heart waver once again.

Spoiler for short rant:

I don't have much sympathy for Yui. Unlike Hanabi in the first season, who was initially completely clueless as to blond-boy's intentions and only wanted to be friends with him and help him get along with their classmates, Yui was well aware from the get-go what type of guy the playboy was, yet she made one incredibly stupid error in judgement after the other.

To start with, she should have told the playboy not to call her Yui. It immediately established a level of intimate familiarity between the two of them that should have been reserved only for her "boyfriend." After all, even Hiyama doesn't call her by her first name. This leads to more intimate familiarity, much of which was initiated by Yui, herself.

They exchange cell phone contact information so that they can have frequent text conversations, something she can't even do with her "boyfriend." You can bet dollars to doughnuts she hasn't told her "boyfriend" about all this text messaging, but prefers to hide it from him.

She goes out of her way to have conversations with him, even following him outside.

When the playboy shows up at the school gate, she immediately runs out to him. Does she not care what her "boyfriend" might think (let alone her classmates who witness her actions), or how her "boyfriend" might feel if she pays so much attention to another boy, a boy that she just recently met yet already calls her Yui-chan? Obviously not.

Frankly, I don't feel like Yui suffered enough for her inconsiderate actions. Where was her hearftfelt apology to Hiyama for making him feel so bad? She was certainly quick enough to apologize to the playboy, so why can't she apologize to her "boyfriend?"

[BWTraveller]

Originally Posted by FredFriendly

Well, after episode 5 it looks like Hiyama is in for a rocky road. Yui lost her anklet which means that her wish "to always be with Hiyama" will not come true. No doubt at some future point in time some other handsome dude will come along to make her heart waver once again.

Spoiler for short rant:

I don't have much sympathy for Yui. Unlike Hanabi in the first season, who was initially completely clueless as to blond-boy's intentions and only wanted to be friends with him and help him get along with their classmates, Yui was well aware from the get-go what type of guy the playboy was, yet she made one incredibly stupid error in judgement after the other.

To start with, she should have told the playboy not to call her Yui. It immediately established a level of intimate familiarity between the two of them that should have been reserved only for her "boyfriend." After all, even Hiyama doesn't call her by her first name. This leads to more intimate familiarity, much of which was initiated by Yui, herself.

They exchange cell phone contact information so that they can have frequent text conversations, something she can't even do with her "boyfriend." You can bet dollars to doughnuts she hasn't told her "boyfriend" about all this text messaging, but prefers to hide it from him.

She goes out of her way to have conversations with him, even following him outside.

When the playboy shows up at the school gate, she immediately runs out to him. Does she not care what her "boyfriend" might think (let alone her classmates who witness her actions), or how her "boyfriend" might feel if she pays so much attention to another boy, a boy that she just recently met yet already calls her Yui-chan? Obviously not.

Frankly, I don't feel like Yui suffered enough for her inconsiderate actions. Where was her hearftfelt apology to Hiyama for making him feel so bad? She was certainly quick enough to apologize to the playboy, so why can't she apologize to her "boyfriend?"

I don't see how Yui initiated any intimacy. The guy is that open in general, so in her desire to be friendly and polite she didn't refuse to be treated the same as the other girls. Also, I haven't seen one bit of evidence that she has any intention to "hide" her texts from Hiyama. Again, out of a desire to be friendly she agreed to exchanging contact information and engaged in conversation. She has pursued him a couple times, but this is again out of a desire to be friends, to thank him for his actions, or to attempt to clear up misunderstandings. She runs out to see him because she assumed he was there to see her (we don't know anyone else from her juku who goes to her school, and he'd just declared that he'd "get serious"), so she thought he needed something. And while she didn't "apologize" to him, she did make sure that he knew that he was the only one, and then also went out of her way to get some one-on-one time with him.

Ultimately, Yui's not fickle or flighty, she's just awkward and timid. She doesn't want to hurt people, so she's very reluctant to say "No". You see this at work when she's worrying over whether Inaba is coming on to her or just joking around. Not to mention the various times he gets aggressive. She doesn't want to be impolite, or to reject what may be just overtures of friendship, and if/when she finds out he's seriously pursuing romance she becomes concerned about how to let him down without hurting him too much. If anything, Hanabi doesn't think things through enough and Yui thinks about things too much, until she's unable to stand up and assert her feelings.

Ultimately, examination of the show does not give me any shred of evidence that Yui's heart has ever "wavered". From start to end, her heart has belonged to Hiyama. She just needs to learn to stand up a bit more. I can't imagine we'd ever need to worry about her "wavering", but I'll admit I am worried for other reasons. Inaba repeatedly put Yui in very uncomfortable situations, situations where he frankly would've had the upper hand even if she wasn't unsure how to resist. She's a cute girl, so yes there will be other guys coming after her, including some really flirtatious bastards, and these guys might be even more presumptive or just decide to use force and worry later. Since she's still in grade school she probably doesn't have to be worried too much about the sort of people likely to come after her trying TOO much, but I could easily see someone stealing her first kiss because she panics and doesn't know how to stop him.

[FlareKnight]

My feelings on this situation were mixed. Just in a sense that Inaba was annoying as heck and I wanted to punch this kid most of the time. And yes I did stop to think it was crazy that I wanted to punch a 12 year old....

I think Yui was fine. For one....again she's 12. It's understandable just in general that she didn't know how to deal with this guy. I do think the realization that Inaba was serious about her did shake her up. Of course Yui with her mentality would be shaken up by someone expressing romantic feelings for her. But I don't think she ever considered any thought outside of Hiyama. I don't think she ever imagined breaking up with him and going out with Inaba. It was just the stage of being emotionally rattled at someone else being serious about her.

While I hate Inaba's existence, at least he was a catalyst. In a sense the difference between the two love triangles is that I feel this one created more emotional drama that worked. I just can't buy any real drama with Hanabi and Takao. They are the sweet couple. While Hiyama and Aoi occasionally bicker and can feel like a crazy ride .

You just can't doubt Yui's feelings. She was so utterly shaken up by the idea that things might be really harmed between her and Hiyama that she shut down. They go all the way to the amusement park before she started back up. And even then her feelings were never swayed. It was all Hiyama all the time. Which made it all the more frustrating to see Inaba even try. Nothing he could do would sway her in a legitimate way. In the end Yui is the type that struggles to assert herself in situations like that. Going with the flow for the benefit of others and often neglecting being as selfish as she should.

Also just want to say that Hiyama is a darn fun character. He is flawed, but really enjoyable. Has his own lack of confidence which is why it took so long to get across his seriousness. He was worried last season in terms of comparing himself to Takao. He wants to protect someone he cares about and struggles with feeling like he's lacking in so many ways. And I just like that he did put in all the work at the family business for that kind of reason. Frankly with recent events I can understand why he wants a phone so darn badly .

[BWTraveller]

Indeed, I too love Hiyama as a character. Not only is he one of the first instances to make me earnestly believe a male tsundere can work, but he's so passionately and completely devoted to Yui. On the other hand, I find it hard to imagine not hating Inaba after the balloon. I am sorry, but you do NOT take a girl who's upset about a fight with her boyfriend and get rid of a treasured symbol of their love. The moment he did that it was clear that he doesn't really know Yui as well as he thinks. The anguish and desperation on her face as that bracelet floated away was kind of hard to watch. I just hope at some point someone tells Yui the one obvious truth that a lot of kids don't get: no good luck charm is anywhere near as powerful as a heart-filled promise between two people in love.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by BWTraveller

Indeed, I too love Hiyama as a character. Not only is he one of the first instances to make me earnestly believe a male tsundere can work, but he's so passionately and completely devoted to Yui. On the other hand, I find it hard to imagine not hating Inaba after the balloon. I am sorry, but you do NOT take a girl who's upset about a fight with her boyfriend and get rid of a treasured symbol of their love. The moment he did that it was clear that he doesn't really know Yui as well as he thinks. The anguish and desperation on her face as that bracelet floated away was kind of hard to watch. I just hope at some point someone tells Yui the one obvious truth that a lot of kids don't get: no good luck charm is anywhere near as powerful as a heart-filled promise between two people in love.

It was the ultimate sign that this guy just doesn't get it. In the end whatever he says he feels about Yui, it's all about him. Even getting Yui to fall in love with him feels like it's more about his ego. "If he can get someone as great as Yui to fall in love with him, how great does that make him?" That kind of thinking. That he's so awesome that she just needs to forget about Hiyama and bask in how great Inaba is...

Just shows what Inaba himself is lacking. Of course the kid is young and can get better, but he's got a long road ahead. And I don't even know if he realizes what he's lacking after all this. The strength for Yui and Hiyama is the focus they put on the other person. Hiyama wants to be better for Yui's sake. Not to be with Yui in order to show off or prove his greatness. It's about feelings not who is "better."

I'm sure Yui will get that message at some point. Both she and Hanabi were caught up in that idea. And it's been like that from the start of the show. The crepes, the sleeping with a picture with a loved one rumor, wish bracelets, etc. Understandable that they are so desperate to make what they've just gained last that they jump on every rumor or trend that comes up.

[FredFriendly]

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

It was the ultimate sign that this guy just doesn't get it. In the end whatever he says he feels about Yui, it's all about him. Even getting Yui to fall in love with him feels like it's more about his ego. "If he can get someone as great as Yui to fall in love with him, how great does that make him?" That kind of thinking. That he's so awesome that she just needs to forget about Hiyama and bask in how great Inaba is...

Very well elucidated, indeed! He really is completely full of himself. I do hope we've seen the last of him.

Spoiler for episode 6:

I watched episode 6 (in Spanish, not that I could understand the subs) and, thankfully, it only had a minimal amount of drama. Unfortunately, the trailer for episode 7 indicates that it will be a Blond-boy-centric episode, someone who, frankly, I couldn't care less about. I hope it's a self-inclusive episode and not an arc that runs to two or more episodes. He is a very close second to my least favorite character in this series. As annoying as those goofs are with their love-bird quotes, at least they aren't trying to steal someone else's girl.

[BWTraveller]

Originally Posted by FredFriendly

Very well elucidated, indeed! He really is completely full of himself. I do hope we've seen the last of him.

Spoiler for episode 6:

I watched episode 6 (in Spanish, not that I could understand the subs) and, thankfully, it only had a minimal amount of drama. Unfortunately, the trailer for episode 7 indicates that it will be a Blond-boy-centric episode, someone who, frankly, I couldn't care less about. I hope it's a self-inclusive episode and not an arc that runs to two or more episodes. He is a very close second to my least favorite character in this series. As annoying as those goofs are with their love-bird quotes, at least they aren't trying to steal someone else's girl.

Spoiler:

I wouldn't go quite that far. I'm not a big fan of Tsutsumi, but he's a lot nobler than some people, and has at least currently seemed to express a very definite surrender to the situation. Actually, the one reason I like him is because he shows the most promise to fix Cocoa. He seems to realize that her beauty is only skin-deep and seems to be the only one who really expresses any sort of negative view of her generally. If anyone is going to tell her off for her behavior it's him. Frankly, I want those two to get together, and let him take his time taming that shrew.

[FredFriendly]

Originally Posted by BWTraveller

Spoiler:

I wouldn't go quite that far. I'm not a big fan of Tsutsumi, but he's a lot nobler than some people, and has at least currently seemed to express a very definite surrender to the situation. Actually, the one reason I like him is because he shows the most promise to fix Cocoa. He seems to realize that her beauty is only skin-deep and seems to be the only one who really expresses any sort of negative view of her generally. If anyone is going to tell her off for her behavior it's him. Frankly, I want those two to get together, and let him take his time taming that shrew.

Personally, I think she and the playboy are more suited for each other, ya know, birds of a feather...

[BWTraveller]

Originally Posted by FredFriendly

Personally, I think she and the playboy are more suited for each other, ya know, birds of a feather...

Now that's a match made in hell.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by BWTraveller

Now that's a match made in hell.

I actually wouldn't be against that pairing . I can't stand either of them so might as well see if they could make each other miserable...

[BWTraveller]

Well, this new episode was interesting and showed some cool points, but wasn't exactly the best. I think it was more setting groundwork for the next major conflict. We had observation of points like the fact that you can't just turn off your feelings for someone; even if you decide to give up and accept that the person didn't choose you, it's still going to take time to really move on. We also had the observation that love does not follow orders. You can decide to be "just friends" or to never fall in love with a person, even swear this to that person, and still suddenly find yourself desperately in love.

Oddly, Hanabi took a big leap here and determined that this carried unpleasant implications on the other end: that if nothing could control or stop your falling in love, then there's no controlling or preventing it when you fall out again. Suddenly, she seems to have decided that the promise she made with Takao to love one another forever might be a rather empty promise. Of course, this is actually both true and false.

There is a degree of control one has with love. One's choices to remain faithful and supportive and dedicated in the bad times have a big impact; married couples don't last long enough to die looking at their great-grandchildren's faces because they never had problems or struggles, but because they made that exact promise and legitimately committed to not just staying together but really looking at and remaining committed to one another. In this sense, a promise to remain together and in love forever is really a very powerful thing when you mean it, even though even in the real world there are lots of people who believe it's over once the first big problem hits. At the same time, Hanabi and Takao's relationship is currently more infatuation than love. By their design it could easily stick and remain as true love, but still it is definitely possible to find once the passion fades and familiarity sets in that too much of the "love" was for illusions and fantasies, as well as fronts put up out of fear of the partner's opinion.

Either way, it's surprising that Hanabi made a jump like this; to think that merely realizing that she couldn't stop herself falling in love led her to the revelation that the "love" she had might fade is quite a leap if you ask me. And I seriously hope that she receives proper correction on this, because as I said real love is much stronger than that and it's really a sad thing to see someone growing up with this view that you can't stop love from just vanishing.

Also, it seems we have more confirmation that Ogura's big sis is seriously not a good role model for youths in love. Not only has she apparently had multiple boyfriends, but she's dealt a lot with getting rid of unwanted men and recently declared that her best way to deal with suitors she doesn't like is to not refuse but "keep" them for convenience.

[FredFriendly]

It wasn't enough they duked it out in season 1? We've gotta go through that crap again?

Spoiler for episode 8 preview:

The preview for episode 8 at the end of episode 7 indicates that Blondie-boy will once again attempt to steal Hanabi from Takao, but this time it looks like Hanabi, unlike Yui, is not quite so in love with her boyfriend as she thought, and might just be ready to ditch Takao for Blondie-boy.

[FlareKnight]

I have to say it is a bit awkward seeing Takao interact with Hanabi's brother. He's so much taller than him .

Credit in this second half to Tsutsumi. In terms of the rival guys he is easily the best character. Really goes above and beyond in being supportive despite his feelings on the matter. Even though it doesn't help him and he won't get any credit for doing so he still makes sure even on the Christmas date to keep the idiot trio out of the mix. Turned into a pretty likable person overall.

I just can't bring myself to like Inaba. Maybe because the comparable act of kindness they gave him in the last episode was making sure Cocoa didn't spend Christmas alone. Oh good. One semi-likable person is making sure one entirely unlikable person isn't spending Christmas alone .

Anyways the last few eps were solid. Certainly some challenges ahead for the couples, though maybe a bit more for Hiyama and Aoi since Aoi may end up going to a different school. But, such is . As a whole it was an alright and fairly cute show. The cast will certainly be missed.

[Guardian Enzo]

My issue with 12-sai is that Aoi and Hiyama are in a different show from everyone else. Their relationship is bittersweet an awkward and endearingly realistic, and Takao and Hanabi are an absolute bore to me. And the rest of it is basically slapstick - not bad slapstick, but slapstick. I can't think of too many shows with such a stark split personality.